Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Talisman

Micky 32 wrote: »

Interesting comment from McKee:

Professor McKee said news of the new strain of the virus was announced in a "very unusual way, particularly given that there have been so many other mutations over the past number of months that were not announced in the same way".

“He added that the mutation could well mean that the virus has weakened. “

My understanding is that there are two mutations in the 'South East England' strain. The first is in the protein spike - the mutation is significant because the protein spike is what the vaccines are focused on training the immune system to attack. The second mutation is the same one that was found in the Danish mink farms. The strain seems more infectious but more testing in laboratory conditions is required.

average_runner

Best thing that hopefully come out of covid is that we dont need to go to A&E for everything

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Less admissions to hospitals and icus also in this cohort as a percentage of cases and in total.

I'm not taken in completely by the let it rip brigade or the government that only restrictions and hospital care have helped. Somewhere in the middle lies the truth. We were not good boys and girls in the summer and bad in the winter with restrictions. It is a respiratory disease that is seasonal and it is natural for its severity to wane over time . If this disease was around 100 years ago it would barely have even have registered due to many other competing illnesses, lower average age of population. Africa for example.

It makes sense to me now that we are at the bottom of vaccine priority list. Tony told my cohort that this is a very dangerous illness and could kill you but now thinks an 18 year old should be vaccinated before me. Why? negligible risk for someone my age without underlying conditions. Either he was dishonest then or things have changed 6 months later.

The only way an 18 year old is ahead of you is if they are in long term residential care or have a high risk pre existing condition

CruelSummer

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/people-with-vaccine-certificates-to-face-fewer-restrictions-on-life-39869247.html

This is absolutely not the way to go and will only increase anti vaccination agendas, validating their ideas.

Don't Chute!

Boggles wrote: »

Translation: Stop with the pandemic denial, it's been nearly a year.

Show me where I denied the pandemic. In any of my posts.

_Kaiser_

Remember when the suggestion of a "vaccine passport" being required to participate in society was being dismissed as a conspiracy theory?

Vaccine certificates may be needed to attend social gatherings or sporting events once the majority of the population are vaccinated.
At the launch of the National Covid-19 Vaccination Programme, Health Minister Stephen Donnelly said certificates could play a key role in the fight against coronavirus if the vaccine significantly reduces transmission of the disease.

The certificates are being considered for air travel in the EU, but they may also be used to allow for greater attendance at mass gatherings once most people are vaccinated.

A Government source said “nothing is being ruled in or out” in terms of how the certificates will be used, but noted that other countries have trialled using them for attending events.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/people-with-vaccine-certificates-to-face-fewer-restrictions-on-life-39869247.html

Being discussed on NT this morning too.

Not so far-fetched after all is it?

average_runner

Someone mentioned we have the youngest population in Europe, that is true for the highest percentage under a certain age group but we dont have the lowest median age in europe.

We have the highest under 14 in Europe, we are within 3% of the rest of Europe for 14-59 and we are 10% behind Italy on over 60 and then within between 6-4,% of other countries in europe with other countries less than us also

Stormyteacup

average_runner wrote: »

And 800 deaths in Germany today not that bad also?

‘Not that bad’ to imply a blase attitude about people losing their lives?

Instead, maybe some perspective about 800 reported deaths in a country of 83 million. Equivalent of 50 reported deaths here.

Germany experienced comparatively fewer deaths in March/April.

I’ve been skeptical of shock headlines for a while now. It really doesn’t take much drilling down to expose them as such.

average_runner

Stormyteacup wrote: »

‘Not that bad’ to imply a blase attitude about people losing their lives?

Instead, maybe some perspective about 800 reported deaths in a country of 83 million. Equivalent of 50 reported deaths here.

Germany experienced comparatively fewer deaths in March/April.

I’ve been skeptical of shock headlines for a while now. It really doesn’t take much drilling down to expose them as such.

Maybe some perspective from you.
If a bomb killed 800 in Germany, what would the attitude be?

800 is up 550 on their daily highest with this virus.

CruelSummer

CruelSummer wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/people-with-vaccine-certificates-to-face-fewer-restrictions-on-life-39869247.html

This is absolutely not the way to go and will only increase anti vaccination agendas, validating their ideas.

If there is a travel one, that allows me to travel freely, I say bring it on.

average_runner

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Remember when the suggestion of a "vaccine passport" being required to participate in society was being dismissed as a conspiracy theory?



https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/people-with-vaccine-certificates-to-face-fewer-restrictions-on-life-39869247.html

Being discussed on NT this morning too.

Not so far-fetched after all is it?

Just dont go these countries then. Same way you wouldn't go to certain countries without vaccinations now

average_runner

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If there is a travel one, that allows me to travel freely, I say bring it on.

Will be easier to get tickets to big events also.
No one really cares about the anti vaccination group, never have in the past

Stormyteacup

average_runner wrote: »

Maybe some perspective from you.
If a bomb killed 800 in Germany, what would the attitude be?

800 is up 550 on their daily highest with this virus.

You seem determined to put me in a box with sociopaths.

Yes their deaths are increasing at a worrying rate, hopefully it will peak soon.

_Kaiser_

average_runner wrote: »

Just dont go these countries then. Same way you wouldn't go to certain countries without vaccinations now

Clearly you missed where our minister for health, and a government source said that it was being looked at HERE too.

You could forseeably be asked for "your papers" when going to the pub, for a meal, to a match, gig - anywhere there's an X amount of other people.

As I said when this idea was first floated, it sounds like something from an 80s Cold War movie.

average_runner

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Clearly you missed where our minister for health, and a government source said that it was being looked at HERE too.

You could forseeably be asked for "your papers" when going to the pub, for a meal, to a match, gig - anywhere there's an X amount of other people.

As I said when this idea was first floated, it sounds like something from an 80s Cold War movie.

Same way you could be asked for ID for all these already?

buried

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Clearly you missed where our minister for health, and a government source said that it was being looked at HERE too.

You could forseeably be asked for "your papers" when going to the pub, for a meal, to a match, gig - anywhere there's an X amount of other people.

As I said when this idea was first floated, it sounds like something from an 80s Cold War movie.

You may as well be talking to the wall man. A lot of people will be literally coming in their pants at the thought of the chance to be given their own licence of satisfactory cleanliness that they can wave around.

_Kaiser_

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Remember when the suggestion of a "vaccine passport" being required to participate in society was being dismissed as a conspiracy theory?



https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/people-with-vaccine-certificates-to-face-fewer-restrictions-on-life-39869247.html

Being discussed on NT this morning too.

Not so far-fetched after all is it?

A few weeks back, it was considered a conspiracy to suggest that we were deliberately spreading fear to get compliance. Then Tony unveiled his fearmeter at a press conference and it became clear that they are gauging the level of fear and openly want it to be higher.

Like you say, the vaccine passport was considered a conspiracy theory a few weeks back. Now our Minister for Health is openly discussing it.

Our government actively spreading fear to gain compliance and discussing forcing people into vaccination is a real concern for me.

I’ll gladly take the vaccine. But tell us the positive reasons to do so instead of threats of being excluded from society.

average_runner

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A few weeks back, it was considered a conspiracy to suggest that we were deliberately spreading fear to get compliance. Then Tony unveiled his fearmeter at a press conference and it became clear that they are gauging the level of fear and openly want it to be higher.

Like you say, the vaccine passport was considered a conspiracy theory a few weeks back. Now our Minister for Health is openly discussing it.

Our government actively spreading fear to gain compliance and discussing forcing people into vaccination is a real concern for me.

I’ll gladly take the vaccine. But tell us the positive reasons to do so instead of threats of being excluded from society.

Actually its Europe and and sure you have to show your passport going into other countries.

As I said before, travel insurance wont cover you for covid if no vaccination as too much of a risk to them.

Health insurance might go the same way and that is fair play

zerosugarbuzz

CruelSummer wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/people-with-vaccine-certificates-to-face-fewer-restrictions-on-life-39869247.html

This is absolutely not the way to go and will only increase anti vaccination agendas, validating their ideas.

This is why I don’t listen to news or read it regarding COVID anymore. All this vaccines “may be” needed to travel and this might happen or that might happen. Pure speculation and fear mongering that our media and “experts “ have made an art form out of.

Stormyteacup

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Clearly you missed where our minister for health, and a government source said that it was being looked at HERE too.

You could forseeably be asked for "your papers" when going to the pub, for a meal, to a match, gig - anywhere there's an X amount of other people.

As I said when this idea was first floated, it sounds like something from an 80s Cold War movie.

Is it really feasible? It’s concerning alright. I could imagine countries that are Covid free requiring a vaccination cert for entry maybe. But for everyday living?

There would have to be exemptions for anyone unable to be vaccinated, including very young babies. And would businesses be so quick to eliminate 30% of their market?

I’d be hopeful that after vaccination rollout and numbers retreating to insignificance, there won’t be an appetite for the social unrest and huge administration headache that would result from what would essentially be mandatory vaccination.

zerosugarbuzz

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

This is why I don’t listen to news or read it regarding COVID anymore. All this vaccines “may be” needed to travel and this might happen or that might happen. Pure speculation and fear mongering that our media and “experts “ have made an art form out of.

It’s a discussion board, so okay to post about it though. I’m posting on it because I would encourage it and be the first in line. Anti-vaxxers can do whatever they like and they should not have any influence on policy. I actually think one is likely for travel so that restrictions can be completely eliminated. Why would it not be? Makes sense to me

BryanMartin21

Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Mandatory vaccinations go against the idea of personal responsibility. There seems to be a misunderstanding from the black-and-white thinking of "if you're sceptical of the vaccine you're an anti-vaxxer loon" as to what mandatory vaccines involves - severely curtailing freedom without a vaccine passport is a mandatory vaccination programme.

Testing on pregnant women and children I understand has not started as of yet so I would think anyone with any sort of intelligence will realise that it will be a couple of years before the vaccine is certified safe for pregnant women / women who want to have kids. Considering we have a very much old white man NPHET and taoiseach, I don't see much consideration of this aspect at the decision making level.

Boggles

BryanMartin21 wrote: »

The whole "my body, my choice" mob are probably hypocritically happy to stroke each other on Twitter about what good citizens they are for tweeting how they'll be top of the queue for the vaccine when their time comes.

How is that hypocritical?

BryanMartin21

Boggles wrote: »

How is that hypocritical?

Hypocritical to claim "my body, my choice" for one health issue and "your body, my choice" for another.

Boggles

BryanMartin21 wrote: »

Hypocritical to claim "my body, my choice" and yet argue for mandatory vaccines for people.

Well that isn't what you said.

But I'm pretty sure no one in governance is arguing for mandatory vaccination at the moment.

I can certainly see a requirement for vaccination if you are entering anther country.

I mean the likes of New Zealand would be pretty stupid not to after all their hard work.

BryanMartin21

MadYaker wrote: »

The virus is the same, the doctors and nurses just got better at treating it.

Anyone who thinks it’s every year that doctors are treating patients in the back of ambulances outside hospitals due to full A&Es is in complete denial.

Do you have a link for that statement to verify it? In the context of Northern Ireland as I'm not familiar with what typically happens there.

I can tell you that in the Republic it would be par for the course in the health system to have a severe hospital bed shortage in normal years.

BryanMartin21

Boggles wrote: »

Well that isn't what you said.

But I'm pretty sure no one in governance is arguing for mandatory vaccination at the moment.

I can certainly see a requirement for vaccination if you are entering anther country.

I mean the likes of New Zealand would be pretty stupid not to after all their hard work.

The Indo article says;

"Vaccine certificates may be needed to attend social gatherings or sporting events once the majority of the population are vaccinated.

At the launch of the National Covid-19 Vaccination Programme, Health Minister Stephen Donnelly said certificates could play a key role in the fight against coronavirus if the vaccine significantly reduces transmission of the disease."

That is a mandatory vaccination programme.

For the likes of NZ, sure, a requirement for a vaccine cert is probably something they would do. But it cannot be introduced in the EU where we have open borders.

Boggles

BryanMartin21 wrote: »

The Indo article says;
That is a mandatory vaccination programme.

That is the journalist hyperbolic opinion based on fúck all.

BryanMartin21 wrote: »

For the likes of NZ, sure, a requirement for a vaccine cert is probably something they would do. But it cannot be introduced in the EU where we have open borders.

The EU don't have open borders as the British will soon find out.

But I imagine the Brits will be one of the first in line to bring in the vaccine passport.

Rrrrrr2

It never ends does it? Now we have the Taoiseach ramping it up yet another notch- threatening to ram us back fully into pointless lockdowns early January. I give up- this is the so called leader and all he can offer is more debt piled onto more debt - he’s such a dithering idiot, very unfortunate he’s Taoiseach at this time. All of Europe is locking down so he has to copy them despite the figures being nowhere near any need for lockdown.

BryanMartin21

Boggles wrote: »

That is the journalist hyperbolic opinion based on fúck all.

In your opinion, so then it is most likely we won't have a mandatory vaccination programme?

Boggles wrote: »

The EU don't have open borders as the British will soon find out.

But I imagine the Brits will be one of the first in line to bring in the vaccine passport.

Fine, the Schengen Area, as opposed to EU, has open borders so they won't have mandatory vaccine certs for travel between the countries as it would result in the collapse of this arrangement.