The Vaccine

ohnonotgmail

Lex Luthor wrote: »

https://m.timesofindia.com/world/next-four-to-six-months-could-be-worst-of-pandemic-bill-gates/amp_articleshow/79709807.cms?__twitter_impression=true

How does a computer geek know so much about a virus?

Hey king mob and dohnjoe, maybe you could both interrogate him

he is a multi billionaire with a lot of time on his hands to read and access to the best medical minds on the planet to ask questions of. Combined with generally being the smartest man in the room it is no surprise he knows so much about it.

ohnonotgmail

Lex Luthor wrote: »

EyesClosed wrote: »

And this is a conspiracy...how?

I'll get to that shortly

any idea when? will it be this century?

Lex Luthor

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

he is a multi billionaire with a lot of time on his hands to read and access to the best medical minds on the planet to ask questions of. Combined with generally being the smartest man in the room it is no surprise he knows so much about it.

and a spokesman for the big pharma companies and WHO aswell?

Where's Tedros Adhanom? Surely he should be doing this?

Oh ya I forgot, he's possibly facing genocide charges

ohnonotgmail

Lex Luthor wrote: »

and a spokesman for the big pharma companies and WHO aswell?

Where's Tedros Adhanom? Surely he should be doing this?

Oh ya I forgot, he's possibly facing genocide charges

bill is not a spokesman for anybody. Does he claim to be?

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

...what?
What money...where..who..why? Any Answers at all?

pwurple

Lex Luthor wrote: »

...............................
So we now have 2 conflicting approaches from Luke O'Neill and Prof Whitty
https://www.thejournal.ie/covid-strain-travel-5299901-Dec2020/

Luke O'Neill has said that if the virus mutates, then the RNA vaccines can be modified quickly
Prof Whitty has said it would be “surprising” if the vaccines already in development were not effective against it.

So which is it?

Both.

You know that picture that goes along with Covid, the spikey ball? I think of it like a stickle-brick. For the vaccine to work, it only needs a partial match to stick. So, a vaccine is usually effective for multiple strains.

It's also true that vaccines can be adjusted /modified if needed. "Quickly".... That's subjective. It's not days... more like months. But that's a fallback, it's not expected to be needed.



If you think about the beginnings of Vaccines.... all this knowledge is based on finding that having had Cowpox was protective against smallpox. (Vacca is the latin for Cow, always wondered why the anti-vac groups use sheep instead of Cow for their insults, what a miss! Cows would be way more fitting). Previously people were doing things like eating smallpox pus , or ground up smallpox scabs in crappy attempts to protect themselves. That clobbered as many people who tried it as it saved. Cowpox was much better, a partial match that didn't come with the risk of killing you.


Anyway, the point is, cowpox was a partial fit with smallpox and so offered that protection. just like the various covid vaccines can be a partial match for multiple strains of covid.

King Mob

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Well tons of conspiracy mongers make a ton of money out of selling their nonsense to you guys.
So therefore they're actually behind the corona virus.

Follow the money!

pwurple

I know from my job in supply chain that at least one of the vaccines is being produced not for profit. Ie, supplied at cost.

(And I didn't see any line item for snakey expensive nano-technology on there either by the way! but if you see any jabs being sold at 100,000$ a go to cover that kind of tech, let me know.)

What money?

EyesClosed

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

any idea when? will it be this century?

He replied with a music video...that's me answered so

runawaybishop

pwurple wrote: »

Both.

You know that picture that goes along with Covid, the spikey ball? I think of it like a stickle-brick. For the vaccine to work, it only needs a partial match to stick. So, a vaccine is usually effective for multiple strains.

It's also true that vaccines can be adjusted /modified if needed. "Quickly".... That's subjective. It's not days... more like months. But that's a fallback, it's not expected to be needed.



If you think about the beginnings of Vaccines.... all this knowledge is based on finding that having had Cowpox was protective against smallpox. (Vacca is the latin for Cow, always wondered why the anti-vac groups use sheep instead of Cow for their insults, what a miss! Cows would be way more fitting). Previously people were doing things like eating smallpox pus , or ground up smallpox scabs in crappy attempts to protect themselves. That clobbered as many people who tried it as it saved. Cowpox was much better, a partial match that didn't come with the risk of killing you.


Anyway, the point is, cowpox was a partial fit with smallpox and so offered that protection. just like the various covid vaccines can be a partial match for multiple strains of covid.

Right, much like the flu vaccine/s. If it varies a lot a new vaccine may need to be developed.

Lex Luthor

So it is all about control

Gives himself plenty of air time, but wont engage in a debate

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

So it is all about control

Gives himself plenty of air time, but wont engage in a debate

what control? can you answer my questions now please...you promised you would

Lex Luthor

Did you not hear what he just said?
No vaccine no school, thats the usual response to people who wont take the vaccine and their children
Exclude them

But he said schools were safe

Lex Luthor

and you have Eilis Ryan of the Workers Party weighing in saying the vaccine should be mandatory

She's done a bit of a u-turn then in regard to her campaign on abortion when she was a bit advocate for the STOP POLICING MY BODY CAMPAIGN

I'd say the local office supplies stores around Kildare St have all run out of brown envelopes

olestoepoke

I'm all for vacinnes, my two children were born in the us and spent their first few years there and so were needled up more than kids here in Ireland. Their doc here couldn't believe the amount of jabs they got. That said I'm uncomfortable the way this one is being rolled out. It all feels a little rushed and forced to me. I read that my chances of survival if I get covid is around the 98% mark so why not just vaccinate the vulnerable and those that want it and let people alone who don't want it?

aido79

Lex Luthor wrote: »

and you have Eilis Ryan of the Workers Party weighing in saying the vaccine should be mandatory

She's done a bit of a u-turn then in regard to her campaign on abortion when she was a bit advocate for the STOP POLICING MY BODY CAMPAIGN

I'd say the local office supplies stores around Kildare St have all run out of brown envelopes

You're really clutching at straws now. Might be time to have a little think about whether there is actually a conspiracy or if you just want there to be one to satisfy your wild imagination.

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Did you not hear what he just said?
No vaccine no school, thats the usual response to people who wont take the vaccine and their children
Exclude them

But he said schools were safe

I won't watch a random video no...I am asking you what the conspiracy is.
I don't want music videos, youtube videos, tweets, blog posts etc etc.
Just a direct answer from you...what is the vaccine conspiracy in your own words...please

Dohnjoe

EyesClosed wrote: »

I am asking you what the conspiracy is.

Seems to be a recurring theme with every "conspiracy" here.

Lex Luthor

aido79 wrote: »

You're really clutching at straws now. Might be time to have a little think about whether there is actually a conspiracy or if you just want there to be one to satisfy your wild imagination.

are you suggesting I should be excluded?

EyesClosed

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Seems to be a recurring theme with every "conspiracy" here.

This is my 4th time asking now

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

are you suggesting I should be excluded?

Could you answer me? Please?

Lex Luthor

EyesClosed wrote: »

I won't watch a random video no...I am asking you what the conspiracy is.
I don't want music videos, youtube videos, tweets, blog posts etc etc.
Just a direct answer from you...what is the vaccine conspiracy in your own words...please

you guys are constantly looking for proof, links, etc

give them to you and you say they are not proof

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

you guys are constantly looking for proof, links, etc

give them to you and you say they are not proof

That is not what I said at all...I said... in your own words...what is the conspiracy?

Lex Luthor

EyesClosed wrote: »

Could you answer me? Please?

No begging at this corner

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

No begging at this corner

So no, you can't answer me...so there is no conspiracy?

aido79

Lex Luthor wrote: »

are you suggesting I should be excluded?

Excluded from what? Who is going to exclude you?
Seriously why are you so against a vaccine that may be the only way for the world to return to normal? Why are you having trouble accepting this? Is it paranoia or are you so against big corporations that you are willing for every year for the foreseeable future to be like 2020?

Even if you can't answer those questions( none of them are particularly difficult) just answer this one...why should I be worried about the vaccine?

King Mob

Lex Luthor wrote: »

you guys are constantly looking for proof, links, etc

give them to you and you say they are not proof

You rarely provide the links and evidence you're asked for, when when you do, it becomes very apparent that you were lying or where misunderstanding what was in the link. And this was likely the reason you were so reluctant to provide them.

Likewise the reason you are so afraid to actually state your beliefs, is that you know they are ridiculous and will be torn apart very easily.
Or worse yet, it will expose that you're talking out of your arse and you can't even invent a ridiculous conspiracy that hasn't been fed to you by youtube cranks.

ohnonotgmail

Lex Luthor wrote: »

are you suggesting I should be excluded?

probably more that you haven't actually contributed much except vagueness.

Dohnjoe

"There's a conspiracy"

-"Okay what it the conspiracy?"

50 pages of dodging, evading and vapid whataboutery

Lex Luthor

aido79 wrote: »

Seriously why are you so against a vaccine that may be the only way for the world to return to normal?

Are you suggesting I put a drug into my body that I am not comfortable taking in order for the world to maybe return to normal?
Thats a big ask if you are

aido79 wrote: »

Even if you can't answer those questions( none of them are particularly difficult) just answer this one...why should I be worried about the vaccine?

I can't tell you why you should be worried about the vaccine but if you have doubts, queries, concerns, ask yourself the following questions:

• Do you trust a vaccine that was developed in record time compared to other vaccines that took many many years to develop?
• Do you trust a vaccine that is being developed by companies that have pushed for exemptions from lawsuits from any harmful side effects and complications?
• Do you trust a government that has agreed to indemnify five drug companies producing Covid-19 vaccines against any liabilities that arise from complications?
• Do you trust RNA vaccines when there was very limited clinical studies for long term effects of the vaccine?
• Do you trust the clinical trials of the vaccine or believe they were done sufficiently?
• Do you believe the clinical trials were done for long enough to establish any medium to long term side effects?

These would be the questions I have asked myself and are the reasons I have based my decision on why I wont be taking it

I hope this answers your question

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Are you suggesting I put a drug into my body that I am not comfortable taking in order for the world to maybe return to normal?
Thats a big ask if you are





I can't tell you why you should be worried about the vaccine but if you have doubts, queries, concerns, ask yourself the following questions:

• Do you trust a vaccine that was developed in record time compared to other vaccines that took many many years to develop?
• Do you trust a vaccine that is being developed by companies that have pushed for exemptions from lawsuits from any harmful side effects and complications?
• Do you trust a government that has agreed to indemnify five drug companies producing Covid-19 vaccines against any liabilities that arise from complications?
• Do you trust RNA vaccines when there was very limited clinical studies for long term effects of the vaccine?
• Do you trust the clinical trials of the vaccine or believe they were done sufficiently?
• Do you believe the clinical trials were done for long enough to establish any medium to long term side effects?

These would be the questions I have asked myself and are the reasons I have based my decision on why I wont be taking it

I hope this answers your question

Why should people answer your questions (many of which have already been answered over and over on this thread) when you refuse to answer any posed to you?

Lex Luthor

EyesClosed wrote: »

Why should people answer your questions (many of which have already been answered over and over on this thread) when you refuse to answer any posed to you?

I never asked anyone to answer my questions, I asked them to ask themselves

I dont need to know

Hope this helps

EyesClosed

Lex Luthor wrote: »

I never asked anyone to answer my questions, I asked them to ask themselves

I dont need to know

Hope this helps

Not really...I'm still waiting for you to fulfil your promise to me of an explanation of your conspiracy theory...

King Mob

Lex Luthor wrote: »

I can't tell you why you should be worried about the vaccine but if you have doubts, queries, concerns, ask yourself the following questions:

• Do you trust a vaccine that was developed in record time compared to other vaccines that took many many years to develop?
• Do you trust a vaccine that is being developed by companies that have pushed for exemptions from lawsuits from any harmful side effects and complications?
• Do you trust a government that has agreed to indemnify five drug companies producing Covid-19 vaccines against any liabilities that arise from complications?
• Do you trust RNA vaccines when there was very limited clinical studies for long term effects of the vaccine?
• Do you trust the clinical trials of the vaccine or believe they were done sufficiently?
• Do you believe the clinical trials were done for long enough to establish any medium to long term side effects?

These would be the questions I have asked myself and are the reasons I have based my decision on why I wont be taking it

I hope this answers your question

But as we've seen you don't have any rational reason for any of these fears beyond your general fear of scientific words and ignorance of how vaccines and viruses work.

And on top of that, you are have had to be very dishonest to pretend your concerns are based on rational reasons.
This is shown in your above questions which have many misrepresentation that have been explained to you in detail many times.

Again, the vaccines have been proved to be safe. That's simply a fact.
You have to invent a mad conspiracy theory to explain away from this fact.

You've been shown that the chances of ANY side effect from vaccines are thousands of times less likely than dying from covid.
You maintain that covid isn't something to worry about. Thus you should maintain that the vaccines are even less of a thing to worry about.
You've been asked to explain this contradiction before, but you ran away because you can't explain it. Another example of the dishonesty you have to engage it.

aido79

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Are you suggesting I put a drug into my body that I am not comfortable taking in order for the world to maybe return to normal?
Thats a big ask if you are





I can't tell you why you should be worried about the vaccine but if you have doubts, queries, concerns, ask yourself the following questions:

• Do you trust a vaccine that was developed in record time compared to other vaccines that took many many years to develop?
• Do you trust a vaccine that is being developed by companies that have pushed for exemptions from lawsuits from any harmful side effects and complications?
• Do you trust a government that has agreed to indemnify five drug companies producing Covid-19 vaccines against any liabilities that arise from complications?
• Do you trust RNA vaccines when there was very limited clinical studies for long term effects of the vaccine?
• Do you trust the clinical trials of the vaccine or believe they were done sufficiently?
• Do you believe the clinical trials were done for long enough to establish any medium to long term side effects?

These would be the questions I have asked myself and are the reasons I have based my decision on why I wont be taking it

I hope this answers your question

Only you can answer the first question but the world will return to normal with or without you taking it because there are enough people who don't see it as a conspiracy.

My answer to all the other questions is yes except for the last because it is impossible to establish the medium to longterm side effects. I believe the correct procedures were followed albeit in a different sequence than they have for other vaccines. I am unlikely to be offered the vaccine in the first half of 2021 and by then millions of people will have been vaccinated by then so any harmful effects will most likely be discovered before then.

Are you sceptical of everything new or just this? The vaccine was developed in record time but maybe that's because they weren't starting from scratch like they have been with other vaccines. They used previous research on coronavirus and mRNA that has been in development for decades to develop the vaccine. It's a bit like a car company, they don't have to reinvent the wheel every time a new model is produced.

You've answered some questions now try this one....What is the conspiracy theory??

Lex Luthor

aido79 wrote: »

You've answered some questions now try this one....What is the conspiracy theory??

You used your lifeline

what really baffles me is that people are saying they are wearing masks in case they may have COVID to protect others as its difficult to tell if you have the virus

So when you get the vaccine and they take their mask off, do they still think they cant pass covid onto someone?

Because if they do they are wrong...!!!

Once you get the vaccine you can still get COVID, but you just wont get sick/hospitalized or die from it (as the vaccine is supposed to protect you)
So if you dont feel the symptoms, but if there is someone out there who is vulnerable, maybe cant take the vaccine for health reasons, the vaccinated person can still spread it
Thats similar to being a superspreader

runawaybishop

What is the conspiracy lex?

King Mob

Lex Luthor wrote: »

You used your lifeline

What conspiracy are you suggesting and why won't you elaborate on it?

enno99

aido79 wrote: »

I am unlikely to be offered the vaccine in the first half of 2021 and by then millions of people will have been vaccinated by then so any harmful effects will most likely be discovered before then.

Sums it up really
I will advocate for others to take it let them be guinea pigs see how it goes

Lex Luthor

enno99 wrote: »

Sums it up really
I will advocate for others to take it let them be guinea pigs see how it goes

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

aido79

Lex Luthor wrote: »

You used your lifeline

what really baffles me is that people are saying they are wearing masks to protect others in case they may have COVID as its difficult to tell if you have the virus

So when you get the vaccine and they take their mask off, do they still think they cant pass covid onto someone?

Because if they do they are wrong...!!!

Once you get the vaccine you can still get COVID, but you just wont get sick/hospitalized or die from it (as the vaccine is supposed to protect you)
So if you dont feel the symptoms, but if there is someone out there who is vulnerable, maybe cant take the vaccine for health reasons, the vaccinated person can still spread it
Thats similar to being a superspreader

What lifeline? I just asked the only question that you don't seem to be able to answer.

I don't think anyone will be advised to stop wearing masks until it's proven that people who are vaccinated can't spread the virus. This is really simple stuff. Why are you trying to complicate it and make it sound like a conspiracy when it clearly isn't?

aido79

enno99 wrote: »

Sums it up really
I will advocate for others to take it let them be guinea pigs see how it goes

Just to clarify, if I was offered the vaccine tomorrow I would take it without hesitation. If that makes me a Guinea pig in your eyes then believe me I won't lose any sleep over it.

skooterblue2

EyesClosed wrote: »

So no, you can't answer me...so there is no conspiracy?

By the time you work out what is going on, It will all be over.

King Mob

skooterblue2 wrote: »

By the time you work out what is going on, It will all be over.

Care to explain what's going on?
Cause it's been 54 pages and not a single conspiracy theorist has been able to explain it.
Just a lot of ignorance and lies.

Lex Luthor

aido79 wrote: »

until it's proven that people who are vaccinated can't spread the virus.

hmmm thats not how it works

Even though your vaccinated, you always have the potential to spread it

That wont change over time

Lex Luthor

aido79 wrote: »

Just to clarify, if I was offered the vaccine tomorrow I would take it without hesitation. If that makes me a Guinea pig in your eyes then believe me I won't lose any sleep over it.

for anyone who is not in the first few categories to get the vaccine, that is a very easy statement to make

Try telling that to an OAP in a care home who has no next of kin and is scared to death of someone putting a needle in their arm against their wishes

Ted_YNWA

Lex Luthor wrote: »

No begging at this corner

Lex Luthor wrote: »

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

Lex Luthor wrote: »

are you suggesting I should be excluded?

Mod

If you don't up your posting style & treat the thread & forum seriously, you will be excluded.

King Mob

Lex Luthor wrote: »

for anyone who is not in the first few categories to get the vaccine, that is a very easy statement to make

Try telling that to an OAP in a care home who has no next of kin and is scared to death of someone putting a needle in their arm against their wishes

Again, you've been telling us that the death toll from covid is not something to worry about. This death rate is far higher in these OAPs you're suddenly so worried about.
You've been shown the chances of any side effects of vaccines are thousands of times less likely than dying from covid.

Your concern here is obviously false.
You aren't actually all that bothered about the welfare of older people. If you were, you'd be far more concerned about the effects of covid than the possible effects of a vaccine that you can't actually point to or explain.

This is simply a dishonest ploy you're trying to save face by appealing to emotion about the safety of older people.

aido79

Lex Luthor wrote: »

hmmm thats not how it works

Even though your vaccinated, you always have the potential to spread it

That wont change over time

How do you know this?

aido79

Lex Luthor wrote: »

for anyone who is not in the first few categories to get the vaccine, that is a very easy statement to make

Try telling that to an OAP in a care home who has no next of kin and is scared to death of someone putting a needle in their arm against their wishes

How many of these people have you spoken to in your research? What about the OAP's in a care home who are scared to death of covid19 because it has caused the death of so many people like them?