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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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    #6872
    sebdavis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 891 ✭✭✭sebdavis


    Former Former Former wrote: »
    His last season, he was first choice - but his competition was falling to bits. Bowe and Trimble were just about finished, Fitzgerald had retired and Dave Kearney was out for months with injury. The next cab off the rank was Craig Gilroy. Of those, only Kearney ever wore green again after the 2017 6N.

    Prior to that, when we had good alternatives, we more often than not picked the alternatives.

    Now he's four years older. I would not be surprised if he never plays for Ireland again tbh.

    The IRFU have invested in him so I guess they plan to play him. Why would they pay for a player to come home if they have no plans to bring him into the squad? Farrell etc must have also cleared bringing him back so they must want him as well

    I fully expect him to get a chance if in form, it's up to him then to prove his ability ahead of the other players.


  • Options
    #6873
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 17,169 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    There's still a chance that Zebo will play for Ireland again. We have no cover for Keenan if he gets injured. Larmour and Stockdale have been tried there and neither have impressed. I had high hopes for Will Addison, but he's perennially injured and we just can't take a chance on him at this stage.

    It all depends on if Zebo gets past Haley for Munster.


  • Options
    #6874
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Clegg wrote: »
    There's still a chance that Zebo will play for Ireland again. We have no cover for Keenan if he gets injured. Larmour and Stockdale have been tried there and neither have impressed. I had high hopes for Will Addison, but he's perennially injured and we just can't take a chance on him at this stage.

    It all depends on if Zebo gets past Haley for Munster.

    It'll be interesting to see where Zebo will get picked for Munster, tbh (and him playing well for Munster is obviously a prerequisite for any Ireland conversation).

    Conway's current form has been poor so it's possible his place could be more under threat than Haley's.


  • Options
    #6875
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,762 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    Zebo is a fine player with plenty of talent. A lot of the issues people have with him are based on or clouded by behaviours we've seen since he left. Before he left he put a load of effort in at Munster and Ireland. Think of his chase back on Larmour in Thomond. While he didn't prevent the try, he did break his backside getting into as good a position as he could have to do so. For Ireland he was stepping in at first receiver a fair bit too, utilising his strong passing game really well. There was very little complaint about his application there.

    Since then though, we have heard about him approaching Joe telling him that he didn't want to play the way that he was being told to. That's effectively telling a coach that you don't want to be picked. It's dumb. He has had a few incidents in the last few years where he has talked about how he feels hard done by not getting selected for Ireland, despite knowing he wouldn't when he was leaving. He has had a few incidents where he had reacted to Joe or Ireland not performing in ways that are at best daft. He has developed a bit of a rep for not being too bothered with the defensive side of the game over in Paris. He has put on a not so insignificant amount of weight too. Add all that to the numerous comments we've heard about him not being a great trainer, and he has managed to paint a really bad picture of himself in the last few years.

    He moved to Paris to play the way that he wanted to and get paid loads of money for it. More power to him. We all want a job that maximises the things we enjoy and minimises the things we don't while giving us loads of money for it. I have absolutely no issue with that at all. He now wants to come home and (presumably) see out his career in Ireland, where I'm sure he'll make the effort again. But he's still that guy that's quite self absorbed. He thought he was hilarious saying Leinster could offer him €5 million a year and he'd say no. But I wouldn't take him for €5. He's the polar opposite to what Leinster are under Cullen. A team first club where the group is more important than the individual.

    Zebo is the closest thing we have to a diva in Irish rugby. And while he is talented, he isn't someone I'd want in my team. He does get some unwarranted flack and I don't doubt he'll make Munster better and make the effort there to do so. Whether he gets a chance with Ireland is an interesting one. You'd imagine he wouldn't have been signed if he was out of the picture, but I can totally understand why there may be some bad blood there to a certain degree too. Apparently taking pleasure in their misfortune was incredibly poor form. And we have options in the back 3 now that mean he may not get a chance there. Time will tell...


  • Options
    #6876
    Former Former Former
    Registered Users Posts: 5,982 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    sebdavis wrote: »
    The IRFU have not invested in him not to play him. Why would they pay for a player to come home if they have no plans to bring him into the squad? Farrell etc must have also cleared bringing him back so they must want him as well

    I fully expect him to get a chance if in form, it's up to him then to prove his ability ahead of the other players.

    The IRFU haven't really invested in him though. They've given him a one-year contract that they have publicly said is worth less than the player wanted. I don't see how this is a ringing endorsement of anything. They didn't stand in Munster's way is about the best we can say but there's no reason to think the national management targeted him.

    I don't think he'll be completely ignored, just that his age might work against him.

    And by his own admission, he doesn't seem to be the sort of guy you want in camp if things aren't going his way.


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    #6877
    Paul Smeenus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,470 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    Completely coincidentally, some decent PR for Munster after the Jenkins backlash.


  • Options
    #6878
    phog
    Registered Users Posts: 24,314 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Paul Smeenus wrote: »
    Completely coincidentally, some decent PR for Munster after the Jenkins backlash.

    You think MR give a toss about what a few snowflakes here think? :pac:


  • Options
    #6879
    sebdavis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 891 ✭✭✭sebdavis


    Former Former Former wrote: »
    The IRFU haven't really invested in him though. They've given him a one-year contract that they have publicly said is worth less than the player wanted. I don't see how this is a ringing endorsement of anything. They didn't stand in Munster's way is about the best we can say but there's no reason to think the national management targeted him.

    I don't think he'll be completely ignored, just that his age might work against him.

    And by his own admission, he doesn't seem to be the sort of guy you want in camp if things aren't going his way.

    Really? in the middle of covid and the IRFU are constantly on telling us they have no money they go out and invest in a player that you think they want nothing to do with?

    The IRFU is a business, they wouldn't waste money just for the fun of it. They owe Zebo nothing and wouldn't put money into a player just for the hell of itl Zebo would of that options in France & England, its not like he has never played in the last couple of years.

    Farrell had to approve the move, the whole new Ireland camp of more relaxed etc will suit Zebo a lot better than the Joe camp when players had to study etc. Farrell worked with him before, so its not like the two of them don't know each other.


  • Options
    #6880
    nerd69
    Registered Users Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭nerd69


    Wait the "disgusting" tweets hes been doing where just emojis?


  • Options
    #6881
    sebdavis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 891 ✭✭✭sebdavis


    molloyjh wrote: »
    Zebo is a fine player with plenty of talent. A lot of the issues people have with him are based on or clouded by behaviours we've seen since he left. Before he left he put a load of effort in at Munster and Ireland. Think of his chase back on Larmour in Thomond. While he didn't prevent the try, he did break his backside getting into as good a position as he could have to do so. For Ireland he was stepping in at first receiver a fair bit too, utilising his strong passing game really well. There was very little complaint about his application there.

    Since then though, we have heard about him approaching Joe telling him that he didn't want to play the way that he was being told to. That's effectively telling a coach that you don't want to be picked. It's dumb. He has had a few incidents in the last few years where he has talked about how he feels hard done by not getting selected for Ireland, despite knowing he wouldn't when he was leaving. He has had a few incidents where he had reacted to Joe or Ireland not performing in ways that are at best daft. He has developed a bit of a rep for not being too bothered with the defensive side of the game over in Paris. He has put on a not so insignificant amount of weight too. Add all that to the numerous comments we've heard about him not being a great trainer, and he has managed to paint a really bad picture of himself in the last few years.

    He moved to Paris to play the way that he wanted to and get paid loads of money for it. More power to him. We all want a job that maximises the things we enjoy and minimises the things we don't while giving us loads of money for it. I have absolutely no issue with that at all. He now wants to come home and (presumably) see out his career in Ireland, where I'm sure he'll make the effort again. But he's still that guy that's quite self absorbed. He thought he was hilarious saying Leinster could offer him €5 million a year and he'd say no. But I wouldn't take him for €5. He's the polar opposite to what Leinster are under Cullen. A team first club where the group is more important than the individual.

    Zebo is the closest thing we have to a diva in Irish rugby. And while he is talented, he isn't someone I'd want in my team. He does get some unwarranted flack and I don't doubt he'll make Munster better and make the effort there to do so. Whether he gets a chance with Ireland is an interesting one. You'd imagine he wouldn't have been signed if he was out of the picture, but I can totally understand why there may be some bad blood there to a certain degree too. Apparently taking pleasure in their misfortune was incredibly poor form. And we have options in the back 3 now that mean he may not get a chance there. Time will tell...

    Is this true? the only thing I seen was the PP video, below, which is funny if you like that sort of thing.

    https://twitter.com/paddypower/status/1168548176338571264?lang=en


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    #6882
    Former Former Former
    Registered Users Posts: 5,982 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    sebdavis wrote: »
    Really? in the middle of covid and the IRFU are constantly on telling us they have no money they go out and invest in a player that you think they want nothing to do with?

    The IRFU is a business, they wouldn't waste money just for the fun of it. They owe Zebo nothing and wouldn't put money into a player just for the hell of itl Zebo would of that options in France & England, its not like he has never played in the last couple of years.

    Farrell had to approve the move, the whole new Ireland camp of more relaxed etc will suit Zebo a lot better than the Joe camp when players had to study etc. Farrell worked with him before, so its not like the two of them don't know each other.

    Again. The IRFU pay a chunk of every provincial contract. There is no special deal for Zebo, the only thing that is unusual is that JVG felt the need to tell everyone they had done it on the cheap.


  • Options
    #6883
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    nerd69 wrote: »
    Wait the "disgusting" tweets hes been doing where just emojis?

    Yeah I'm curious about this. I don't remember anything bad at all but I don't follow twitter very closely.


  • Options
    #6884
    sebdavis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 891 ✭✭✭sebdavis


    Former Former Former wrote: »
    Again. The IRFU pay a chunk of every provincial contract. There is no special deal for Zebo, the only thing that is unusual is that JVG felt the need to tell everyone they had done it on the cheap.

    Ok you are right!!


  • Options
    #6885
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    thomond2006 wrote: »

    Half of the forum when Zebo scores the crucial try to win the RWC for Ireland.

    Jokes on you! Ireland will never win a world cup.


  • Options
    #6886
    Paul Smeenus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,470 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    phog wrote: »
    You think MR give a toss about what a few snowflakes here think? :pac:

    A few snowflakes on here? Absolutely not.

    https://www.otbsports.com/rugby/munster-jenkins-aherne-wood-1174973

    https://www.irishmirror.ie/sport/rugby-union/johann-van-graan-defends-munster-23821816

    https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/the-left-wing/do-they-not-have-rg-snyman-do-they-not-have-jean-kleyn-do-they-not-have-enough-there-40262999.html

    https://extra.ie/2021/03/31/sport/rugby/munster-defend-signing-jason-jenkins

    https://punditarena.com/rugby/eoin-harte/donncha-ocallaghan-criticises-munster-south-african-signing/

    https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/rugby/pro14/erasmus-too-many-imports-could-end-up-hurting-irish-40266803.html

    https://clarechampion.ie/horan-urges-munster-to-invest-in-local-talent-to-secure-provinces-future/

    https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/wood-slams-munsters-decision/

    https://www.the42.ie/the42-rugby-weekly-21-5398977-Apr2021/

    https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/south-african-lock-jason-jenkins-joins-munster-as-hanrahan-and-sweetnam-depart-1.4522817


  • Options
    #6887
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    nerd69 wrote: »
    Wait the "disgusting" tweets hes been doing where just emojis?

    It wasn't just emojis. Sending out tweets like this when we got stuffed by Wales...

    Zebnssssssssssssssssssssss.JPG

    Super classless stuff.


  • Options
    #6888
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    phog wrote: »
    You think MR give a toss about what a few snowflakes here think? :pac:

    A former Munster Press Officer used to go absolutely bananas about stuff written on Irish rugby forums. They're well aware of what is said online. The joke, as per usual, is on you.


  • Options
    #6889
    Jump_In_Jack
    Registered Users Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭Jump_In_Jack


    molloyjh wrote: »
    Zebo is a fine player with plenty of talent. A lot of the issues people have with him are based on or clouded by behaviours we've seen since he left. Before he left he put a load of effort in at Munster and Ireland. Think of his chase back on Larmour in Thomond. While he didn't prevent the try, he did break his backside getting into as good a position as he could have to do so. For Ireland he was stepping in at first receiver a fair bit too, utilising his strong passing game really well. There was very little complaint about his application there.

    Since then though, we have heard about him approaching Joe telling him that he didn't want to play the way that he was being told to. That's effectively telling a coach that you don't want to be picked. It's dumb. He has had a few incidents in the last few years where he has talked about how he feels hard done by not getting selected for Ireland, despite knowing he wouldn't when he was leaving. He has had a few incidents where he had reacted to Joe or Ireland not performing in ways that are at best daft. He has developed a bit of a rep for not being too bothered with the defensive side of the game over in Paris. He has put on a not so insignificant amount of weight too. Add all that to the numerous comments we've heard about him not being a great trainer, and he has managed to paint a really bad picture of himself in the last few years.

    He moved to Paris to play the way that he wanted to and get paid loads of money for it. More power to him. We all want a job that maximises the things we enjoy and minimises the things we don't while giving us loads of money for it. I have absolutely no issue with that at all. He now wants to come home and (presumably) see out his career in Ireland, where I'm sure he'll make the effort again. But he's still that guy that's quite self absorbed. He thought he was hilarious saying Leinster could offer him €5 million a year and he'd say no. But I wouldn't take him for €5. He's the polar opposite to what Leinster are under Cullen. A team first club where the group is more important than the individual.

    Zebo is the closest thing we have to a diva in Irish rugby. And while he is talented, he isn't someone I'd want in my team. He does get some unwarranted flack and I don't doubt he'll make Munster better and make the effort there to do so. Whether he gets a chance with Ireland is an interesting one. You'd imagine he wouldn't have been signed if he was out of the picture, but I can totally understand why there may be some bad blood there to a certain degree too. Apparently taking pleasure in their misfortune was incredibly poor form. And we have options in the back 3 now that mean he may not get a chance there. Time will tell...

    If only Joe Schmidt had listened we might have done better in the World Cup. Just saying.


  • Options
    #6890
    sebdavis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 891 ✭✭✭sebdavis


    Teferi wrote: »
    It wasn't just emojis. Sending out tweets like this when we got stuffed by Wales...

    Zebnssssssssssssssssssssss.JPG

    Super classless stuff.

    Im not a huge fan of Zebo but come on now. Hardly something terrible


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    #6891
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Teferi wrote: »
    It wasn't just emojis. Sending out tweets like this when we got stuffed by Wales...


    Super classless stuff.

    Context?


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    #6892
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    sebdavis wrote: »
    Im not a huge fan of Zebo but come on now. Hardly something terrible

    It's not just the one incident though - he's done stuff like that a few times, it's a pattern of really classless behaviour. It all adds up into someone I don't want to see play for Ireland.


  • Options
    #6893
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Context?

    We got stuffed by Wales.


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    #6894
    its_phil
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭its_phil


    sebdavis wrote: »
    Im not a huge fan of Zebo but come on now. Hardly something terrible

    Immediatley after when a defeat is raw to the players and management, it's fairly terrible from a guy who supposedly wants to still be your teammate.

    It's just a lack of class.


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    #6895
    nerd69
    Registered Users Posts: 10,091 ✭✭✭✭nerd69


    Teferi wrote: »
    It's not just the one incident though - he's done stuff like that a few times, it's a pattern of really classless behaviour. It all adds up into someone I don't want to see play for Ireland.

    Didn't you say disgusting? You'd want a lot more.thab that for disgusting


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    #6896
    The Inbetween is mine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    I hadn't seen the Paddy Power advert... that was very funny I must admit


  • Options
    #6897
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    nerd69 wrote: »
    Didn't you say disgusting? You'd want a lot more.thab that for disgusting

    I don't know what you're on about tbh.


  • Options
    #6898
    The Inbetween is mine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    Teferi wrote: »
    It's not just the one incident though - he's done stuff like that a few times, it's a pattern of really classless behaviour. It all adds up into someone I don't want to see play for Ireland.

    Those tweets are absolutely nothing, I'd be surprised if anyone in the Irish camp would give a toss about them...and anybody else's opinion is worthless tbh


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    #6899
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    The Inbetween is mine wrote: »
    Those tweets are absolutely nothing, I'd be surprised if anyone in the Irish camp would give a toss about them...and anybody else's opinion is worthless tbh

    To be clear, here is the timeline:

    Zebo tells Joe he doesn't want to play for him. (Fair play, it's your right to tell a coach that (even if it is the only coach you've won a significant medal with))

    Zebo takes a big pile of cash to go to France knowing there is a soft rule that you won't be selected for Ireland if you play abroad. (Again, fair play - it's a short career and you should leverage it as much as possible. I hope his bank account looks like scrooge mcduck's).

    So, after telling a coach he doesn't want to play for him AND knowing there is a soft rule in place knowing he won't get picked, he proceeds to spend the next 3 years whinging about not being selected in the media, sending tasteless tweets about Ireland losing and generally being happy when Ireland do badly etc.

    It's the overall context that matters lads, not one or two individual events.


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    #6900
    The Inbetween is mine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    He spent 3 years whinging? ....lads....mods wouldn't allow us discuss Zebo on here with regards to Ireland...and it wasn't because of his whinging....
    I've really got to wonder at the level of disdain shown towards Zebo throughout his career....it's not a good look


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    #6901
    theVersatile
    Registered Users Posts: 2,300 ✭✭✭theVersatile


    Teferi wrote: »
    A former Munster Press Officer used to go absolutely bananas about stuff written on Irish rugby forums. They're well aware of what is said online. The joke, as per usual, is on you.

    Source?
    Sig.png



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