Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2020/2021

jonneymendoza

Soups123 wrote: »

He performed better than Arteta and agreed he was poor

You can't blame arteta for all the error's that has happen on multiple players.

tayto lover

We’re going nowhere.

Soups123

jonneymendoza wrote: »

You can't blame arteta for all the error's that has happen on multiple players.

Honestly Jonney. Yourself and Quazzi are just on a crusade now.

Anyway I’ll park it here have a good weekend

AdamD

Quazzie wrote: »

Tonights lost points is down to a player making a big error.

As pointed out earlier, we must have the most of these type of errors that cost us points. Arteta can't be blamed for that. When we have our players, turn up, play to a basic level, and then we lose, then we can fully and justifiably question Arteta. Of the offside wasn't given by VAR, and Pepe scores the penalty, and then Leno catches a very basic cross, we wouldn't be here saying Arteta got it spot on. So we also shouldn't be blaming him when the opposite happens.

No it's not. A good team wins that game even with the error. It was a home game and we scored 0 goals. Arsenal have scored 19 goals in 16 home games this season. We could make 0 errors and still be mid table.

Ardennes1944

Fraudulent.

wonga77

I wouldnt mind but Everton were awful tonight. They would have been quite happy to take the point.
Just when you think the team cant let you down any more...
Home record
P17 - W 6 - D 4 - L 7
-1 goal difference.

Thats where we're at now unfortunately...

FixitFelix

OmegaGene wrote: »

Can we keep Pickford and replace him with Arteta on the bus

We've enough blunder prone players

tayto lover

AdamD wrote: »

No it's not. A good team wins that game even with the error. It was a home game and we scored 0 goals. Arsenal have scored 19 goals in 16 home games this season. We could make 0 errors and still be mid table.

And it’s happened far too often.
Worst season in EPL I think.

Quazzie

Soups123 wrote: »

One day you’ll wake up Quazzi your relentless in your defense of Arteta, it has no substance but each to there own

I'm not defending Arteta, but how can anyone look at that game tonight and read the stats, and then blame Arteta for the lost points. Over 50% more possession than them. 50% more shots. 3 times as many on target. Disallowed a penalty by a millimetre in an offside call by VAR. A freakishly embarrassing OG from our keeper.

How can you see all that and blame Arteta.

al87987

jonneymendoza wrote: »

You can't blame arteta for all the error's that has happen on multiple players.

He literally SOLD the keeper who will get in the majority of teams of the year and made Leno his number 1. You absolutely can blame him here

AdamD

AdamD wrote: »

I really struggle to see how anybody can watch this team on a regular basis and think Arteta is a good coach

I don't get it myself. People are happy to criticise players but not the manager. There was a post about Nketiah earlier that I mostly agreed with but half the points could be applied to Arteta.

We're on a run now of 4W, 3D, 5L in the last 12 matches. The funny thing is that I fully expected us about 5 matches ago I expected us to finish strongly in an ultimately pointless decent run.

5 games to go in this ****ty season, should be easy points to pick up
A Newcastle (15th)
H WNA (19th)
A Chelsea (4th)
A Palace (13th)
H Brighton (16th)

Looking at the remaining fixtures Chelsea is the only one that shouldn't be a straightforward win. But they'll be coming off their semi-final CL second leg and then City and then us.

Last season was the lowest points total in 24 years I think. We need another 10 from the remaining fixtures just to match that. A failure of a season whatever happens. Winning the EL would unfortunately just extend our fall into mediocrity.

tayto lover

al87987 wrote: »

He literally SOLD the keeper who will get in the majority of teams of the year and made Leno his number 1. You absolutely can blame him here

But he has nice hair.

omega man

Arsenal official statement:
We’re sorry, we made another mistake. We’d like to rejoin the ESL as we're screwed otherwise.

Seriously though, serious pressure to win the EL now.

FixitFelix

al87987 wrote: »

He literally SOLD the keeper who will get in the majority of teams of the year and made Leno his number 1. You absolutely can blame him here

Didn't Martinez make a balls up in their last game.

AdamD

Quazzie wrote: »

I'm not defending Arteta, but how can anyone look at that game tonight and read the stats, and then blame Arteta for the lost points. Over 50% more possession than them. 50% more shots. 3 times as many on target. Disallowed a penalty by a millimetre in an offside call by VAR. A freakishly embarrassing OG from our keeper.

How can you see all that and blame Arteta.

Its quite simple really, we created very few if any decent chances in the entire game. That's on Arteta, the coach. You could absolve him if it was a once off, it clearly isn't. You could maybe excuse it if he was managing a team who typically score few goals - he isn't.

FixitFelix

AdamD wrote: »

Its quite simple really, we created very few if any decent chances in the entire game. That's on Arteta, the coach. You could absolve him if it was a once off, it clearly isn't. You could maybe excuse it if he was managing a team who typically score few goals - he isn't.

Look at the amount of times Saka and Pepe got to the by line and couldn't pick a pass, that's on them. Saka literally kicked it straight to pickford at one point

Underground

FixitFelix wrote: »

Didn't Martinez make a balls up in their last game.

He's had a few moments alright, still a quality keeper, and I would say the same about Leno.

Leno is not the problem.

Quazzie

AdamD wrote: »

Its quite simple really, we created very few if any decent chances in the entire game. That's on Arteta, the coach. You could absolve him if it was a once off, it clearly isn't. You could maybe excuse it if he was managing a team who typically score few goals - he isn't.

We created more than them. That's what matters. Higher xG too. We just didn't have a striker to put them away.

One thing I would criticise him on is that Nketiah should be nowhere near the first team.

FixitFelix

FixitFelix wrote: »

Look at the amount of times Saka and Pepe got to the by line and couldn't pick a pass, that's on them. Saka literally kicked it straight to pickford at one point

Hey, probably works all the time in training against Leno. :pac:

omega man

Quazzie wrote: »

We created more than them. That's what matters. Higher xG too. We just didn't have a striker to put them away.

One thing I would criticise him on is that Nketiah should be nowhere near the first team.

Higher xG. Ffs

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

We created more than them. That's what matters. Higher xG too.

We might win something for that at the end of the season.

Quazzie

So the question that needs to be answered is this. Who lost us the game tonight. Leon or Arteta?

L'prof

Quazzie wrote: »

We created more than them. That's what matters. Higher xG too. We just didn't have a striker to put them away.

One thing I would criticise him on is that Nketiah should be nowhere near the first team.

Ah here. I’m a big fan of xG but that’s clutching a bit. It was 0.74 v 0.53. Feck all worth taking about for either side

Quazzie

Quazzie wrote: »

So the question that needs to be answered is this. Who lost us the game tonight. Leon or Arteta?

L'prof

Quazzie wrote: »

So the question that needs to be answered is this. Who lost us the game tonight. Leon or Arteta?

Definitely Leon...whoever he is :pac:

L'prof

L'prof wrote: »

Ah here. I’m a big fan of xG but that’s clutching a bit. It was 0.74 v 0.53. Feck all worth taking about for either side

I don't go in for all those kind of stats but does it state and xG for the goal that actually happened?

wonga77

Quazzie wrote: »

We created more than them. That's what matters. Higher xG too. We just didn't have a striker to put them away.

Jonney was making the same claim after the fulham game. 1 point from a possible 6 but we created more chances in both games. At the end of the day goals win games and we're woefully lacking in that department.
I don't understand the creating chances comment myself and it's not something that I would be taking comfort in

Quazzie

L'prof wrote: »

Ah here. I’m a big fan of xG but that’s clutching a bit. It was 0.74 v 0.53. Feck all worth taking about for either side

It's not a lot, but the point remains. If either side should have won that game it should have been Arsenal
The reason we lost is 100% Leno.

tayto lover

Quazzie wrote: »

It's not a lot, but the point remains. If either side should have won that game it should have been Arsenal
The reason we lost is 100% Leno.

And the reason we barely scraped a draw at home to WBA?

emmetlego

omega man wrote: »

Higher xG. Ffs

The division continues, after a brilliant night for Arsenal fans, where we showed more fight than Arsenal fans have in decades. So, firstly, to the gunners outside Emirates tonight... Well done guys, bloody well done.

Tonight was an individual error. Not an Arteta error. We were the better team, created a lot of chances, and when you're missing your top 2 strikers, it's Arteta's fault for them being injured or sick.

It's also Arteta's fault that Bernd Leno made a mistake. All 'keepers make mistakes. Even the utterly faultless Martinez made couple of boo boos this week.

It's Arteta's fault that we missed our left full through injury.

Let's be honest here. For the last few weeks, all our eggs are in the EL basket. It's a perilous position, but cest la Vie. We cannot expect our players to be on fire tonight, when in 6 days we have a season defining game (1 of 3) to come. It's also good to remember that these guys are human, and the protest outside this evening, must have affected them in some way.

All in all, what has been a rough ride of a week for us gunners, we are still in the same position footballing wise. Win 3 games, and we'll be in the UCL next year and have won a European trophy. Maybe, just maybe then, you doubters will think Mikel is the man. Just like me and my family do!

It's ok to disagree with me, just please don't ram your emotional rants down my throat in difference. Good night.

Quazzie

wonga77 wrote: »

Jonney was making the same claim after the fulham game. 1 point from a possible 6 but we created more chances in both games. At the end of the day goals win games and we're woefully lacking in that department.
I don't understand the creating chances comment myself and it's not something that I would be taking comfort in

I remember pointing it out during Emery's reign that Auba was getting us a lot of undeserved points and that it would eventually dry up. Now it has. This is what was always bound to happen. We had a great goalscorer. Now.we don't. You can't win without goals. Auba papered over a lot of cracks and we're seeing how deep those cracks run now.

Azatadine

Quazzie wrote: »

It's not a lot, but the point remains. If either side should have won that game it should have been Arsenal
The reason we lost is 100% Leno.

Always somebody else......never, ever Arteta.......

Can I ask why you have such belief in him? He has no managerial history, we play atrocious most of the time, out position in the table is embarrassing. What gives you the belief that he's an outstanding coach. The facts don't support it. Why do you believe he's outstanding or will be outstanding without any indications that its true?

How many absolute howlers is that for Leno now? At what point will we finally admit that we need a new goalkeeper? Unfortunately I expect the typical Arsenal nonsense of "standing behind him" while he flounders for another 18 months. Sign another keeper who isn't good enough to automatically kick him out of the starting 11. Then the new keeper starts playing more, Leno leaves and we still have a substandard starting goalkeeper but now it's the year 2025.

Soups123

Quazzie wrote: »

I'm not defending Arteta, but how can anyone look at that game tonight and read the stats, and then blame Arteta for the lost points. Over 50% more possession than them. 50% more shots. 3 times as many on target. Disallowed a penalty by a millimetre in an offside call by VAR. A freakishly embarrassing OG from our keeper.

How can you see all that and blame Arteta.

Quazzi you always look at the excuse and not the problem. Football is a game of mistakes, more than half the goals scored are linked to a mistake. Ignore the Leno error and look at the game.

We created next to nothing, we had a lot of the ball but zero cohesion in attack, that’s a game on game problem, with minor exceptions. His teams flip flop game to game in whether to press, sit, play possession, concede possession. It’s a non stop confusion and it’s the reason we see no consistency. Same with his starting 11.

Arteta is a young coach still learning, there is nothing in what any of us fans can see that suggests he’s any better than a Martinez, Robson, Keane, Lampard, Gerard, Veira, Henry, Howe. But we cannot afford to be a club that takes on a complete novice, we are Arsenal FC not Wigan. Arteta belongs in the championship or maybe lesser European leagues and like an 18 yr old player given time to grow.

He’s nowhere near the point of self confidence and coaching knowledge for a club like Arsenal especially with the state of the club at the top.

You can find an excuse for it all if that’s how you want to think, but ask yourself what have you seen or what do you know of Arteta that gives you a belief he’s the right man.

Quazzie

Azatadine wrote: »

Always somebody else......never, ever Arteta.......

Can I ask why you have such belief in him? He has no managerial history, we play atrocious most of the time, out position in the table is embarrassing. What gives you the belief that he's an outstanding coach. The facts don't support it. Why do you believe he's outstanding or will be outstanding without any indications that its true?

Please link to where I said Arteta is outstanding.

tayto lover

Arteta is a bluffer.
Just listening to him now.
“ In the moment ....”. Bullsh1t.

Underground

Said it before but I'm happy to give Arteta more time, jury is still out but if we're languishing in 10th next Christmas then serious review of the manager is needed. Next season is judgement time.

I actually fancy us to deliver against Villareal. I wrote off our league season long ago, the players look like they've mentally checked out of it too. I think they'll turn up on Thursday.

bad2dabone

I like arteta. I don't see things getting better in the short term under him.

I think he should be let go in the summer.

Quazzie

Soups123 wrote: »

Quazzi you always look at the excuse and not the problem. Football is a game of mistakes, more than half the goals scored are linked to a mistake. Ignore the Leno error and look at the game.

We created next to nothing, we had a lot of the ball but zero cohesion in attack, that’s a game on game problem, with minor exceptions. His teams flip flop game to game in whether to press, sit, play possession, concede possession. It’s a non stop confusion and it’s the reason we see no consistency. Same with his starting 11.

Arteta is a young coach still learning, there is nothing in what any of us fans can see that suggests he’s any better than a Martinez, Robson, Keane, Lampard, Gerard, Veira, Henry, Howe. But we cannot afford to be a club that takes on a complete novice, we are Arsenal FC not Wigan. Arteta belongs in the championship or maybe lesser European leagues and like an 18 yr old player given time to grow.

He’s nowhere near the point of self confidence and coaching knowledge for a club like Arsenal especially with the state of the club at the top.

You can find an excuse for it all if that’s how you want to think, but ask yourself what have you seen or what do you know of Arteta that gives you a belief he’s the right man.

We were missing out first and second choice striker. We also created 6 shots on goal of which 3 were on target. I repeat. The stats would show that tonights loss is now down to Arteta.

How many shots do you expect us to have every game?

L'prof

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't go in for all those kind of stats but does it state and xG for the goal that actually happened?

A big fat zero chance of a goal

xG is informative for me more than anything. If I haven’t seen a match, like tonight, then I’ll check the xG first because it will give me a far better sense of how good the chances crated were than just looking at shots on/off target

Soups123

Underground wrote: »

Said it before but I'm happy to give Arteta more time, jury is still out but if we're languishing in 10th next Christmas then serious review of the manager is needed. Next season is judgement time.

I actually fancy us to deliver against Villareal. I wrote off our league season long ago, the players look like they've mentally checked out of it too. I think they'll turn up on Thursday.

Genuine question. Why is 10th now acceptable? What is your own thinking on more time for Arteta is it because we saw glimpses earlier?

I do believe we shouldn’t be a revolving door I think any manager that ever takes us forward will need time, there is no magic fix but I just don’t see the blueprint with Arteta.

omega man

emmetlego wrote: »

The division continues, after a brilliant night for Arsenal fans, where we showed more fight than Arsenal fans have in decades. So, firstly, to the gunners outside Emirates tonight... Well done guys, bloody well done.

Tonight was an individual error. Not an Arteta error. We were the better team, created a lot of chances, and when you're missing your top 2 strikers, it's Arteta's fault for them being injured or sick.

It's also Arteta's fault that Bernd Leno made a mistake. All 'keepers make mistakes. Even the utterly faultless Martinez made couple of boo boos this week.

It's Arteta's fault that we missed our left full through injury.

Let's be honest here. For the last few weeks, all our eggs are in the EL basket. It's a perilous position, but cest la Vie. We cannot expect our players to be on fire tonight, when in 6 days we have a season defining game (1 of 3) to come. It's also good to remember that these guys are human, and the protest outside this evening, must have affected them in some way.

All in all, what has been a rough ride of a week for us gunners, we are still in the same position footballing wise. Win 3 games, and we'll be in the UCL next year and have won a European trophy. Maybe, just maybe then, you doubters will think Mikel is the man. Just like me and my family do!

It's ok to disagree with me, just please don't ram your emotional rants down my throat in difference. Good night.

Don’t disagree but bloody hell, I get all that for questioning “xG” lol

Azatadine

Quazzie wrote: »

Please link to where I said Arteta is outstanding.

Fair enough. Maybe you never said outstanding but you clearly think he's great and make infinite excuses for him. It baffles me as its 100% faith based rather than fact based. What's the faith based on?

tayto lover

10 home losses.

Soups123

Quazzie wrote: »

We were missing out first and second choice striker. We also created 6 shots on goal of which 3 were on target. I repeat. The stats would show that tonights loss is now down to Arteta.

How many shots do you expect us to have every game?

Okay but

Auba, Laca out is a one game problem.
3 shots on target is awful, 6 in total is awful. The average this season per game is 11 in the PL?

Again though your looking at excuses, look at the over all picture we are not even close to top 6 and that because game on game we are simply not playing good enough

Quazzie

Azatadine wrote: »

Fair enough. Maybe you never said outstanding but you clearly think he's great and make infinite excuses for him. It baffles me as its 100% faith based rather than fact based. What's the faith based on?

My personal opinion is that it's hard to fully judge him giving everything regarding the peculiarities of this season because of Covid, and because the club needs to be ripped down to start again which was needed when Wenger left. I don't believe we've gotten to see what Arteta can or can't offer. I don't go against all criticism of Arteta and some people make very valid observations. I think no matter what manager we have now we will struggle.

But tonight was down to Leno,, his ridiculous mistake, and the fact we're missing our first two choice strikers.

Underground

Soups123 wrote: »

Genuine question. Why is 10th now acceptable? What is your own thinking on more time for Arteta is it because we saw glimpses earlier?

I do believe we shouldn’t be a revolving door I think any manager that ever takes us forward will need time, there is no magic fix but I just don’t see the blueprint with Arteta.

Finishing 10th should be a sackable offence for any manager of a club like Arsenal.

I'd cut him a bit more slack seeing as he inherited a team in sharp decline. I can't remember our league position when he took over but it was probably around 10th or so. There was a massive clean up job needed, much of that was done in January.

It looks like KSE have to invest in the squad in the summer if they're to make their position with the fans any way tenable. I'm hoping he can bring in players who fit how he wants to play.

We went on a good run after christmas where I did see some green shoots, he finally, finally, finally started giving the young players a chance. This is something he took far too long to do imo. For a young manager he tends to rely heavily on experienced players (Willian).

But like I said, next season is key. The honeymoon period is over and he's had pretty much a free pass in the league when most managers would have lost their job had they been in his position at Christmas. If we're midway through next season and still mid table, nowhere near the CL places, then he needs to go.

bad2dabone

tayto lover wrote: »

10 home losses.

19 goals in 17 home games.

It's really really poor.

As I say, arteta says all the right things, but the performances are consistently bad. A good performance is pretty rare.

Time to move on I think.

Ardennes1944

I agree it's been a horrible time for a new rookie manager to come into a club already in a slump but if Arteta doesn't win the EL i think he has to go.

If we were happy with this level we should have kept Emery. The inconsistency is massive

Quazzie

Quazzie wrote: »

I remember pointing it out during Emery's reign that Auba was getting us a lot of undeserved points and that it would eventually dry up. Now it has. This is what was always bound to happen. We had a great goalscorer. Now.we don't. You can't win without goals. Auba papered over a lot of cracks and we're seeing how deep those cracks run now.

Auba was converting an insanely high percentage of chances at the start of one season with Emery, and the theory was that it would rebalance by the end of the season, which it did.

This season and last don't really relate to that period of time, although you would expect him to start converting more chances than he has been.

My problem is that we don't have enough players who can contribute to the scoring. We used to have at least half a dozen players on the pitch that were likely goal scorers, and could probably pitch in with 5-10 goals a season each. Now we have hardly any.