Trump vs Biden 2020, Day 64 of the Pennsylvania count (pt 5) Read OP

Curious_Case

jmayo wrote: »

Well the big eventuality was that somewhere around 77million Americans voted against him.

Now I was always led to believe that The Establishment was a small minority of connected people, but maybe the US one is 77 million or so.

Have you mistaken me for a Trump supporter I wonder ?

Anyways, try to consider the bloc of Biden voters and my (or your) "establishment" as two separate entities, both of whom have voted Biden in and therefore Trump out.

Incidentally, my definition of "establishment" tallies (pardon the pun) with yours.

Also, no one yet knows how muddy said waters will eventually get.

Inquitus

Inquitus wrote: »

Trump reminds me of Gemma O'Doherty :P

Be a stiff competition for most annoying voice between the two of them. Gems might get it by a nose :-)

Randle P. McMurphy

s1ippy wrote: »

Lads he's done some absolutely bizarre stuff today.

Stefan Simanowitz (@StefSimanowitz) Tweeted:
Over the last 24 hours #Trump has sacked the entire Pentagon civilian leadership

Mark Esper was fired by tweet on Monday & replaced with Miller

*Over the last 72 hours, Trump has also sacked the heads of the agencies that oversee nuclear weapons & electricity/natural gas supply.* https://twitter.com/StefSimanowitz/status/1326302670253121537?s=20

Axios (@axios) Tweeted:
Republicans are hinting at an extreme last-chance way for Trump to cling to power.

In this long-shot scenario, Trump could try to block key secretaries of state from certifying results, allowing state legislatures to appoint pro-Trump electors. https://t.co/RbBpOFLZsf https://twitter.com/axios/status/1326520461560336384?s=20

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/11/trump-nsa-ellis-firings.html

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/11/downright-dangerous-democrat-alarm-as-trump-stacks-pentagon-with-loyalists

He could be getting ready for his Reichstag moment. By enabling him the Republicans are in danger of sleepwalking themselves in to the same mess the Germans got in to. Some may say I'm being over dramatic, but any student of history can see the parallels with his political career to date and a certain politician in 1930's Germany.

Call me Al

Leroy42 wrote: »

So they won the motion to have the case dismissed?

Another significant court win for Trump. Send more money quick!!!!:rolleyes:

It's all smoke and mirrors.
They don't care.

Patrick2010

briany wrote: »

He's in illustrious company in terms of celebrities who rabidly support Trump. Kirstie Alley and Randy Quaid are also fully paid-up MAGA-hat-wearing conspiracy nuts.

Oh, Gary Busey's a fan as well.

Surprised to see James Woods is such a Trump fan


https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1326311273735155714

Tony EH

^
Sad to see.

Quin_Dub

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Surprised to see James Woods is such a Trump fan


https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1326311273735155714

Woods is a deeply unpleasant individual and has been publicly showing it for quite some time.

His support for Trump is consistent with the rest of his world-view.

briany

Randle P. McMurphy wrote: »

He could be getting ready for his Reichstag moment. By enabling him the Republicans are in danger of sleepwalking themselves in to the same mess the Germans got in to. Some may say I'm being over dramatic, but any student of history can see the parallels with his political career to date and a certain politician in 1930's Germany.

Classic boiling frog strategy, here. The thing that the public will not stand for Trump doing is always one move away, and by the time they have enough it's too late. This is the evil genius of him normalising his craziness. You can't sling mud at someone who's covered in shít, and you can't expect someone who has broken so many political conventions not to break a few more.

sabat

sabat wrote: »

It's interesting how you managed to take the entirety of what you want to happen and convert it into a definitive prediction about what will happen. You have zero idea what might turn up. If it does transpire that enough irregularities occurred to hand it to Biden then there's a very good case-and probably a lot more public support-for reopening AZ and WI.

Given the history of recounts, their effect is pretty negligible as they're incredibly accurate.

Tell me how

Watching the way people such as James Woods we vehemently insistent that this election was illegal, I reckon we are going to spend the rest of our lives seeing articles and documentaries being produced on 'the greatest conspiracy of the 21st century'.

The counting is going to be completed, Biden is going to win the relevant states, the electors will nominate him and he will be President.

But, the Trumpeteers will forever talk about mail in ballot fraud, lack of transparency and so on.

Some of them probably won't be too bothered that Trump lost they'll still have their meal ticket in talking about how the liberal media and the democrats stole this election.

Saw one comment on the above James Woods tweet that said when you see Fox News saying Biden won, it shows just how widespread the fix actually is, instead of them saying 'well actually, there probably isn't any evidence'

briany

Tell me how wrote: »

Saw one comment on the above James Woods tweet that said when you see Fox News saying Biden won, it shows just how widespread the fix actually is, instead of them saying 'well actually, there probably isn't any evidence'

Here's the problem - people like this are starting off with a basic assumption and then reinterpreting reality to remain consistent with that assumption.

So,

If the media is against Donald Trump, then that is because they are crooked. That fits with the basic assumption that Trump is righteous.

If the courts rule against Trump in this allegation of voter fraud, then that is because those courts are bought or otherwise biased. Same thing.

You can't convince these people with external logic or reason. It would probably be humiliating for them to climb down from such a high ledge in full view of other people, so their pride wouldn't let them anyway. They may do so in private, more quietly, after contemplation, though. What gets through to such a person could even be different for every case.

drogon.

Tell me how wrote: »

But, the Trumpeteers will forever talk about mail in ballot fraud, lack of transparency and so on.

I saw a tweet by some random person, saying going forward the Republican Party is going to be a trump party. I think they are going down a path with no return if you ask me.

sabat

Randle P. McMurphy wrote: »

He could be getting ready for his Reichstag moment. By enabling him the Republicans are in danger of sleepwalking themselves in to the same mess the Germans got in to. Some may say I'm being over dramatic, but any student of history can see the parallels with his political career to date and a certain politician in 1930's Germany.

He has had virtually unlimited power for 4 years now-can you give an example of what he's done to bring about this fascist state? Obama for example created the concept of a kill list-his "disposition matrix" of Americans citizens he could personally act as judge and executioner on. Did Trump do anything like that?

Tell me how

briany wrote: »

If the media is against Donald Trump, then that is because they are crooked. That fits with the basic assumption that Trump is righteous.

If the courts rule against Trump in this allegation of voter fraud, then that is because those courts are bought or otherwise biased. Same thing.

You can't convince these people with external logic or reason. It would probably be humiliating for them to climb down from such a high ledge in full view of other people, so their pride wouldn't let them anyway. They may do so in private, more quietly, after contemplation, though. What gets through to such a person could even be different for every case.

Therein lies the problem. And the reality that there are at least 100M people in America who believe this way.

How does the country get from the place where it is now, to a place where only 10-20M people actively think things are this corrupt in this way.

We (society) are lucky that Trump was not able to harness this fervour and passion with more cynicism while laughing at people behind their back but being diplomatic to their face. We are lucky in him making a mess of covid which ultimately I think was the deciding factor in him not being returned.

Loafing Oaf

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Surprised to see James Woods is such a Trump fan


https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1326311273735155714

Well he did play HR Haldeman and Roy Cohn. Maybe he took the method thing too far:P

Keyzer

ElitesTeam wrote: »

Dead people voting for Racist Biden

100,000+ biden votes all 4am with no trump

ballots after deadlines

Fraud Election was rigged for Demacorrupts

High probability you're a staunch supporter of Gemma O'Doherty. Baseless statements backed up with nil evidence.

In other news, Aliens are comprehensively taking over planet earth in a clandestine manner through the circulation of Elves on the Shelves.

humberklog

The 18th minute past the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month.

namloc1980

ElitesTeam wrote: »

Dead people voting for Racist Biden

100,000+ biden votes all 4am with no trump

ballots after deadlines

Fraud Election was rigged for Demacorrupts

No evidence again I see. And the 100,000 plus votes for Biden in the middle of the count was debunked on election night I believe. Why are you people so so gullible? How much have you donated to Trump's fund to pay off his debts?

briany

Tell me how wrote: »

Therein lies the problem. And the reality that there are at least 100M people in America who believe this way.

I don't think it's fair to say that everyone who voted for Donald Trump, and then some, is at the exact same level of unreasonable and crazy. Some may be dyed-in-the-wool conservatives, some may like that he's not a conventional politician, some may like his promises not to take the US into any new foreign wars. Each group, or some of them, could like those things and still admit to the man being less than perfect.

We tend to focus on the ones out in the street who are strapped up and carrying 'stop the steal' signs as being representative of Trump's voting demographic. It was at least heartening to see that poll which found that 80 percent polled believed Biden to be the rightful winner.

However, if even half of Trump's 2020 voting base believes all the cr@p being thrown around, that's still a huge, huge number of people and very worrying for the US, going forward.

sabat

sabat wrote: »

He has had virtually unlimited power for 4 years now-can you give an example of what he's done to bring about this fascist state? Obama for example created the concept of a kill list-his "disposition matrix" of Americans citizens he could personally act as judge and executioner on. Did Trump do anything like that?

Of course he's used something first developed by Bush and continued by Obama, he just has reporting of drone attacks silenced unless he's looking to gain from it politically like in the case of Qassem Soleimani.

Be a bit naive to think otherwise as he's constantly tweeting about Muslims including sharing fake videos. Now.suddenly people who supported his stance on Muslims, and are constantly giving out about them emigrating here, are suddenly worried about drone strikes against them.

froog

GOP cant afford anymore attention trump and his ghouls are sucking up with the Georgia run off coming up. i'd imagine they start shutting the f up about trump pretty sharpish and telling him to cop on.

rossie1977

sabat wrote: »

He has had virtually unlimited power for 4 years now-can you give an example of what he's done to bring about this fascist state? Obama for example created the concept of a kill list-his "disposition matrix" of Americans citizens he could personally act as judge and executioner on. Did Trump do anything like that?

He has ramped up nationalism to a dangerous level.
Shown distain for human rights especially asylum seekers
Created a ton of enemies which to blame societies ills on.
Increased the us militaries power
Has tried to control the media
Obsessed with national security
Has overseen religion playing role in government
Has ensured corporate power is strongest than at any time.
Labour power now weaker in the US
Shown complete distain for science, arts and intellectuals
Government is rife with corruption and cronyism
Has refused to accept results of democratic election

So yes Trump has sown the seeds for fascism in the US. Just a question will someone smarter than him come along and implement it fully.

When people think of fascism they think of Hitler or Mussolini but fascists in 2020 have a different coat of paint. Russia, Israel, Hungary, Poland are all fascist states right now.

froog

sabat wrote: »

He has had virtually unlimited power for 4 years now-can you give an example of what he's done to bring about this fascist state? Obama for example created the concept of a kill list-his "disposition matrix" of Americans citizens he could personally act as judge and executioner on. Did Trump do anything like that?

wasn't the disposition matrix a list of terrorists?

2ndcoming

humberklog wrote: »

The 18th minute past the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month.

\

U wot m8?

Strumms

Trump has been effectively fûcked headfirst under a bus by Boris Johnson today...

Speaking at Prime Minister's Questions, Mr Johnson told the House of Commons: "One of the many merits of the excellent conversation I had yesterday with president-elect Joe Biden was that we were strongly agreed on the need for ONCE AGAIN the UK and the US to stand together to stick up for our values around the world.

"To stick up for human rights and stick up for global free trade, to stick up for NATO, and to work together in the fight against climate change.

"It was refreshing, if I may say, to have that conversation and I look forward to many more."


The ‘once again’ phrase is very enlightening.... smart and impressive from Boris really as you might expect but he could have put that view over in more diplomatic language... sounds like a guy relieved to have a ‘reasonable’ and level headed man now to work with.

ChikiChiki

Randle P. McMurphy wrote: »

He could be getting ready for his Reichstag moment. By enabling him the Republicans are in danger of sleepwalking themselves in to the same mess the Germans got in to. Some may say I'm being over dramatic, but any student of history can see the parallels with his political career to date and a certain politician in 1930's Germany.

I don't think that assessment is OTT.

It's only when all this is over, we will realise how mad these times truly are.

Zak Flaps

Strumms wrote: »

Trump has been effectively fûcked headfirst under a bus by Boris Johnson today...

Speaking at Prime Minister's Questions, Mr Johnson told the House of Commons: "One of the many merits of the excellent conversation I had yesterday with president-elect Joe Biden was that we were strongly agreed on the need for ONCE AGAIN the UK and the US to stand together to stick up for our values around the world.

"To stick up for human rights and stick up for global free trade, to stick up for NATO, and to work together in the fight against climate change.

"It was refreshing, if I may say, to have that conversation and I look forward to many more."


The ‘once again’ phrase is very enlightening.... smart and impressive from Boris really as you might expect but he could have put that view over in more diplomatic language... sounds like a guy relieved to have a ‘reasonable’ and level headed man now to work with.

Dictionary.....embarrassment....photo....etc

cnocbui

I realised how mad things were the minute Trump won the last election. There shouldn't have been the last 4 years, let alone the nonsense now.

joe40

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Woods is a deeply unpleasant individual and has been publicly showing it for quite some time.

His support for Trump is consistent with the rest of his world-view.

Are then any examples of what you might call "nice people" who support Trump. His supporters seem very shouty and angry all the time.

DrumSteve

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Surprised to see James Woods is such a Trump fan


https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1326311273735155714

My immediate thoughts