Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

treade1

rubadub wrote: »

what is your definition of strange?

here is google's.



It is certainly unusual, but does not surprise me, and not difficult to understand. We were joking in work as the usual lad who seems to always have "something" at this time of year has caught nothing. The last ~15years or so he always had something and would be sneezing & coughing and we were saying he would be banished this year.

there were several sites explaining it, going on about typical R numbers for it, and how its just basically down. Some even talking how the flu could be at risk of being wiped out.

It doesn't just magically develop, like how some people think you get a cold just from being out in cold weather.

But you see that is where you might be wrong. The common cold "rhinoviruses" are able to hide in a healthy host. The term is viral latency. It can then reawaken at a time of its choosing. It is therefore possible that exposure to cold weather my trigger the latent virus hiding in your system to reawaken. The wisdom of older people handed down from generation to generation should not be immediately dismissed as nonsense.

There is no evidence yet to suggest that Covid-19 can exhibit viral latency but it certainly would be a useful tool for a seasonal virus looking to survive to have in its armoury.

PowerToWait

acequion wrote: »

Your point being what exactly? Look at the thread title! "Relaxation of restrictions". Anything to do with Mc Conkey and the zero covid anti relaxation pushers is highly relevant and can lead to some very "scintillating discourse" as the many pages of this long thread will reveal.

My point being that juvenile name calling is almost exclusively reserved for those on the denial / let it rip side of things, which to my mind reveals quite a lot about the intellectual capacity of those posting that level of discussion.

Don't Chute!

Penfailed wrote: »

Why do people continue watching things like this when it makes their blood pressure rise so much?

It’s the nine o’clock news. Are we not allowed to comment on the way these people are reporting this thing?

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

I really don’t understand how nobody is getting flu in flu season...

The usual suspects will obviously claim its restrictions but sure even level 5 and we still have hundreds a day testing positive for Covid.

Flu is less transmissible than covid therefore any restrictions will have a greater effect. FLu also doesn't just emerge form hibernation in Winter, it is transmitted here by people coming from overseas, ebbing and flowing across the world. Can anyone think of anything that may have interrupted that this year?

Micky 32

Boggles wrote: »

You mean science and reality?

So Boggles, will you be coming back here next winter proposing more restrictions to keep the flu at bay? :rolleyes:


The flu isn’t that transmissible anyway. I deal with the public everyday and haven’t caught it in 10 years.

Uriel.

normanoffside wrote: »

How’s about a mad idea like approving some of the more reliable antigen tests to be taken by any visitor?
No, that would be too much like lateral thinking so instead limit visitors and don’t test them. Typical Tony and his narrow way of thinking.

Oh yes, the tests that missed 51% of COVID-19 cases in a trial in Liverpool.
Amazing not relying on such as successful approach for THE most vulnerable people.

Penfailed

Don't Chute! wrote: »

It’s the nine o’clock news. Are we not allowed to comment on the way these people are reporting this thing?

Be my guest.

normanoffside

Uriel. wrote: »

Oh yes, the tests that missed 51% of COVID-19 cases in a trial in Liverpool.
Amazing not relying on such as successful approach for THE most vulnerable people.

Source?

Even if true there are a lot more reliable ones on the market now, which is why I said about picking one of the more reliable ones..

bb1234567

Deleted User wrote: »

I really don’t understand how nobody is getting flu in flu season...

The usual suspects will obviously claim its restrictions but sure even level 5 and we still have hundreds a day testing positive for Covid.

https://twitter.com/zorinaq/status/1337899269219446784

Also happened in Nz and Aus, no flu activity and also no COVID. No mystery there, a much less infectious disease was largely eliminated by measures which are keeping a handle on COVID. Not that much of a leap, not to mention unprecedented uptake in flu vaccine across the planet and major reduction in air travel between hemispheres.

In addition to that this conspiracy of a flu cover up is just ridiculous. If any government or healthcare system was prepared to lie so boldly and classify all flu cases as COVID, wouldn't it be easier just to announce some fake flu cases alongside in order to calm the inevitable firestorm by 'truthers' alleging cover up and conspiracy on twitter and online. Seems like a really needlessly controversy means of making COVID look worse than it is, must be really desperate to pump up those COVID cases. Why don't they just do that with all the bogus PCR tests instead you guys talk about everyday?

Uriel.

normanoffside wrote: »

Source?

Even if true there are a lot more reliable ones on the market now, which is why I said about picking one of the more reliable ones..

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-paper-presenting-preliminary-data-on-accuracy-of-the-innova-lateral-flow-sars-cov-2-antigen-test-in-the-liverpool-pilot/

Which more reliable ones? Can you link me to some of the audited data?

Again, I simply say, you NPHET/public health authorities can't win. It was their fault for not imposing visiting restrictions quick enough in March according to many people. Now its their fault that visiting is restricted.

FintanMcluskey

bb1234567 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/zorinaq/status/1337899269219446784

Also happened in Nz and Aus, no flu activity and also no COVID. No mystery there, a much less infectious disease was largely eliminated by measures which are keeping a handle on COVID. Not that much of a leap, not to mention unprecedented uptake in flu vaccine across the planet and major reduction in air travel between hemispheres.

In addition to that this conspiracy of a flu cover up is just ridiculous. If any government or healthcare system was prepared to lie so boldly and classify all flu cases as COVID, wouldn't it be easier just to announce some fake flu cases alongside in order to calm the inevitable firestorm by 'truthers' alleging cover up and conspiracy on twitter and online. Seems like a really needless way of creating controversy just to make COVID look worse than it is, must be really desperate to pump up those COVID cases. Why don't they just do that with all the bogus PCR tests instead?

If we continue in lockdowns we can save influenza deaths in future?

Or is there an acceptable number of deaths from respiratory illnesses?

bb1234567

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

If we continue in lockdowns we can save influenza deaths in future?

Or is there an acceptable number of deaths from respiratory illnesses?

I think we are below the threshhold of what is acceptable level of deaths yes and have been for some time. What does it matter? I'm not making the rules. Just pointing out that the theory flu cases are being classified as COVID makes no sense, and influenza acitivity has been at minimal levels in regions of the world with few COVID restrictions (Sweden), and places with no COVID cases at all.(australia and New zealand)

FintanMcluskey

bb1234567 wrote: »

I think we are below the threshhold of what is acceptable level of deaths yes and have been for some time. What does it matter? I'm not making the rules. Just pointing out that the theory flu cases are being classified as COVID makes no sense, and influenza acitivity has been at minimal levels in regions of the world with few COVID restrictions (Sweden), and places with no COVID cases at all.(australia and New zealand)

It matters because the justification for removal of restrictions will have to be quantified.

Restrictions are now credited with preventing covid and influenza deaths.

Boggles

Micky 32 wrote: »

So Boggles, will you be coming back here next winter proposing more restrictions to keep the flu at bay? :rolleyes:

No Micky 32 I won't.

Micky 32 wrote: »

The flu isn’t that transmissible anyway.

Indeed, helped by vaccines, etc.

I would suggest going forward they mitigate further in places which drive the flu.

The flu is definitely an interesting debate. Just last year there was bad flu going around and hospitals overwhelmed.

But we didn’t close down the country and wear masks etc.

And any of us could have easily helped spread it to an elderly person that died.

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

The flu is definitely an interesting debate.

It isn't really, you continually trying to equate it as being the same thing won't change reality.

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

It matters because the justification for removal of restrictions will have to be quantified.

Restrictions have been removed, the main quantified justification is the instance rate in the community.

The higher the instance rate the harsher the restrictions.

See Holland who will be bringing in extremely harsh restrictions until mid Jan at least.

The Netherlands will go into a total lockdown from tonight, with all but essential shops closing, as well as schools, museums, gyms and hairdressers. Prime minister Mark Rutte will announce the measures in a speech to the nation at 7pm, but many have already been leaked or confirmed via official channels, broadcaster NOS said.

However, reports that a curfew might be part of the package, particularly at New Year, have not yet been confirmed. Both primary and secondary schools will be shut from Wednesday and will shift back to online education. Daycare centres will also close, but will remain open for parents who work in essential professions.

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

The flu is definitely an interesting debate. Just last year there was bad flu going around and hospitals overwhelmed.

But we didn’t close down the country and wear masks etc.

And any of us could have easily helped spread it to an elderly person that died.

Spot on. Unfortunately the arm chair experts chose to ignore / disregard "eradication" of flu this year.

Its a bit like talking about suicides and all other lockdown consequences, not very popular. Not related to covid directly. Dont make headlines. Shure lockdown makes people happier ofc theres no increase in suicides :rolleyes:

cian68

Deleted User wrote: »

The flu is definitely an interesting debate. Just last year there was bad flu going around and hospitals overwhelmed.

But we didn’t close down the country and wear masks etc.

And any of us could have easily helped spread it to an elderly person that died.

We had vaccines

Boggles

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Spot on. Unfortunately the arm chair experts chose to ignore / disregard "eradication" of flu this year.

Which experts armchair or otherwise are ignoring the flu this year?

The "eradication" of the flu given the restrictions because of Covid prove Covid is far more transmissible than the seasonal flu and by extension is a far more dangerous disease.

I fail to see any intelligent angle on this one that doesn't scupper the false narrative about the flu versus Covid.

suicide_circus

If we dont wear masks and socially distance every flu season, there will be avoidable deaths.

Polar101

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

If we continue in lockdowns we can save influenza deaths in future?

Sure we can. Or we vaccinate people against influenza. I think the second option is better.

FintanMcluskey

Polar101 wrote: »

Sure we can. Or we vaccinate people against influenza. I think the second option is better.

If we take the second option you are justifying a couple of hundred, if not thousand, influenza deaths in a Ireland each Winter, even with the vaccine

Why are you deciding that’s it’s ok for some to die?

Surely we can’t play God?

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

If we take the second option you are justifying a couple of hundred, if not thousand, influenza deaths in a Ireland each Winter, even with the vaccine

Why are you deciding that’s it’s ok for some to die?

Surely we can’t play God?

Are you saying we should bring in restrictions for the flu with mitigation?

I mean so far we have eradicated it.

But for the more lucid individual that just highlights how much more transmissible and dangerous Covid is, even with wide sweeping restrictions and mitigation is still has the ability to cause mass deaths and overwhelm hospital systems to the point countries have had to airlift their critical to other countries.

The richest country in the world just surpassed 300,000 deaths in 10 odd months.

But sure not even a flu, something something. MSM. Can't trust them BillyBob55 told me.

FintanMcluskey

Boggles wrote: »

Are you saying we should bring in restrictions for the flu with mitigation?

I mean so far we have eradicated it.

But for the more lucid individual that just highlights how much more transmissible and dangerous Covid is, even with wide sweeping restrictions and mitigation is still has the ability to cause mass deaths and overwhelm hospital systems to the point countries have had to airlift their critical to other countries.

The richest country in the world just surpassed 300,000 deaths in 10 odd months.

But sure not even a flu, something something. MSM. Can't trust them BillyBob55 told me.

Really hard to follow this.

Anyhow, As regards the first question in your post I’m asking what number of deaths from influenza will be acceptable in future. Surely the answer is 0.

I’m just trying to quantify it.

Now your second point. Are you alluding to suggest that perhaps widespread restrictions don’t actually work?

The last nonsense you posted is not something I’ll bother debating

suicide_circus

Death is unacceptable

Lockdowns will be extended and used until they get 70% vaccination coverage. I think 40-50% of people will take the vaccination when available and offered to them. The remaining percentage required will gradually "give-in" as the lockdowns drag on.

EU are calling the shots here. You'll see every country adopt a similar approach as the vaxxes are rolled out.

Boggles

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Anyhow, As regards the first question in your post I’m asking what number of deaths from influenza will be acceptable in future. Surely the answer is 0.

Nope.

That view point would be remedial in the extreme.

BeefeaterHat

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Lockdowns will be extended and used until they get 70% vaccination coverage. I think 40-50% of people will take the vaccination when available and offered to them. The remaining percentage required will gradually "give-in" as the lockdowns drag on.

EU are calling the shots here. You'll see every country adopt a similar approach as the vaxxes are rolled out.

And of course you can look forward to the traditional Irish **** up with distributing the vaccine. Micheal with his 'we hope'. You shouldn't be hoping you should be preparing.

CruelSummer

Two push notifications to my phone re ‘new strain’ in the U.K. More hyped up hysteria. We’d a new strain in Ireland this October already.
No doubt this will be used as a tool for more restrictions. Coupled with that Míchael Martin stated no ‘normality’ until at least June, vaccines roll out will be slow. The Vaccine task force sounds like they haven’t a clue when they’ll get what vaccine.
Meanwhile the people are out and about, living life! Shops, restaurants, gyms, are busy. No one is living in fear and very few are paying much attention to the scraremongering at the moment thankfully.