Congratulations to our Minister for Justice, Helen McEntee!!

whippet

Invidious wrote: »

If she can't take maternity leave, why is her spokesperson stating that she will be going on maternity leave?

she is obviously making special arrangements to take leave of some description for the maternity period - but the fact remains that she has no automatic right to maternity leave like the rest of the working women in ireland.


It shows up a major anomaly in the law - which her pregnancy will hopefully expiate a resolution to it.

Invidious

whippet wrote: »

she is obviously making special arrangements to take leave of some description for the maternity period - but the fact remains that she has no automatic right to maternity leave like the rest of the working women in ireland.

And yet she's taking maternity leave regardless, which makes all your hand-waving seem a little bit pointless.

whippet

Invidious wrote: »

And yet she's taking maternity leave regardless, which makes all your hand-waving seem a little bit pointless.

No ... the fact still remains that there is no provision in law for maternity leave which in office

Invidious

whippet wrote: »

No ... the fact still remains that there is no provision in law for maternity leave which in office

And the fact also remains that the woman in question will be taking maternity leave regardless, as confirmed by her spokesperson. So there's no huge issue here to get worked up about.

whippet

Invidious wrote: »

And the fact also remains that the woman in question will be taking maternity leave regardless, as confirmed by her spokesperson. So there's no huge issue here to get worked up about.

And yet here you are getting all worked up about it.

If she is like most women, announcing a pregnancy, she is probably just entering her second trimester.

Which means most likely most of her time off will fall while the Dail is closed for the summer.

She probably planned it that way!

blanch152

Invidious wrote: »

And yet she's taking maternity leave regardless, which makes all your hand-waving seem a little bit pointless.

Are you suggesting that she shouldn't get maternity leave or that she shouldn't take it?

One of the biggest problems with the glass ceiling is that senior positions are not treated the same for maternity leave as more junior ones in the same organisation or elsewhere. Quite often, there is pressure on would-be mothers to step down or their career can be adversely affected.

We need to change this.

miamee

Invidious wrote: »

And the fact also remains that the woman in question will be taking maternity leave regardless, as confirmed by her spokesperson. So there's no huge issue here to get worked up about.

But will she be able to take a full 26 weeks as every other woman in Ireland is entitled to do after giving birth? That is the issue most are seeing here, that she is in a position where her right to maternity leave is not guaranteed, in fact she appears not to have any. I'd imagine that will be rectified at some stage in the not too distant future but it will be interesting to see if and when it happens.

Invidious

miamee wrote: »

But will she be able to take a full 26 weeks as every other woman in Ireland is entitled to do after giving birth?

I'm sure she'd be able to if she wanted to. Whether she will or not is up to her; the only thing we know at present is that she plans to be absent for an unspecified period of time.

That said, what you're saying here is very different to another poster, who was insinuating that she wouldn't be able to take any maternity leave at all.

blanch152

Invidious wrote: »

I'm sure she'd be able to if she wanted to. Whether she will or not is up to her; the only thing we know at present is that she plans to be absent for an unspecified period of time.

That said, what you're saying here is very different to another poster, who was insinuating that she wouldn't be able to take any maternity leave at all.

Are you suggesting that she should get out of bed after giving birth and just go back to work?

You seem to be insinuating something about her but I am not sure what.

Invidious

blanch152 wrote: »

Are you suggesting that she should get out of bed after giving birth and just go back to work?

Where have I suggested such a thing?

I corrected a poster who insinuated that a sitting minister would be unable to take any maternity leave, pointing out that she does indeed plan to take maternity leave. And that's completely fine with me.

AllForIt

Finally women have the right to have a baby.

Feisar

Wibbs wrote: »

While I consider McEntee a muppet on a few levels Whippet is 100% spot on. The fact that there isn't the provision of maternity leave for a minister is daft. Something I didn't know either. I assumed that laws around maternity leave would apply to all jobs and positions? It seems not.

If someone is employed on a contract basis do they get paternity leave, I would have presumed not?
Is a ministerial position regular employment? One gets elected by the people to represent them and then have a child during the period. Unlike sickness which obviously isn't a choice is having a child during a time when an elected representative fair? Then there is the ministerial position, does a political party operate like a normal employer?

whippet

Invidious wrote: »

Where have I suggested such a thing?

I corrected a poster who insinuated that a sitting minister would be unable to take any maternity leave, pointing out that she does indeed plan to take maternity leave. And that's completely fine with me.

I pointed out that there is no provision in irish law for a sitting minister to take maternity leave. You want to twist this in a different way. You have stated that this isn't a newsworthy item - i disagreed and gave my reason.

She is obviously able to make a personal arrangement with her employers to facilitate extended time off to care for her new born .... however the newsworthness of the item is still there - she has no statutory entitlement to maternity leave.

whippet

Feisar wrote: »

Is a ministerial position regular employment

yes - it is salaried and normal PRSI, PAYE is paid on the employment.

biko

A tweet that became news that became a thread.
The Irish Sun eat your heart out..

Feisar

whippet wrote: »

yes - it is salaried and normal PRSI, PAYE is paid on the employment.

Cheers, I'm not trying to come across as a dick on the topic.

Topgear on Dave

Good interview with Lisa Chambers on RTE now discussing this.

General gist : Politics is very competitive and somewhat similar to self employment, it's not realistic to take 6 months out (although you can). You won't be re-elected next time round.

markodaly

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Good interview with Lisa Chambers on RTE now discussing this.

General gist : Politics is very competitive and somewhat similar to self employment, it's not realistic to take 6 months out (although you can). You won't be re-elected next time round.

Has it been revealed by Helen McEntee what type of leave she is taking?
If not, then perhaps best leave the speculation to the bots on Twitter.

Geuze

Feisar wrote: »

If someone is employed on a contract basis do they get paternity leave, I would have presumed not?
Is a ministerial position regular employment? One gets elected by the people to represent them and then have a child during the period. Unlike sickness which obviously isn't a choice is having a child during a time when an elected representative fair? Then there is the ministerial position, does a political party operate like a normal employer?

The political party is not the employer.

The Oireachtas is the employer.

bobbysands81

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Good interview with Lisa Chambers on RTE now discussing this.

General gist : Politics is very competitive and somewhat similar to self employment, it's not realistic to take 6 months out (although you can). You won't be re-elected next time round.

Not true in Helen’s sense as, being a Minister, she has a constituency office full of staff that are paid by the State to work on her behalf to serve her constituency needs as well as a plethora of advisors on a savage wage. This work has huge amounts of visibility and will continue whether she is working or not.

It could be argued that any Minister that fails to get re-elected, having access to these supports designed to get them re-elected so they can concentrate on matters of the State, is incompetent in the first place.

blanch152

whippet wrote: »

Wow ... do some people really think like that in 2020?

Yes, these boards are full of that sort of thing.

Topgear on Dave

markodaly wrote: »

Has it been revealed by Helen McEntee what type of leave she is taking?
If not, then perhaps best leave the speculation to the bots on Twitter.

Not really what I was trying to do with that post but I am cynical about the nature of Ireland's local politics.

Good luck to her and I hope all goes well.

arctictree

whippet wrote: »

yes - it is salaried and normal PRSI, PAYE is paid on the employment.

But there is no security of employment. I doubt if a politician could bring their employer (the oireachtas) to the EAT for unfair dismissal after 4 years!
Lets face it, its not a normal job. Its not contracting either.

Junkyard Tom

If, by some cosmic anomaly, humanity awoke tomorrow and it was men who got pregnant then, within months, there'd the great universal paternity leave, vending machines with the morning after pill, abortion on demand, creches in most pubs and so on.

JP Liz V1

Apparently tested positive for Covid19, hope she and baby and family will be ok

biko

Oh crap, hope it won't be a problem for her.

markodaly

biko wrote: »

Oh crap, hope it won't be a problem for her.

Well, thankfully they have sorted this out and come to some arrangement.
https://www.thejournal.ie/helen-mcentee-maternity-leave-2-5378276-Mar2021/

But as usual, the some comments on Social Media and online are of the usual low-level sexist type.

UDAWINNER

Its hard to believe thats it has taken until 2021 for this to be an Issue in Ireland. Really shows how backward we are in Ireland that a women has not been in this position ages ago.

Quantum Erasure

just 10 days behind the UK...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/02/suella-braverman-becomes-first-cabinet-minister-take-paid-maternity/