Labour's Corbyn suspended for reaction to anti-semitism report

suicide_circus

Were the commission wrong?

bunderoon

suicide_circus wrote: »

Were the commission wrong?

None of us can say, can we?
Where is the evidence so we can see it?
What were the definitions and terms used?
Who are the members of the commission? Do we know if they have bias?



You see how all our commissions pan out. We all know they are never right.
They are set up to come to one outcome and one outcome only.

suicide_circus

Jewish conspiracy is it?

biko

I just found the Panorama show

Plenty testimonies about Labour anti-Semitism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4Qq_M_0RaE

bunderoon

suicide_circus wrote: »

Jewish conspiracy is it?

Are you stooping to that level now? Come back up to where we are and be an adult.

If a charge is made to anyone about anything, evidence is needed. Simple as.

fiveleavesleft

suicide_circus wrote: »

You'll have to ask the Equality and Human Rights Commission who seem to think there were problems.

Problems is an understatement. It was absolutely insane the stuff that was going on. Corbyn had a hell of a job trying to get a handle on it.

It's such a shame he didn't get control earlier. Maybe he could have done more or maybe he couldn't. It was a very difficult situation, the report even damns him for doing too much!:eek:!

bunderoon

biko wrote: »

I just found the Panorama show

Plenty testimonies about Labour anti-Semitism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4Qq_M_0RaE

Thanks, I'll have to give that a watch.

fiveleavesleft

biko wrote: »

I just found the Panorama show

Plenty testimonies about Labour anti-Semitism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4Qq_M_0RaE

Be very wary of this show. The reports show some of the people interviewed were actively using (even boasting about it) anti-semitism to smear Corbyn.

bunderoon

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Be very wary of this show. The reports show some of the people interviewed were actively using (even boasting about it) anti-semitism to smear Corbyn.

Hopefully it wont be 60mins wasted. But if its just people giving unsupported anecdotes, then it wont be much of a reliable source.

breezy1985

bunderoon wrote: »

Hopefully it wont be 60mins wasted. But if its just people giving unsupported anecdotes, then it wont be much of a reliable source.

It is mostly talking heads telling personal stories

fiveleavesleft

bunderoon wrote: »

Hopefully it wont be 60mins wasted. But if its just people giving unsupported anecdotes, then it wont be much of a reliable source.

It's a bit of a hatchet job. Give it a watch but the reports show some of the interviewee's (Matthews, Hogan & McNicoll) were lying & they sought to use anti-semitism as weapon against Corbyn.

biko

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Give it a watch but the reports show some of the interviewee's (Matthews, Hogan & McNicoll) were lying & they sought to use anti-semitism as weapon against Corbyn.

What reports?

biko

This is a guess of course but if someone is fervently pro-Palestine then they are probably as fervently anti-Israel.
And if someone are anti-Israel and a bit stupid they become anti-Jewish because they cannot separate things.

Can Corbyn, fervently pro-Palestine, be blamed for anti-Jewish stupid party members?
Yes, if he cannot root them out of the party.

fiveleavesleft

biko wrote: »

What reports?

The EHRC report & the leaked Labour report which the EHRC one is based on.

biko

This is the EHRC report
https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/investigation-into-antisemitism-in-the-labour-party.pdf

It doesn't mention any of those 3 names.

Gervais08

joemurt wrote: »

Not bad faith at all mate.


You set the criteria. I matched it. Facts are facts. Sorry if they make you look silly.


You should apologize.



Own your mistake.

As should you - for not knowing the difference between Mossad and Judaism.

fiveleavesleft

biko wrote: »

This is the EHRC report
https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/sites/default/files/investigation-into-antisemitism-in-the-labour-party.pdf

It doesn't mention any of those 3 names.

Yep the juicy stuff is in the leaked Labour Party report:D. The EHRC use it as the base of their one, sometimes relaying stuff verbatim. Seek it out, it's a fun read.

biko

Can you link to the leaked report?
We need proof, no offence.
You made the claim they lied, so I think you should provide the proof.

fiveleavesleft

biko wrote: »

Can you link to the leaked report?
We need proof, no offence.

I'll have a look, read it during lockdown.

biko

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Be very wary of this show. The reports show some of the people interviewed were actively using (even boasting about it) anti-semitism to smear Corbyn.

I assume these are the three you mentioned earlier?
It's really difficult to trust what you say without any proof.

fiveleavesleft

biko wrote: »

Can you link to the leaked report?
We need proof, no offence.
You made the claim they lied, so I think you should provide the proof.

Here ya go.
https://cryptome.org/2020/04/Labour-Antisemitism-Report.pdf

bunderoon

biko wrote: »

This is a guess of course but if someone is fervently pro-Palestine then they are probably as fervently anti-Israel.
And if someone are anti-Israel and a bit stupid they become anti-Jewish because they cannot separate things.

Can Corbyn, fervently pro-Palestine, be blamed for anti-Jewish stupid party members?
Yes, if he cannot root them out of the party.

I'm pro-Palestine and Pro-Israel.
I disagree with the violence, but understand why its happening.
I disagree with actions on both sides. And this doesnt make me an Islamophobe or Antisemite.

Disagreeing with Israel's policies is not anti-Jewish or anti-Israel.

You shouldn't oversimplify things by saying well if this person is this, then they must be that. Again, disingenuous and promotes ignorance.

end of the road

suicide_circus wrote: »

Jewish conspiracy is it?

nope, you had the following.
1. people who did not want to except corbyn as leader and who would do whatever to get him out, including the stifeling of any investigations into no. 2 below.

2. a small number of genuine antisemetic incidents, mainly social media based by a mix of some labour supporters and infiltrators most likely from the tories and alt right.
3. the alt right who wanted boris in power as their version of trump (or so they thought he would be) .

stick that all together and you have what we have.

biko

bunderoon wrote: »

Disagreeing with Israel's policies is not anti-Jewish or anti-Israel.

Good, it appears you can separate "church and state".

bunderoon

biko wrote: »

Good, it appears you can separate "church and state".

I can surely.

So from today, have you learned anything going forward about not believing everything you hear in the news?

biko

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

Here ya go.
https://cryptome.org/2020/04/Labour-Antisemitism-Report.pdf

Thanks, of course it's still unknown if this is even a real document or just something written by anyone and uploaded to that site.

But let's discuss it anyway.
It's 850 pages. What am I looking for to see your assertions of them lying?

joemurt

Gervais08 wrote: »

As should you - for not knowing the difference between Mossad and Judaism.

You should just stop replying with silliness. It just makes you look even sillier. Apologies are simple.



I know the difference between the two. Obviously you don't know the the process and requirements of becoming an agent of mossad or you wouldn't be attempting this silly game to save face. Weak.

joemurt

biko wrote: »

I suppose it goes to show that anyone can do or say something anti-Semitic, also Jewish people.
Is it an excuse? No.

Agree its no excuse. There is no excuse for any form of racism.



Its just odd that some people can be racist and prosper, while others can be anti racist and be ostracized.



And no, the n word argument you put forward doesn't work. It was racist and wrong, like the n word.

joemurt

biko wrote: »

What reports?

John Ware produced the Panorama episode provided. He doesn't have a great track record.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ware_(TV_journalist)


Labour submitted a formal complaint about the programme to the BBC, but the BBC’s Executive Complaints Unit rejected this.[23][24] Over 20 complaints of bias were taken to Ofcom, who ruled that the programme had in fact been "duly impartial" and had given appropriate weight to Labour's position


BBC had to pay damages for another one of his episodes demonizing a Muslim group.

biko

joemurt wrote: »

John Ware produced the Panorama episode provided. He doesn't have a great track record.

So he made those Labour members say those things?
Seems unlikely.

joemurt wrote: »

BBC had to pay damages for another one of his episodes demonizing a Muslim group.

What happened was a photograph on screen included a Mr Yaqub who was General Manager of Islamic Relief UK. Yaqub was not part of the programme, but was in the photo.

BBC wished to make clear that they did not intend to include Mr Yaqub as a subject of the Panorama programme complained of,
and had still less intended to defame him.

The BBC agreed to pay damages to Mr Yaqub over the inclusion of the picture in the programme.