France vs Ireland...England $hat the bed..it's on!

Enquiring

molloyjh wrote: »

Exactly how has Sexton been poor? I'd love for someone to enlighten me on this as it seems to be a given with some people. I mean, sure he isn't at his best any more. But at his best he was the best in the world. So holding him to that standard is crazy. But what exactly about his game is poor?

His running of the backline, decision making, kicking and so on have been poor. Just compare him with his opposite number yesterday and you see the difference between a top level 10 and an average one. Let's not forget that Ireland had more of the ball.

Skeetur

Enquiring wrote: »

Sexton would really have thrown a tantrum if he was taken off earlier.

They probably should have been put on earlier but at the end of the day, both Gibson Park and Byrne are not up to this level and unfortunately, Murray and Sexton aren't either. That leaves us in a tough spot.

He would probably throw a tantrum regardless but he just wouldn't be right to be mad if Byrne was getting a decent chance to change things.

It's a tough spot but Farrell should have backed someone when the game was still winnable.

molloyjh

Enquiring wrote: »

His running of the backline, decision making, kicking and so on have been poor. Just compare him with his opposite number yesterday and you see the difference between a top level 10 and an average one. Let's not forget that Ireland had more of the ball.

Sorry, thats just identifying the things a 10 does. In what way was Sexton poor in those areas though? You're not actually explaining your point at all.

Lets take his kicking for example. His restarts were all contestable yesterday. His kicking from the tee was perfect. That little grubber for Keenan was a beauty, we just got a bit unlucky the last bounce. Some of his touch finds were excellent (even if the camera work didn't always show it - remember the roar from the sideline when he hit a lovely one in the first half?). He missed touch with 1 penalty and made a bit of a balls of a cross field when we had advantage. But overall his kicking game yesterday was pretty good.

WhoamI2022

Trey13 wrote: »

Well as regards hooker, Ronan Kelleher played 40 minutes this championship. Sure he was given his debut but he was thrown on for the last 7 minutes against Scotland and last 13 minutes against Wales. Fair enough he got 20 minutes against England but with the way he was playing for Leinster, I’d have expected him to start either against Scotland or Wales. So, yes he got a debut, but minimal meaningful gametime.

What do you mean entire new backrow? Dorris and Connors have been given chances yes. And that’s been brilliant to see. Max Deegan got 10 minutes aswell. But Stander is still our 8. It’s not an entire new backrow in personnel. Then you’ve got POM who has featured a lot throughout.

Fair enough we have given Larmour and Stockdale a go. I don’t think Stockdale is good enough at 15 but I’m happy we have given him a go there and we know what he’s like there.

And Keenan has been on the wing for the last two games. That’s been brilliant. He’s looked enthusiastic and lively, a good example of giving a young player a shot.

Overall, I don’t massively disagree with your post that we’ve made progress. I think we have made some. But I think Kelleher should have got more than 40 minutes in this championship. I think we should have started someone other than Murray or Sexton at 9/10 at some stage. I’m happy with the progress made in the back 3 though yes.

Will leave you to it ....

Car99

almostover wrote: »

The problem is that Sexton is on the decline and we've nobody in the wings to take over. When O'Gara was in a similar position Sexton was more than good enough to be an international 10. Ross Byrne et al nowhere near the standard

Our only hope is Joey recovers well in the near future.

magic17

Can the thread title be changed to "Ireland $hat the bed... it's off!"?

WhoamI2022

molloyjh wrote: »

Sorry, thats just identifying the things a 10 does. In what way was Sexton poor in those areas though? You're not actually explaining your point at all.

Lets take his kicking for example. His restarts were all contestable yesterday. His kicking from the tee was perfect. That little grubber for Keenan was a beauty, we just got a bit unlucky the last bounce. Some of his touch finds were excellent (even if the camera work didn't always show it - remember the roar from the sideline when he hit a lovely one in the first half?). He missed touch with 1 penalty and made a bit of a balls of a cross field when we had advantage. But overall his kicking game yesterday was pretty good.

At this stage it doesn’t matter if sexton and Murray play good/bad/indifferent, you will still have the same posters saying they played terrible and they should be swapped.

WhoamI2022

Car99 wrote: »

Our only hope is Joey recovers well in the near future.

Joey is a 15 and if he returns should be put in at 15.

Trey13

WhoamI2022 wrote: »

Will leave you to it ....

You’ve asked me to refer to points you’ve made. I have. And now you have nothing to offer. I agree with some of your points. But I guess you know everything and don’t need to engage in a discussion with anyone ever. But I’m sure you know it all!!

Trey13

I thought Sexton was actually pretty good. I think he asks questions of defences until we get deep inside their 22. Then we revert to pick and go. At one stage he lost the head telling Murray to keep it tight on their 5. I thought his kicking for touch was good, along with his place kicking. The kick for Keenan was a beauty.

However, some of his kicking from hand is poor. I think there’s a misnomer in rugby that kicking down the middle of the pitch is a good kick. Sure it’s contestable but we saw last night what happens when you don’t get it right (try at the end of the first half). The only contestable kicks should be put within 15m of the touchline.

Sexton being good and giving someone else a shot aren’t mutually exclusive. I think at 35, Sexton shouldn’t be too aggrieved if someone else gets a start against Wales in two weeks.

is_that_so

Car99 wrote: »

Our only hope is Joey recovers well in the near future.

Unfortunately, he's looking increasingly like a career cut short player. Larmour is a better long term option there.

greendom

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'll take that at half time.

We are the better team, much more constructive in possession and playing a more varied game.

France are incredibly opportunistic and in a tight game they will hurt us off crappy ball and poor territory in a way that just isn't part of our DNA.

Neither the Irish nor the French player had the ball in their hand for the potential penalty tries and I really don't see how one could be a sure score and the other not considering the ball was at Hugo's fingertips and the French player had to gather a bouncing ball. I'm struggling with why they either both weren't or neither were penalty tries. You take the player out and Keenan is right under that.

I think Barnes is a great ref but he's not penalising France for being on the wrong side of the breakdown when Ireland gather the ball - it's a penalty regardless of the outcome. He's definitely missing a fair bit at the breakdown but so far we've the upper hand there so won't complaint too much.

If Stockdale could be a bit more accurate and assured in the backfield and we convert more of our territory we could do this. Frances defence is terrific but they were blowing out their arse for the last 15. I really wish we had more off the bench but there is plenty to be happy about that half.

COME ON IRELAND.

If the French player had the ball in his hands it wouldn't have even been a penalty. It's what you call a tackle!

WhoamI2022

Trey13 wrote: »

You’ve asked me to refer to points you’ve made. I have. And now you have nothing to offer. I agree with some of your points. But I guess you know everything and don’t need to engage in a discussion with anyone ever. But I’m sure you know it all!!

I never said I know everything , or threw around accusations at people about playing the game.

The fact when I mentioned hooker all you said was kelleher tells it’s own story!!! :-)

Car99

WhoamI2022 wrote: »

Joey is a 15 and if he returns should be put in at 15.

At 10 or 15 I'd be happy with him in either position if he gets fit . Joey at 10 ith Johnny at 12 or Johnny at 10 Joey at 15 would give us more options.

Trey13

WhoamI2022 wrote: »

I never said I know everything , or threw around accusations at people about playing the game.

The fact when I mentioned hooker all you said was kelleher tells it’s own story!!! :-)

Rory Best retired so by default we are always going to have a new hooker. We went with the wrong option in my opinion. I don’t think Herring is better than Kelleher now, nor do I think he will be in 3 years.

Skeetur

molloyjh wrote: »

Sorry, thats just identifying the things a 10 does. In what way was Sexton poor in those areas though? You're not actually explaining your point at all.

Lets take his kicking for example. His restarts were all contestable yesterday. His kicking from the tee was perfect. That little grubber for Keenan was a beauty, we just got a bit unlucky the last bounce. Some of his touch finds were excellent (even if the camera work didn't always show it - remember the roar from the sideline when he hit a lovely one in the first half?). He missed touch with 1 penalty and made a bit of a balls of a cross field when we had advantage. But overall his kicking game yesterday was pretty good.

During crucial parts of the game he missed touch, kicked the ball away in the opposition half, squandered advantage (as he always does), bombed up and under after up and under with no return, created very little for the backs going forward. On top of that terrible decision making to turn down points in a game we needed to win by 6.

France conceded a lot of penalties and Ireland had a lot of possession yet he couldn't manufacture anything really. The fact you're saying he was good because 1 grubber almost led to something and some of his basics were OK kinda shows the expectations some have of him. Don't be **** and it's a good game.

molloyjh

Skeetur wrote: »

During crucial parts of the game he missed touch, kicked the ball away in the opposition half, squandered advantage (as he always does), bombed up and under after up and under with no return, created very little for the backs going forward. On top of that terrible decision making to turn down points in a game we needed to win by 6.

France conceded a lot of penalties and Ireland had a lot of possession yet he couldn't manufacture anything really. The fact you're saying he was good because 1 grubber almost led to something and some of his basics were OK kinda shows the expectations some have of him. Don't be **** and it's a good game.

So that was 100% down to Sexton, yeah? All the other 14 on the pitch had no responsibility there? Really? Come on.

Skeetur

molloyjh wrote: »

So that was 100% down to Sexton, yeah? All the other 14 on the pitch had no responsibility there? Really? Come on.

What part are you talking about? Lots of other players were poor too. It was a poor performance and Sexton contributed to that.

WhoamI2022

Skeetur wrote: »

What part are you talking about? Lots of other players were poor too. It was a poor performance and Sexton contributed to that.

It wasn't a poor performance. Overall Ireland could have beaten France but make some silly mistakes.



What is the winning percentage for team away from home in the 6 nations?

Enquiring

molloyjh wrote: »

Sorry, thats just identifying the things a 10 does. In what way was Sexton poor in those areas though? You're not actually explaining your point at all.

Lets take his kicking for example. His restarts were all contestable yesterday. His kicking from the tee was perfect. That little grubber for Keenan was a beauty, we just got a bit unlucky the last bounce. Some of his touch finds were excellent (even if the camera work didn't always show it - remember the roar from the sideline when he hit a lovely one in the first half?). He missed touch with 1 penalty and made a bit of a balls of a cross field when we had advantage. But overall his kicking game yesterday was pretty good.

I identified what a 10 does and I identified who did it brilliantly; Ntamack and who was average to poor; Sexton. The range of passing, getting the backline motoring, the kicking game and so on. It was just a different level altogether. I would say men against boys but Ntamack is only 21 and Sexton is 35.

molloyjh

Skeetur wrote: »

What part are you talking about?

The creating opportunities. That isnt completely down to a 10. Its a team effort. Sexton was fine yesterday. We had a limited midfield and a weakened pack, especially in the second half. We also got a bit unlucky at times. That bounce for Keenan and Barnes missing Willemse blatantly taking out players from the wrong side at the ruck at the end of the first half (should have been a penalty & a yellow) being the big two that stand out. Even Stockdales spilled ball ahead of the last French try, where he had done all the hard work getting outside Vakatawa and handing off Rattez. Had he held that and found Keenan we could easily have been in for a score. Instead the spill indirectly leads to a French 7 pointer.

We created quite a few opportunities and just got either a little unlucky or made a couple of small unforced errors that cost us. Look at even the first French try of the second half. The kick was actually good, Conway just totally misjudged it and ended up completely missing it. Had he challenged forit, then the quick ball wouldn't have been there and the try wouldn't have been scored.

We had unforced errors galore in that second half, spread across almost every player. Small errors compounding small errors. Then we had a bench that simply didn't have the ability to right the ship. We were also facing a French side that were impressively ruthless at taking their opportunities.

There were elements of that second half that were very disappointing. But it wasn't as bad as some have made out and Sexton certainly wasn't at the root of the issues.

Skeetur

WhoamI2022 wrote: »

It wasn't a poor performance. Overall Ireland could have beaten France but make some silly mistakes.



What is the winning percentage for team away from home in the 6 nations?

It was a poor performance. Winning percentage has nothing to do with it. Ireland had all the possession, advantages and opportunities yesterday to win that game. They didn't because they played poorly.

Away games without a home crowd renders the away game stats pretty meaningless anyway.

With France having finally got their sh1t together after frankly more than an embarrassing decade of awful and incompetent coaching appointments and England being ahead in the power stakes and just generally having Ireland's number it's hard to see Ireland doing better than third in the six Nations in the coming years.

The structured game plan worked under Schmidt for a while but those days are long in the past.

The academies, especially at Leinster, are proficient at developing decent players to a professional standard but unless the real quality and inherent talent is there, well...

WhoamI2022

glasso wrote: »

With France having finally got their sh1t together after frankly more than an embarrassing decade of awful and incompetent coaching appointments and England being ahead in the power stakes and just generally having Ireland's number it's hard to see Ireland doing better than third in the six Nations in the coming years.

The structured game plan worked under Schmidt for a while but those days are long in the past.

The academies, especially at Leinster, are proficient at developing decent players to a professional standard but unless the real quality and inherent talent is there, well...

Let see next season when we have France and England at home before throwing all the toys out of the pram.

clsmooth

lawrencesummers wrote: »

I think Stockdale is close to world class.

He’s not a 15, but he’s as good an attacking winger as exists.

He really isn’t. Give one example of a world class performance of his in the last 2 years? On form he should be nowhere near a Lions squad which isn’t exactly a glowing endorsement for ‘world class’ status. I’d argue he shouldn’t even be in the Irish 23. Id have Conway, Keenan, Larmour and Earls (not in any particular order) ahead of him with Lowe to come on.

He’s very passive in defence/lackadaisical in defence. See the England try he gave up this year (and last) and not putting in a shot for Dupont’s try last night (who doesn’t take a free shot at the opposition 9’s ribs?!). He’s just not sharp enough. Give him space to run into and he’s very good but that space doesn’t exist at the top level. He’s just way to error prone and doesn’t seem to have the concentration required at the top level at this particular moment. I genuinely can’t see how anyone can even consider him world class. 2018 is looking like outlier at the moment unfortunately.

A spell away from the spotlight would probably be in his best interests right now to work on his weaknesses and fingers crossed he can come back a better player as he has great potential but the negatives outway the positives at the moment unfortunately.

WhoamI2022

Skeetur wrote: »

It was a poor performance. Winning percentage has nothing to do with it. Ireland had all the possession, advantages and opportunities yesterday to win that game. They didn't because they played poorly.

Away games without a home crowd renders the away game stats pretty meaningless anyway.

Really? what have you based this on?

Skeetur

molloyjh wrote: »

The creating opportunities. That isnt completely down to a 10. Its a team effort. Sexton was fine yesterday. We had a limited midfield and a weakened pack, especially in the second half. We also got a bit unlucky at times. That bounce for Keenan and Barnes missing Willemse blatantly taking out players from the wrong side at the ruck at the end of the first half (should have been a penalty & a yellow) being the big two that stand out. Even Stockdales spilled ball ahead of the last French try, where he had done all the hard work getting outside Vakatawa and handing off Rattez. Had he held that and found Keenan we could easily have been in for a score. Instead the spill indirectly leads to a French 7 pointer.

We created quite a few opportunities and just got either a little unlucky or made a couple of small unforced errors that cost us. Look at even the first French try of the second half. The kick was actually good, Conway just totally misjudged it and ended up completely missing it. Had he challenged forit, then the quick ball wouldn't have been there and the try wouldn't have been scored.

I never said it was completely down to the Sexton. I said Sexton for his part was poor, without the old wrap around he looks to be a pretty one dimensional in attack. Shift it out or take the contact. Everything else didn't work. One grubber almost came off, the cross field, the other grubbers were no where near being executed correctly and the remainder of his contribution was up and unders with poor payoff.

You cant just write it all off as bad luck and bad refereeing, thats just a huge cop out. If the execution was better there would have been better results. Sexton was on for 70 minutes and his attack was basic, limited and poorly executed.

We had unforced errors galore in that second half, spread across almost every player. Small errors compounding small errors. Then we had a bench that simply didn't have the ability to right the ship. We were also facing a French side that were impressively ruthless at taking their opportunities.

There were elements of that second half that were very disappointing. But it wasn't as bad as some have made out and Sexton certainly wasn't at the root of the issues.

As I said there were plenty of mistakes and poor performances particularly in the second half. I never blamed Sexton for all of it but he made mistakes, he executed poorly, opportunities were lost because of it. He was poor.

Whats also being overstated is how good France were. They weren't that good. Their discipline was terrible which is why Ireland had so much territory and possession and several of their tries came from absolute balls ups by Ireland. Which just compounds the poor performance. Couldnt execute when in positions to take advantage and gifted points to France through mistakes.

beggars_bush

Stockdale has bulked up and got slower and it seems,
worse
Wouldn't be the first player this has happened to

beggars_bush

beggars_bush wrote: »

Stockdale has bulked up and got slower and it seems,
worse
Wouldn't be the first player this has happened to

He was always more of a Clydesdale than a Cheetah tbh

awec

Losing to France is not the issue, people should stop pointing out that we lose to France all the time. The manner of the defeat is the big issue here.

We were comfortably beaten by France and they barely got out of third gear. You would nearly go as far as to say we beat ourselves. Right from the start the approach was just stupid, we were playing the game like we needed to win by 30 points, when all we needed was a 6 point victory. 6 points is nothing!

I am amazed that none of the coaches, the captain, nor any of the other senior players took at look at the England result and realised that what we needed to do was be at least level in the game by the 60/70 points mark, and then go for the 6 we need. Instead it was pure gung ho rubbish from the off. It was as if nobody understood the position we were in.

Individual errors contributed, Stockdales errors being high profile and obvious but he was not alone. We had an advantage and Sexton kicked the ball straight into touch. And turning down 3 points before half time to make it a 1 point game was absolute insanity. Put the ball over the bloody bar, it was a gift of points.

For the majority of players it was a crap outing, a trend that is unfortunately becoming a little bit too common for too many of our supposed first choice players.

Skeetur

WhoamI2022 wrote: »

Really? what have you based this on?

Because the home crowd is a big factor in home advantage and why its difficult to win away from home. Playing in an empty stadium isn't consistent with how previous games have been played.

Just look at Scotland yesterday beating Wales away for the first time in 20 years. Not quite the same as playing them in a packed stadium with the roof closed and everyone belting out the anthems to amped up, crying players.

molloyjh

glasso wrote: »

With France having finally got their sh1t together after frankly more than an embarrassing decade of awful and incompetent coaching appointments and England being ahead in the power stakes and just generally having Ireland's number it's hard to see Ireland doing better than third in the six Nations in the coming years.

The structured game plan worked under Schmidt for a while but those days are long in the past.

The academies, especially at Leinster, are proficient at developing decent players to a professional standard but unless the real quality and inherent talent is there, well...

I think there's def an element of truth to this. All these things are cyclical. We've had some special talent in Ireland over the last 15 years or so. From the POCs & BODs to the Healys, Ferris' & SOBs to Murray and Sexton being the best half back combo in the world. We dont seem to have a huge number if top level talent like that coming through at the moment. England and France have both gone through similar periods. Most countries do. Look at SA too. We can't expect to be immune to those same peaks and troughs. We look like we might be hitting one now.

Fifth in the world is a reasonable place for us to be in general. Rugby isn't the religion here that it is in NZ. And we simply dont have the numbers that France, England or SA have. When things go well we can move ahead of some of those countries, but we dont have some automatic right to do so. People need to maintain that perspective.

Skeetur

awec wrote: »

Losing to France is not the issue, people should stop pointing out that we lose to France all the time. The manner of the defeat is the big issue here.

We were comfortably beaten by France and they barely got out of third gear. You would nearly go as far as to say we beat ourselves. Right from the start the approach was just stupid, we were playing the game like we needed to win by 30 points, when all we needed was a 6 point victory. 6 points is nothing!

I am amazed that none of the coaches, the captain, nor any of the other senior players took at look at the England result and realised that what we needed to do was be at least level in the game by the 60/70 points mark, and then go for the 6 we need. Instead it was pure gung ho rubbish from the off. It was as if nobody understood the position we were in.

Individual errors contributed, Stockdales errors being high profile and obvious but he was not alone. We had an advantage and Sexton kicked the ball straight into touch. And turning down 3 points before half time to make it a 1 point game was absolute insanity. Put the ball over the bloody bar, it was a gift of points.

For the majority of players it was a crap outing, a trend that is unfortunately becoming a little bit too common for too many of our supposed first choice players.

Yeah I found Sextons interview weird. He said they went for a combination of tries and points approach. Which makes no sense, surely there was a plan at the start. Take points, build and maintain a lead, if tries come they come. And that's why Murray tried the long range effort. Kick everything. But they seemed to abandon that at some point for absolutely no reason.

OldRio

WhoamI2022 wrote: »

Really? what have you based this on?

Since professional sport started after lockdown a study was done regarding the above. Away victories have increased.

molloyjh

awec wrote: »

...what we needed to do was be at least level in the game by the 60/70 points mark...

I have to completely disagree with this. Our bench was significantly weaker than theirs. We needed to be clearly ahead at that point. France were playing for 2nd place because they knew they wouldn't be able to win the 6Ns. They werent going to lose their heads if it was level after 60 mins. If anything they'd be confident that their bench could win it for them.

GreeBo

dublinman1990 wrote: »

Stockdale has a constellation try.

He is our star player

D15er

awec wrote: »

We were comfortably beaten by France and they barely got out of third gear.

I'm more concerned that we got beaten by France and WE barely got out of third gear. Where is the intensity, who's taking the game by the throat and giving the players something to rally behind?

It was the same in the England game, there doesn't seem to be a plan B when things go wrong, we just keep doing the same thing.

thomas 123

I think the lack of talent along with selection based on contract / status has come home to roost, I don’t think it’s looking good long term for the next World Cup.

Looking at scrum half as example - Why are we bringing in the likes of Gibson-park when Mgrath, Cooney, Marmion all have played well for their provinces?

Then AF brings Casey in from Munster to train with the squad?

I honestly don’t get it at all.

Heres Johnny

I'd replace sexton as captain ASAP but still pick him at 10. That turned down kick coming up to half time was a terrible decision.

You pick your best players in internationals if you want to sell them as an event. Developing players is for the pro14. Even in Europe the provinces don't play people to give them experience to see if they are good enough.
Now, I don't see a POC or BOD obvious captain type in our squad but I think Ryan would be a good captain.

But for one absolute fook up from Hogg Ireland would be fifth / just above the whipping boys.

aloooof

thomas 123 wrote: »

I think the lack of talent along with selection based on contract / status has come home to roost, I don’t think it’s looking good long term for the next World Cup.

Looking at scrum half as example - Why are we bringing in the likes of Gibson-park when Mgrath, Cooney, Marmion all have played well for their provinces?

Then AF brings Casey in from Munster to train with the squad?

I honestly don’t get it at all.

Agreed with Marmion. But McGrath and Cooney have both played poorly for their provinces since the return, to the point that they had both been dropped. McGrath specifically for JGP.

OldRio

I'm struggling to understand why we went for points at the start. (Murray kick from 55m, missed it, but what a boot on him) to turning down a easy 3 points.

thomas 123

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I'd replace sexton as captain ASAP but still pick him at 10. That turned down kick coming up to half time was a terrible decision.

You pick your best players in internationals if you want to sell them as an event. Developing players is for the pro14. Even in Europe the provinces don't play people to give them experience to see if they are good enough.
Now, I don't see a POC or BOD obvious captain type in our squad but I think Ryan would be a good captain.

Decision making is wrong all over the park - it’s like all we can do is box kick and hope it seems.

Like Throwing to the back of the line out in a critical phase of the game twice.

And Running hard lines off a center without your hands ready to take the ball then looking shocked as to why he passed it to you?

penybont exile

Enquiring wrote: »

Wales? Yeah but you know that out of nowhere Wales can spring a grand slam or put together a world cup run. Having a very poor 6 Nations doesn't seem to matter.

Yep .... and once you can live with that .....as a small rugby playing nation ....... you feel a lot better about yourself ......

Christy42

OldRio wrote: »

I'm struggling to understand why we went for points at the start. (Murray kick from 55m, missed it, but what a boot on him) to turning down a easy 3 points.

No idea why we went for the first one but the one right before half time was no where near a guaranteed 3. I would have expected Sexton to get it but people are acting like it was automatic. Those 3 points were not key to the game.

molloyjh

glasso wrote: »

But for one absolute fook up from Hogg Ireland would be fifth / just above the whipping boys.

???? Had Scotland won that game we'd be on 10 or 11 points, ahead of Wales and Italy. Thag sort of what if stuff applies to everything though, not just things that went in our favour. Had Barnes seen Willemse at the end of the first half yesrerday we'd have gone in at half time a point behind and a man advantage for the first 9 mins of the second half. Then we wouldn't have conceded the points we did in that period and possibly have won the 6Ns.

What if...

OldRio

Christy42 wrote: »

No idea why we went for the first one but the one right before half time was no where near a guaranteed 3. I would have expected Sexton to get it but people are acting like it was automatic. Those 3 points were not key to the game.

I disagree. Those 3 points were crucial. We kicked to the corner. Then France turned us over. Half time.
Big momentum swing. France enter dressing room cocker hoop. Ireland enter dressing room on a down.
Small margins, Huge swings.

WhoamI2022

glasso wrote: »

But for one absolute fook up from Hogg Ireland would be fifth / just above the whipping boys.

For xyz we would be xyz


That's sport.

UAEguy2020

glasso wrote: »

But for one absolute fook up from Hogg Ireland would be fifth / just above the whipping boys.

Scotland scored a penalty from that knock on meaning even if he grounded the ball and converted the score would have been Ireland 19-16 Scotland...

WhoamI2022

Christy42 wrote: »

No idea why we went for the first one but the one right before half time was no where near a guaranteed 3. I would have expected Sexton to get it but people are acting like it was automatic. Those 3 points were not key to the game.

How many times have we seen Ireland and Leinster convert those chance at the end of the first half. At least at two different points Ireland could have got a penalty. They didn't and France got a turn over. That's the luck of the draw.