Will you take an approved COVID-19 vaccine?

Caraibh

chrisbonnie wrote: »

So the pandemic has simply been a big fib then?

I wish someone could have told all those people that died, the big fakers!

What in that post isn't true?

They did change the criteria for a pandemic.

They did change how deaths are attributed.

They are using a fraudulent test to scare people.

And the vaccine is experimental.

Where in the tweet does it say that the people who died were fakers?

plodder

Caraibh wrote: »

What in that post isn't true?

They are using a fraudulent test to scare people.

And the vaccine is experimental.

Both false.

schmoo2k

plodder wrote: »

Children, pregnant women and people with some conditions aren't going to be given it, and that's not because it is unsafe, but because it hasn't been tested on those groups.

Children <15 account for 21.15% of our population.

From the WHO: "The percentage of people who need to have antibodies in order to achieve herd immunity against a particular disease varies with each disease. For example, herd immunity against measles requires about 95% of a population to be vaccinated. The remaining 5% will be protected by the fact that measles will not spread among those who are vaccinated. For polio, the threshold is about 80%."

I wonder what % will be required for Covid?

schmoo2k

Caraibh wrote: »

What in that post isn't true?

They did change the criteria for a pandemic.

They did change how deaths are attributed.

They are using a fraudulent test to scare people.

And the vaccine is experimental.

Where in the tweet does it say that the people who died were fakers?

"They did change the criteria for a pandemic." - not for Covid they didn't and Covid meets the requirement of both anyway.

"They did change how deaths are attributed." - this is only an argument for the total numbers. Covid is killing people without the need of a bus to run them over etc.

"They are using a fraudulent test to scare people." - Don't mix up bad journalism / facbook posts with the actual numbers (hint: the tests aren't 100% accurate, but the accuracy rate they publish is correct).

"And the vaccine is experimental" - correct, but there are three which are have finished up their "testing" phases and are awaiting final approval, at which point they are not "experimental". Note: The number of test patients in the trials has been a lot higher than previous similar (non expedited) trials.

plodder

schmoo2k wrote: »

Children <15 account for 21.15% of our population.

From the WHO: "The percentage of people who need to have antibodies in order to achieve herd immunity against a particular disease varies with each disease. For example, herd immunity against measles requires about 95% of a population to be vaccinated. The remaining 5% will be protected by the fact that measles will not spread among those who are vaccinated. For polio, the threshold is about 80%."

I wonder what % will be required for Covid?

Apparently, Moderna are about to start a trial with children (and Pfizer already have started). So, maybe it will actually be available for kids eventually.

paw patrol

Parabellum9 wrote: »

We don’t need anything draconian like that but they should have life made as hard and restricted as possible. It’s their choice if they don’t want to take it but that should come with severe consequences for being able to access services or live life as normal.

Caraibh wrote: »

It's frightening to hear such talk, isn't it? A society of 1st and 2nd class citizens.

but there you have it above - he doesnt want anything draconian but wants life ...wait for it....

life made as hard and restricted as possible

that's the mentality. the inner Chinese communist party coming to the fore. The individual means nothing only the state matters.
Collectivism cheered on by others too.

paw patrol

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

There are 6 categories of people in my eyes

1Those willing and happy to take the vaccine. They have complete faith. First in the queue if they could etc

2Those who will put any concerns they have to the side because they want to do their part in stopping the virus and getting life back to normal

3Those who are concerned about the vaccine and possible side effects. They have taken previous vaccines but are unsure about this one

4Those who have other health problems can have nobody to turn to to give them reassurances or information specific to their particular health ailment. They are worried about side effects and what might happen to them

5 People who dont want to take the vaccine as they feel that if they catch covid they are not at risk. A mild illness etc.

6 Antivaxxers who believe it's a conspiracy, population control etc

I am both 3 and 5.

prob more on 5 but hard to say.


If i take it won't be for a long time, i'll let the worthy along with the virtue signalling politicians and celebs go first. No need to keep me a place in the queue.

Seweryn

Interesting to read, here is the instruction published by the UK Government:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/940565/Information_for_Healthcare_Professionals_on_Pfizer_BioNTech_COVID-19_vaccine.pdf

The Belly

CEO of Pfizer said this on NBC when interviewed last night.

On whether someone can still transmit the virus after vaccination, Pfizer Chairman & CEO Dr. Albert Bourla tells @LesterHoltNBC
“I think this is something that needs to be examined. We are not certain about that right now with what we know.” #Dateline

tobefrank321

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Jesus christ, should we wear a badge or label to identify ourselves as not taken the vaccine, or maybe herded into compounds and left out under armed guard.

Nope. But you will find your options limited in life going forward.
If you want a proceedure done in hospital, elective or otherwise, the first question you'll be asked is did you receive the vaccine? This will be done to protect the medical staff, vulnerable patients who might share a ward with you but mostly YOURSELF.
After that if you want to travel to a large number of countries who take covid serioualy you'll be asked for proof. The last thing they need is a "Paddy" sick with covid taking up their hospital resources.
No badges or labels, but proof of responsible adult behaviour.

tobefrank321

The Belly wrote: »

CEO of Pfizer said this on NBC when interviewed last night.

On whether someone can still transmit the virus after vaccination, Pfizer Chairman & CEO Dr. Albert Bourla tells @LesterHoltNBC
“I think this is something that needs to be examined. We are not certain about that right now with what we know.” #Dateline

If it shortens the symptomatic period and stops people shedding huge amounts of virus through coughing etc this should be enough to reduce spread.

eagle eye

The Belly wrote:

On whether someone can still transmit the virus after vaccination, Pfizer Chairman & CEO Dr. Albert Bourla tells @LesterHoltNBC “I think this is something that needs to be examined. We are not certain about that right now with what we know.†#Dateline

CEO of Pfizer said this on NBC when interviewed last night.

Not being certain sounds to me like the vaccine isn't ready.

tobefrank321

If you want to be part of society then at least make an effort to boost the herd immunity of society.
Most anti vaxxers benefit from herd immunity without them knowing it. And without vaccines we'd be stuck in permanent lockdown to avoid often fatal diseases.

ebbsy

I have diabetes but even if I did not I would still get it anyway.

I used to suffer a lot before I got the flu jab. Now things are a lot better.

It is common sense in my view to get this vaccine. If it was not safe it would not be approved.

ebbsy

tobefrank321 wrote: »

Nope. But you will find your options limited in life going forward.
If you want a proceedure done in hospital, elective or otherwise, the first question you'll be asked is did you receive the vaccine? This will be done to protect the medical staff, vulnerable patients who might share a ward with you but mostly YOURSELF.
After that if you want to travel to a large number of countries who take covid serioualy you'll be asked for proof. The last thing they need is a "Paddy" sick with covid taking up their hospital resources.
No badges or labels, but proof of responsible adult behaviour.

Good point. I think certain airlines will need to see proof of vaccination.

And I agree with them.

Das Reich

What about people that got the covid already they also have to take the vaccine?

GreeBo

breezy1985 wrote: »

Or cake

Well we're out of cake.

paw patrol

tobefrank321 wrote: »

Nope. But you will find your options limited in life going forward.
If you want a proceedure done in hospital, elective or otherwise, the first question you'll be asked is did you receive the vaccine? This will be done to protect the medical staff, vulnerable patients who might share a ward with you but mostly YOURSELF.
After that if you want to travel to a large number of countries who take covid serioualy you'll be asked for proof. The last thing they need is a "Paddy" sick with covid taking up their hospital resources.
No badges or labels, but proof of responsible adult behaviour.

without the numbers of positive results which in itself begs the questiin are you actually sick is asymptotic.


How serious is covdi19 as an illness ?

It doesn't appear to be a bad illness - remember we are flattening the curve and all that jazz.

It would appear to be a numbers game because bar extreme cases it doesn't seem that bad - the current numbers are

47000 active cases only 239 in hospital (remember not all those hospital cases are in there cos of covid either).



In the future when people are immune with the vaccine or with the own immunity* why would a covid case cause any issue for a hospital or HSE equivalent anywhere in the world.




*research is showing that T-Cells are showing a response to covid in people who had it. Funny that isn't mentioned . Vaccine works on TCells too.


The numbers don't tally with the aggression in your post toward people without a vaccine

Ashbourne hoop

Das Reich wrote: »

What about people that got the covid already they also have to take the vaccine?

It's a good question. With the rate of re-infection barely worth mentioning, its perhaps unlikely to be needed, but its one of the unknowns at this stage.

average_runner

Das Reich wrote: »

What about people that got the covid already they also have to take the vaccine?

Yes they will. Test on people who had the virus, shown they lost the antibodies after 6 months.

GreeBo

eagle eye wrote: »

Not being certain sounds to me like the vaccine isn't ready.

Not really, they are certain (up to the demonstrated efficacy levels) that the person taking the vaccine wont get it, they just dont know if you can still be a carrier.

But even if the vaccine meant you couldn't get it or carry it, its still 100% possible to transmit it on your hands, clothes etc.
Its not like its some blood borne disease, its spread by droplets, they dont have to originate *from* you to be *on* you.

Think of it like a bullet proof vest, it is likely going to stop you from getting shot, but if you shoot someone else who isnt wearing a vest they still die.

polesheep

average_runner wrote: »

Yes they will. Test on people who had the virus, shown they lost the antibodies after 6 months.

That doesn't mean that they don't have immunity.

paw patrol

average_runner wrote: »

Yes they will. Test on people who had the virus, shown they lost the antibodies after 6 months.

what about T-Cells?
Research I read is the T-Cells adapt to fight covid.


in laymans terms:

Antibodes stop you getting the illlness
T-Cells beat up the illness when you get it

the vaccines (ones I read - cos i'm aware there are now millions and billions of vaccines) appear to be related to T-Cells.
You should read more of my posts - I was lashing this stuff out like mad in September

grogi

average_runner wrote: »

Yes they will. Test on people who had the virus, shown they lost the antibodies after 6 months.

You don't need a sea of antibodies to have immunity. As long as your body can quickly identify the perpetrator and produce antibodies, you're fine.

average_runner

grogi wrote: »

You don't need a sea of antibodies to have immunity. As long as your body can quickly identify the perpetrator and produce antibodies, you're fine.

But when will we know this?

polesheep

average_runner wrote: »

But when will we know this?

Having immunity is the norm. You really wouldn't expect the body not to be immune after an initial infection.

average_runner

polesheep wrote: »

Having immunity is the norm. You really wouldn't expect the body not to be immune after an initial infection.

But its a respiratory virus which means it can change strain like the flu can.
So reinfection is possible?

eagle eye

GreeBo wrote: »

Not really, they are certain (up to the demonstrated efficacy levels) that the person taking the vaccine wont get it, they just dont know if you can still be a carrier.

But even if the vaccine meant you couldn't get it or carry it, its still 100% possible to transmit it on your hands, clothes etc.
Its not like its some blood borne disease, its spread by droplets, they dont have to originate *from* you to be *on* you.

Think of it like a bullet proof vest, it is likely going to stop you from getting shot, but if you shoot someone else who isnt wearing a vest they still die.

He wasn't talking about clothes or any other way you could spread the virus, he was literally talking about the potential for the person to still be a transmitter.
If he said yes or no that's a hell of a lot different to being uncertain. Uncertainty is not acceptable.
I've always had a lot of respect for Pfizer but I'm uncomfortable with this vaccine.
I certainly will not be taking it or the moderna vaccine anyways due to my concerns over mRNA.
I will take the Oxford one.

polesheep

average_runner wrote: »

But its a respiratory virus which means it can change strain like the flu can.
So reinfection is possible?

It can but thankfully it seems to be quite stable. If it were to change strain with ease then immunity through vaccination would also be much more difficult to achieve. I'm not advocating that we can do without vaccines and wait for herd immunity through infection, but there is immunity through infection.

average_runner

polesheep wrote: »

It can but thankfully it seems to be quite stable. If it were to change strain with ease then immunity through vaccination would also be much more difficult to achieve. I'm not advocating that we can do without vaccines and wait for herd immunity through infection, but there is immunity through infection.

Ok, i was thinking we might need vaccine every year!!