Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

normanoffside

Boggles wrote: »

Well you are, you have stated that we would have had the same results without restrictions.

You are making things up.

Coybig_

MadYaker wrote: »

You sound very upset maybe its time to get off boards for a while?

Ding Ding Ding.

There we go. Thanks for proving my point about you.

When you can no longer deflect the argument to ridiculousness, abandon ship and utilise the next technique in the handbook. Claiming that the other people are just too upset or invested.

Captain_Crash

MadYaker wrote: »

Just because there haven’t been outbreaks in restaurants and pubs doesn’t mean that the virus isn’t spreading in restaurants and pubs. When they do contact tracing they only look at the previous 48 hours afaik. It will spread anywhere that people are together.

I agree to the point that I’d be surprised if there hasn’t been a few cases transmitted in pubs in the last two weeks. Like you say, it’ll spread in any social setting regardless of how many pints or substantial meals are on the table.... however considering are no recorded “clusters” and no widespread transmission attributed to pubs and bars, it’s safe to say they are not a driver in rising case numbers, not any more so than any other setting where the public are present in number.

Coybig_

Penfailed wrote: »

No? No apology for calling me a liar? Coybig_?

I apologise for saying your statement was a lie. I did not call you a liar.

The two weeks that "wet pubs" were open in certain areas slipped my mind. It could have been the fact that they have been closed in the capital throughout or the months where they have been open across Europe.

I'm sure you will use this to deflect further over the coming pages as you struggle to justify the reasoning behind this.

average_runner

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I agree to the point that I’d be surprised if there hasn’t been a few cases transmitted in pubs in the last two weeks. Like you say, it’ll spread in any social setting regardless of how many pints or substantial meals are on the table.... however considering are no recorded “clusters” and no widespread transmission attributed to pubs and bars, it’s safe to say they are not a driver in rising case numbers, not any more so than any other setting where the public are present in number.

The wexford cluster was from a pub.

The mullingar cluster last sept was from a pub, gorey last sept was from a pub and the Waterford one also.
Load of donegal ones from pubs also

Penfailed

Coybig_ wrote: »

I apologise for saying your statement was a lie.

Thanks.

average_runner

Coybig_ wrote: »

I apologise for saying your statement was a lie. I did not call you a liar.

The two weeks that "wet pubs" were open in certain areas slipped my mind. It could have been the fact that they have been closed in the capital throughout or the months where they have been open across Europe.

I'm sure you will use this to deflect further over the coming pages as you struggle to justify the reasoning behind this.

Most pubs in Dublin were opened back then. Just got local takeaway to deliver

MadYaker

normanoffside wrote: »

Nightclubs in Europe are similar to wet pubs in Ireland?
That's a mad statement
You've clearly never been to a nightclub on the continent.

I don't mean they look the same or sound the same ffs. I mean they offer a similar environment for the virus to spread with lots of pissed people up on top of each other. I've lived in 2 different countries on the continent.

Kermit.de.frog

I can not understand how some still can't see beyond the pub given the deteriorating situation here and abroad.

You only have to look across the Irish Sea right now to know we need our priorities in line.

normanoffside

MadYaker wrote: »

I don't mean they look the same or sound the same ffs. I mean they offer a similar environment for the virus to spread with lots of pissed people up on top of each other. I've lived in 2 different countries on the continent.

Nightclubs on the continent are jam packed, full of people dancing and in close contact and open until 6am.

yes, 'wet pubs' in Ireland, can be pretty packed especially around Christmas time, but people were only asking them to be opened on the basis of everyone sat at a table, table service etc.

There is no comparison at all

Boggles

normanoffside wrote: »

You are making things up.

Nope

normanoffside wrote: »

.
I'm still convinced that the initial advice we received on 14th march (before the first lockdown) would have ended up having more or less the same results we have had up to now without a lot of the negative side affects.

MadYaker

normanoffside wrote: »

Nightclubs on the continent are jam packed, full of people dancing and in close contact and open until 6am.

yes, 'wet pubs' in Ireland, can be pretty packed especially around Christmas time, but people were only asking them to be opened on the basis of everyone sat at a table, table service etc.

There is no comparison at all

Exactly and that is why nightclubs on the continent have been closed throughout, just like the wet pubs here.

Id wonder how workable it would be. Tables 2m apart, 90 minute time limit, table service only. Id probably opt for somewhere I could get a bite to eat. Plus with loads more places open it's a lot harder for authorities to ensure that publicans are following the rules.

normanoffside

Boggles wrote: »

Nope

Again you are interpreting things to suit your own argument

Our initial response did involve restrictions and advice and measures to mitigate spread, while engaging with the public and asking for goodwill and co-operation.
Remember they closed the schools and pubs?

I stand by that post and it doesn't contradict my other posts.

Boggles

normanoffside wrote: »

Again you are interpreting things to suit your own argument

Our initial response did involve restrictions and advice and measures to mitigate spread, while engaging with the public and asking for goodwill and co-operation.
Remember they closed the schools and pubs?

I stand by that post and it doesn't contradict my other posts.

Well no, you pointed to "initial advice".

Not restrictions.

So indeed you are all over the place.

As for depending on "goodwill" it clearly hasn't worked.

So no it's remedial in the extreme to think we can "goodwill" ourselves through the pandemic.

normanoffside

Boggles wrote: »

Well no, you pointed to "initial advice".

Not restrictions.

So indeed you are all over the place.

As for depending on "goodwill" it clearly hasn't worked.

So no it's remedial in the extreme to think we can "goodwill" ourselves through the pandemic.

We disagree so.

BryanMartin21

Penfailed wrote: »

I was at the pub. They were open in September/October (except Dublin). We're not the only place this was happening. They have been closed for longer in the north.

Try harder to do what?

They were food pubs.

One of my locals has been closed since March. In Germany I went out to late bars even in August when we had crushed the curve. It is wrong to say TH has a vendetta against alcohol. Look at the conference held in Dublin Castle back right just before lockdown.

MadYaker

Tony has a vendetta against anywhere the virus will spread because that is the job he has been told to do by government. Saying it's because of some bizarre personal agenda of his is completely illogical and there's no evidence for it. Theatres have been shut since this began, does he hate theatres as well? What about music festivals? He must hate them as well, and crowds at matches. I seem to remember him telling people to avoid packed public transport also. He must hate the environment and want people to drive everywhere!!!

Zebra3

MadYaker wrote: »

What do you think is worse from a business perspective, staying closed for a year and a half, or taking out a loan to build a kitchen and hire a chef and then open your doors for business? Increasing overheads is better than staying closed for 18 months. Why aren't more pubs going bust? Any wet pubs that are still closed can afford to wait this out. If they couldn't afford to wait it out they would be talking the necessary steps to resume trading.

I've seen a lot rubbish posted up here, but this one takes the biscuit.

Maybe pub owners don't want a kitchen because they know it won't succeed.

Maybe they don't feel that they should have to bow to such nonsense to stay open.

Maybe they can't get a loan to do so.

Maybe they can't get planning permission to do so.

Maybe, just maybe, they can't hire a chef (as you the expert said they should) to work ten hours a day, seven days a week.

Any wet pubs that are still closed can afford to wait this out you say? Wow, it must be great to be able to know the finances of so many private businesses. Why are your talents wasted on here? You should have your own tv show!!!

The arrogance is astounding.

MadYaker

Zebra3 wrote: »

I've seen a lot rubbish posted up here, but this one takes the biscuit.

Maybe pub owners don't want a kitchen because they know it won't succeed.

Maybe they don't feel that they should have to bow to such nonsense to stay open.

Maybe they can't get a loan to do so.

Maybe they can't get planning permission to do so.

Maybe, just maybe, they can't hire a chef (as you the expert said they should) to work ten hours a day, seven days a week.

Any wet pubs that are still closed can afford to wait this out you say? Wow, it must be great to be able to know the finances of so many private businesses. Why are your talents wasted on here? You should have your own tv show!!!

The arrogance is astounding.

I'm sorry, did I hurt your feelings?

None of the nonsense you typed refutes my original points. There are options available to wet pubs to get their doors open, some have availed of it, some haven't. Have you noticed a lot of pubs going bust?

Penfailed

BryanMartin21 wrote: »

They were food pubs.

They weren't. All pubs were allowed to reopen (except Dublin) for almost a month. Some decided not to open. They were allowed to though.

https://www.irishpost.com/news/wet-pubs-in-ireland-reopen-for-first-time-in-six-months-except-in-dublin-193356

normanoffside

Going back to Tony's tweet earlier.

Only 2 days ago Failte Ireland, in conjunction with the HSE and the Government put out an advert to encourage people to eat out over Christmas and convince people how safe it is.


https://twitter.com/Failte_Ireland/status/1339884207879954432

How can he be let get away with saying the exact opposite less than 48 hours later?

He's a dangerous man

Penfailed

normanoffside wrote: »

Going back to Tony's tweet earlier.

Only 2 days ago Failte Ireland, in conjunction with the HSE and the Government put out an advert to encourage people to eat out over Christmas and convince people how safe it is.


https://twitter.com/Failte_Ireland/status/1339884207879954432

How can he be let get away with saying the exact opposite less than 48 hours later?

He's a dangerous man

Hahaha! Dangerous?! How so?

average_runner

normanoffside wrote: »

Going back to Tony's tweet earlier.

Only 2 days ago Failte Ireland, in conjunction with the HSE and the Government put out an advert to encourage people to eat out over Christmas and convince people how safe it is.


https://twitter.com/Failte_Ireland/status/1339884207879954432

How can he be let get away with saying the exact opposite less than 48 hours later?

He's a dangerous man

Because of what happened in wexford

Allinall

normanoffside wrote: »

Going back to Tony's tweet earlier.

Only 2 days ago Failte Ireland, in conjunction with the HSE and the Government put out an advert to encourage people to eat out over Christmas and convince people how safe it is.


https://twitter.com/Failte_Ireland/status/1339884207879954432

How can he be let get away with saying the exact opposite less than 48 hours later?

He's a dangerous man

Perhaps he doesn’t agree with them?

Why shouldn’t he be allowed speak his mind?

normanoffside

Penfailed wrote: »

Hahaha! Dangerous? How so?

Because he is only supposed to be an advisor to government but is using his platform to undermine and contradict governemnt.

Penfailed

normanoffside wrote: »

Because he is only supposed to be an advisor to government but is using his platform to undermine and contradict governemnt.

How does that make him a dangerous man? How is he undermining or contradicting the government? He's advising people that it's safer to avoid eating out. He's right.

normanoffside

Allinall wrote: »

Perhaps he doesn’t agree with them?

Why shouldn’t he be allowed speak his mind?

Because he is not tweeting in a personal capacity he is making a public announcement from a public servant account.

if he has issues with government advice he should bring it up with then in private.

average_runner

normanoffside wrote: »

Because he is only supposed to be an advisor to government but is using his platform to undermine and contradict governemnt.

The behaviour out there needs to be called out.

Captain_Crash

average_runner wrote: »

The wexford cluster was from a pub.

The mullingar cluster last sept was from a pub, gorey last sept was from a pub and the Waterford one also.
Load of donegal ones from pubs also

If you read my post, and the preceding posts related to it, you’d be aware the timeframe we were discussing was since hospitality opened two weeks ago, not since last Sept!

However, I’d be surprised if there were no cases from pubs in the last two weeks. But it’s clearly not a significant amount! NPHET would be quick to remind us if it was eh!!

Penfailed

normanoffside wrote: »

Because he is not tweeting in a personal capacity he is making a public announcement from a public servant account.

if he has issues with government advice he should bring it up with then in private.

The government are advising people how to eat out safely. Tony is advising people that it's even safer not to eat out at all. What's the problem? ...and how does that make him a dangerous man? I think it makes him less dangerous, if anything.