Nimbyism: Windfarm off South County Dublin

ted1

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

See now I think you're just being sarcastic. I get it now. At least I hope that comment was tongue-in-cheek and you don't actually believe it.

Nope, it’s based on scientific evidence.
Think of the wake of the turbine like the a plume of smoke it propagates downwind and affects the aswell as causing turbulence. I work in the industry ( bit not this project ) and was talking to our modellers about it.

Banana Republic 1

ted1 wrote: »

Nope, it’s based on scientific evidence.
Think of the wake of the turbine like the a plume of smoke it propagates downwind and affects the aswell as causing turbulence. I work in the industry ( bit not this project ) and was talking to our modellers about it.

“Plume of smoke it propagates” they don’t run on diesel lad. There’s not many hand-gliders going down O’Connell street, turbulence FFs

ted1

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

“Plume of smoke it propagates” they don’t run on diesel lad. There’s not many hand-gliders going down O’Connell street, turbulence FFs

I said “think”, a plume of smoke is visible so it’s an easy analogy for people to understand.

Banana Republic 1

ted1 wrote: »

I said “think”, a plume of smoke is visible so it’s an easy analogy for people to understand.

Fair enough but I do know most of what’s pushed out from the anti turbine crowds is fake news.

Gaoth Laidir

ted1 wrote: »

Nope, it’s based on scientific evidence.
Think of the wake of the turbine like the a plume of smoke it propagates downwind and affects the aswell as causing turbulence. I work in the industry ( bit not this project ) and was talking to our modellers about it.

Firstly, our prevailing winds are southwesterlies, with easterlies making up less than 10% of the total winds in any one year.



Secondly, what exactly do you think would be any downwind effects be? You reckon trampolines will be strewn across the N11? :rolleyes: Remember, these people live downwind of the Wicklow mountains, which are in the way of the vast majority of the area's winds.

Banana Republic 1

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Firstly, our prevailing winds are southwesterlies, with easterlies making up less than 10% of the total winds in any one year.



Secondly, what exactly do you think would be any downwind effects be? You reckon trampolines will be strewn across the N11? :rolleyes: Remember, these people live downwind of the Wicklow mountains, which are in the way of the vast majority of the area's winds.

To many facts there, all the swivel eyes may explode.

beauf

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

If sombrero wearer was ten miles away then it wouldn’t matter.

If the turbines were the size of a sombrero then the ten miles wouldn't and location wouldn't be an issue.

beauf

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

Sarcasm doesn’t seem to work on this site.

Common sense doesn't seem to work either.

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

No, I don’t know where the children’s hospital came from lad we are talking about wind farms.

Actually we are talking about the location of wind farms. You decided that objecting to the location of a wind farm was the same as objecting to any form of clean energy.

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

. happy to breath in tonnes of NOX, sulphur, and particulates that burn your lungs and destroy your DNA. Good one!

Banana Republic 1

beauf wrote: »

If the turbines were the size of a sombrero then the ten miles wouldn't and location wouldn't be an issue.

How would the sombrero fit into a cinema if it was the size of a wind turbine ?

beauf

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

How would the sombrero fit into a cinema if it was the size of a wind turbine ?

Drive in...

Edgware

The usual whingers will object like their ancestors objected to the Rock of Cashel building and railways

beauf

Edgware wrote: »

The usual whingers will object like their ancestors objected to the Rock of Cashel building and railways

Just to be pedantic, technically since its about nimbyism they could only object if they live near the Rock of Cashel, every railway and every wind farm.
They are unlikely to be the same people with the same ancestors and live in all these places all at the same time.

ted1

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Firstly, our prevailing winds are southwesterlies, with easterlies making up less than 10% of the total winds in any one year.



Secondly, what exactly do you think would be any downwind effects be? You reckon trampolines will be strewn across the N11? :rolleyes: Remember, these people live downwind of the Wicklow mountains, which are in the way of the vast majority of the area's winds.

Downwind are the recreational bay users like sailors , kitesurfers, windsurfers among others. These are vested interests/stakeholders who have legitimate concern.

I’ve yet to hear a good reason why they can’t be located further out to sea

beauf

ted1 wrote: »

...
I’ve yet to hear a good reason why they can’t be located further out to sea

I assume its just cost. I would assume the suitable sites that are feasible are limited, and also the costs of construction in certain locations might be prohibitive.

Maybe they could hide them with a wall. Trump might be free soon to take up such a project...

ted1

beauf wrote: »

I assume its just cost. I would assume the suitable sites that are feasible are limited, and also the costs of construction in certain locations might be prohibitive.

Maybe they could hide them with a wall. Trump might be free soon to take up such a project...

There several area available on the East coast that are further out and suitable. But the Germans want more profit, and sure it doesn’t affect them

bob mcbob

ted1 wrote: »

Downwind are the recreational bay users like sailors , kitesurfers, windsurfers among others. These are vested interests/stakeholders who have legitimate concern.

I’ve yet to hear a good reason why they can’t be located further out to sea

If they go further out they will be in the middle of the Irish Sea shipping routes -

see map in section 4

https://www.vox.com/2016/4/25/11503152/shipping-routes-map

beauf

bob mcbob wrote: »

If they go further out they will be in the middle of the Irish Sea shipping routes -

see map in section 4

https://www.vox.com/2016/4/25/11503152/shipping-routes-map

Its a long coastline. Its hard to believe that the only options are a shipping lane, and just off Sandycove. Are there no shipping lanes into Dublin and Dún Laoghaire that are near by?

Again I'm reminded off the children hospital. The only options where a terrible location and and even worse location. In the entire country.

Gaoth Laidir

ted1 wrote: »

Downwind are the recreational bay users like sailors , kitesurfers, windsurfers among others. These are vested interests/stakeholders who have legitimate concern.

I’ve yet to hear a good reason why they can’t be located further out to sea

You didn't hear the reason? It was very clearly stated that the reason is because of the shallow waters there. A secondary reason is efficiency and cost, with reduced cabling and hence power losses.

Both of these were clearly stated by the same contractor that you earlier told me acknowledges that the turbines will be visible. Maybe some selective hearing going on, no?

ted1

bob mcbob wrote: »

If they go further out they will be in the middle of the Irish Sea shipping routes -

see map in section 4

https://www.vox.com/2016/4/25/11503152/shipping-routes-map

Nope. It’s a large stretch of coast that’s 90km wide. It’s not all shipping lanes. How big to you think ships are ?

ted1

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

You didn't hear the reason? It was very clearly stated that the reason is because of the shallow waters there. A secondary reason is efficiency and cost, with reduced cabling and hence power losses.

Both of these were clearly stated by the same contractor that you earlier told me acknowledges that the turbines will be visible. Maybe some selective hearing going on, no?

There’s other sand banks available, and the losses on a the line will be minimal. The fact you think it’s to believe it’s for line loss in comical.


So you think the north Irish Sea WF is going to lose money as it’s 17km offshore ?

Gaoth Laidir

ted1 wrote: »

Downwind are the recreational bay users like sailors , kitesurfers, windsurfers among others. These are vested interests/stakeholders who have legitimate concern.

Again, what exactly are these concerns? You do know that they're not like an electric fan in your house, yes? They won't be making wind. In fact, the whole way they work is by extracting some of the energy from the wind. If you can share some of this alleged modelling work that shows there to be the risk of a Braymuda Triangle in Dublin Bay then please share it for all to see.

Gaoth Laidir

ted1 wrote: »

There’s other sand banks available, and the losses on a the line will be minimal. The fact you think it’s to believe it’s for line loss in comical.

Which banks are these? Please point them out.

https://atlas.marine.ie/#?c=53.2760:-6.0133:12

And power loss is not a factor? I need to go back to college so.

ted1

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Again, what exactly are these concerns? You do know that they're not like an electric fan in your house, yes? They won't be making wind. In fact, the whole way they work is by extracting some of the energy from the wind. If you can share some of this alleged modelling work that shows there to be the risk of a Braymuda Triangle in Dublin Bay then please share it for all to see.

I know exactly how they work. No I can’t share the data. The wind tips will be travelling at approx 200 kmh displacing a huge amount of air and creating vortices

ted1

Gaoth Laidir wrote: »

Which banks are these? Please point them out.

https://atlas.marine.ie/#?c=53.2760:-6.0133:12

And power loss is not a factor? I need to go back to college so.

You should if you think that the Power loss over 20km is any real difference than over 10km.

How much power do you think that the Celtic interlink is going to lose ?

Gaoth Laidir

ted1 wrote: »

I know exactly how they work. No I can’t share the data. The wind tips will be travelling at approx 200 kmh displacing a huge amount of air and creating vortices

I can't believe this. You think that a rotational tip speed of 200 km/h means a horizontal wind of 200 km/h? You seem to be implying that it will generate great big horizontal tornados that will topple anything in its path.

And why can't you share the data?

Gaoth Laidir

ted1 wrote: »

You should if you think that the Power loss over 20km is any real difference than over 10km.

How much power do you think that the Celtic interlink is going to lose ?

I said power loss is a secondary factor, but it is a factor in the overall economics of it. It is one of a list of factors that are considered, some larger than others.

Markcheese

ted1 wrote: »

Downwind are the recreational bay users like sailors , kitesurfers, windsurfers among others. These are vested interests/stakeholders who have legitimate concern.

I’ve yet to hear a good reason why they can’t be located further out to sea

How many wind surfers and kite surfers are gonna be that far out ,
I accept that there may be some turbulence , but at distance ?
I never seen a sheep or cows blown into the skys or knocked over by wind turbines ,

beauf

If cabling getting power from France isn't a problem. Why is it a problem a vastly shorter distance just off shore.

Banana Republic 1

ted1 wrote: »

I know exactly how they work. No I can’t share the data. The wind tips will be travelling at approx 200 kmh displacing a huge amount of air and creating vortices

How many miles out?

Banana Republic 1

ted1 wrote: »

There’s other sand banks available, and the losses on a the line will be minimal. The fact you think it’s to believe it’s for line loss in comical.


So you think the north Irish Sea WF is going to lose money as it’s 17km offshore ?

Plenty the South China Sea