Your New WHS Index

joebloggs32

redhill wrote: »

Wee chart for most types of competition

I don't know what a tracker mortgage is......



This new system really is all greek to me. Cant get my head around any of it.

big_drive

prawnsambo wrote: »

In order of handicap from lowest to highest: 25%, 20%, 15%, 10%.

Is that of course handicap or whs index?
If index, do you use exact index?

Also if two people are same handicap which is listed first, as the % applied to each player is different?

Suppose youd 4 players with following whs indexes

12.3, 14.2, 14.2, 21.6

How's it worked for that group?

hurleronditch

big_drive wrote: »

Is that of course handicap or whs index?
If index, do you use exact index?

Also if two people are same handicap which is listed first, as the % applied to each player is different?

Suppose youd 4 players with following whs indexes

12.3, 14.2, 14.2, 21.6

How's it worked for that group?

Ive never seen that method before but it looks like 10.2 by my calculations, if it’s a scramble you play off a shared handicap so it doesn’t matter if player B or player C has their handicap divided by 15 or 20%, the outcome will be the same for the team.

I feel like that method for a 4 man team gives you quite a high handicap allowance - when I was involved with a society we used use 1/6th the combined for a 3 man scramble and 1/10th for a 4 man. Under those methods the above listed 4 players would have been off 6.3 under the 1/10th rule

prawnsambo

big_drive wrote: »

Is that of course handicap or whs index?
If index, do you use exact index?

Also if two people are same handicap which is listed first, as the % applied to each player is different?

Suppose youd 4 players with following whs indexes

12.3, 14.2, 14.2, 21.6

How's it worked for that group?

It's course handicap. Same as for any other form of play. course handicap is reduced by a percentage to give playing handicap. In the case where two players have the same course handicap, one gets the higher and one gets the lower. Basically decide yourselves I would imagine. Or you could allocate depending on handicap index. Somebody on 14.4 would be on the same course handicap as someone on 13.6. As said above, it's a team handicap, so it really doesn't matter which method you use.

prawnsambo

joebloggs32 wrote: »

I don't know what a tracker mortgage is......

This new system really is all greek to me. Cant get my head around any of it.

There are plenty of explainer videos on the Golf Ireland website. It's not that difficult. Just forget about anything CONGU used to do, it's all gone.

Seve OB

That scramble crap is just a big load of crap.
Scramble is not counting and basically people can run scrambles however the like

Whoever came up with that hair brained idea didn’t really think it through did they?

I reckon anyone running a scramble will or at least should stick to the tried and tested 10% rule. Do they really need to be giving a maths lesson to every group before their tee times????????

Brusna

Seve OB wrote: »

That scramble crap is just a big load of crap.
Scramble is not counting and basically people can run scrambles however the like

Whoever came up with that hair brained idea didn’t really think it through did they?

I reckon anyone running a scramble will or at least should stick to the tried and tested 10% rule. Do they really need to be giving a maths lesson to every group before their tee times????????

It’s not, it’s a far fairer system. The 10% method is unfair and gives low handicap team captains a big advantage.

Everyone knows that scrambles are dominated by the low handicap player on the team.

You could have a 3 handicap player given a team handicap of 6 and give him 3 players to help him.
He is getting a 3 shot higher handicap than he usually needs on his own.

In the same competition you cold have a 12 handicap player as team captain with a team handicap of 7. 5 shots less than he usually needs.

How is that fair? Just because it’s the way it was always done doesn’t mean it’s the right way.

Russman

prawnsambo wrote: »

There are plenty of explainer videos on the Golf Ireland website. It's not that difficult. Just forget about anything CONGU used to do, it's all gone.

This is the most important point IMO with regard to understanding the new system. You need to not try to compare any aspect of it with CONGU and try to forget any long held beliefs about CONGU or handicaps, its all new.

Or just accept what the computer prints out on your card and away you go and just play golf

Seve OB

Brusna wrote: »

It’s not, it’s a far fairer system. The 10% method is unfair and gives low handicap team captains a big advantage.

Everyone knows that scrambles are dominated by the low handicap player on the team.

You could have a 3 handicap player given a team handicap of 6 and give him 3 players to help him.
He is getting a 3 shot higher handicap than he usually needs on his own.

In the same competition you cold have a 12 handicap player as team captain with a team handicap of 7. 5 shots less than he usually needs.

How is that fair? Just because it’s the way it was always done doesn’t mean it’s the right way.

Hmmm, did you crunch the numbers?

a team with 4 18 handicappers will get a 75% increase on their team handicap with the new system.

a team with 3 18 handicappers and a 3 handicapper will get an increase of 95% on their team handicap

overall it's not going to make any difference. scrambles are only meant to be a bit of craic

callaway92

On the above being a 4 man example, what’s the 3 person example?

ie 9 Hole Scramble - What way are handicaps for that under the new system?

moycullen14

I'm a member of two clubs (posh!). I can log into masterscoreboard for either club. On one it says my H/C index is 9.9 and the other it says 10.6. Both are 'supplied from Golf Ireland.

Club 1:
Handicap Index = 9.9
as at Friday, 4 June 2021 13:22

Handicap Index values calculated and supplied by Golf Ireland

Your official Handicap Index may be viewed at https://www.golfireland.ie/my-golf-login

Club 2:
Handicap Index = 10.6
as at Friday, 4 June 2021 10:51

Handicap Index values calculated and supplied by Golf Ireland

Your official Handicap Index may be viewed at https://www.golfireland.ie/my-golf-login


I thought you were supposed to have one index. Is this some oddity on masterscoreboard or do I have two indexes depending on which club I play? Confused.

My National Handicap ID is the same in both cases.

Frisbee

Hey this probably isn't the correct thread but closest one that fits the query. And also runs into moycullens query above. How does being a member of two clubs work?

I live right beside a club (actually right beside, I could be on the first tee in 3 minutes from my desk) but they are closed for membership. However there might be some 5 Day Membership openings coming up.

So say I joined there as a 5 Day member, and continued to be a member in my existing club (mainly for the ability to play weekends) how would that work particularly with the BRS app. Would I have an option to book into either club on the app at the same time? e.g. pick a profile within it?

Seve OB

moycullen14 wrote: »

I'm a member of two clubs (posh!). I can log into masterscoreboard for either club. On one it says my H/C index is 9.9 and the other it says 10.6. Both are 'supplied from Golf Ireland.

Club 1:
Handicap Index = 9.9
as at Friday, 4 June 2021 13:22

Handicap Index values calculated and supplied by Golf Ireland

Your official Handicap Index may be viewed at https://www.golfireland.ie/my-golf-login

Club 2:
Handicap Index = 10.6
as at Friday, 4 June 2021 10:51

Handicap Index values calculated and supplied by Golf Ireland

Your official Handicap Index may be viewed at https://www.golfireland.ie/my-golf-login


I thought you were supposed to have one index. Is this some oddity on masterscoreboard or do I have two indexes depending on which club I play? Confused.

My National Handicap ID is the same in both cases.

Firstly masterscoreboard has actually nothing to do with your handicap. have you even bothered logging into Golf Ireland?

Do you by any chance pay GUI fees to both clubs? Possible you have two different GUI profiles/numbers?

You will need to ask your secondary club to link your profiles and you shouldn’t be paying them a GUI fee

Seve OB

Frisbee wrote: »

Hey this probably isn't the correct thread but closest one that fits the query. And also runs into moycullens query above. How does being a member of two clubs work?

I live right beside a club (actually right beside, I could be on the first tee in 3 minutes from my desk) but they are closed for membership. However there might be some 5 Day Membership openings coming up.

So say I joined there as a 5 Day member, and continued to be a member in my existing club (mainly for the ability to play weekends) how would that work particularly with the BRS app. Would I have an option to book into either club on the app at the same time? e.g. pick a profile within it?

No. If both clubs use BRS they are separate and will be separate logins.

prawnsambo

moycullen14 wrote: »

I'm a member of two clubs (posh!). I can log into masterscoreboard for either club. On one it says my H/C index is 9.9 and the other it says 10.6. Both are 'supplied from Golf Ireland.

Club 1:
Handicap Index = 9.9
as at Friday, 4 June 2021 13:22

Handicap Index values calculated and supplied by Golf Ireland

Your official Handicap Index may be viewed at https://www.golfireland.ie/my-golf-login

Club 2:
Handicap Index = 10.6
as at Friday, 4 June 2021 10:51

Handicap Index values calculated and supplied by Golf Ireland

Your official Handicap Index may be viewed at https://www.golfireland.ie/my-golf-login


I thought you were supposed to have one index. Is this some oddity on masterscoreboard or do I have two indexes depending on which club I play? Confused.

My National Handicap ID is the same in both cases.

This sounds like you are using two numbers and have designated both clubs as your home club. As a result you now have two handicap indexes.

You need to sort this quickly. It's your responsibility to nominate a home club. You will have to inform both handicap secretaries and the one at your nominated home club will have the unenviable task of merging your records.

I may be wrong here, but I encountered a similar situation recently and it was a mess to sort out.

Frisbee

Seve OB wrote: »

No. If both clubs use BRS they are separate and will be separate logins.

Ok that makes sense, cheers!

joebloggs32

Russman wrote: »

This is the most important point IMO with regard to understanding the new system. You need to not try to compare any aspect of it with CONGU and try to forget any long held beliefs about CONGU or handicaps, its all new.

Or just accept what the computer prints out on your card and away you go and just play golf

Thats what i have been doing.

Play my round, record my score and let the computer work out my points

hurleronditch

Brusna wrote: »

It’s not, it’s a far fairer system. The 10% method is unfair and gives low handicap team captains a big advantage.

Everyone knows that scrambles are dominated by the low handicap player on the team.

You could have a 3 handicap player given a team handicap of 6 and give him 3 players to help him.
He is getting a 3 shot higher handicap than he usually needs on his own.

In the same competition you cold have a 12 handicap player as team captain with a team handicap of 7. 5 shots less than he usually needs.

How is that fair? Just because it’s the way it was always done doesn’t mean it’s the right way.

In your example, both the 3 and the 12 handicapper are playing with 3*20 handicappers to make up their teams to get to a 6 and a 7 handicap.

Under the revised system, the 3 handicapper would have 10 shots for his team, and the 12 would have 12 for the team.

So it’s added a unnecessary complexity for what is a fun format, and doesn’t really address the issue you highlighted. It’s totally fair that a 12 handicapper has to play to a much lower handicap for a scramble, it’s a scramble after all. A 12 will hit no more than half the counting shots for his team I would wager

Seve OB

prawnsambo wrote: »

This sounds like you are using two numbers and have designated both clubs as your home club. As a result you now have two handicap indexes.

You need to sort this quickly. It's your responsibility to nominate a home club. You will have to inform both handicap secretaries and the one at your nominated home club will have the unenviable task of merging your records.

I may be wrong here, but I encountered a similar situation recently and it was a mess to sort out.

I’m also a member of 2 clubs so have just gone through this although I did only have a single handicap record.

I agree with your thoughts that it does sound like poster has 2 records, hence my questions above. And if so it would be a lot more complicated than my situation.

Anyway, I was just going to say, it was my away club which had to sort the merger out, but Iay have been slightly different

Brusna

hurleronditch wrote: »

In your example, both the 3 and the 12 handicapper are playing with 3*20 handicappers to make up their teams to get to a 6 and a 7 handicap.

Under the revised system, the 3 handicapper would have 10 shots for his team, and the 12 would have 12 for the team.

So it’s added a unnecessary complexity for what is a fun format, and doesn’t really address the issue you highlighted. It’s totally fair that a 12 handicapper has to play to a much lower handicap for a scramble, it’s a scramble after all. A 12 will hit no more than half the counting shots for his team I would wager

And is it totally fair that a 3 handicapper has to play to a much higher handicap in a scramble?

In your example it’s actually a two shot swing back to the higher handicap team. Yeah it doesn’t fully address the issue but it helps.

But you think we should just ignore that and stick with the old system just because it’s easier to work out the handicap!

Brusna

Seve OB wrote: »

I’m also a member of 2 clubs so have just gone through this although I did only have a single handicap record.

I agree with your thoughts that it does sound like poster has 2 records, hence my questions above. And if so it would be a lot more complicated than my situation.

Anyway, I was just going to say, it was my away club which had to sort the merger out, but Iay have been slightly different

Yes it’s the secondary club that has to sort it. I had to deal with this exact situation yesterday. I resigned the member and then reinstated him as an away member.

His rounds on our system then disappeared and I had to manually put them back on his record at his home club. Luckily for me he only had 4 rounds on our record so it wasn’t too bad but still took a bit of time to sort it out.

prawnsambo

Brusna wrote: »

Yes it’s the secondary club that has to sort it. I had to deal with this exact situation yesterday. I resigned the member and then reinstated him as an away member.

His rounds on our system then disappeared and I had to manually put them back on his record at his home club. Luckily for me he only had 4 rounds on our record so it wasn’t too bad but still took a bit of time to sort it out.

The one we had happened before the changeover. We knew the member was a member of another club, but didn't know he had both as home clubs. It was spotted when he had won a comp in his other club with >36 points but it didn't show up on our records. So the situation was a bit different then. But it was the other home club that had to update the records then. A lot of phone calls and emails to get it sorted.

Brusna

Seve OB wrote: »

Hmmm, did you crunch the numbers?

a team with 4 18 handicappers will get a 75% increase on their team handicap with the new system.

a team with 3 18 handicappers and a 3 handicapper will get an increase of 95% on their team handicap

overall it's not going to make any difference. scrambles are only meant to be a bit of craic

In your example it’s also a two shot swing to the higher handicap team.

But yeah we should just ignore that because a scramble is only a bit of craic!

Would you prefer a much simpler no handicap scramble or stick with the 10% method?

Brusna

prawnsambo wrote: »

The one we had happened before the changeover. We knew the member was a member of another club, but didn't know he had both as home clubs. It was spotted when he had won a comp in his other club with >36 points but it didn't show up on our records. So the situation was a bit different then. But it was the other home club that had to update the records then. A lot of phone calls and emails to get it sorted.

It’s head wrecking being a handicap secretary at the moment!

Seve OB

Brusna wrote: »

In your example it’s also a two shot swing to the higher handicap team.

But yeah we should just ignore that because a scramble is only a bit of craic!

Would you prefer a much simpler no handicap scramble or stick with the 10% method?

You seem to be getting very worked up over a scramble.

And I still don’t see anything to say this new Caroll vorderman method is any fairer

Brusna

Seve OB wrote: »

You seem to be getting very worked up over a scramble.

And I still don’t see anything to say this new Caroll vorderman method is any fairer

Well in the example you gave it’s two shots fairer but you don’t see it so fair enough and you were the one who said “ That scramble crap is just a big load of crap.” I have no interest in scrambles but comments like that do annoy me yeah. But maybe I’m more sensitive to it now because I’m listening to crap like this pretty much every time I go to the club.

Rant over, we’ll move on.

big_drive

Another query somebody might be able to confirm. Am I correct in saying a score only counts after midnight. I've a score gone up today that appears in orange like as if non counting but it's actually the best score I have had.
Am I correct in saying that will go green and become counting after midnight tonight?

finglashoop

big_drive wrote: »

Another query somebody might be able to confirm. Am I correct in saying a score only counts after midnight. I've a score gone up today that appears in orange like as if non counting but it's actually the best score I have had.
Am I correct in saying that will go green and become counting after midnight tonight?

yep

goes up as white then overnight it gets added to counting scores if good enough

Dayor Knight

Brusna wrote: »

Yes it’s the secondary club that has to sort it. I had to deal with this exact situation yesterday. I resigned the member and then reinstated him as an away member.

His rounds on our system then disappeared and I had to manually put them back on his record at his home club. Luckily for me he only had 4 rounds on our record so it wasn’t too bad but still took a bit of time to sort it out.

Gents,

Another two club situation I hope you can clarify for me - I joined a second club closer to home last Summer. Played mainly casual golf there and a couple of open competitions using my home club G.I. number. Couldn't sign in to competitions on my new club G.I. number, contacted handicap sec and he asked me to get a handicap cert from my home club so he could set me up as an 'away' member. That was before WHS introduction and lockdown, so I'm only sorting it out now...

Under WHS, should the secondary club just link my record to my home club record so that the handicap records are automatically updated? (I have no separate records under the new club as yet).

Is there any need (or point) for me to get a handicap record from my home club to get this set up?


Any info appreciated..

Thanks

dan_ep82

Played an away round today and the score that showed up on my GolfIreland is wrong by a long way, anything I can do?

It's not a winning score or even a cut but its very wrong.
I went birdie,double,par,scratch and its showing dbl,bogey,scratch,par


*18th showing as a scratch aswell that I had a bogie on. Difference of six shots from first and last holes. Emailed them to see if the can check the card.