Women Detained, Stripped for Involuntary Medical Check at Doha Airport

Sardonicat

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Their country their laws. You want to go back packing to Kandahar, be my guest. You are a big girl, you know the benefits and the dangers. I am not responsible for your choices or their actions.

Who the hell said you were? Are you saying it's the women's fault for choosing a flight that stops over in Qatar?

strandroad

Multipass wrote: »

In Qatar it is illegal for an unmarried woman to be pregnant. It was most likely an employee, and hopefully this incident will make the world more aware of the barbaric laws of this region, especially as applied to their ‘guest workers’/slaves.

Most likely scenario, I agree. Why would someone planning to abandon their newborn want to be on an intercontinental flight around the time of birth?
With what they did to passengers I wonder how they treated airport employees.

skooterblue2

Sardonicat wrote: »

Are you saying it's the women's fault for choosing a flight that stops over in Qatar?

You know where it wouldnt have happened? Ireland, United States, Canada, Rest of Europe, Russia.
I am not saying it was their fault but you have to assess your risks with each country. Would you visit Qatar after reading this article? I would assess the risk of it happening to me in the current climate and then make my decision based on that.

Sardonicat

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You know where it wouldnt have happened? Ireland, United States, Canada, Rest of Europe, Russia.
I am not saying it was their fault but you have to assess your risks with each country. Would you visit Qatar after reading this article? I would assess the risk of it happening to me in the current climate and then make my decision based on that.

Are you able to answer a direct question with a direct answer?

suicide_circus

440Hertz wrote: »

That’s the problem though with many countries with abysmal human rights records. On the surface of it everything is shiny, modern and normal, until you fall foul of some scenario that displeases the state.

As a gay man, I’d be extremely wary of going through certain countries, never mind visiting and I actively avoid spending money on products or services from places that would treat me as some kind of subhuman. It’s just the unfortunate reality of the world we live in and frankly, the more we fail to criticise it, the worse it gets.

I’ve often heard people singing the praises of various ultra conservative places in the Middle East, based entirely on experiencing a bubble of money & exceptional privilege of never having to have actually dealt with the regime that runs the place.

Seem a lot of the world is more concerned with cheap flights, oil wealth and shiny things than human rights.

What happened at that airport is totally unacceptable but, that’s what you’re supporting by turning a blind eye to it and just focusing on the shiny shiny oil wealth.

People who go to work and play in the likes of UAE with it's bronze age beliefs and treatment of poor foreigners, women and minorities would want to have a long hard look at themselves.

skooterblue2

strandroad wrote: »

Most likely scenario, I agree. Why would someone planning to abandon their newborn want to be on an intercontinental flight around the time of birth?
With what they did to passengers I wonder how they treated airport employees.

Go Find Loy Macedo on youtube. Dubai are sending all their low paid indian immigrant employees home. There are 4 classes of people in Dubai. Dubai Citizens, High skilled immigrants (USA, EU, Aus), Low skilled (Philippino, indian, etc) and then construction labourers and fishermen the lowest (Pakistani, indian). I think it is most likely some poor Indian or Philippino girl who felt she couldnt tell anyone. There was a panic and this is disaster it endup as.

skooterblue2

Sardonicat wrote: »

Are you able to answer a direct question with a direct answer?

CAn you ask me a question you havent pre-empted so you can give me both barrels no matter which way I answer?

Sardonicat

skooterblue2 wrote: »

CAn you ask me a question you havent pre-empted so you can give me both barrels no matter which way I answer?

I asked you a simple question which you answered by saying what you would do. That's got nothing to do with what I asked you. Do you think it's the women's own fault for choosing a flight with a stopover in Qatar?

skooterblue2

suicide_circus wrote: »

People who go to work and play in the likes of UAE with it's bronze age beliefs and treatment of poor foreigners, women and minorities would want to have a long hard look at themselves.

Why? They are paid to just come and do their jobs. They just want to come and do their work. Its not their job to solve every injustice in the world. Its like people in the entertainment industry being surprised to hear about Harvey Weinstein or Doctor Luke. You know where you are going and what the dangers are. If you dont like it dont go. Else leave the rest of us alone for wanting to better ourselves.

skooterblue2

Sardonicat wrote: »

Do you think it's the women's own fault for choosing a flight with a stopover in Qatar?

In the same situation (female 16+), I would avoid certain countries. My current wife is always saying she wants to on Safari to either Kenya or South Africa. I tell her not a hope in hell. Does make me a racist or just socially aware?

charlietheminxx

skooterblue2 wrote: »

In the same situation (female 16+), I would avoid certain countries. My current wife is always saying she wants to on Safari to either Kenya or South Africa. I tell her not a hope in hell. Does make me a racist or just socially aware?

So that's a roundabout yes then. Even though they didn't choose to travel TO that country, they were merely travelling THROUGH it, a distinction which has been pointed out many times.

I feel a bit sorry for your current wife as well.

skooterblue2

charlietheminxx wrote: »

So that's a roundabout yes then. Even though they didn't choose to travel TO that country, they were merely travelling THROUGH it, a distinction which has been pointed out many times.

I feel a bit sorry for your current wife as well.

No problem. Yeah its a bit crap but I have had relations in Rhodesia (up until as late as '85) and were happy to get out of there. My niece is half south african and is dying to see her relatives there. There are just some people you cant help. If you are not willing to recognise these tin pot dictators and their laws then dont go.

Sardonicat

skooterblue2 wrote: »

In the same situation (female 16+), I would avoid certain countries. My current wife is always saying she wants to on Safari to either Kenya or South Africa. I tell her not a hope in hell. Does make me a racist or just socially aware?

But do you think it's those women's own fault for choosing a flight with a stop over in Qatar? I'm really not interested in what you would or wouldn't do.

osarusan

"You've only yourself to blame if you get in trouble for cracking open a beer in Riyadh" is a world away from "You've only yourself to blame if airport authorities make a terribly invasive (and maybe unprecedented) decision in reaction to an abandoned newborn while you are in transit at the airport".

No comparison whatsoever between the two.

skooterblue2

Sardonicat wrote: »

But do you think it's those women's own fault for choosing a flight with a stop over in Qatar? I'm really not interested in what you would or wouldn't do.

I just think they were unlucky on that day. Once you leave the EU/USA/Western looking world, all the assumed rights you are accustomed to go out the window, that goes for men too.

skooterblue2

osarusan wrote: »

"You've only yourself to blame if you get in trouble for cracking open a beer in Riyadh" is a world away from "You've only yourself to blame if airport authorities make a terribly invasive (and maybe unprecedented) decision in reaction to an abandoned newborn while you are in transit at the airport".

No comparison whatsoever between the two.

Once again their country their laws. When you are in a third world country and in a vulnerable position, the correct answer is "that is what I was thinking myself!". You do know that a womans testimony is only worth half of that of a mans? That should give you a hint of how things are going to turn out.

Sardonicat

skooterblue2 wrote: »

I just think they were unlucky on that day. Once you leave the EU/USA/Western looking world, all the assumed rights you are accustomed to go out the window, that goes for men too.

I didn't ask if you thought they were lucky or unlucky, did I? I asked if you thought it was their fault. Can you answer that with a one word answer?

skooterblue2

Sardonicat wrote: »

I didn't ask if you thought they were lucky or unlucky, did I? I asked if you thought it was their fault. Can you answer that with a one word answer?

You want me to blame them for it? That is not going to happen. Of course it is some airport manager decision that you want to blame me for all their woes. Or is it the misfortunate girl you want to blame? All I said if I were female and over 16 I wouldnt in the country. Anything else is immaterial.

Sardonicat

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You want me to blame them for it? That is not going to happen. Of course it is some airport manager decision that you want to blame me for all their woes. Or is it the misfortunate girl you want to blame? All I said if I were female and over 16 I wouldnt in the country. Anything else is immaterial.

All I want is you to answer a very simple question! No one is blaming you. You, however, seem to be blaming the women themselves for having the temerity to book a flight with a stop over in Qatar. The fact that you won't clarify if you think it's their own fault or not coupled with remarks like 'their countries, their laws' ' well, I wouldn't go' looks a hell of a lot like you do think it's their fault,you just won't be straight up about it. You'll hide behind smug inferences instead.

skooterblue2

Sardonicat wrote: »

All I want is you to answer a very simple question! No one is blaming you. You, however, seem to be blaming the women themselves for having the temerity to book a flight with a stop over in Qatar. The fact that you won't clarify if you think it's their own fault or not coupled with remarks like 'their countries, their laws' ' well, I wouldn't go' looks a hell of a lot like you do think it's their fault,you just won't be straight up about it. You'll hide behind smug inferences instead.

Do you think Qatar is a civilised country? Would you go there? If you say "no" then you are racist. Or is it you are socially aware? It goes the other way too you know.

ceadaoin.

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You want me to blame them for it? That is not going to happen. Of course it is some airport manager decision that you want to blame me for all their woes. Or is it the misfortunate girl you want to blame? All I said if I were female and over 16 I wouldnt in the country. Anything else is immaterial.

Do you not realise that airlines have severely restricted their routes due to the pandemic, particularly going to Australia. Depending on their final destination, lots of people no longer have a choice about where they transit through. They most likely didn't actively choose to be there and they certainly shouldn't expect to be taken off a plane and sexually assaulted.

skooterblue2

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Do you not realise that airlines have severely restricted their routes due to the pandemic, particularly going to Australia. Depending on their final destination, lots of people no longer have a choice about where they transit through. They most likely didn't actively choose to be there and they certainly shouldn't expect to be taken off a plane and sexually assaulted.

Yes. I also realise I have a fairly firm position that I have no desire to visit any african country, Hence I do not go there, or take the risk of accidentally being there. Hence I have not contracted malaria or become embroiled with some dodgy government officials in certain countries.

osarusan

Not just one flight by the sounds of it, 'flights'.

I just can't get over how, between finding the newborn and actually doing the examinations, nobody involved caught on to how it would look internationally.

Qatar's government apologised and said the baby was safe in medical care.

It said the baby girl had been found in a plastic bag, buried under rubbish, prompting an "immediate search for the parents, including on flights in the vicinity of where the newborn was found".

"While the aim of the urgently-decided search was to prevent the perpetrators of the horrible crime from escaping, the State of Qatar regrets any distress or infringement on the personal freedoms of any traveller caused by this action," a statement read.

The government had directed a "comprehensive, transparent investigation" into the incident, and said it would share the results with other countries.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-54714472

skooterblue2

osarusan wrote: »

Not just one flight by the sounds of it, 'flights'.

I just can't get over how, between finding the newborn and actually doing the examinations, nobody involved caught on to how it would look internationally.



https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-54714472

that is what I thought. 17 Sounded a bit low from just one country.. Its Qatar, they aren't part of the EU, its not like they have to listen to anyone because they own a lot of international debt relative to their size. IF you want to take if further, they will take it to the next OPEC meeting and you could see oil and Gas production slowing up also they own a lot of renewable technologies they bought up in the 1970's.

You are going to need a big stick to rattle the Qatari cage.

joseywhales

donegal_man wrote: »

This was an appalling violation of the women's human rights and bodily integrity and whoever authorised it should should be at the very least dismissed from his post.
However, the calls on here for all Muslim women in the west to be similarly assaulted are also appalling.

I mean if we want to be fair handed about it, we should cavity search a few dozen wealthy muslim men, since they are the ones with the decision making power in these countries. We can say we found a bag of coke in the toilet.

ohnonotgmail

osarusan wrote: »

Not just one flight by the sounds of it, 'flights'.

I just can't get over how, between finding the newborn and actually doing the examinations, nobody involved caught on to how it would look internationally.



https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-54714472

what was that some people were saying to justify this, that they were trying to find the woman in case she needed medical aid? well the statement from the qatari government has cleared that up.

skooterblue2

joseywhales wrote: »

I mean if we want to be fair handed about it, we should cavity search a few dozen wealthy muslim men, since they are the ones with the decision making power in these countries. We can say we found a bag of coke in the toilet.

You will find that most wealthy muslim men are members of the extended royal family and probably have diplomatic immunity. Not worth the trouble considering the repercussions

nomdeboardie

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Actually the DoFA does issue warning of countries you should be aware of.
I have been abroad and I was in situation where I felt I needed to complain about the quality of whiskey in the night club (it was clear to me it was knocked off). I considered my position. Nobody at home knew I was in that night club, the bouncers looked like they were at tryouts for the mafia, the probability of being taken out and given a hiding was fairly high. I reconsidered my position. I stayed quiet and drank Heineken long necks and went home safe and sound afterwards.

Its not always about the laws sometimes its about the culture. There is very litte the DoFA can do over there in that timeline. You have to be aware of your place in society and who you are dealing with.

Sure, but to be fair to any of the women who were just passing through on a stopover, at least, they could hardly have forseen their predicament :rolleyes:

skooterblue2

nomdeboardie wrote: »

Sure, but to be fair to any of the women who were just passing through on a stopover, at least, they could hardly have forseen their predicament :rolleyes:

Have you learned nothing from the Spanish Inquisition?, expect the unexpected. In these tinpot dictatorships you can the government change in half an hour. Didnt the crown prince in Nepal gun down his own Royal family in one room? He would have done it sooner only he stopped to have a cigarette at the end. He killed 9 members of his own family. Then I imagine he wanted to clean house and dispose of the people who backed him. You want to go looking for predictability among these people?