Gyms to Reopen 2021???

rondog

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Incorrect.

If it's an underlying cause, its included on the death cert as per the WHO guidance.

Anyway, neither of us are in the correct forum for this.

Incorrect-if a person tests positive for COVID ,the death is reported as COVID whether its from heart failure,cancer etc.

rondog

rondog wrote: »

...........

You can say 'well people die from COVID' so we should shut down, many die from drowing,car crashes ,other viruses and bacterial infections, should we ban or shut down all other causes of death?afterall if we stop driving ,sports,swimmming we can prevent those deaths.

Death from swimming as tragic as it is, isn't contagious.

rondog

Augeo wrote: »

Death from swimming as tragic as it is, isn't contagious.

But its preventable so why dont we shut down swimming pools?

Flu among other viruses causes many death each season so why not shut down each Cold/FLu season?
Norovirus causes 680 million cases a year and is highly contagious with 200k deaths so why not shut down when Norovirus kicks off?

papu

rondog wrote: »

But its preventable so why dont we shut down swimming pools?

Flu among other viruses causes many death each season so why not shut down each Cold/FLu season?
Norovirus causes 680 million cases a year and is highly contagious with 200k deaths so why not shut down when Norovirus kicks off?

US Norovirus deaths per annum ~900.. cmon you're equating having the squirts with Covid-19

Alf Veedersane

rondog wrote: »

Incorrect-if a person tests positive for COVID ,the death is reported as COVID whether its from heart failure,cancer etc.

That's just incorrect.


https://www.who.int/classifications/icd/Guidelines_Cause_of_Death_COVID-19.pdf?ua=1



Example:




Anyway, like I said, this is not the forum for it.

rondog

rondog wrote: »

But its preventable so why dont we shut down swimming pools?

Flu among other viruses causes many death each season so why not shut down each Cold/FLu season?.................

Because there's a vaccine and hence a low number of deaths. Hospitals can cope to an extent.

With no vaccine and no restrictions Covid would run rampant (as we got a glimpse of in Jan).

rondog

papu wrote: »

US Norovirus deaths per annum ~900.. cmon you're equating having the squirts with Covid-19

Norovirus results in about 685 million cases of disease and 200,000 deaths globally a year.[6][7] It is common both in the developed and developing world.[3][8] Those under the age of five are most often affected, and in this group it results in about 50,000 deaths in the developing world.[6] Norovirus infections occur more commonly during winter months.[6] It often occurs in outbreaks, especially among those living in close quarters.[3] In the United States, it is the cause of about half of all foodborne disease outbreaks.[3] The virus is named after the city of Norwalk, Ohio, where an outbreak occurred in 1968.[9]

Just the Squirts is it?
Various different reports give differing recovery rates from COVID of 97-99%.
Vast majority of COVID cases are very mild or asymptomatic.

rondog

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

That's just incorrect.


https://www.who.int/classifications/icd/Guidelines_Cause_of_Death_COVID-19.pdf?ua=1



Example:




Anyway, like I said, this is not the forum for it.

Im referring to Ireland and cant seem to post a link so the below is an extract of a report in the Journal.

"When asked how Covid-19 deaths are recorded, a spokesperson for the HSE told TheJournal.ie: “In cases where an individual who has had a positive Covid-19 test before or after death, this will be notified to the national surveillance system and reported by HPSC as a death in a confirmed Covid-19 case.”

Alf Veedersane

rondog wrote: »

Im referring to Ireland and cant seem to post a link so the below is an extract of a report in the Journal.

"When asked how Covid-19 deaths are recorded, a spokesperson for the HSE told TheJournal.ie: “In cases where an individual who has had a positive Covid-19 test before or after death, this will be notified to the national surveillance system and reported by HPSC as a death in a confirmed Covid-19 case.”

The guidance is applicable in Ireland.


That article is from last May, things change.


https://www.thejournal.ie/cso-underlying-cause-death-5276913-Nov2020/


"Ireland has been counting Covid-19 deaths on foot of advice from the World Health Organization, which issued guidance on the matter earlier this year. The CSO said that the hierarchy in which the causes of death are written on a death certificate will impact on what it assigns to be the underlying cause of death for the purposes of this data."

rondog

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

The guidance is applicable in Ireland.


That article is from last May, things change.


https://www.thejournal.ie/cso-underlying-cause-death-5276913-Nov2020/


"Ireland has been counting Covid-19 deaths on foot of advice from the World Health Organization, which issued guidance on the matter earlier this year. The CSO said that the hierarchy in which the causes of death are written on a death certificate will impact on what it assigns to be the underlying cause of death for the purposes of this data."

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/heal...inds-1.4295324

You are talking about 'Guidance' and in an ideal world the true figures might be reflected but its common knowledge and very easy to see many reports online about people saying their family members died from non covid related illness but the death cert had COVID.

https://theconversation.com/died-fro...-deaths-145438.

Even medical professionals are saying its hard to distinguish between dying with and from.

rondog

PPAP wrote: »

Sad thing is, most club gyms are still open. I have keys for my local gaa gym in my village and while I haven't used it, i've seen a good few lads going in and out, some are local gardai using it reguarly.

It's like that everywhere in the country

Personally I don't see gyms opening until indoor dining does, sometime in the summer, NPHET and the like see them as high risk.

This is true.I know of a few Muay thai and MMA gyms that are still holding classes ,one even posts live videos of training on Insta.

Fair play to them,people have had enough.

Alf Veedersane

rondog wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/heal...inds-1.4295324

You are talking about 'Guidance' and in an ideal world the true figures might be reflected but its common knowledge and very easy to see many reports online about people saying their family members died from non covid related illness but the death cert had COVID.

https://theconversation.com/died-fro...-deaths-145438.

Even medical professionals are saying its hard to distinguish between dying with and from.

There's chatter on social media and mostly not first hand.

You can see clear trends in hospitalisations, ICU admissions and deaths.

Most medical professionals are seeing the direct impacts of covid.

Everyone is sick of it. My father is isolated because of the restrictions. I have seen him twice in a year. I would love to be in the gym. Be able to travel more than 5k. I have kids that miss their friends. I want this to be over.

But going down this route of saying it's not what it is does no one want favours. So lets just leave this here.

Thelonious Monk

So according to the roadmap I can't see gyms open before May anyway

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

So according to the roadmap I can't see gyms open before May anyway

It's not any sort of road map..all I heard was schools. No mention of anything else. A ****ing shìtshow.

yourdeadwright

I'm all for gyms opening up but at the same time PTs on Instagram are a joke,

Constantly going on about its the only thing to help peoples mental health is nonsense ,
Back in the 80's & 90's even early 00's there was f*ck all gyms people where not going around like Zombies complaining of mental health ,

If you really want to help people like they claim they should be making video's encouraging everyone to get outdoors and train or do it at home or in your garden ,

The people who need them most actually listen to there every word and then use it as an excuse that they can't do exercise when they can ,

yourdeadwright

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I'm all for gyms opening up but at the same time PTs on Instagram are a joke,

Constantly going on about its the only thing to help peoples mental health is nonsense ,
Back in the 80's & 90's even early 00's there was f*ck all gyms people where not going around like Zombies complaining of mental health ,

If you really want to help people like they claim they should be making video's encouraging everyone to get outdoors and train or do it at home or in your garden ,

The people who need them most actually listen to there every word and then use it as an excuse that they can't do exercise when they can ,

I've kept 80% of my client base going via online sessions and home visits for the last year. Some have said they actually prefer it to being in the gym!

I know it's far from the best situation, but you can usually find a way to make things work. It's small gym owners I feel sorry for. This must be a nightmare for them.

yourdeadwright

Basil3 wrote: »

I've kept 80% of my client base going via online sessions and home visits for the last year. Some have said they actually prefer it to being in the gym!

I know it's far from the best situation, but you can usually find a way to make things work. It's small gym owners I feel sorry for. This must be a nightmare for them.

I feel for people losing business and losing money as everyone need to feed there families but I cant stand the sh*te on social media


Somewhere about 2 or 3 years ago PT's all of a sudden overnight became experts in mental health the majority for one reason to make clients think they NEED them more , The constantly putting up of these **** talking videos makes vulnerable people think there is no alternative which is false & does more harm than good,

silverharp

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I'm all for gyms opening up but at the same time PTs on Instagram are a joke,

Constantly going on about its the only thing to help peoples mental health is nonsense ,
Back in the 80's & 90's even early 00's there was f*ck all gyms people where not going around like Zombies complaining of mental health ,

If you really want to help people like they claim they should be making video's encouraging everyone to get outdoors and train or do it at home or in your garden ,

The people who need them most actually listen to there every word and then use it as an excuse that they can't do exercise when they can ,

the weather hasnt been great, I do a park routine and I try to get a 2 hr cycle in at the weekend, but the weather throws out routine more often than not, last weekend for instance was my first time on a bike in 3 weeks.
After March the weather will be better and evenings longer but that doesnt help at the moment

yourdeadwright

silverharp wrote: »

the weather hasnt been great, I do a park routine and I try to get a 2 hr cycle in at the weekend, but the weather throws out routine more often than not, last weekend for instance was my first time on a bike in 3 weeks.
After March the weather will be better and evenings longer but that doesnt help at the moment

The weather is grand as long as you have a rain coat,


For cycling yes it could be dangerous but for getting out for a walk or a run its fine ,

Black Sheep

Basil3 wrote: »

I've kept 80% of my client base going via online sessions and home visits for the last year. Some have said they actually prefer it to being in the gym!

I know it's far from the best situation, but you can usually find a way to make things work. It's small gym owners I feel sorry for. This must be a nightmare for them.

That's great to hear.

I know a few businesses that have done better than they expected by going digital. Not the same revenue as before, but recouping far more than they expected. Anecdotally, I know of 1-2 yoga businesses whose situation has actually improved by moving to an online streaming platform and actually doing away with bricks and mortar space. It's a bit glib to say "suddenly the clientele is international", but there's also an element of truth to that. When it comes to availing of online training, we can all train with anyone we want these days.

On the other hand, I know of a PT business with two locations and a significant number of staff, that has still not made the jump to online training of any kind. The business is effectively in hibernation. One of the co-owners I spoke to decided early on that they weren't willing to do online training. I think it was a mixture of being sceptical and unfamiliar with it as a model combined with a forlorn hope the pandemic wouldn't last. They never revisited it.

---

The roadmap is a little grim alright. It's all kicked down the road bar education and the information about the continuance of financial supports.

I do wonder what happens if, in late 2021 or 2022, we've vaccinated everyone and the UK and Ireland is wide open for business.... And then a vaccine resistant strain starts to circulate, or comes in with a trucker from Portgual or whatever.... What happens then? If we're open then that strain goes around very quickly. What do we do then, aren't we back to square 1?

silverharp

yourdeadwright wrote: »

The weather is grand as long as you have a rain coat,


For cycling yes it could be dangerous but for getting out for a walk or a run its fine ,

a bit of an assumption there, not seen too many people doing yoga or an aerobics class in 2C and rain. most people who still got to work normal days will find it difficult to keep a routine going. People arent machines

yourdeadwright

silverharp wrote: »

a bit of an assumption there, not seen too many people doing yoga or an aerobics class in 2C and rain. most people who still got to work normal days will find it difficult to keep a routine going. People arent machines

Just cause you can't do your class doesn't mean you can't go out side for some exercise ,Yes a gym or class is a great & convenient but its not essential

rondog

Black Sheep wrote: »

That's great to hear.

I know a few businesses that have done better than they expected by going digital. Not the same revenue as before, but recouping far more than they expected. Anecdotally, I know of 1-2 yoga businesses whose situation has actually improved by moving to an online streaming platform and actually doing away with bricks and mortar space. It's a bit glib to say "suddenly the clientele is international", but there's also an element of truth to that. When it comes to availing of online training, we can all train with anyone we want these days.

On the other hand, I know of a PT business with two locations and a significant number of staff, that has still not made the jump to online training of any kind. The business is effectively in hibernation. One of the co-owners I spoke to decided early on that they weren't willing to do online training. I think it was a mixture of being sceptical and unfamiliar with it as a model combined with a forlorn hope the pandemic wouldn't last. They never revisited it.

---

The roadmap is a little grim alright. It's all kicked down the road bar education and the information about the continuance of financial supports.

I do wonder what happens if, in late 2021 or 2022, we've vaccinated everyone and the UK and Ireland is wide open for business.... And then a vaccine resistant strain starts to circulate, or comes in with a trucker from Portgual or whatever.... What happens then? If we're open then that strain goes around very quickly. What do we do then, aren't we back to square 1?

They are working on a vaccine that can 'try' and encompass the new variants but as you say if there is a new mutation that is very different it may be able to bypass existing vaccines and you are correct we may be back at square 1.

SOme of the current vaccines are less effective against new strains and scientists are trying to tweak vaccines so they are effective,

There's confidence that vaccines such as the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna ones — (as opposed to vaccines that use an inactivated form of the virus) can be tweaked to tackle new virus variants

I'm still hoping that gyms and non essential retail will be permitted to open in April with some restrictions.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

Augeo wrote: »

I'm still hoping that gyms and non essential retail will be permitted to open in April with some restrictions.

Going by previous dates expect an announcement then and a further 6 weeks of shìte talk before anything is allowed open.

All going well we will be down to 200/300 cases per day by mid March. Plenty time for them to have their ducks in a row for early April announcement IMO.

OmegaGene

OmegaGene wrote: »

the numbers will no doubt rise again with people going out and about getting kids to school , do not get your hopes up

They might well but iirc we had schools open for Oct and Nov?
Not all students are returning in March either
I find the hope positive tbh and will be well able to cope with gyms not opening in April should that be the case.

completedit

Missing a weights session. More so for my shoulders than anything; it should be a crime to have shoulders this narrow.

Some interesting home workouts. I started off with Joe Wicks; good solid conditioning workouts. Particularly like his 25 minute Hit workout. Just nice to move the body in ways I haven't while working out with free weights.

Ray Donovan

completedit wrote: »

Missing a weights session. More so for my shoulders than anything; it should be a crime to have shoulders this narrow.

Posts like these is the reason:

1. People are intimidated going to a gym
2. The perception is out there that a lot of gym goers are dcikheads.

yourdeadwright

completedit wrote: »

Missing a weights session. More so for my shoulders than anything; it should be a crime to have shoulders this narrow.

Some interesting home workouts. I started off with Joe Wicks; good solid conditioning workouts. Particularly like his 25 minute Hit workout. Just nice to move the body in ways I haven't while working out with free weights.

I'v no heavy weights at home and although like you say its nice to run more and move in different ways, there is nothing quite like throwing a load of weight on a bar and moving it, Squats,bench press ,Shoulder press, deadlifts all missed ,

I feel like a dweeb

Alf Veedersane

I'm jealous of people who can run and do those higher intensity conditioning workouts.

Having to make my peace with walking.

I've yet to break into a run, woeful times for 2021

2nd Row Donkey

I'm running 6 days a week, alternating between days of 5-6km and 10-11km.

I've also just completed a 90 day resistance band programme from undersun fitness (TA2 build), that's 5 days a week. Standing in the park, sometimes in in half light and in all weather's hail, rain, wind (and even snow a week ago).

I'm sure dog walkers and power walkers are wondering what the hell is that guy with the giant elastic bands doing over there but if I don't get out of the house and exercise every day I get cranky and moody and I'm sure I'm a nightmare to live it as my wife and daughter will testify.

The constant mud and dirt, and the never ending washing of outdoor sports clothing is a pain in the @ss. Also, my post workout shower at home seems to take me 3 times as long as a shower in the gym for whatever reason.

Anyway, I'd give it all up in a heartbeat to get back into the gym where ironically I'd probably do the exact same type of workout on the threadmill and resistance bands. I just miss the classes, and the people, the atmosphere and that nice freshly pumped feeling as you leave the gym to go to work in the morning.

Thelonious Monk

I go running 4 or 5 times a week, it's great, I only took it up last year. When the gyms open I probably wont go as much and I'll miss it for sure, it's just lovely running through the park and trees.

Running is great once you get into it, went from not enjoying a 5k last March when first lockdown landed to being comfortable doing 15km in April after only running 90km in between them. I haven't gone out much in Jan & Feb though this time around.

FileNotFound

Screwed the knees a few years back with over running - incorrect supporting work - been trying to get a few runs in each week, keeping to 5 km max and the odd 3km sprints.

Miss the classes the most, was nice getting a pre work spin class in - just made the work day easier.

Look forward to getting back to the gym when it opens, whenever that will be.

senordingdong

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I go running 4 or 5 times a week, it's great, I only took it up last year. When the gyms open I probably wont go as much and I'll miss it for sure, it's just lovely running through the park and trees.

I gave it a go but it's been detrimental to muscle mass.

Thelonious Monk

senordingdong wrote: »

I gave it a go but it's been detrimental to muscle mass.

do you not think it's more important to be able to run a bit rather than the size of your muscles?

paw patrol

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

do you not think it's more important to be able to run a bit rather than the size of your muscles?

definitely not.

although I don't believe its' an either/or scenario

senordingdong

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

do you not think it's more important to be able to run a bit rather than the size of your muscles?

I'm able to run but running more as a substitute to weight training hasn't been productive.

the baby bull elephant

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

do you not think it's more important to be able to run a bit rather than the size of your muscles?

You really don't like people having any muscle mass do you?

Thelonious Monk

the baby bull elephant wrote: »

You really don't like people having any muscle mass do you?

First time I've brought it up here, I think. I would usually lift pretty heavy without being obsessive about it.

Alf Veedersane

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

do you not think it's more important to be able to run a bit rather than the size of your muscles?

It's not one over the other. You've said you'd be more inclined to prioritise running, others will prioritise lifting and retaining muscle mass.

I can't run because i don't want to expedite the need for a hip replacement (and it now hurts) but if I could, I probably would but not at the expense of the weight training because that's more of a priority than improving running times.

Thelonious Monk

Oh I just mean I'd be more likely to go to a gym instead of going for my run, that's what happened last 2 times gyms opened, my running went out the window.
Meanwhile though it's good to get out and do different kinds of exercise while options are limited.

Alf Veedersane

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Oh I just mean I'd be more likely to go to a
Meanwhile though it's good to get out and do different kinds of exercise while options are limited.

Yep. Whatever works for people

senordingdong

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Oh I just mean I'd be more likely to go to a gym instead of going for my run, that's what happened last 2 times gyms opened, my running went out the window.
Meanwhile though it's good to get out and do different kinds of exercise while options are limited.

Yeah there's loads more I'd love to be able to do but so much of it conflicts with other things I want.

Will_I_Regret

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I can't run because i don't want to expedite the need for a hip replacement (and it now hurts)

Do you really think your hip injury will get to that stage?

Alf Veedersane

Will_I_Regret wrote: »

Do you really think your hip injury will get to that stage?

It definitely will. It's a matter of 'when' and not 'if'.
The femoral head is slowly dying through lack of blood flow to it. There is no way to fix it and loaded impact (running) will hasten the collapse of the dead bone and then it needs to be replaced.

Hip flexion is sore uncomfortable past a certain point, which sucks cos it means no more rowing. I'd have definitely bought a C2 for lockdown otherwise.

So walking is the main source of exercise. But as it gets drier I'll be doing slam ball work again cos I enjoyed that as conditioning work.

Black Sheep

I'll make a rare post that's on-topic.

C.D.C. Traces Covid Outbreaks in Gyms, Urging Stricter Precautions

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/24/health/coronavirus-gyms-outbreaks.html