Rent deposit retention.

Syngmaster

Hi everyone,

We (myself and my wife) had a couple of issues with our previous landlord.
We've finally moved into another place but the story with the previous landlord hasn't finished yet.

Just a few words about the situation.
When we moved in we were asked to pay rent in cash, which was kinda fine with us but sounded a bit dodgy (possible tax evasion:)). The landlord's son was the one we met first time, gave us the tenant agreement, was picking up cash etc. He was acting as the landlord's agent. We had never seen the landlord until a Friday afternoon. The landlord came up without any notice and said that the rent should go up from the next month (it'd been our 3rd month since we moved in). And if we don't agree, we have 2 weeks to vacate the property. We'd lodged a dispute with RTB the same date regarding invalid rent increase. After talking to locals (we were new in town), it turned out that this guy has a very bad reputation in town and in county as well, known as a fraud and a criminal and every one suggested to find another place asap (even guards ). So we paid for a month and told him that we'd be moving out and gave him a month notice. 3 weeks after we were ready to move out, but he didn't want to give us the deposit back (unsurprisingly) so we opened another dispute with RTB, but close the previous one as the rent increase didn't really make sense anymore.
We told him that as we paid the rent for a month, we'll stay the extra week, and will give him keys only after that. He said that he'd change the lock and he actually did. New tenants moved in the same evening :eek:

P.S.
- No written notices was given from the landlord due to his fraud/criminal nature obviously (he said he doesn't give anything in written, never).
- No registration with RTB (same reason as above)
- We were on the fixed term (unfortunately), however as Threshold suggested, if both parties agree to finish the lease, any deposit retention would be illegal. (there was no damaged to the property, we're very nice tenants )

So the question that I have is: what are our chances in getting the deposit back? Even if it'll take a few months, it's just a matter of principle.

jimbobjoe71

I'm sure someone will be along to explain legally what you can do but I just wanted to say that you should report the landlord for tax evasion. See below link. Sorry you got scammed.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/assist-us/reporting-shadow-economy-activity/reporting.aspx

Syngmaster

I've reported the issue to RTB already. Should I also report it to Revenue?

Pkiernan

Syngmaster wrote: »

I've reported the issue to RTB already. Should I also report it to Revenue?

Yes.

Additionally, you have been illegally evicted and eligible for up to 10k in compensation. Call RTB and tell them you have been kicked out.

Syngmaster

Pkiernan wrote: »

Yes.

Additionally, you have been illegally evicted and eligible for up to 10k in compensation. Call RTB and tell them you have been kicked out.

Fortunately for us, we found another house in 2 weeks so we were already living at another address. It was an eviction but only technical as we told him that we'd moving out on a particular date. And on that day, when he said that deposit is non-refundable, I told him that he's not going to get the keys back today, only next week. We wanted to go to guards to report trespassing but they all know the guy and they would've told us to deal with RTB. Even local solicitors, when we asked for help, they asked the name of the landlord but after hearing it, they were like: 'Sorry, can't help you'. The dispute that has been opened is about a deposit retention and illegal eviction (2 things in one dispute), but I know it'll take a while in order to get the situation sorted from their side.

Anyway, I'll do an extra report to Revenue. Thanks

Claw Hammer

Pkiernan wrote: »

Yes.

Additionally, you have been illegally evicted and eligible for up to 10k in compensation. Call RTB and tell them you have been kicked out.

It is up to 20k for an illegal eviction, but this is hardly ever awarded.

Mrs OBumble

Choose your enemies carefully.

Legally, you have every right to take the case, to be awarded compensation, and to have that compensation paid to you.

Practically, the chances of the third step happening may be so small that it effort required for the first steps may not be justified.

Syngmaster

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Choose your enemies carefully.

Legally, you have every right to take the case, to be awarded compensation, and to have that compensation paid to you.

Practically, the chances of the third step happening may be so small that it effort required for the first steps may not be justified.

The only thing I really need is to get my deposit back.
Don't really care about the compensation for the eviction.
I added that to the dispute hoping it'll increase my chances of getting the deposit back.

Claw Hammer

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Choose your enemies carefully.

Legally, you have every right to take the case, to be awarded compensation, and to have that compensation paid to you.

Practically, the chances of the third step happening may be so small that it effort required for the first steps may not be justified.

It is easier for a tenant to collect compensation than it is for a landlord.

Burzum

Evictions are frozen during the lockdown, he has broken more than one law, from reading the first post it seems that he has been getting away with this for awhile now, so if you are in a position to take this person to court then go ahead, not for the compensation but more so for him to be shown he needs to follow the rules like everyone else.

Syngmaster

Burzum wrote: »

Evictions are frozen during the lockdown, he has broken more than one law, from reading the first post it seems that he has been getting away with this for awhile now, so if you are in a position to take this person to court then go ahead, not for the compensation but more so for him to be shown he needs to follow the rules like everyone else.

If the case goes to court, I'd be happy to be there. In the RTB enforcement report I mentioned my details in order to be contacted should the case proceed to court. It's just a matter of principle. I've been renting for 7 years, happened that we changed houses once a year, so 7 landlords and first time ever had such an unpleasant experience. Can't just let it go..

Smouse156

Syngmaster wrote: »

If the case goes to court, I'd be happy to be there. In the RTB enforcement report I mentioned my details in order to be contacted should the case proceed to court. It's just a matter of principle. I've been renting for 7 years, happened that we changed houses once a year, so 7 landlords and first time ever had such an unpleasant experience. Can't just let it go..

Go to court and obtain a judgement mortgage against that property and any other property the landlord owns along with all costs. If he doesn’t pay, apply to the court Sheriff to enforce.

Obviously this is hugely costly and time consuming and depends on whether he has any equity in the property (could not be paying the mortgage).

Dav010

If the guards are telling you he is a nasty piece of work and to move ASAP, others are telling he is a criminal, and solicitors are refusing to represent you against him, I think that would give me pause for thought in whether I would want him knocking on my door after I had reported him to Revenue and the RTB. Certainly I would like to see him get his comeuppance, but not if it put me and my wife in danger.

Syngmaster

Dav010 wrote: »

If the guards are telling you he is a nasty piece of work and to move ASAP, others are telling he is a criminal, and solicitors are refusing to represent you against him, I think that would give me pause for thought in whether I would want him knocking on my door after I had reported him to Revenue and the RTB. Certainly I would like to see him get his comeuppance, but not if it put me and my wife in danger.

I agree, that's what concerned me, especially when he was very aggressive over the phone (shouting, yelling). I left a statement at the local Garda station explaining the situation in details. They said that he would't do any physical abuse or something like this but in order to avoid stress it's better make a move. This guy(his family) has tons of properties in the town (1/3 of the market) and in other towns in the county. While speaking with Threshold and mentioned his name, the customer service person was surprised as they (Threshold) got contacted by guards regarding similar issues in other towns.

So we're not the first and not the last in this situation, so it means that we're no the only one who reported that and I don't think he'll be knocking the door of every tenant he had.

As soon as I got sorted with the deposit, I'll forget about it

Mrs OBumble

Claw Hammer wrote: »

It is easier for a tenant to collect compensation than it is for a landlord.

It's easier for a tenant to be awarded compensation, for sure.

But how is the actual collection easier for them? As in being handed the cash.

brisan

And some people wonder why we have RPZs and a heavily regulated rental market

Pkiernan

brisan wrote: »

And some people wonder why we have RPZs and a heavily regulated rental market

And tenants who fail to act and put up with landlords like this make things worse for the next person.

No point in having laws that people can't be arsed to follow.

Fol20

Pkiernan wrote: »

Yes.

Additionally, you have been illegally evicted and eligible for up to 10k in compensation. Call RTB and tell them you have been kicked out.

You mention you agreed to move out and you also mention he changed the locks.

If you agreed to move out after 4 weeks and he changed the locks before the agreed date, then i would bring this up in your RTB dispute and usually you would receive compensation for this terrible behaviour.

I suspect he an old school type of person that just ignores all laws in place. These type of ll give the rest of us ll a bad name and causes more pain for good ll as the government bring in more legislation to stop this behaviour.

Take him to the cleaners, he deserves it for all the dodgy stuff he is doing.

Fol20

Syngmaster wrote: »

I've reported the issue to RTB already. Should I also report it to Revenue?

I personally wouldnt report him to revenue until after your case is resolved.. You dont know he isnt paying taxes but based on everything you have said, i very much doubt everything is above board.

Savage_Henry

“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”

Claw Hammer

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It's easier for a tenant to be awarded compensation, for sure.

But how is the actual collection easier for them? As in being handed the cash.

Because the RTB will issue proceedings against the Landlord in the District Court The Landlord can always be served since the address of the property is known, whereas a tenant can disappear and if there is no subsequent address the landlord cannot serve proceedings or even instigate a case in the RTB. Once judgement has been entered it is again far easier to take enforcement proceedings such as judgement mortgage, garnishee, instalment order against the landlord since the property address is known.

Samuel T. Cogley

I'd try and find out some more about this lad before I went any further. There are some very nasty pieces of work out there with property as an 'investment' from 'other' sources of income.