Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Captain_Crash

almostover wrote: »

Where did the 6000 figure come from? On average we have 85 deaths per day. COVID is contributing to 20 deaths per day. This is simple stuff. COVID is dangerous.

You had suggested that 1 in 5 are dying of covid, or 20% of deaths. If we take 20% our annual average number of deaths of 30000 you get 6000. Granted you didn’t suggest it was 20% over the course of the year, just a given day. But that’s where the poster got the number from.

Interestingly tho, if currently we have a consistent positive rate of 20%, and let’s pretend for a second that 1 in 5 people in the country have the ‘rona.... then it stands to reason that 1 in 5 deaths would be people who have it!

Boggles

Lundstram wrote: »

You do know there’s people qualified to deal with pandemics?

5 epidemiologists.

They have a whole university department at their disposal.

But why 5 specifically?

froog

the economy grew 3.4% last year.

hamburgham

Lundstram wrote: »

Interesting Twitter thread:

https://twitter.com/naomiohreally/status/1347870067829190656?s=21

I see a teacher whinging on it about teachers not being ‘consulted’. What groups of workers or employers have been ‘consulted’ since this all started?

hamburgham

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

It’s amusing really

The only resort as a counter to well structured scientific data is to ask the mods to close the thread

Makes me sick

Yes, I dropped into the ‘flip flop’ thread on the teaching forum and wrote 3/4 posts disagreeing with closing the schools. The most common response which they all seem to find hilarious is ‘ Hi Norma’. Then I was called a troll and the mod deleted my posts and they’re now going to make the thread private so they’ don’t have to deal with this nonsense’’. You can only post on that thread if you agree with the schools closing.If you don’t, your posts will be deleted.. Absolutely incredible

hamburgham

Hooter23 wrote: »

It said on the news most health care workers will wait longer until more people get the vaccine first before decided if they will get it...always putting others before themselves sure aren't they great our heroes...as for the poor old people in nursing homes I dont think anyone even asked them if they wanted it

Yes, I was wondering why we hadn’t heard anything about uptake amongst HCW considering how many of them don’t take the flu vaccine.

Mr. Karate

Penfailed wrote: »

Endless lockdowns? It's not and hasn't been endless. The first one ended. The second one did too. Believe it or not, this current one will also end.

We've had months of restrictions when we weren't in full lockdown. We've spent 10 months of 2020 and they seem keen on repeating it this year. So Yes it does seem endless at this stage.

hamburgham

Lundstram wrote: »

It takes 40 highly paid people to do that? Many of them have zero expertise in epidemiology including are gracious leader Tony Holohan.

If only so much resources was poured into giving the vaccine..

Or cancer research which kills a significant number every year. I’m guessing it’s responsible for more deaths than COVID.

Penfailed

Mr. Karate wrote: »

We've had months of restrictions when we weren't in full lockdown. We've spent 10 months of 2020 and they seem keen on repeating it this year. So Yes it does seem endless at this stage.

So...not endless lockdowns like your OP stated. Thanks for the clarification.

Mr. Karate

Penfailed wrote: »

So...not endless lockdowns like your OP stated. Thanks for the clarification.

Our movements and activities have still have been greatly limited so yes it is endless.

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

So crash the economy completely?

Have you any sort of filter between thought and typing?

Now if you could link to your claim the government are manufacturing the numbers I'd appreciate it.

Hahaha, I’m fairly confident you know I don’t mean that literally. It’s a hypothetical situation.

We see it again and again on this thread. People with very good circumstances getting outraged that a poor barber that maybe can’t feed their family would try to flout the rules to survive.

For the second part, the government have admitted to overstating deaths. If a tweet from the then Taoiseachs official account is not enough for you... nothing will be.

Silentcorner

froog wrote: »

the economy grew 3.4% last year.

Ya that is down from 26% growth a few years ago!!!!

Go into your nearest town and see if it's booming...I'll never get over people's complete lack of understanding of economic growth in this country!

froog

froog wrote: »

the economy grew 3.4% last year.

The country is officially in recession and have a 20 billion budget deficit with over 20% out of work...

Mr. Karate

Deleted User wrote: »

Hahaha, I’m fairly confident you know I don’t mean that literally. It’s a hypothetical situation.

We see it again and again on this thread. People with very good circumstances getting outraged that a poor barber that maybe can’t feed their family would try to flout the rules to survive.

For the second part, the government have admitted to overstating deaths. If a tweet from the then Taoiseachs official account is not enough for you... nothing will be.

You can definitely tell who's struggling and who isn't on here. I guarantee many of the "Lockdown failed so we need more lockdowns" on here wouldn't be so gung-ho about more of them if they had trouble paying their bills and putting food on the table.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

The country is officially in recession and have a 20 billion budget deficit with over 20% out of work...

I think a recession is two consecutive quarters in the minus margin..i dont think thats happened yet so officially im not sure we are in one yet.

Penfailed

Penfailed wrote: »

Does that mean that it's only those fully employed that support lockdown? I thought it was those that were happy on the PUP to sit at home and watch Netflix that supported it? It's hard to keep up with this thread sometimes.

No, but before people act outraged, they should stop for a minute and consider the impact that been forced out of work and onto 350 or less a week would have on them.

Penfailed

Mr. Karate wrote: »

Our movements and activities have still have been greatly limited so yes it is endless.

I'm not sure you know the meaning of endless. There will be an end, therefore it's not endless. That goes for the current lockdown (the other ones weren't endless) or the restrictions.

St.Spodo

Mr. Karate wrote: »

Because much like the wannabe tyrants in the Dail if they were struggling to pay their bills and put food on the table they wouldn't be so keen on keeping us in endless lockdowns.

NPHET recommended mandatory quarantine for all airline passengers last May. If the government acted on their advice, the first lockdown would have been the last one. As it stands, the government is content to go against international best practice by constantly opening up the economy before we have the virus under control at very low levels in the community, while letting new cases come into the country and mix freely with the public. Blame the government.

FintanMcluskey

almostover wrote: »

Where did the 6000 figure come from? On average we have 85 deaths per day. COVID is contributing to 20 deaths per day. This is simple stuff. COVID is dangerous.

I’ll ask the question in a different way

Is the vaccine going to prevent those 20 deaths?

Will the vaccine lower the death rate to 65 per day

FintanMcluskey

froog wrote: »

the economy grew 3.4% last year.

GDP increased by 3.4%

GDP is known as leprechaun economics when related to Ireland

It’s an imaginary metric

walus

almostover wrote: »

Where did the 6000 figure come from? On average we have 85 deaths per day. COVID is contributing to 20 deaths per day. This is simple stuff. COVID is dangerous.

Still cant see why we should leave a virus spread unchecked just because those who succumb to it are of a certain age group.

I dont agree with everything the government has done with regards to restrictions. They should have brought in enforced quarantine upon arrival to the country for one. However, pushing this narrative of lockdowns don't work is irresponsible.

If we didnt lockdown our economy would suffer just as badly. Do you think people would go out if COVId was rife?

Lockdowns are the least worst option right now.

Let’s put things into context. Last year air pollution killed more than twice the number of people who died with/of COVID. Yet we don’t have driving bans and gardai issuing tickets for idling our motors for no reason. Why is that you think?
There is tens if not hundreds of things out there that are far more dangerous than COVID. Period. Yet we changed the way we live and work, crashed the economy as the governments around the world subscribed to the lockdown-and-vaccine franchise that they were sold on.

This whole story is an example of a sunk cost fallacy of the highest order.

Dempo1

GocRh wrote: »

New Department of Health secretary general Robert Watt in line for €292,000 salary in role
https://www.independent.ie/news/new-department-of-health-secretary-general-robert-watt-in-line-for-292000-salary-in-role-39948719.html

So we have a CMO, a CEO in the HSE, a Health Minister, a Secretary General, all earning 200k + per year.
And yet we can't pay student nurses. Or upgrade IT systems to keep track of COVID cases. Or rollout vaccines 24x7.
When will this madness end?

It's frankly disgusting and the absurd justification just outrageous. Is it seriously being suggested the new secretary General will be alone in a nerve centre managing single handidly the vaccine Roll out? It seems the department of Health's senior managements team answer to a little extra work is hire another well paid official to assume responsibility.

The departments handling of this crisis, especially senior pen and statistics pushing management has been shocking to date with Paul Reid in particular absolutely spoofing his way through every crisis & debacle. Every single manager in tge hse should be required to work on a ward for 12 months as part of appointment process.

HBC08

hamburgham wrote: »

Yes, I dropped into the ‘flip flop’ thread on the teaching forum and wrote 3/4 posts disagreeing with closing the schools. The most common response which they all seem to find hilarious is ‘ Hi Norma’. Then I was called a troll and the mod deleted my posts and they’re now going to make the thread private so they’ don’t have to deal with this nonsense’’. You can only post on that thread if you agree with the schools closing.If you don’t, your posts will be deleted.. Absolutely incredible

I know,shocking isn't it?
Any times the loons on this thread go out into other threads they are laughed out of it and/or eventually banned.
It's ok,you're back in the safe space now,carry on.

MOH

Penfailed wrote: »

I'm not sure you know the meaning of endless. There will be an end, therefore it's not endless. That goes for the current lockdown (the other ones weren't endless) or the restrictions.

DEpends what business you're in. It's been endless for some.

funnydoggy

When this is all over or at a manageable level, I hope to f*ck people start voting this nepotism, jobs for the boys, mismanagement bullshít out. We're not the likes of the USA or Brazil but jaysus we love our corruption except in Ireland, it's Corruption Lite, or being a chancer. We then have state funded shows making light of it, or shows dedicated to asking soft questions and no real change. Horrible.

froog

walus wrote: »

Let’s put things into context. Last year air pollution killed more than twice the number of people who died with/of COVID. Yet we don’t have driving bans and gardai issuing tickets for idling our motors for no reason. Why is that you think?
There is tens if not hundreds of things out there that are far more dangerous than COVID. Period. Yet we changed the way we live and work, crashed the economy as the governments around the world subscribed to the lockdown-and-vaccine franchise that they were sold on.

This whole story is an example of a sunk cost fallacy of the highest order.

does air pollution completely overload health systems in a matter of weeks if left unchecked?

FintanMcluskey

HBC08 wrote: »

I know,shocking isn't it?
Any times the loons on this thread go out into other threads they are laughed out of it and/or eventually banned.
It's ok,you're back in the safe space now,carry on.

If you are not aware the dangers of group think you need to read up on history.

Penfailed

MOH wrote: »

DEpends what business you're in. It's been endless for some.

That's moving away from the original point. The OP said endless lockdowns. There have been a few. They've ended, therefore, not endless.

Penfailed

froog wrote: »

does air pollution completely overload health systems in a matter of weeks if left unchecked?

Is air pollution contagious?

Mr. Karate

Penfailed wrote: »

I'm not sure you know the meaning of endless. There will be an end, therefore it's not endless. That goes for the current lockdown (the other ones weren't endless) or the restrictions.

Really? I can't remember the last time they mentioned returning to normality without making it seem so far away that we won't live long enough to see it.