Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

JP Liz V1

What happens now to people who have booked into hotels for Christmas?

acequion

acequion wrote: »

I agree. I'm out and about all the time, teach in a huge school and to date I know of one death among my acquaintances, a 90 year old man with a plethora of underlying conditions. I would know of up to 5 adults who've tested positive, ranging from asymptomatic, to mild symptoms to just one who was bed ridden for a few days back in the first wave but made a perfect recovery [a 62 year old] A few kids at school who tested positive but came bouncing back after their 14 days looking the very picture of health.

Sorry but all this terror and hypochondria is completely lost on me and I find the constant drama and over reacting beyond tiresome.

the absolute temerity of you coming on here with your real world view laced with Donald trump conspiracy thread rhetoric ..don't you now anyone who's ill?? cant you find an aged neighbour perhaps who's looking for company and has misanthropic views of cander to share?? but it;s a plague on our houses? have you looked outside? beyond the civil servants and those who never seen an agar dish or heard of Robert Bunsen? I'm afraid if you don't know anyone covered in buboes on all fours crawling to their local A&E, well then..you're no good for this thread or our cause pal...over to conspiracy with you buddy..
with your contrarian " I'm not seeing that at all in my town" non conformist divil may care whimsey and reverie!!

Yeah I'm the same......not a one!!! funny that eh acequion...:D

Necro

As it happens I know of a number of family members who had Covid.

My 92 year old great aunt had it and she had no issues thankfully. Was very lucky as she would (naturally) have some underlying health conditions.

One of my uncles went in for gallstone removal the other day and unfortunately contracted it in the hospital and is now very sick in the Covid ward. Hoping he pulls through.

My cousin has also contracted it in or around the same time. As far as I know he's doing ok, still spouting pro-Trump guff on Twitter so it hasn't slowed him down much.

All three live in the UK.


And then there's myself. Caught it in October and was mostly ok bar shortness of breath for a couple of weeks. Wasn't able to climb the stairs or even pick up my son without that nasty feeling of breathlessness.

Got quite bad at one point and needed a very strong dose of steroids to finally shift it. Still not fully there really, but back in the office now (had been WFH for 8 weeks). Had to get out or I'd go crackers in the house.

Maybe I'm incredibly unlucky in knowing people personally that have it and hopefully will fully recover but from my own experience I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Jinglejangle69

acequion wrote: »

I watched Prime Time, something I wouldn't normally do. I thought Varadkar was useless and O Callaghan was all nicey nice. Couple of tougher questions for effect such as "should we close schools?" but no probing. And of course he just parroted out the line, "No we're not closing schools", international evidence and yada yada. Now I'm a teacher and have been happy to go out to school but there is no doubting that numbers are rising in schools but no we mustn't close schools. Class dismissed there.:rolleyes: As for "will all this be policed?" cue a totally pathetic politician style non committal answer. Translation, No it won't be policed, they're just relying as always on public goodwill.

I thought the hairdresser was excellent, really made her case in a clear, dignified fashion. And you'd have to agree and wonder wtf they're doing closing these businesses. The restaurant guy was just too apologetic for my liking.

Here we go again down the same old road and god only knows what will happen next. Varadkar promising dizzying amounts of money which will be financed just how??? Borrowing?? And for how long?? You really would have to be terrified for when financial reality comes crashing down around us all.

That will be the big mutant that will trigger the long hangover from this nightmare. I just shudder at the thoughts of how bad it will be. We were never more lacking in proper leadership.

So we shouldn't lockdown like most countries are doing?

acequion

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

So we shouldn't lockdown like most countries are doing?

Where did I say that???

But as you ask so bluntly I'll answer bluntly. Our half arsed lockdowns have achieved little to nothing beyond temporary suppression and temporary breathing space after. They've suppressed numbers while we close only for them to shoot back up when relieved.

So either show a bit more imagination and balls and only shut down locally and where necessary and enforce it, allowing others places with lesser numbers more leniency and stop shutting down the same sectors all the time without presenting the public irrefutable proof that these sectors are contributing to spikes.

As for your remarks re other countries. Apples and oranges. Most other countries allowed greater leeway to their citizens in summer and autumn making their actions now more bearable and understandable.

We didn't. We were still panicking and still "gravely concerned" at 20 cases a day back in July.

patnor1011

I have seen it too. I was at the center of an outbreak where 20 people out of 90 tested positive back in summer. All of them came back after 2 weeks none had any problems only one out of 20 got some fever and cough all gone after 2 weeks.
3 of family members got it so far, uncle and his wife both of them over 60 and both of them seriously overweight. Uncle was in bed for a day and next day he was working in his garden. His wife had it harder with temperatures for a week but she is ok too. She is complaining about shortness of breath after taking stairs but to be fair she is about 130 kilograms and short of breath every time she does anything for a number of years already...
Of course some people died after contracting this virus but majority of them would die contracting even flu or any other respiratory virus anyway. This another lockdown is just PR stunt so they can say look we are doing something but not many people are going to follow these new orders.

JRant

Listened to this podcast today and it's one of the most obvious yet unused solutions. Rapid antigen testing is probably our most effective way out of this. Michael Mina is a Havard professor in immunology and lays out the facts without getting into any no sense whatsoever.

He outlines the role these tests can have, why they can be very effective, the best way to use them and touches on some points around why they haven't been used to date.

He also mentions something that really hit home. The medical professionals leading the covid response are looking for "perfection" and will not accept anything less. When in a real world scenario we just need something that will keep the R0 below one and home test kits are the way.

One important point he raised that I haven't heard before is that rolling out a vaccine while a virus is still rampant is froth with danger as it gives the virus a chance to mutate away from the vaccine. Therefore, he argued that rapid testing at home will keep the numbers low enough to allow society get back to normal and the vaccine to do its thing.

Anyway, no matter what side of the divide you think you are on it's a great listen and well worth the 2 hours in my opinion.

https://youtu.be/L-RuvUkcyJI

acequion

Necro wrote: »

As it happens I know of a number of family members who had Covid.

My 92 year old great aunt had it and she had no issues thankfully. Was very lucky as she would (naturally) have some underlying health conditions.

One of my uncles went in for gallstone removal the other day and unfortunately contracted it in the hospital and is now very sick in the Covid ward. Hoping he pulls through.

My cousin has also contracted it in or around the same time. As far as I know he's doing ok, still spouting pro-Trump guff on Twitter so it hasn't slowed him down much.

All three live in the UK.


And then there's myself. Caught it in October and was mostly ok bar shortness of breath for a couple of weeks. Wasn't able to climb the stairs or even pick up my son without that nasty feeling of breathlessness.

Got quite bad at one point and needed a very strong dose of steroids to finally shift it. Still not fully there really, but back in the office now (had been WFH for 8 weeks). Had to get out or I'd go crackers in the house.

Maybe I'm incredibly unlucky in knowing people personally that have it and hopefully will fully recover but from my own experience I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Thanks for sharing your experience Necro and glad to hear you're ok.

But your last bit there which I've emboldened, is that not what we say about any dose we come down with?

JP Liz V1

Necro wrote: »

As it happens I know of a number of family members who had Covid.

My 92 year old great aunt had it and she had no issues thankfully. Was very lucky as she would (naturally) have some underlying health conditions.

One of my uncles went in for gallstone removal the other day and unfortunately contracted it in the hospital and is now very sick in the Covid ward. Hoping he pulls through.

My cousin has also contracted it in or around the same time. As far as I know he's doing ok, still spouting pro-Trump guff on Twitter so it hasn't slowed him down much.

All three live in the UK.


And then there's myself. Caught it in October and was mostly ok bar shortness of breath for a couple of weeks. Wasn't able to climb the stairs or even pick up my son without that nasty feeling of breathlessness.

Got quite bad at one point and needed a very strong dose of steroids to finally shift it. Still not fully there really, but back in the office now (had been WFH for 8 weeks). Had to get out or I'd go crackers in the house.

Maybe I'm incredibly unlucky in knowing people personally that have it and hopefully will fully recover but from my own experience I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Thanks for sharing and glad you are ok, hope your family and friends will be too

TomSweeney

Deleted User wrote: »

In the US for example there were 61,000 flu deaths in the 17 /18 flu season. Notice a difference?

The bs on this thread is becoming more and more laughable at this stage

OK so assuming this year USA has 350K deaths from covid, that's 17% ....



So surely in 17/18 there should have been maybe 17% of the restrictions, of the hysteria etc ?
There was none.



At what point do deaths move from being acceptable,part of life and something we don't worry about to something we do worry over and anyone that hugs granny is a murderer and we need ongoing lockdowns till the virus is 100% eradicated (impossible btw) .. and people scream at others on the street for not wearing a mask ... etc .. ?

TomSweeney

Deleted User wrote: »

A person at Deutsche Bank who’s role it is to analyse what may happen, makes a prediction about what may happen and suddenly its evidence they are directing what is happening. That belongs in a different forum in my opinion

What pisses me off about these guys is that they will lecture us on how we can live our lives, and meanwhile they will do what they want to do... there will be no restrictions for him and his ilk.

acequion

acequion wrote: »

As for your remarks re other countries. Apples and oranges. Most other countries allowed greater leeway to their citizens in summer and autumn making their actions now more bearable and understandable.

We didn't. We were still panicking and still "gravely concerned" at 20 cases a day back in July.

This is really the most important point.

I don’t think anyone can complain too much about some restrictions when we have over 1000 daily cases. (Although I still feel we go too far)

But we really should have been enjoying life between May and September like most other countries did.

I remember one day we had 4 cases and 0 deaths with less than 15 in hospital and we still refused to open pubs. Our green list was mainly countries that didn’t even have a direct flight from Ireland. We insisted on 9 euro meals and curfews.

Even now, we were told we could have Christmas if we locked down for 6 weeks. Now they have essentially cancelled Christmas anyways bar dinner on Christmas Day.

And back into what is rumoured to be months of lockdown. I’ve no idea how people are still supportive of this.

Can only assume a large chunk are working from home and saving a fortune for now.

acequion

Deleted User wrote: »

This is really the most important point.

I don’t think anyone can complain too much about some restrictions when we have over 1000 daily cases. (Although I still feel we go too far)

But we really should have been enjoying life between May and September like most other countries did.

I remember one day we had 4 cases and 0 deaths with less than 15 in hospital and we still refused to open pubs. Our green list was mainly countries that didn’t even have a direct flight from Ireland. We insisted on 9 euro meals and curfews.

Even now, we were told we could have Christmas if we locked down for 6 weeks. Now they have essentially cancelled Christmas anyways bar dinner on Christmas Day.

And back into what is rumoured to be months of lockdown. I’ve no idea how people are still supportive of this.

Can only assume a large chunk are working from home and saving a fortune for now.

Thankfully I fcuked off out of this miserable country for a bit in summer so missed all that!

But re what you say about people wfh, I'm not convinced. I wfh in the spring. Bliss for a while but very quickly got sick of it. Was delighted to be back in situ in autumn.

So wfh doesn't explain how people are supposedly ok with this now.

And I completely agree re being baffled as to how people could still be supportive. But this is Ireland after all.:rolleyes:

FintanMcluskey

Deleted User wrote: »

September wants its argument back. Hospital admissions lag cases by 12 days and deaths by 21 days

We will surely see the death lag from October any day now

galway_lad

Deleted User wrote: »

Can only assume a large chunk are working from home and saving a fortune for now.

Unless you were eating out every day and commuting cost you a tonne, I doubt you're saving a lot. I know I'm not. In time yes, but money nah.

Eric Cartman

Penfailed wrote: »

I only know one fella coming home from London (Tier 4). He already has a photo up of pints in a gastropub in the north enroute to the south. There will be zero self-quarantining from that cohort. I know I only have one example...but I don't think anyone that's coming home for a two week holiday is likely to quarantine for two weeks...

Love how the rest of us who remained and followed guidelines have to put up with higher infections for the sale of the most selfish brazen types like that

Paddygreen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ3N_2r6R-o

Glad we live in a democracy guys.

rusty cole

rusty cole wrote: »

in Bold, no idea what that means, who "does" from this?? you know relatives of work colleagues, sure you do... 180 degrees of separation there for all to see, my neighbors dog has a friend who's a relative... sure... give some context to your experiential tales of woe, what age was the intensive care relative, weight? health status? wow, I'm fairly socially networked and know not a soul with it and yet you're in touch with at risk groups a plenty?? or a complete spoofer, my money is on the latter. Newsflash, everyone with conditions are fearful, that's the point most are making there Samuel Hahnemann.

So do you want eircodes also? I can give you that to. The spoofers are the scientifically illiterate on this thread. And trying to equate those actually following the science with junk pseudoscience with your reference there at the end. Feck me, ye lot have absolutely zero self awareness

TomSweeney

TomSweeney wrote: »

OK so assuming this year USA has 350K deaths from covid, that's 17% ....



So surely in 17/18 there should have been maybe 17% of the restrictions, of the hysteria etc ?
There was none.



At what point do deaths move from being acceptable,part of life and something we don't worry about to something we do worry over and anyone that hugs granny is a murderer and we need ongoing lockdowns till the virus is 100% eradicated (impossible btw) .. and people scream at others on the street for not wearing a mask ... etc .. ?

17% of a total the occurred with widespread restrictions in place,

Wanderer78

Paddygreen wrote:

Glad we live in a democracy guys.

Democracy moved on long go round here

TomSweeney

TomSweeney wrote: »

What pisses me off about these guys is that they will lecture us on how we can live our lives, and meanwhile they will do what they want to do... there will be no restrictions for him and his ilk.

He wasn’t lecturing, he was giving an opinion on what he though 2021 would be like

FintanMcluskey

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

We will surely see the death lag from October any day now

Since September there have been 50,000 cases and 450 deaths. 0.9%. Of course we are missing some cases, based on our testing rate probably 30 to 50%, so put it at 0.6% for arguments sake. Just a flu bro

_Kaiser_

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Since September there have been 50,000 cases and 450 deaths. 0.9%. Of course we are missing some cases, based on our testing rate probably 30 to 50%, so put it at 0.6% for arguments sake. Just a flu bro

Numbers of cases are irrelevant. Outcome of cases is the important metric.

How many of those deaths had serious existing conditions, were already very vulnerable to illness as a result, or as a result of age? Do you think people unfortunately just wouldn't still be dying if there was no CV-19?

Boggles

2020 is the deadliest year in US history as coronavirus 'kills one American every 33 seconds'

A rise in deaths between 20,000 and 50,000 is not unusual due to the country's ageing and growing population - but the increase this year is thought to be closer to 400,000.

This sort of increase - a jump of around 15% from 2019 - would mark the biggest single-year percentage leap since 1918, when hundreds of thousands of lives were lost due to the First World War and Spanish flu

20th of January can't come fast enough.

Paddygreen

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Democracy moved on long go round here

Did it? How? It’s the age old game as far as you can see .

Paddygreen

It has comrade paddy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHomETco0MI

moonage

I immediately thought of Tony H when I saw the following quote:

"The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false-face for the urge to rule it. Power is what all messiahs really seek: not the chance to serve.” H.L. Mencken

Paddygreen

The same old story. Idiots will march to the beat.

Paddygreen

Gael23

I’m thinking again about taking the vaccine,
NPHET are nit considering the damage this is doing to the overwhelming amount of people this virus is not a big deal to and will face the consequences of these restrictions for a very long time after this virus is a distant memory. Life is too short to live like this.

If level 5 is the default vaccines are pointless