The Leinster Championship is dead.

jmayo

Sheep breeder wrote: »

You say Wicklow has had no success and it is down to one thing the county Board, the same old cronies for the last thirty years playing lannigans ball one stepped in the chairman position and the other to the Leinster council and back and forth, example from a Wicklow friend who’s son was a minor 3 years ago went to play a tournament in Longford and on the way back stopped in to hotel for soup and sandwich for the team, the lads from the county board and management went in for the full dinner in the next room. The mates son is playing soccer in Dublin now and no interest in the gaa.

Now to be fair underage soccer in Wicklow is a disaster as well and that would be why your mate's son is playing his soccer in Dublin leagues.
I know of one instance where u16/u17 team travelled the length of the county for match. Both teams had warmed up and togged out for 3 pm kick off, but no sign of ref.
Someone from home club phoned Wicklow League to be told "oh yeah the ref had to cancel this morning and we didn't have replacement".
They couldn't be ar**d to let either club know so one travelled an hour and both wasted their saturday afternoon.

That is the type of shyte Wicklow are at in soccer and in GAA.
Bunch of useless feckless halfwits seem to always end up running stuff in that county and all the hard work the grassroots do is wasted.

tritium

Rock77 wrote: »

Yes but did he work within the rules? Could any county do what he did? If so, then it’s fair game, a level playing field.

No special treatment for one county....

Didn’t dublin work within the rules? Is anyone saying they stole the money? Could any other county have come up with similar plans and implemented them?

elefant

tritium wrote: »

Didn’t dublin work within the rules? Is anyone saying they stole the money? Could any other county have come up with similar plans and implemented them?

Yes. No. No.

Uncle Pierre

tritium wrote: »

Didn’t dublin work within the rules? Is anyone saying they stole the money? Could any other county have come up with similar plans and implemented them?

You're missing the point again. Micko and Kildare/Wicklow/whoever else worked within rules and a system that was the same for everybody, even if there was a bit of "cute hoor-ism" about it. Dublin worked within the rules of a system that was available to them only.

But to answer your questions:

Didn’t Dublin work within the rules? - Yes. Have already said that.

Is anyone saying they stole the money? - No.

Could any other county have come up with similar plans and implemented them? - An emphatic NO. They could have come up with grand plans all right, but the chances of getting the money to implement them would have been slim to none.

The Dublin funding became available through the intervention of Bertie Ahern and his influence with the Irish Sports Council. Think about that for a minute - the Taoiseach of the entire country going out of his way to secure a multi-million euro deal for GAA in his native county but not for anywhere else.

Imagine the outcry there would have been if Enda Kenny had even thought about trying the same for Mayo. Or if Michéal Martin tried the same for the hypothetical "Rejuvenate Cork hurling" programme that I keep throwing out.

dunnerc

Rolo2010 wrote: »

What about Dublin City and South Dublin? Fingal would not be a culchie team. Ballymun, Finglas, and Blanch are all in Fingal. Balbriggin isn't culchie land either. I suggest you take a look at Google Maps.

Ballymun and Finglas are not Fingal

Uncle Pierre

dunnerc wrote: »

Ballymun and Finglas are not Fingal

This is true. Ironic that the one who suggested looking at Google Maps should have had a look himself first.

Rolo2010 wrote: »

Ballymun, Finglas, and Blanch are all in Fingal......I suggest you take a look at Google Maps.

So just to help him out:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Fingal,+Co.+Dublin/@53.4443458,-6.4157234,11z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x486710e503e56e29:0x109890ca878afc0c!8m2!3d53.4923939!4d-6.2539777

gormdubhgorm

Rock77 wrote: »

Yes but did he work within the rules? Could any county do what he did? If so, then it’s fair game, a level playing field.

No special treatment for one county....

I never said it was not within the rules fair play to Micko for exploiting it. It earned him success.

I wonder why the same thing cannot be continued with Meath or Kildare today due to their proximity to Dublin you would think that there would be lots of players living or working in Kildare or Meath. That would like to play for either county.

Plus Kildare have the curragh surely there would be big lumps of army lads from all around the country, working their willing to play ball for the lillywhites? Plus they now have Jack O'Connor a top class high profile GAA manager.

major interest

In terms of the dominance of the Dublin footballers, surely one thing that could be tried is a re-emphasis within Dublin GAA itself more towards hurling (funding, structures etc.)

Despite the improvements their hurlers have made in the last 15 years they are still not competing for All Irelands and have only one provincial title. As Donal Og pointed out on the Sunday Game recently, Dublin do not produce the type of high quality forwards that the footballers produce and any of the better dual players (e.g. Connolly, O Callaghan) inevitable opt for the footballers.

While hurling is never likely to be as big a draw as football in the county, redressing this imbalance would seem like a logical goal for a Dublin GAA and the GAA as a whole.

Akesh

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I never said it was not within the rules fair play to Micko for exploiting it. It earned him success.

I wonder why the same thing cannot be continued with Meath or Kildare today due to their proximity to Dublin you would think that there would be lots of players living or working in Kildare or Meath. That would like to play for either county.

Plus Kildare have the curragh surely there would be big lumps of army lads from all around the country, working their willing to play ball for the lillywhites? Plus they now have Jack O'Connor a top class high profile GAA manager.

Yes but the numbers you're talking about are very low. The problem really doesn't lie with the GAA. It's government policy, where they have allowed the private sector to dictate the major centralisation of work in Ireland in Dublin. You have lots of lads from all around the country studying, working and living in Dublin. The advantages of this have been obvious to Dublin.

Until you can still work and live in the local community nothing will change. At inter county the above problem becomes obvious as some very good players just opt out or don't even bother playing due to the commitments involved in an inter county set up. Then you add in the numbers and financial advantage Dublin had anyway and it becomes a joke of a competition at the highest level.

At underage, when you consider the resources available, Kildare and Meath have done very well in comparison to Dublin, particularly Kildare.

Dublin should be winning 99.99% games on numbers alone. Counties of a fraction of Dublin's population can't and won't ever compete against a county of 1M+ with modern resources.

The Leinster championship is long dead at senior inter county level and there is no brining it back to the level of competition two decades ago. The country has moved on.

Rock77

major interest wrote: »

In terms of the dominance of the Dublin footballers, surely one thing that could be tried is a re-emphasis within Dublin GAA itself more towards hurling (funding, structures etc.)

Despite the improvements their hurlers have made in the last 15 years they are still not competing for All Irelands and have only one provincial title. As Donal Og pointed out on the Sunday Game recently, Dublin do not produce the type of high quality forwards that the footballers produce and any of the better dual players (e.g. Connolly, O Callaghan) inevitable opt for the footballers.

While hurling is never likely to be as big a draw as football in the county, redressing this imbalance would seem like a logical goal for a Dublin GAA and the GAA as a whole.

In terms of Dublin footballers dominance, why would Dublin GAA try anything to change it?

gormdubhgorm

Akesh wrote: »

Yes but the numbers you're talking about are very low. The problem really doesn't lie with the GAA. It's government policy, where they have allowed the private sector to dictate the major centralisation of work in Ireland in Dublin. You have lots of lads from all around the country studying, working and living in Dublin. The advantages of this have been obvious to Dublin.

I can't argue with that fair point. Plus as the country lads grow up they end up setting up clubs, or being integral parts to the life of Dublin GAA clubs and the cycle continues Dublin get stronger.

But I was thinking by their proximity to Dublin surely it gives Meath and Kildare advantages as many are dormitory towns and so on.Leading to the big smoke.

Maybe a tweak in the rules in the GAA for Kildare and Meath? Because there must be load of players falling through the cracks GAA wise who come up to Dublin to work and it is too difficult for them to travel home to play for their home club.

Because I believe for any province to be considered a proper competition there should be at least three competitive counties. Otherwise it is a waste of time with either two teams dominating in a duopoly or in Dublin's case one team.
If there is not three competitive counties in each province. They should either be scrapped or reformed.

I would have the main AI as follows:

Donegal, Mayo and Galway as the three in 'Province 1'
Tyrone, Monaghan, Kildare in 'Province 2'
Kerry, Dublin, Cork in another 'Province 3'
Tipp, Meath, Cavan in another 'Province 4'

Each province has a home and away group phase of at least 4 games each

The top two of each group go towards the AI QF's which are knock out. An open draw QF would be ideal and keep the whole thing a bit random.

Based on NFL rating and team performances on a 2/3 year cycle the leagues can be rejigged. No backdoor or any of that craic.

Rock77

tritium wrote: »

Didn’t dublin work within the rules? Is anyone saying they stole the money? Could any other county have come up with similar plans and implemented them?

This has been answered very well already and I have a sneaky suspicion you already knew before you asked but...

Yes Dublin worked within the rules.

Not one person said Dublin stole the money.

All other counties could have come up with similar plans.

Here’s the important bit however...

No other county could have implemented these plans because only on county was given millions by the GAA to do so.

You are so defensive about this for no reason, nobody has said any of this is Dublin’s fault! Dublin have done brilliantly to become the best team in the country for years now.. the money is not the sole reason for their success.

The fact remains that Dublin have and continue to have an advantage over every other county, that is the fault of the GAA

Rock77

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I never said it was not within the rules fair play to Micko for exploiting it. It earned him success.

I wonder why the same thing cannot be continued with Meath or Kildare today due to their proximity to Dublin you would think that there would be lots of players living or working in Kildare or Meath. That would like to play for either county.

Plus Kildare have the curragh surely there would be big lumps of army lads from all around the country, working their willing to play ball for the lillywhites? Plus they now have Jack O'Connor a top class high profile GAA manager.

Yeah I hear you, I have no doubt that there’s lots of things Kildare could do to improve.

However in my opinion the solution to the problem with Leinster football should begin with having all counties treated fairly.

major interest

Rock77 wrote: »

In terms of Dublin footballers dominance, why would Dublin GAA try anything to change it?

Dublin is capable of competing for All Irelands in both. The current situation is lopsided and results in dominance in one code and not competing at all in the other. It would make sense to tip the balance in whatever way they can towards hurling for that reason.

Rock77

major interest wrote: »

Dublin is capable of competing for All Irelands in both. The current situation is lopsided and results in dominance in one code and not competing at all in the other. It would make sense to tip the balance in whatever way they can towards hurling for that reason.

Sorry yeah I see your point now, yes you would imagine that those involved in Dublin hurling would be calling for this.

Although hasn’t Dublin hurling made great strides over the last number of years aswell?

And my point was with Dublin football going so well, why would they change anything?

Dyr

Rolo2010 wrote: »

What about Dublin City and South Dublin? Fingal would not be a culchie team. Ballymun, Finglas, and Blanch are all in Fingal. Balbriggin isn't culchie land either. I suggest you take a look at Google Maps.

You might want to take a look at google maps too, Ballymun is not in Fingal. Even though it was included in Fingal for hurling project

ShyMets

The approach I would take with Dublin is to split them into 4. If after doing so Dublin remain competitive I would continue to split until Dublin no longer remain a force.

We can then at that point go back to believing that the Football Championship is completive and any number of teams can win it.

Problem solved!

major interest

Rock77 wrote: »

Sorry yeah I see your point now, yes you would imagine that those involved in Dublin hurling would be calling for this.

Although hasn’t Dublin hurling made great strides over the last number of years aswell?

And my point was with Dublin football going so well, why would they change anything?

I think Dublin GAA will need to consider it carefully. The footballers have won 8 out of 10 All Irelands. That kind of dominance (which is likely to continue if no change happens) will make the competition in its current guise unviable realistically. In that scenario, the GAA will be forced to act to address the dominance (whether that be splitting the county into 4 etc.)

My point was that it is actually in their own best interests to try engineer it so that hurling takes a bit more precedence. I think a situation where Dublin footballers win 5 and hurlers win 3 in a decade is a bit more tenable than footballers winning 8 in a decade. Its the same number of titles overall for the county but the spread means that there is more semblance of competition.

The Lost Sheep

ShyMets wrote: »

The approach I would take with Dublin is to split them into 4. If after doing so Dublin remain competitive I would continue to split until Dublin no longer remain a force.

We can then at that point go back to believing that the Football Championship is completive and any number of teams can win it.

Problem solved!

That is just missing the point and just looks petty.
Do you do the same with Kilkenny, Tipp in hurling. Same with Kerry?
Splitting Dublin doesnt help the majority of counties. Most Leinster counties have won very few titles and splitting dublin wont help them at all.

ShyMets

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

That is just missing the point and just looks petty.
Do you do the same with Kilkenny, Tipp in hurling. Same with Kerry?
Splitting Dublin doesnt help the majority of counties. Most Leinster counties have won very few titles and splitting dublin wont help them at all.

My post was in jest. Splitting Dublin does nothing to solve the overall issues of the GAA.

People point to the Leinster Championship and rightly point out that its a one horse race. They will refer back to the late 90's and early 00's and say look how competitive it was. And they're right but thats the exception. Leinster has been dominated by Dublin and Meath with other teams occasionally challenging.

Whats happening now is one team has had a prolonged series of dominance. This does need to be addressed.

But lets depart from the fallacy that Leinster was always some sort of competitive gem in the Provincial structure

Rock77

major interest wrote: »

I think Dublin GAA will need to consider it carefully. The footballers have won 8 out of 10 All Irelands. That kind of dominance (which is likely to continue if no change happens) will make the competition in its current guise unviable realistically. In that scenario, the GAA will be forced to act to address the dominance (whether that be splitting the county into 4 etc.)

My point was that it is actually in their own best interests to try engineer it so that hurling takes a bit more precedence. I think a situation where Dublin footballers win 5 and hurlers win 3 in a decade is a bit more tenable than footballers winning 8 in a decade. Its the same number of titles overall for the county but the spread means that there is more semblance of competition.

I just can’t see anyone in Dublin GAA saying ‘we’re too good lads, we need to win less so they don’t split the county’

Surely they should continue being the best they can be and not worry about hypothetical situations.

The Lost Sheep

ShyMets wrote: »

My post was in jest. Splitting Dublin does nothing to solve the overall issues of the GAA.

People point to the Leinster Championship and rightly point out that its a one horse race. They will refer back to the late 90's and early 00's and say look how competitive it was. And they're right but thats the exception. Leinster has been dominated by Dublin and Meath with other teams occasionally challenging.

Whats happening now is one team has had a prolonged series of dominance. This does need to be addressed.

But lets depart from the fallacy that Leinster was always some sort of competitive gem in the Provincial structure

Fair enough. Yeah youre spot on in saying splitting Dublin doesnt solve much. It wont get most counties near winning a leinster title and the late 90s/early 00s are an outlier

Uncle Pierre

With talk of Fingal and other areas and hypothetical splits, here's something to consider, with some elements of it being reality and some being just hypothetical too.

The traditional county of Dublin hasn't even existed in legal and administrative terms since 1994. That's an absolute fact.

The Local Government (Dublin) Act of 1993 legislated that from 1st January 1994, the former County Dublin would cease to exist, and in its place would be formed three new administrative counties (Fingal, South Dublin, and Dun Laoghaire/Rathdown) and a borough area of Dublin city.

The traditional "County Dublin" continued to operate in GAA, under the terms of the GAA Rule Book, which sets out structures for County Board, inter-county competitions, etc.

However, the GAA Rule Book doesn't actually define its interpretation of the word "county". And in the absence of an alternative GAA definition, then legal logic suggests that the county boundaries as prescribed in the law of the land should apply in GAA terms too.

So hypothetically, a good barrister could probably put up a good argument along these lines in the High Court, if anybody gave him/her the brief to do so. And it could possibly be ruled that "Dublin" have been operating illegally in inter-county circles since 1994, as no "County Dublin" has actually existed since then.

Could even end up expunging all "Dublin" successes since then, in the same way that all of Lance Armstrong's "victories" in the Tour de France were scrubbed from the record.

Anybody want to do a whiparound for a good barrister?

major interest

Rock77 wrote: »

I just can’t see anyone in Dublin GAA saying ‘we’re too good lads, we need to win less so they don’t split the county’

Surely they should continue being the best they can be and not worry about hypothetical situations.

I'm not sure they are at the best they can be in hurling though. When they won that Leinster hurling in 2013 and nearly made the All Ireland final, I would have definitely pegged them to have made more progress in the following years than they have done. Even at minor and U-20, they haven't been particularly successful considering the player pool they have.

Conversely, in the football they have absolutely powered ahead. I don't know the ins and outs of the Dublin GAA board but if I were involved I'd certainly be thinking there is room for improvement on the hurling side. A rebalance towards the hurling might have the knock on effect of slightly damping down the football dominance but if that resulted in a big breakthrough in hurling I would say it was worth it.

But I do agree, all any county can do is maximize the resource available to them (player pool, financial, support base) and Dublin are no different in that regard.

Fann Linn

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

With talk of Fingal and other areas and hypothetical splits, here's something to consider, with some elements of it being reality and some being just hypothetical too.

The traditional county of Dublin hasn't even existed in legal and administrative terms since 1994. That's an absolute fact.

The Local Government (Dublin) Act of 1993 legislated that from 1st January 1994, the former County Dublin would cease to exist, and in its place would be formed three new administrative counties (Fingal, South Dublin, and Dun Laoghaire/Rathdown) and a borough area of Dublin city.

The traditional "County Dublin" continued to operate in GAA, under the terms of the GAA Rule Book, which sets out structures for County Board, inter-county competitions, etc.

However, the GAA Rule Book doesn't actually define its interpretation of the word "county". And in the absence of an alternative GAA definition, then legal logic suggests that the county boundaries as prescribed in the law of the land should apply in GAA terms too.

So hypothetically, a good barrister could probably put up a good argument along these lines in the High Court, if anybody gave him/her the brief to do so. And it could possibly be ruled that "Dublin" have been operating illegally in inter-county circles since 1994, as no "County Dublin" has actually existed since then.

Could even end up expunging all "Dublin" successes since then, in the same way that all of Lance Armstrong's "victories" in the Tour de France were scrubbed from the record.

Anybody want to do a whiparound for a good barrister?

Seems like you're;

Uncle Pierre

Fann Linn wrote: »

Seems like you're;

LOL. Maybe so. And I did say it was hypothetical.

But it's also a fact that the courts have made binding rulings on certain GAA operations and procedures in the past. It would be an interesting one if somebody decided to go that way with this one.

ShyMets

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

LOL. Maybe so. And I did say it was hypothetical.

But it's also a fact that the courts have made binding rulings on certain GAA operations and procedures in the past. It would be an interesting one if somebody decided to go that way with this one.

Hypothetical there is a case there. But if a county board did take the case the optics would look awful.

Sour grapes wouldn't even cover it

Dyr

major interest wrote: »

I'm not sure they are at the best they can be in hurling though. When they won that Leinster hurling in 2013 and nearly made the All Ireland final, I would have definitely pegged them to have made more progress in the following years than they have done. Even at minor and U-20, they haven't been particularly successful considering the player pool they have.

Conversely, in the football they have absolutely powered ahead. I don't know the ins and outs of the Dublin GAA board but if I were involved I'd certainly be thinking there is room for improvement on the hurling side. A rebalance towards the hurling might have the knock on effect of slightly damping down the football dominance but if that resulted in a big breakthrough in hurling I would say it was worth it.

But I do agree, all any county can do is maximize the resource available to them (player pool, financial, support base) and Dublin are no different in that regard.

I'd say this as someone who prefers hurling: If you look at successful dual counties there's usually a geographic split between hurling and foootball. Not the case in Dublin, its all football first. There's very few hurling only clubs or clubs where hurling is the dominant code

Doubt you'll ever see Dublin have much hurling success.

The Lost Sheep

jmayo wrote: »

Now to be fair underage soccer in Wicklow is a disaster as well and that would be why your mate's son is playing his soccer in Dublin leagues.
I know of one instance where u16/u17 team travelled the length of the county for match. Both teams had warmed up and togged out for 3 pm kick off, but no sign of ref.
Someone from home club phoned Wicklow League to be told "oh yeah the ref had to cancel this morning and we didn't have replacement".
They couldn't be ar**d to let either club know so one travelled an hour and both wasted their saturday afternoon.

That is the type of shyte Wicklow are at in soccer and in GAA.
Bunch of useless feckless halfwits seem to always end up running stuff in that county and all the hard work the grassroots do is wasted.

That issue with ref is far from a wicklow gaa, GAA, issue. Happens all the tme in all sports. Its happened to me coaching and as a ref in rugby....

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I can't argue with that fair point. Plus as the country lads grow up they end up setting up clubs, or being integral parts to the life of Dublin GAA clubs and the cycle continues Dublin get stronger.

But I was thinking by their proximity to Dublin surely it gives Meath and Kildare advantages as many are dormitory towns and so on.Leading to the big smoke.

Maybe a tweak in the rules in the GAA for Kildare and Meath? Because there must be load of players falling through the cracks GAA wise who come up to Dublin to work and it is too difficult for them to travel home to play for their home club.

Because I believe for any province to be considered a proper competition there should be at least three competitive counties. Otherwise it is a waste of time with either two teams dominating in a duopoly or in Dublin's case one team.
If there is not three competitive counties in each province. They should either be scrapped or reformed.

I would have the main AI as follows:

Donegal, Mayo and Galway as the three in 'Province 1'
Tyrone, Monaghan, Kildare in 'Province 2'
Kerry, Dublin, Cork in another 'Province 3'
Tipp, Meath, Cavan in another 'Province 4'

Each province has a home and away group phase of at least 4 games each

The top two of each group go towards the AI QF's which are knock out. An open draw QF would be ideal and keep the whole thing a bit random.

Based on NFL rating and team performances on a 2/3 year cycle the leagues can be rejigged. No backdoor or any of that craic.

You dont need to scrap the provinces or reform them. Keep provinces as they are but change their role in the all ireland. Main portion of all ireland should be league/group based. Its crazy that all competitions start and are completed before the next really starts. Thayt needs to change.

Enquiring

One thing that can't be ignored is that it's not just one area of Dublin GAA that has improved. Their senior footballers have obviously dominated but so have their female counterparts. Also, their underage results have changed dramatically and their club teams. This shows the effect the money has had across the board.

It seems to be gathering huge momentum now. Soon enough the mainstream media will have to start discussing it and splitting Dublin will come into serious consideration. There probably will be a need to have an investigation into the origins of the funding. Was it all above board? Bertie Ahern and Maria Bailey's father were involved. And with the Dublin County Boards refusal to release their accounts, it all seems very murky.

Fann Linn

Enquiring wrote: »

One thing that can't be ignored is that it's not just one area of Dublin GAA that has improved. Their senior footballers have obviously dominated but so have their female counterparts. Also, their underage results have changed dramatically and their club teams. This shows the effect the money has had across the board.

It seems to be gathering huge momentum now. Soon enough the mainstream media will have to start discussing it and splitting Dublin will come into serious consideration. There probably will be a need to have an investigation into the origins of the funding. Was it all above board? Bertie Ahern and Maria Bailey's father were involved. And with the Dublin County Boards refusal to release their accounts, it all seems very murky.

You forgot to mention the Magdalen Laundries, the Mountjoy breakout and Nicky Kelly in your conspiracy.

Enquiring

Fann Linn wrote: »

You forgot to mention the Magdalen Laundries, the Mountjoy breakout and Nicky Kelly in your conspiracy.

What conspiracy? Bertie Ahern as Minister for Finance and John Bailey as Dublin County Board chairman met up to put the plan into place way back in the late 90's. The Dublin County Board have also not released their financial accounts.

Uncle Pierre

Fann Linn wrote: »

You forgot to mention the Magdalen Laundries, the Mountjoy breakout and Nicky Kelly in your conspiracy.

Uncle Pierre

Fann Linn wrote: »

You forgot to mention the Magdalen Laundries, the Mountjoy breakout and Nicky Kelly in your conspiracy.

Fann Linn

Enquiring wrote: »

What conspiracy? Bertie Ahern as Minister for Finance and John Bailey as Dublin County Board chairman met up to put the plan into place way back in the late 90's. The Dublin County Board have also not released their financial accounts.

Right. I thought this was about Leinster football. Didnt think I'd stumbled into the conspiracy thread, but there ye go. Looks like Mayo got a poor return on Enda being taoiseach judging by your line.

Got to go now. Dublin ladies kicking off now. Hoping Berties investment pays off today!!!

ArielAtom

Enquiring wrote: »

One thing that can't be ignored is that it's not just one area of Dublin GAA that has improved. Their senior footballers have obviously dominated but so have their female counterparts. Also, their underage results have changed dramatically and their club teams. This shows the effect the money has had across the board.

It seems to be gathering huge momentum now. Soon enough the mainstream media will have to start discussing it and splitting Dublin will come into serious consideration. There probably will be a need to have an investigation into the origins of the funding. Was it all above board? Bertie Ahern and Maria Bailey's father were involved. And with the Dublin County Boards refusal to release their accounts, it all seems very murky.

What do you mean murky.

Rolo2010

ShyMets wrote: »

Hypothetical there is a case there. But if a county board did take the case the optics would look awful.

Sour grapes wouldn't even cover it

It wouldn't work. The legal logic he refers to doesn't exsist. At most, a judge would advise the GAA to come up strict definition and they would just go with the traditional county boundaries.

largepants

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Come on, that is some spin on it.

Micko got his son Karl to move to to Kildare to play for them, just one example!

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-20345763.html

"Resigned to the fact he would not improve on the three championship appearances he made in the green and gold over 1992 and 1993, nor the nine league appearances he made in ’93 scoring 3-21, (Karl) O’Dwyer parted from Kerry in 1997.

A few months after he secured a teaching job in Rathangan - before moving to Confey where he continues to work today - he was a Kildare player under the management of his father Mick."



When Micko managed Wicklow didn't he poach one of Carlow's best players Thomas Walsh?

https://hoganstand.com/county/kildare/article/index/14281

Micko was notorious for the 'transfer market'.

He was cute hoor worked his celebrity well, for the good of his teams.

I give you Ryan O Dwyer, Declan Darcy, John Timmons, Ciaran Barr. Will I carry on?

I'm sure you'll have an excuse for each one. You're proving very good at that.

Enquiring

Fann Linn wrote: »

Right. I thought this was about Leinster football. Didnt think I'd stumbled into the conspiracy thread, but there ye go. Looks like Mayo got a poor return on Enda being taoiseach judging by your line.

Got to go now. Dublin ladies kicking off now. Hoping Berties investment pays off today!!!

Which is the conspiracy? Bertie and Bailey or Dublin County Board not releasing their accounts?

Fann Linn

Enquiring wrote: »

Which is the conspiracy? Bertie and Bailey or Dublin County Board not releasing their accounts?

The murky business your alleging. Any proof or are you just trying to spin a web?

Cilldara_2000

ShyMets wrote: »

My post was in jest. Splitting Dublin does nothing to solve the overall issues of the GAA.

People point to the Leinster Championship and rightly point out that its a one horse race. They will refer back to the late 90's and early 00's and say look how competitive it was. And they're right but thats the exception. Leinster has been dominated by Dublin and Meath with other teams occasionally challenging.

Whats happening now is one team has had a prolonged series of dominance. This does need to be addressed.

But lets depart from the fallacy that Leinster was always some sort of competitive gem in the Provincial structure

The roll of honour does not back up this point.

The most competitive period was the 17 seasons from 1935 to 1951. Seven different counties won Leinster Championships, Meath five, Laois four, Louth three, Dublin two, Kildare, Wexford and Carlow one each. This is the golden era of competition within Leinster.

1997 to 2005 is the second most competitive period.

Prior to that, only from 1983 was it sown up between Dublin and Meath.

Offaly won three Leinster Championships in each of the 60s, 70s and 80s. Three different counties won in the 70s. Four different counties won in the 1960s: Dublin three, Meath three, Offaly three and Longford one. The 1950s also had four different counties winning, and I've already outlined from 1935 above.

The simple facts are that the periods where two counties dominate are the less common and the Leinster championship had many very competitive periods where numerous different counties managed to get over the line. It really was a competitive gem in the provincial structure.

Enquiring

ArielAtom wrote: »

What do you mean murky.

We all know about Bertie's history and the Bailey families dodginess. When you add in the omerta over the Dublin County Board's financial accounts, it's all very murky. It could all be above board but I think it deserves investigation for sure.

Fann Linn

Enquiring wrote: »

We all know about Bertie's history and the Bailey families dodginess. When you add in the omerta over the Dublin County Board's financial accounts, it's all very murky. It could all be above board but I think it deserves investigation for sure.

Go to your local Garda station with your concerns and see what they say.

Cilldara_2000

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Come on, that is some spin on it.

Micko got his son Karl to move to to Kildare to play for them, just one example!

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-20345763.html

"Resigned to the fact he would not improve on the three championship appearances he made in the green and gold over 1992 and 1993, nor the nine league appearances he made in ’93 scoring 3-21, (Karl) O’Dwyer parted from Kerry in 1997.

A few months after he secured a teaching job in Rathangan - before moving to Confey where he continues to work today - he was a Kildare player under the management of his father Mick."

When Micko managed Wicklow didn't he poach one of Carlow's best players Thomas Walsh?

https://hoganstand.com/county/kildare/article/index/14281

Micko was notorious for the 'transfer market'.

He was cute hoor worked his celebrity well, for the good of his teams.

So one example and that happens to be his own son who had actually started working and living in the county prior to playing for the county. That's hardly "scouring the country for anyone who would line out for them".

The other examples you might find, all two of them, also lived and worked in the county. What he actually did was scour the county, not the country.

And I'm insufficiently familiar with what went on in other counties to comment on them.

Enquiring

Fann Linn wrote: »

The murky business your alleging. Any proof or are you just trying to spin a web?

Again, which part do you not believe?

ArielAtom

Enquiring wrote: »

We all know about Bertie's history and the Bailey families dodginess. When you add in the omerta over the Dublin County Board's financial accounts, it's all very murky. It could all be above board but I think it deserves investigation for sure.

Stop beating around the bush and either state your accusations on stay quiet.

ShyMets

ArielAtom wrote: »

Stop beating around the bush and either state your accusations on stay quiet.

This type of nonsense really annoys me. You see it posted quite a bit. The suggestion that there was and perhaps still is some underhand financial activity going on with the Dublin County Board.

Yet when you ask for proof you're met with the sound of Crickets

Enquiring

ArielAtom wrote: »

Stop beating around the bush and either state your accusations on stay quiet.

What accusations? I'm saying this deserves investigation. Look at the characters involved and the amount of money that has been taken for this scheme. Millions of taxpayers money I might add. I think it'd be of public interest.

Did you smash it

The strangest thing to happen with Dublins accounts apart from they are kept very much under wraps was when they held a fundraising dinner selling tickets for 2500 euro a table and we’re going to have an auction at it and a big glitzy night. Then when the Dublin accounts leaked on st Sylvester’s website for that year the total amount for fundraising was 59k.

No one asked any questions in our esteemed media of course. Could be completely fine what happened to that money but makes no sense.

Enquiring

ShyMets wrote: »

This type of nonsense really annoys me. You see it posted quite a bit. The suggestion that there was and perhaps still is some underhand financial activity going on with the Dublin County Board.

Yet when you ask for proof you're met with the sound of Crickets

Any reason why they won't release their accounts? Anything to hide?