“S” Moderator

Vizzy

Lmklad wrote: »

Got a reply, and not from the local Super but from their Firearms Policy Section in Garda Headquarters, “you are indeed correct, an application has to be made for each silencer. The “S” on the certificate relates to use with the firearm listed on the certificate”

FO showed me the email be got.

But the "firearm" ( the silencer in this case), is not listed on the certificate.

cookimonster

Lmklad wrote: »

Got a reply, and not from the local Super but from their Firearms Policy Section in Garda Headquarters, “you are indeed correct, an application has to be made for each silencer. The “S” on the certificate relates to use with the firearm listed on the certificate”

FO showed me the email be got.

I don't know if it's because I haven't had my third morning coffee, but I call Bullsh1t on that....

As pointed out we don't get issued licences, certificates etc, etc for moderators or NV gear, we get authorisation. Altough the moderator is classed as a firearm there is nothing laid down on how this item is recorded on the system other then the individual is authorised to process one.

The mistake I see here in the above statement is a misunderstanding of the following 'an application has to be made for each silencer'. In other words my authorization for a moderator for my .270 doesn't mean I am authorised to use it on my 30-06. Each firearm is individually authorised, but it doesn't stop me from going out and buying various moderators for each and every authorised firearm.

The joke is I don't even have a moderator for the .270 (and never will) altough I am authorised for one and if one day I buy a double rifle I will most likely look for authorisation for that along with use of NV, because you never know what's around the corner.

Sparks

Technically, it's not an authorisation though cookie - authorisations are governed by section 2, paragraph 5 and they're constrained - a super can't authorise anything not explicitly listed in "the possession, use or carriage of firearms or ammunition in that district in any of the circumstances specified in paragraphs (d), (e), (f), (g), (h), (j) or (k) of subsection (4) of this section, or of any component parts of a firearm, during such period, not exceeding one year, as may be specified in the authorisation." and that means you couldn't authorise a moderator for hunting, for example.
Also, just below that bit, it says "(6) In subsections (3)(g) and (4) (other than paragraphs (i) and (k)), references to a firearm or ammunition do not include references to a restricted firearm or restricted ammunition." meaning that any restricted firearm's moderator (or NV gear or anything else) can't be covered by an authorisation either.

So most of the moderators in this country have to be licenced (because most are for hunters and hunting isn't part of the paragraphs they're talking about); we don't get individual licences for them purely because it's always been less hassle for AGS to treat them as component parts, and the law even refers to them as being component parts (well, arguably, anyway - they're listed explicitly when section one describes what a component part is).

Really, this is on the list of "things which should have been sorted out years ago" but you'd have to be able to get a firearms bill through the Dail without every press-hungry muppet in the place looking to put their thumbprints on it to either tell rural voters they helped or urban voters that they're tough on crime (nb. both of which statements would be what we'd - in polite company - call lies). This is a huge part of why Irish firearms leglislation is, well, a dog's breakfast of a thing at the best of times.

cookimonster

Sparks wrote: »

This is a huge part of why Irish firearms leglislation is, well, a dog's breakfast of a thing at the best of times.

Thanks for the clarification and the brilliant analogy.

zeissman

My mate recently renewed his 308 stalking rifle licence and applied for a moderator.
It was granted but it says on the letter that the moderator can only be used for vermin shooting.
Can the super do this ?

BattleCorp

Lmklad wrote: »

Got a reply, and not from the local Super but from their Firearms Policy Section in Garda Headquarters, “you are indeed correct, an application has to be made for each silencer. The “S” on the certificate relates to use with the firearm listed on the certificate”

FO showed me the email be got.

Maybe I'm reading the above paragraph incorrectly.

I fully understand that if you want to put a silencer on your gun, licence number 12345, then you need the magic S on your licence to use a silencer on that gun (12345). 100% clear on that.

But if you have two silencers that fit that gun (maybe one for target shooting and one for hunting), how do you make an application for the second silencer? You can't. So how is the paragraph I quoted above correct?

Chiparus

:rolleyes:So if I want a new one to I submit it as a substitiution or a new application?:rolleyes:

BattleCorp

Chiparus wrote: »

So if I want a new one to I submit it as a substitiution or a new application?

I'm happy to be corrected but if you already have an S on your licence, then you just go ahead and buy a new silencer and you don't need to do anything else.


You were being sarcastic I see. I answered before you added in the rolls eyes emoji.

solarwinds

And now the AGS have been asked the question (unnecessarily in my opinion) that Pandora's box is now opened.

solarwinds

solarwinds wrote: »

And now the AGS have been asked the question (unnecessarily in my opinion) that Pandora's box is now opened.

And now you can bet that the most restrictive interpretation will be the rule.

Lmklad

zeissman wrote: »

My mate recently renewed his 308 stalking rifle licence and applied for a moderator.
It was granted but it says on the letter that the moderator can only be used for vermin shooting.
Can the super do this ?

No he can’t. A 308 cannot be used for vermin shooting lol. Might be worth it for your mate to point that out.

solarwinds

Lmklad wrote: »

No he can’t. A 308 cannot be used for vermin shooting lol. Might be worth it for your mate to point that out.

Why can't a .308 be used for vermin ?. Granted, a bit on the larger side but if its your only rifle and have a licence for it why not, if you state on your application your intended use.
I know plenty using .243 for foxes, I used a Swede myself for years.

zeissman

solarwinds wrote: »

Why can't a .308 be used for vermin ?. Granted, a bit on the larger side but if its your only rifle and have a licence for it why not, if you state on your application your intended use.
I know plenty using .243 for foxes, I used a Swede myself for years.

That is correct. You can use your 308 for vermin.

Feisar

Lmklad wrote: »

No he can’t. A 308 cannot be used for vermin shooting lol. Might be worth it for your mate to point that out.

Ya don't wanna see what a Hornady 150 gr TAP in .308 does to a fox!

Cass

Surprisingly its not "that" devastating.

I've used my 308 for the occasional fox (coincidence more so than purpose act). BT 150gr. It makes a tidy entry hole and a fist size exit hole. However it also dumps all energy on impact so while i make sure there is a safe area behind or back stop it rarely goes much beyond the animal when hit. Heads shots are a different kettle of Fish.

cookimonster

Feisar wrote: »

Ya don't wanna see what a Hornady 150 gr TAP in .308 does to a fox!

Sako Hammerhead 150gr SP 30-06,...... dead is dead.