Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580479#Comment_118580479

i don't think anybody will mind if we lose a game

Fair enough. Oh wait, there's more?

a loss tomorrow would be catastrophic.

<insert 'that escalated quickly' meme here>

Bogwoppit

Not sure where you’re getting that forecast but it’s going to be pretty windy by all accounts.

Bazzo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579878#Comment_118579878

He didn't just play for Blackrock underage. He played for Ballina too.

sydthebeat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118581075#Comment_118581075

I didnt say that though, did i.

Bazzo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118581081#Comment_118581081

I'll let you argue the semantics of it

sydthebeat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118581089#Comment_118581089

no need, theres no semantics involved.

no one is talking about mini rugby here

starkid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580957#Comment_118580957

i should clarify a game against a full strength side.

If anybody thinks losing tomorrow won't be a calamity they are delusional.

Tomorrow is a must win game. thats about the jist of it.

I think anything after that bar Italy people could accept. even a sneaky scottish win might just about be acceptable.

I'm bullish, i think we can win it outright. However if we somehow did lose tomorrow i'd be raging and i think it would be justified.

we have finished 3rd three years in a row. i think people can rightly criticise if its a fourth year.

Skyfloater

I had got the wind speeds off the met.ie which in fairness are showing 40km/h with gusts for tomorrow afternoon now. Even still that's a very strong wind to have to deal with.

Dubinusa

Fuckin hell! Wtf. Where do they come from? The boards will be lit up for the foreseeable future.

A 3rd place finish would not be catastrophic, imo. The evolution of our play is important and a year out from the world cup, it's time to improve our play and vary our structure. 4 years ago, we were a one style team with no other avenues to play. We got sodomized in the world cup.

I think we win our 3 home games and probably lose one of the away games. We could lose both away games, but if we are in the game and don't get horses, I think we'll be in a good place.

clsmooth

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580964#Comment_118580964

How much does the wind affect games in the Aviva considering it’s design?

bilston

I'd rather finish 3rs playing the way we did in the Autumn than finish 2nd playing boring one out Rugby based on ball retention like we did in the past.

In other words it isn't as simple as saying where we finish will dictate how we view our performance.

Plus we are away to both France (best team in the world at the moment perhaps?) and England who if they get forward dominance with Marcus Smith at out half could become a very very good side.

I wouldn't say defeat tomorrow would be catastrophic, in an era of Pandemic, Financial Crises, Climate Change and now a potential war in Europe, nothing in rugby can be viewed as catastrophic!

But admittedly it would be hugely disappointing and frankly quite a big blow to Ireland and Andy Farrell.

TRC10

3 home wins and being competitive away to France and England would be acceptable. Considering we got comprehensively beaten away to those two in 2020, going there and being competitive and being in with a shot at winning on 70 mins would be progress.

Picking up a win in Paris or London would be excellent. A Grand Slam with this years schedule would be an incredible achievement.

I just hope to see more of the same rugby we saw v Japan and NZ, while also developing our game further and drip feeding in some new players to improve our depth. I'd hope that if we've lost to both England and France and are out of the title race, we'll use the Scotland game to give someone else a start at 10 and rotate a bit.

sydthebeat

anything less than a 5 game TBP grand slam is not acceptable !!

Podge_irl

I will be very disappointed with anything less than 4 wins and I'll be absolutely gutted with a loss tomorrow - there should be no excuse for it.

Yeah_Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118576455#Comment_118576455

Just catching up on the last couple of days posts. An All Black has switched to Ireland?!? Who is that? Is he the first player to switch under the new regulations to strengthen tier 2 nations?

bilston

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118581944#Comment_118581944

Didn't you know that there are 5 million All Black's living in New Zealand?!

Talk about cheapening Jersey!

Braindead Gorilla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118579882#Comment_118579882

Funny you referring to my name. Do you think I was using it to refer to myself or you? Do you use your Boards name to refer to yourself? No I didn’t think so, it was to belittle others.

You want to utilise the academies? Fine good nobody is not getting a chance. But there are good enough foreign players. To exclude them on the basis in a 50-50 call that they are foreign is discrimination.

I’m not going to get into an argument on breaking the law for your own beliefs. But are you saying Farrell should?

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118581942#Comment_118581942

I can't say I'll be "very disappointed" if we don't win in London or Paris. England are a lot stronger than I think people are giving them credit for and winning in Paris was incredibly tough even when they were sh*te. Now they're the best team in the world.

We shouldn't fear going there and we should go and give it a right crack, but I won't be disappointed if we lose but are competitive.

I'd love to win a Championship and that's never a bad thing. But at the same time I'd be happy to go into a world cup year under the radar without a giant target on our backs.

Shehal

If we want to have a mindset of winning the RWC in 2023 then we have to aim to win the 5 games and be disappointed with anything less. Im not saying we should be expecting 5 wins but the target should always go for gold in these scenario's, the reality is we are good enough to win in Paris and London so the aim should be win those matches.

nerd69

Saying there can be no excuses before a game is played seems odd.

Interested Observer

I think we're more than capable of winning all 5 games but we have England and France away and those will be exceptionally tough games. How disappointed or otherwise I will be is pretty irrelevant but we should clearly be winning the 3 home games well imo. I think we should beat England, France is a great big who knows. If they play like they did against NZ and we play like we did against NZ then it'll be a hell of a game but very hard to know who the winner would be. I think France can probably hit an extra couple of % than us at the very top end. I think the manner of our performances is very important though.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582215#Comment_118582215

Why?

Wales are riddled with injuries, Ireland are not. Ireland were much better in the autumn. I suppose half the team could slip chasing the opening kick off and all get injured.

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582493#Comment_118582493

Or we could have a man red-carded after 13 minutes.

irelandrover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582493#Comment_118582493

Or loads could get covid before the game.

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582216#Comment_118582216

It's difficult but getting to a RWC SF never mind winning a RWC is also very difficult, what would prepare us better for this difficult situation than beating France and England in their own backyard, it shouldn't be a case of either win the 5 games or the 6N is a failure but the mindset needs to be win all the games. The reality is both matches are going to be one score games bar an anomaly with France and England being favourites due to being at home against us but that that gap can be overcome if we play better on the day.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582499#Comment_118582499

Well that will be our own fault

Violent Mediocrity

.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580139#Comment_118580139

The problem with your logic is that you applied it to the extreme end of the spectrum were one to follow it to its conclusion. (Surprise surprise). You say the relaxation of the 3 year rule further brought to its 100% application would result in a club team.

That doesn’t prove your point. By being on the side that protects Ireland from total representation from foreign players you are creating a set of circumstances which prioritises one set of people over another. Following that logic absolutely results in an entrenched ideology and that translates into the coaching and team management and makeup.

Ok for a bystander or partisan unaffiliated supporter but for someone designing a system or infrastructure for both the game and the wider aspects of what makes it great, and to make the playing field level between both sides, a different set of standards should apply. 

For example, if we want the international game to prosper we should encourage international travel and cross pollination both on and off the pitch not entrenchment. Rejection of the foreigner discourages that.  Some would argue that makes it more passionate and better but I would argue that would transfer into how people remain open minded to differences aesthetically and stylistically. 

Moreover, it prevents a viewpoint of seeing the legitimacy for a little of both arguments existing at the same time. That is, to have both foreign representation (if it is good enough) and to have majority (but not total representation) of Irish born players. 

As to the legitimacy of my arguments, it provides for diversity and cross pollination of skill sets, experiences, backgrounds, and encourages cooperation between countries and not complete lockdown in lack of acceptance and promotion of foreigners. By operating on the extreme end of the spectrum and seeing only one side of the argument absolutely, you remove leeway for both sides to exist in unison and together at the same time. So don’t follow logic even if it lands you on the side of the Irish people and nation and me on that of the foreigner, to its conclusion to win an argument. It is extremist, totalitarian and bigoted.

Dubinusa

I'd rather an Irish team being Irish! If that makes me a bigot..... so be it.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582143#Comment_118582143

I often think posts like this conflate “we” the team and “we” the fans.

There’s no doubt whatsoever that the team will be targeting 5 wins. But I don’t think it makes much of a difference what the fans think would be a reasonable outcome.

FlubberJones

Far too much over confidence in this thread, realistically things go wrong and the unexpected derails the best of gameplan..

Personally I would be looking forward to a good game, and I am, and even on paper you look the better team... but who knows.... 😁