Inheritance tax advice recomendation

Bass Reeves

Dolly401 wrote: »

I guess your right. Im taking a big risk for my family if I proceed with the transfer. It is alot of money to us. I think I will contact revenue again and try and get an answer.

You are taking a big risk for your family if you do not. 70k in inheritance tax is 200k in inheritance as well as unused portion of CAT already. Maybe 300k plus.

Get a long-term loan interest rates are low talk to your credit union incase things go pear shaped, talk to a bank about a long-term loan with land as security.

You will find when you make the decision the rest will fall into place. I not sure I would talk to revenue they will cover there advice and give you the worst case scenario

Dolly401

ml100 wrote: »

Are your parents going to keep a right of residency in their house, this can complicate things too depending on how its worded, but it might help you if you can't get argi relief on the house, when I did my transfer I was told by my accountant that if the transfer included a right of residency for my parents in the house, the house would not transfer from a revenue point of view until they gave up that right (either sign it away or die), but I would be the legal owner (from a fair deal point if view) from when the transfer happened, this could give you some time to save for the tax etc, might be something to check out.

Thanks for this. Yes they are keeping a right of residency. This is useful information - none of my 'experts' have raised this before.

JeffKenna

ml100 wrote: »

Are your parents going to keep a right of residency in their house, this can complicate things too depending on how its worded, but it might help you if you can't get argi relief on the house, when I did my transfer I was told by my accountant that if the transfer included a right of residency for my parents in the house, the house would not transfer from a revenue point of view until they gave up that right (either sign it away or die), but I would be the legal owner (from a fair deal point if view) from when the transfer happened, this could give you some time to save for the tax etc, might be something to check out.

This is a really good point. You might want to fact check it with your accountant but I don't think any liability on the house will fall to you until both of your parents pass away. This will give you a few years to sort things out if worst comes to worst.

Bass Reeves

ml100 wrote: »

Are your parents going to keep a right of residency in their house, this can complicate things too depending on how its worded, but it might help you if you can't get argi relief on the house, when I did my transfer I was told by my accountant that if the transfer included a right of residency for my parents in the house, the house would not transfer from a revenue point of view until they gave up that right (either sign it away or die), but I would be the legal owner (from a fair deal point if view) from when the transfer happened, this could give you some time to save for the tax etc, might be something to check out.

Get out of jail free card. Talk to your accountant about this. It gets you to a place where when you inherit you will have an income from it

monseiur

Bass Reeves wrote: »

You are taking a big risk for your family if you do not. 70k in inheritance tax is 200k in inheritance as well as unused portion of CAT already. Maybe 300k plus.

Get a long-term loan interest rates are low talk to your credit union incase things go pear shaped, talk to a bank about a long-term loan with land as security.

You will find when you make the decision the rest will fall into place. I not sure I would talk to revenue they will cover there advice and give you the worst case scenario

Surely the rental income from 30 acres should go a long way in paying back this €70K bank loan ?
If I was in her position I would move my business to another solicitor and accountant.
Explain to both that you wish to transfer both land and house into your name, get the required valuation's etc. You are not obliged to know your brothers business, so proceed as if you're totally in the dark of what your brother did or did not claim in the past............ what they don't know should not bother them.
So brazen it out, act innocent/ignorant if/when required. Chances are that revenue will be happy once you pay some money, they don't go out of their way chasing every last cent in cases similar to yours when even they can't give you a clear, precise unambiguous answer.
Your parents can explain that the house you're inheriting is the family house/farmhouse (which it is) and they probably will have a lien on it until they pass away.
Also bear in mind that you sometimes have to spend a little money to make a lot of money. The ball is your court - play it or loose everything game set and match.

zf0wqv9oemuasj

Panch18 wrote: »

Don't forget Stamp Duty either - its at a ridiculous 7.5% now on none residential property

He would be eligible for consanguinity relief which would reduce the stamp duty to 1% on the agri land.

893bet

Dolly401 wrote: »

Yep that house powers the sheds. My bit I am inheriting could be sold as a farm in its own right - house, outhouses and land. So could the other bit though my brother inherited though.

But not without the house it couldn’t be sold as they share the same yard and power supply etc.

I recommend Aisling Meehan. She is an accountant and tax consultant that specialises in farm transfers.

She won’t be cheap but she is good at her job and should be able to answer your questions.
An hour of her time for starters may be useful as long as you have all the required information to provide her.

Panch18

Hannah Proud Hospital wrote: »

He would be eligible for consanguinity relief which would reduce the stamp duty to 1% on the agri land.

yep very good point

Tonynewholland

cosatron wrote: »

aonther option for you is to proceed with the land transfer and get your parents to will you the house. Will this work? Your already caught for fair deal scheme anyways so you can use the house against this.

It’s better to transfer the farm house with the farm. You can’t get ag. relief on it when transferred later.

ahnowbrowncow

Dolly401 wrote: »

Thanks for this. Yes they are keeping a right of residency. This is useful information - none of my 'experts' have raised this before.

This is it, and as others have mentioned, unless the accountants and solicitors deal with inheritcance and CAT regularly they are not to be conisdered experts in this. Following their advice, if incorrect, will not prevent you from being liable for any tax due.

You need to contact someone that has plenty of experience in this, not all accountants do, which is evidenced by both accountants giving differing opinions.

Donegalforever

Dolly401 wrote: »

I have paid them for the advice and happy to pay more for it in writing - but none of them appear to want to put it in writing, Im guessing they are not 100% convinced they are correct.

I suggest that you ask Accountant No 2 to refer you to a Solicitor who specialises in this type of case.

I had a problem with a solicitor who frankly didn't know he a*rse from her elbow when it came to land transfer. She was supposed to specialise in that field - pun intended.
I had to do research and point out to her where she was wrong.

blackbox

Panch18 wrote: »

The ironically name "FAIR DEAL" scheme

the most unfair deal ever created - an absolute sham

You don't have to use it. You are perfectly free to pay for a private nursing home if you think that is fairer.

The scheme gives security and comfort to a lot of people.

Panch18

blackbox wrote: »

You don't have to use it. You are perfectly free to pay for a private nursing home if you think that is fairer.

The scheme gives security and comfort to a lot of people.

Work all your life pay loads of taxes along the way and then pay for your nursing home

Do f all all your life, draw welfare all your life, get someone else to pay for your nursing home

If fact the guys paying are paying double to subsidise the ones that aren't paying.

This is the Irish definition of fair

batman75

OP it sounds to me that Revenue will only adjudicate on your scenario when you make a definitive move.

The fact that revenue are hedging their bets means that accountants will also feel themselves to be on mucky soil. Solo accountants never put anything in writing whatever chance you have with an accountancy firm.

Given the age of your parents the wish to avail of the fair deal scheme possibly should have been discussed and acted upon years ago. But you are where you are but a salutary lesson for those in a similar situation.

Interesting point vis a vis right of your parents to live on in the house once transferred to you.

I would be surprised if the rental property fell under the farmhouse definition. I would assume the farmhouse is where you parents reside.

If you thread carefully you should be able to avoid the avoidable inheritance pitfalls. Bear in mind if advice sounds too good to be true it generally is.

Regarding the fair deal and it's fairness yeah I would agree that the state should pick up the tab especially if you have paid taxes all your life. The cost of old folks homes is a terrible burden on families.

trg

Aisling Meehan is a solicitor. I'd steer clear because of the conflicting advice coming from the solicitors.

I'd suggest FDC or IFAC, bound to be one of them near you. They specialise in this farm stuff and don't forget farm tax has legislation specifically for farmers, no other trade has this.

I think go with one of those for this job, pay their fee, and take their advice and be done with it.

There's often more than 1 way to skin a cat too, if there is they'll tell you.

Thegingerbear

As someone said earlier you need specialist tax advice and the best route to go is contact a Tax Consultant and they will give you the definitive answer that you require. I am surprised your Solicitor or Accountant haven't already pointed you in that direction especially if they are unsure themselves. They are not cheap, about €350 for an hours consultation but it's money well spent and will ensure no surprises from Revenue.