US Presidential Election 2020 Thread II - Judgement Day(s)

Itssoeasy

prawnsambo wrote: »

The point is not to pander to Trump and just leave him swinging in the wind. He will have to concede eventually. The last thing Biden wants or needs is to seem beholden to him.

I’m not saying to pander to trump because the way the general service administration and its role in the transition work doesn’t require trumps approval or any involvement thankfully. The administrator in charge has decided to not do it.

prawnsambo

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I’m not saying to pander to trump because the way the general service administration and its role in the transition work doesn’t require trumps approval or any involvement thankfully. The administrator in charge has decided to not do it.

I don't think she's decided. She's been told. She's out of a job if she goes against Trump. Same as what happened to Krebs.

looksee

This sounds a bit alarming on the face of it, but presumably JPM is trying to drop the hint to the Republicans that if they mess about they could sink the stock market, which would be a rather un-Republican thing to do.

I love the idea that the 1887 ECA could be declared unconstitutional - I thought anything going back that far was sacrosanct!

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/18/business/stock-market-election-trump-jpmorgan/index.html

Even so, the JPMorgan strategist laid out several developments that could cast doubt on that outcome, including that one or more states submit competing slates of electors. Those competing slates would then be resolved January 6 by the new Congress through rules spelled out in the Electoral Count Act of 1887.
"The nightmare scenario for markets," according to Cembalest, would be if Senate Republicans declare the ECA unconstitutional, flip three states in Trump's favor to give him the required 270 electoral votes and Democrats refuse to participate.
"All of which sets up the prospect of dueling inaugurations," Cembalest wrote, noting that this outcome was only "narrowly averted" in 1876.
Another risk laid out by Cembalest is if Barr directs investigators to "seize or impound election records" to probe for voter fraud, slowing down the process.

Water John

prawnsambo wrote: »

I don't think she's decided. She's been told. She's out of a job if she goes against Trump. Same as what happened to Krebs.

She needs to get a new job as either way she's gone.

Brian?

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I’m not saying to pander to trump because the way the general service administration and its role in the transition work doesn’t require trumps approval or any involvement thankfully. The administrator in charge has decided to not do it.

The war Trump approaches everything is that someone is getting screwed on every deal. If he doesn’t feel like he’s screwing the other side he feels like he’s lost. It’s monumentally stupid, but this is how he’s approaching the transition.

V8 Interceptor

VinLieger wrote: »

Yes he won a lower percentage of the total turnout than he did last time therefore he is less popular than he was in 2016 with the total number of voters.

You said he was less popular than last time despite him polling 10 million more this time. That's clearly not true. The fact that Biden is more popular than Hillary or anyone else is neither here nor there. Donald Trump got more votes than last time so, by your barometer of popularity ie votes, he is more popular.

Professor Moriarty

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

You said he was less popular than last time despite him polling 10 million more this time. That's clearly not true. The fact that Biden is more popular than Hillary or anyone else is neither here nor there. Donald Trump got more votes than last time so, by your barometer of popularity ie votes, he is more popular.

But he's still toast. A Pyrrhic victory.

V8 Interceptor

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

But he's still toast. A Pyrrhic victory.

True. Its incredible to me that Joe Biden of all people polled the most votes in US Presidential history. Yes there was a very big anti-Trump vote that mobilised but can that alone explain his extraordinary numbers?

uncleoswald

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

True. Its incredible to me that Joe Biden of all people polled the most votes in US Presidential history. Yes there was a very big anti-Trump vote that mobilised but can that alone explain his extraordinary numbers?

Votes go up as the population increases so these records are always broken.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_turnout_in_United_States_presidential_elections

And

As you say, Trump drove a lot of people to the polls, both for him and against him. Mail-in/absentee voting means people don't have to take time of work etc...
This year was just a perfect storm really.

Bobeagleburger

Trumps mishandling of Covid drove millions to postal votes. To... vote against him.

Poetic justice.

V8 Interceptor

Whatever about the US election, would any of you guys be comfortable with mail in voting here? I wouldn't. I think going down to the booth and posting your ballot is the safest and most tried and trusted method there is.

SuperSean11

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Whatever about the US election, would any of you guys be comfortable with mail in voting here? I wouldn't. I think going down to the booth and posting your ballot is the safest and most tried and trusted method there is.

What makes you say that?

Bobeagleburger

Finger print on an application would be ok with me.

V8 Interceptor

SuperSean11 wrote: »

What makes you say that?

Like I said its tried and tested. Would you be okay with mail in voting?

uncleoswald

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Whatever about the US election, would any of you guys be comfortable with mail in voting here? I wouldn't. I think going down to the booth and posting your ballot is the safest and most tried and trusted method there is.

I've done both while living in Canada and it worked well. Security wise it seemed as secure as in person, which never seemed very thorough in either country anyway. And neither seem easy to exploit on a large scale.

Of course election security with either method should be paramount but there is a time to deal with potential security concerns, and the weeks after you lose isn't really it. If Trump had won would any of these issues be issues, would any time be spent looking at them? No of course not, this is all for show.

V8 Interceptor

^^
Good points there. Its just from a layman's perspective I'd imagine mail in would be more vulnerable to fraud than in person. But its interesting you say in Canada it seemed just as secure.

BonnieSituation

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

^^
Good points there. Its just from a layman's perspective I'd imagine mail in would be more vulnerable to fraud than in person. But its interesting you say in Canada it seemed just as secure.

Explain how?

I have voted in every election since I turned 18, missing only the locals and Europeans in 2014 cos I was in Canada, and I have yet to be asked for ID.

V8 Interceptor

They asked you for your polling card though right?


(I don't want to do too many one liners in this Forum)

MadYaker

I’d have no problem with mail in voting here but I don’t think it’ll ever be necessary because we don’t have one of our major political parties attempting to make as difficult for people to vote as possible.

~Rebel~

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

True. Its incredible to me that Joe Biden of all people polled the most votes in US Presidential history. Yes there was a very big anti-Trump vote that mobilised but can that alone explain his extraordinary numbers?

Mad alright, but really when you think of how politically aware people have been forced to be this year between everything, along with the very well run grassroots campaign ("make a voting plan") run by the Dems, and then the big one of voting options.

Obviously we know all about expanded mail-in voting. But in person voting was hugely expanded too, and was available for 10+ days as well.

Covid meant they had to make it easier for people to vote. And when it's easier to do, more people do it.

MadYaker wrote: »

I’d have no problem with mail in voting here but I don’t think it’ll ever be necessary because we don’t have one of our major political parties attempting to make as difficult for people to vote as possible.

Yup, it's pretty much as easy to vote in Ireland as it would be to go drop the mail-in vote into the postbox.

V8 Interceptor

MadYaker wrote: »

I’d have no problem with mail in voting here but I don’t think it’ll ever be necessary because we don’t have one of our major political parties attempting to make as difficult for people to vote as possible.

I've heard people say the Republicans do that. Mind you I've also heard the Dems make mail in easy in "their" areas only.

~Rebel~

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

I've heard people say the Republicans do that. Mind you I've also heard the Dems make mail in easy in "their" areas only.

What does this mean? What made the 'dem' area of a state easier than the 'gop' area of a state?

BonnieSituation

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

They asked you for your polling card though right?


(I don't want to do too many one liners in this Forum)

I look nothing like the photo on my polling card though.

jimmycrackcorm

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Whatever about the US election, would any of you guys be comfortable with mail in voting here? I wouldn't. I think going down to the booth and posting your ballot is the safest and most tried and trusted method there is.

How is going to the booth a better option?
We already have the issue of third level students, for example, being away from their normal domicile missing out regularly on voting.

Isn't democracy most satisfied by ensuring as much as possible that people can vote as easily as possible? Mail-in votes are validated in the US via signature. Your signature is used to validate every contract you sign -from a bill pay phone to a 30-year mortgage.

So what's the objection?

V8 Interceptor

~Rebel~ wrote: »

What does this mean? What made the 'dem' area of a state easier than the 'gop' area of a state?

I honestly don't know. I heard them arguing about it on TV the other night re the election in Michigan. I've no doubt both parties try to get their own vote out as much as possible and use all legal shenanigans to get their demographic to cast a ballot.

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I look nothing like the photo on my polling card though.

There's a photo on the polling cards? I never saw one!

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

How is going to the booth a better option?
We already have the issue of third level students, for example, being away from their normal domicile missing out regularly on voting.

Isn't democracy most satisfied by ensuring as much as possible that people can vote as easily as possible? Mail-in votes are validated in the US via signature. Your signature is used to validate every contract you sign -from a bill pay phone to a 30-year mortgage.

So what's the objection?

Surely there's more to it than that?

MadYaker

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

I've heard people say the Republicans do that. Mind you I've also heard the Dems make mail in easy in "their" areas only.

They have said it themselves, quotes from both Trump and a senior member of his campaign

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/dec/21/trump-adviser-republicans-voter-suppression

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/03/30/trump-voting-republicans/%3foutputType=amp

BonnieSituation

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

There's a photo on the polling cards? I never saw one!

Eh?

No. There's not. Cmon.

VinLieger

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

I've heard people say the Republicans do that. Mind you I've also heard the Dems make mail in easy in "their" areas only.

Well yes they make it easier to vote in areas they control..... they cant do anything in areas they don't. Do you think there's a problem with making it easier to vote?


I find it highly curious you seem to be equating both voter suppression with easier voting access as being nefarious political tools?

Brian?

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Whatever about the US election, would any of you guys be comfortable with mail in voting here? I wouldn't. I think going down to the booth and posting your ballot is the safest and most tried and trusted method there is.

Tell that to the hundreds of dead people who voted for Bobby Sands.

Former Coach

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Mad alright, but really when you think of how politically aware people have been forced to be this year between everything, along with the very well run grassroots campaign ("make a voting plan") run by the Dems, and then the big one of voting options.

Obviously we know all about expanded mail-in voting. But in person voting was hugely expanded too, and was available for 10+ days as well.

Covid meant they had to make it easier for people to vote. And when it's easier to do, more people do it.




Yup, it's pretty much as easy to vote in Ireland as it would be to go drop the mail-in vote into the postbox.

And we don’t have to wait hours in a queue.......