Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

Even with a vaccine, flu overwhelms hospitals every year.

At some point you have to accept a certain level of risk/death.

At some point you will have to accept this is not flu.

JRant

JRant wrote: »

End goal is to do away with every single restriction and go back to normality. I'd say that's probably 2022 at the rate we are vaccinating.

Short to medium term, I would like to see Level 2 once those groups are vaccinated. Far from ideal but I would think it's about the best we could hope for in this country. I would love to see all restrictions dropped for the entire summer and then maybe increase if required later in the year. It's a dangerous game to play though and I think the government now feel they have this lockdown "tool" in their armory for any of the future winter trolley crisis we will inevitably find ourselves in.

That’s a big fear alright. What will we do when Covid is gone but we have 700 in hospital with Flu in December 2023 and Tony calls for lockdown?

This strain of flu loves alcohol he’ll tell us.

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

At some point you will have to accept this is not flu.

Ok, so you are ok with hospitals getting overwhelmed with flu but just not Covid?

facehugger99

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

We've already made the sacrifice over the last year. We're continuing to make it now.

But at some point, the problems caused by the restrictions and lockdowns will become greater than the benefits of the approach. It's already starting - people under increased financial pressure, PUP tax due, property tax due, increased winter utility bills, businesses closed again (a lot of whom may not reopen), jobs gone/suspended again etc.

The Government seems to think that they can wait it out, hoping that the vaccine, increased herd immunity (after all most of these increased cases will be fine), and faster progress elsewhere in dealing with the situation will solve the problem for them given the slow rollout here - in order words, as usual, they're trying to ignore the bigger picture and kick the can down the road.

But with the current pace and plan, vaccinating everyone could take 2 years. Are we going to yo-yo in and out of restrictions until then? I suppose it's possible at this stage - after which we'll see mass retirements among the current crop of TDs and a general election to let (likely SF :eek:) deal with the fallout... jut as happened in 2011!

I dare say we'll ALL regret the current approaches long before that though.

That happened some time ago. It has been hidden by a massive €20bn of borrowings in 2020 and looking like being more in 2021.

This is being added to the eye-watering levels of debt built up during the last recession. The cost of servicing this debt, while low at present, is highly unlikely to remain so. Having a debt of this magnitude leaves the State seriously exposed to another major downturn. And there is no way of paying down a big debt like this without running continual budget surpluses and keeping a tight rein on spending - something which we have continuously proved ourselves unable to do. No doubt SF, the epitome of fiscal responsibility, will steer us in the right direction after the next election.:rolleyes:

And the response to Covid is not a case of valuing lives above economies. Our health service, sh;ite as it is, requires €20bn a year to provide a crap service, our education and infrastructural needs are all likely to increase. These facilities directly contribute to life expectancy and quality of life outcomes. The demographic negatively impacted by our response to Covid are younger and will live with the consequences for far longer than someone in their mid-80's.

This has been clear for months, the politicians can see this but they are too cowardly to explain it to the hysterical mob lest they be accused of being granny-killers. It is the greatest abdication of responsibility I have ever witnessed.

It is truly a shameful situation and it is getting worse week by week.

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

Ok, so you are ok with hospitals getting overwhelmed with flu but just not Covid?

I'm not okay with either, but one is exponentially more transmissible and dangerous a fact that seems to constantly escape you.

Until you acknowledge that fact and give up parroting the pandemic denial grifters you will be trapped in your own circular echo chamber.

That's hardly good for your mental health above all else.

FintanMcluskey

“If you you’ve had one or two, maybe you just don’t keep up the kind of standards or behaviour that we’re advising as well as you should”

A sound bite from Tony H today

FintanMcluskey

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

“If you you’ve had one or two, maybe you just don’t keep up the kind of standards or behaviour that we’re advising as well as you should”

A sound bite from Tony H today

He just can’t help himself from his rather bizarre obsession with alcohol.

JRant

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

“If you you’ve had one or two, maybe you just don’t keep up the kind of standards or behaviour that we’re advising as well as you should”

A sound bite from Tony H today

Puritanical nonsense from him. Maybe some do, maybe some don't, he has absolutely no way of knowing either way.

JRant

JRant wrote: »

Puritanical nonsense from him. Maybe some do, maybe some don't, he has absolutely no way of knowing either way.

He did say "maybe", just like you did in fact.

JRant

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0108/1188442-coronavirus-vaccine/


More vaccines on the way in Q2 of this year. Should be a good news story until you read this part

"The head of the Health Service Executive said yesterday that 15,314 first doses of the Covid-19 vaccine have been administered from the 81,900 doses that have been delivered."

That's just pitiful stuff. Less than 20% of delivered vaccines have been administered.

JRant

[Deleted User] wrote: »

He did say "maybe", just like you did in fact.

He's hardly speaking from a scientific point if view then, is he?

He can advise standards and behaviours, what he can't do is start judging people for having a drink or two.

Boggles

JRant wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0108/1188442-coronavirus-vaccine/


More vaccines on the way in Q2 of this year. Should be a good news story until you read this part

"The head of the Health Service Executive said yesterday that 15,314 first doses of the Covid-19 vaccine have been administered from the 81,900 doses that have been delivered."

That's just pitiful stuff. Less than 20% of delivered vaccines have been administered.

It is a good news story but you left out this bit for some reason.

Chief Executive Paul Reid said the programme is on track to have 35,000 doses delivered by the end of the week

We badly need to build up the stock. So the vaccines can be given as directed by the people who made them.

Not the lunacy of shure we can give them whatever whenever that some of neighbors seem to be suggesting.

JRant

JRant wrote: »

He's hardly speaking from a scientific point if view then, is he?

He can advise standards and behaviours, what he can't do is start judging people for having a drink or two.

Hi is advising people who cant moderate their behaviour after a few drinks try to avoid having a few drinks or to avoid situations where they need to moderate their behaviour

If the vaccines work as well as we hope, once the nursing homes are done the deaths should be cut in half.

Then when the elderly are done we should be near 0 deaths.

At that point, it will be hard to convince anyone that there is a crisis anymore and naturally the restrictions SHOULD disappear.

But we need to up our vaccine game big time.

Tenzor07

Deleted User wrote: »

Then when the elderly are done we should be near 0 deaths.
.

And everyone can go back to a time when people used to pass away from illnesses other than Covid?

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Hi is advising people who cant moderate their behaviour after a few drinks try to avoid having a few drinks or to avoid situations where they need to moderate their behaviour

Who can’t moderate their behaviour though? How does he know this? What evidence does he have?

What evidence does he have that meeting for a pint is different than meeting for tea?

It’s just an anti alcohol agenda coming through again

sprucemoose

Deleted User wrote: »

Who can’t moderate their behaviour though? How does he know this? What evidence does he have?

What evidence does he have that meeting for a pint is different than meeting for tea?

It’s just an anti alcohol agenda coming through again

Fantastic point, i suggest we campaign for a max blood/tea concentration level now on for driving!!!

FintanMcluskey

Deleted User wrote: »

Hi is advising people who cant moderate their behaviour after a few drinks try to avoid having a few drinks or to avoid situations where they need to moderate their behaviour

I can’t understand the justification of this nanny state

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

What evidence does he have that meeting for a pint is different than meeting for tea?

Galway village where GAA team partied with fans in busy pub now has 'at least 50 coronavirus cases'

Each and everyone of them fúcked off their head on tea.

:pac:

JRant

Boggles wrote: »

It is a good news story but you left out this bit for some reason.



We badly need to build up the stock. So the vaccines can be given as directed by the people who made them.

Not the lunacy of shure we can give them whatever whenever that some of neighbors seem to be suggesting.

I didn't leave anything out, I quoted the relevant part. If Reid told me it was sunny outside I'd bring an umbrella. I am not taking anything he says at face value, just judging them on actual performance.

Do the manufacturers say to only use 20% of your total stock at any one time?
We have the vaccines to protect a lot more people than have been currently injected. That is going to directly cost lives.

hynesie08

Alcohol impairs judgement, this is not a secret...

"one or two" in relation to pints is the most vague term in the world and you all know it, it's up there with a "quick one" in it's lack of consistency. Why is it now supposed to be a defined measure? If he said after 7 pints, you'd have people thinking that meant 6 takeaway pints were OK......

Honestly lads, I don't like Tony either, he shouldn't have his job after the cervical scandal. But this is a stretch.....

sprucemoose

Boggles wrote: »

Each and everyone of them fúcked off their head on tea.

:pac:

while i agree with what youre trying to say......

....its the GAA so tea wouldn't be out of the question tbh. some of them are probably already on the alcohol bans for the 2023 championship

Boggles

JRant wrote: »

I didn't leave anything out, I quoted the relevant part. If Reid told me it was sunny outside I'd bring an umbrella. I am not taking anything he says at face value, just judging them on actual performance.

Do the manufacturers say to only use 20% of your total stock at any one time?
We have the vaccines to protect a lot more people than have been currently injected. That is going to directly cost lives.

Running out of vaccines and making up how it should be administrated will probably cost lives too.

Slow and steady, build up the system. Safety and effectiveness is as important as speed.

I agree though if this isn't achieved soon, there should be some serious questions.

Boggles

sprucemoose wrote: »

while i agree with what youre trying to say......

....its the GAA so tea wouldn't be out of the question tbh. some of them are probably already on the alcohol bans for the 2023 championship

There is videos.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Deleted User wrote: »

Even with a vaccine, flu overwhelms hospitals every year.

At some point you have to accept a certain level of risk/death.

We have more people in icu at the moment with covid than we have icu admissions with flu over a full flu season (6 months).

We are usually overwhelmed doesnt compare to the moment.

sprucemoose

Boggles wrote: »

There is videos.

wasn't being serious, just mocking the pious nature that certain people in the GAA have at times

FintanMcluskey

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

I can’t understand the justification of this nanny state

Its advice, not a nanny state. The people who are most likely to need to take the advice are least likely to listen anyway.

There is advice given everyday or every week on a multitude of areas of everyday life. If you are offended by being advised you need to take some advice, and chill

JRant

JRant wrote: »

I didn't leave anything out, I quoted the relevant part. If Reid told me it was sunny outside I'd bring an umbrella. I am not taking anything he says at face value, just judging them on actual performance.

Do the manufacturers say to only use 20% of your total stock at any one time?
We have the vaccines to protect a lot more people than have been currently injected. That is going to directly cost lives.

There is a concept in any major endeavour called a "scale up". One of the most important factors is continuity of supply. Scaling up prior to continuity of supply being established is the sure fire way to failure.

We were able to vaccinate 1 million people against the flu in Autumn in 6 weeks.

CruelSummer

On the alcohol point...while I don't think there should be any curbs on people buying say a bottle of wine/spirits/beers...Maybe they should introduce a limit on the amount you can buy. I know these systems will all be abused, send in one person, then another. But it might deter some.
I just two people in the alcohol section of my local supermarket buying 3 cases full of wine - 18 bottles. Followed by a couple of boxes of beer. They didn't really have anything else in their trolley only alcohol. Who would need that kind of quantity of alcohol at the moment.

JRant

Boggles wrote: »

Running out of vaccines and making up how it should be administrated will probably cost lives too.

Slow and steady, build up the system. Safety and effectiveness is as important as speed.

I agree though if this isn't achieved soon, there should be some serious questions.

We've had months to prepare. Even being conservative we could double that total and still have enough stock in reserve for a second dose. The serious questions need to be asked now though.