US Presidential Election 2020 Thread II - Judgement Day(s)

L1011

gmisk wrote: »

I think your right
I think 7ish EC votes went to people like Kasich or Paul in 2016.

None officially, all from faithless electors.

Supreme Court has reduced the risks of that happening by allowing sanctions for faithless electors.

Carfacemandog

paleoperson wrote: »

He can direct that a recount takes place in a close election. It is standard practice and they couldn't refuse.

The key criteria is being within 1% I believe, which it currently is as Biden leads by 0.7%. There is 5% left to be counted though which ifi am correct is almost entirely provision and mail in, whichnight put Biden above that threshold. I guess we'll have to see.

Headshot

Itssoeasy wrote: »

He can request a recount. It can’t order or direct anything.

With I think over 26 thousand votes difference, a request to recount wont cause that count to deviate that much

Typically you might get maybe 12 or so but not thousands

extra gravy

His fraud accusation is also a kick in the teeth to the thousands of civically minded decent Americans who offer up their time make sure the election actually happens and to count the votes. Imagine doing a 12+ hour shift counting votes and then you see your President accuse you of fraud. Desperate carry on from him but hopefully democracy and fairness will triumph in the end.

Exclamation Marc

Biden lead in Michigan at 45000.

TomOnBoard

JazzyJ wrote: »

But the US senate gives each state an equal voice?

Yes. That's how it was set up in the bi-cameral model. The House was created as a body to represent the voting populations, and the Senate to represent the States..

paleoperson

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

As longs as votes don't go missing (as happens in Russia which Trump is trying to emulate)

Then lets recount, it means he will have to shut up about stopping counts elsewhere.

Funny you should mention Russia - I was just thinking today about how if this the US looking on from abroad they would simply pick the side they favoured and declare them the winner and the other side imposters. For example if Putin narrowly won and the other side was saying there was vote tampering oh god we'd never hear the end of it.

The mere allegations of vote tampering or otherwise unfair activities in voting are enough for people like you to go to town on Russia as having unfair elections. Meanwhile when Trump says it it's just all sour grapes, right?

Protests in the streets - if it was in Russia or another countries it'd be valiant angry protestors protesting against democracy gone wrong when the people chose someone else. With Trump it's more like angry racists trying to wreak havoc now that their leader has lost.

Eh? Eh? Where is the lie?

Carfacemandog

Headshot wrote: »

With I think over 26 thousand votes difference, a request to recount wont cause that count to deviate that much

Typically you might get maybe 12 or so but not thousands

For reference, Wisconsin was recounted in 2016 at the request of Jill Stein, the difference was 132 votes.

VinLieger

Headshot wrote: »

With I think over 26 thousand votes difference, a request to recount wont cause that count to deviate that much

Typically you might get maybe 12 or so but not thousands

Even the GOP ex governor of Wisconsin admits a recount wont fix that gap



https://twitter.com/ScottWalker/status/1324002777597677569

pixelburp

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I don’t agree that a Biden presidency will be impossible to function because of McConnell. McConnell has a relationship with Biden pre trump having served in the senate together. He gave some very warm remarks towards Biden when Biden became Vice President and also passed an amendment to a cancer bill to rename it to beau Biden. My point is that Biden may be able to work with the GOP in the senate given his history.

I can't say I"ve dug too deep into Biden's manifesto, but the language of "healing" and the overall tone of reconciliation in Biden's words - not to mention being famously a centrist - does make me wonder how much foreshadowing was applied towards the possibility the Senate would not turn blue. It must have been a factor in the thinking of the campaign; in which case the obvious next step might be identifying soft R republicans who could be turned on more palatable, centrist initiatives. Obviously, things like the expansion of the ACA are now going to be very difficult to achieve, while I"m not sure where many Republicans might sit in terms of electoral reform (or expansion of the SC etc).

Exclamation Marc

WI recount will cost $3m. Oof.

vafankillar

Exclamation Marc wrote: »

WI recount will cost $3m. Oof.

not exactly oof in terms of a us presidential election

extra gravy

Exclamation Marc wrote: »

WI recount will cost $3m. Oof.

It's quite American that you can buy a recount rather than it being based on the public interest.

paul71

Brian? wrote: »

Ordering? He can't order them to do anything.

I think he can if there is less than 1% difference.

I am not certain which states do that but some have an automatic recount if the difference is less than 1%, others have a recount if the difference is less than 1% and a recount is requested by a candidate.

I suspect the same is going to happen in Georgia no matter which way the first count goes.

nc6000

Carfacemandog wrote: »

For reference, Wisconsin was recounted in 2016 at the request of Jill Stein, the difference was 132 votes.

What was Jill Stein hoping to gain from a recount?

VinLieger

Exclamation Marc wrote: »

WI recount will cost $3m. Oof.

Please tell me the campaign pays for this?

Rjd2

pixelburp wrote: »

I can't say I"ve dug too deep into Biden's manifesto, but the language of "healing" and the overall tone of reconciliation in Biden's words - not to mention being famously a centrist - does make me wonder how much foreshadowing was applied towards the possibility the Senate would not turn blue. It must have been a factor in the thinking of the campaign; in which case the obvious next step might be identifying soft R republicans who could be turned on more palatable, centrist initiatives. Obviously, things like the expansion of the ACA are now going to be very difficult to achieve, while I"m not sure where many Republicans might sit in terms of electoral reform (or expansion of the SC etc).

Biden and Mitch are relatively pally.

I don't quite know how the senate will play out, but Mitch won't be to upset if they hold the senate and Biden is president as he will fancy his chances of thwarting anything to progressive and he knows Biden isn't really going to upset the status quo.

On the bolded point, no matter whether right or wrong morally, if you are a Republican who isn't a professional Never Trumper then why on earth would you support policies which hurt your party considerably?

JazzyJ

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Yes. That's how it was set up in the bi-cameral model. The House was created as a body to represent the voting populations, and the Senate to represent the States..

So why not have the presidential election as popular vote? States still get an equal voice in congress. Each person gets an equal vote in the presidential election.

astrofool

paleoperson wrote: »

Funny you should mention Russia - I was just thinking today about how if this the US looking on from abroad they would simply pick the side they favoured and declare them the winner and the other side imposters. For example if Putin narrowly won and the other side was saying there was vote tampering oh god we'd never hear the end of it.

The mere allegations of vote tampering or otherwise unfair activities in voting are enough for people like you to go to town on Russia as having unfair elections. Meanwhile when Trump says it it's just all sour grapes, right?

Protests in the streets - if it was in Russia or another countries it'd be valiant angry protestors protesting against democracy gone wrong when the people chose someone else. With Trump it's more like angry racists trying to wreak havoc now that their leader has lost.

Eh? Eh? Where is the lie?

Similar to the Hunter laptop, everybody has been watching Trump try and setup this accusation, going back as far as de-funding the USPS, so everybody was well aware he would jump to this (just as everybody knew he would try and claim victory before the counts finished).

The important thing is to rise above it and follow the rules, as the states are doing.

Itssoeasy

Trump is tweeting that they are “finding” ballots in states. They are counting them not finding them.

Itssoeasy

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I don’t agree that a Biden presidency will be impossible to function because of McConnell. McConnell has a relationship with Biden pre trump having served in the senate together. He gave some very warm remarks towards Biden when Biden became Vice President and also passed an amendment to a cancer bill to rename it to beau Biden. My point is that Biden may be able to work with the GOP in the senate given his history.

Easy to do when it's meaningless.
He went on the record right from the start of the Obama administration to block and frustrate everything the Dems would try to do.

peteeeed

Anyone see this guy on the BBC this morning? Looks like he's still drinking the kool aid
https://twitter.com/sethweathers/status/1324048471675068416?s=21

Rjd2

peteeeed wrote: »

Anyone see this guy on the BBC this morning? Looks like he's still drinking the kool aid
https://twitter.com/sethweathers/status/1324048471675068416?s=21

I'd actually have some respect for him if he actually put his money where his mouth is, but like the thread in current affairs so many Trumper's don't have the balls to back up their "big calls".

Itssoeasy

Deleted User wrote: »

Easy to do when it's meaningless.
He went on the record right from the start of the Obama administration to block and frustrate everything the Dems would try to do.

Well the gesture was my point. It was a genuinely nice moment and seemed genuine whether the action was meaningless.,I know he did but I think that might have been a seasoned veteran senator pulling a kruskev on Kennedy in the 1960s. McConnell will know he can’t ****ehawk Biden like he did Obama should he become president.

paul71

extra gravy wrote: »

It's quite American that you can buy a recount rather than it being based on the public interest.

Recounts are a standard in most Democracies. They happen here all the time. The difference is that in a First past the post system mistakes are rarely found, in a PR system like ours they are more likely to discover errors. To be honest with a 20,000 gap its not going to make a difference, they will probably find a couple of hundred error and there is no reason to think they would not be found to benefit Biden.

embraer170

Anyone think we will have some more clarity in the next 5 hours?

I am hoping to get to bed a bit earlier tonight.

Timberrrrrrrr

Carfacemandog wrote: »

The key criteria is being within 1% I believe, which it currently is as Biden leads by 0.7%. There is 5% left to be counted though which ifi am correct is almost entirely provision and mail in, whichnight put Biden above that threshold. I guess we'll have to see.

Now that would definitely send trump over the edge!

vafankillar

are the small percentages of votes left to be counted in wisconsin and michigan mail in or election day or what? anything in the mix to give trump a hope of a win?

won't be sad to see him leave office, but truely enjoyed the dems being made sweat scared ****less for the entire day

StringerBell

embraer170 wrote: »

Anyone think we will have some more clarity in the next 5 hours?

I am hoping to get to bed a bit earlier tonight.

It will likely be tomorrow tbh, could even be Friday depending on how close it is in Nevada and PA.

Shelga

vafankillar wrote: »

are the small percentages of votes left to be counter in wisconsin and michigan mail in or election day or what? anything in the mix to give trump a hope of a win?

won't be sad to see him leave office, but truely enjoyed the dems being made sweat scared ****less for the entire day

Why? How unpleasant to enjoy seeing half the country stressed to the max.

239k coronavirus deaths and counting, yeah it's an absolute hoot.