Eirgrid warns of power outages

crossmolinalad

suicide_circus wrote: »

Build a nuclear plant and stop relying on dirty fossil fuels and unreliable renewables

And what about the nuclear waste???

ted1

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Exactly how many of us in Ireland are able to work/learn/communicate remotely this year due to Covid because there is datacenter capacity being bought up by Zoom, Amazon, Microsoft to handle all those video calls and all the other infrastructure needed for remote work.

You swear some posters want us all go back to farming potatoes (and not even the kind that can make chips :P )


Anyways going back to interconnectors, longest one is NorNed at 360 miles for 700MW at cost of 600 million
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NorNed

Distance from Norway to Ireland is 3-4x longer (Assuming the Brits play ball now...)



Thats not including then connections that will be needed to cross the country from Sligo lets say (look at the trouble Eirgrid having building north south interconnector with no one wanting powerlines in their area)

You then approach the price of a nuclear plant just for an electric pipe that doesnt actually produce power and actually loses a good chunk over this distance because physics, and puts us at mercy of Norwegians and the Brits

Why are you going from Norway?
The Celtic interconnecter is going France -Ireland
Green link is going wakes- Wexford/Waterford
We already have the EWIC and Moyle

jetfiremuck

They could repurpose it to operate as an incinerator to electric . I know it would take money ,however considering that a facility like this would never get planning today, it would ensure employment etc going forward.

l

Look at Covanta and the objections there..............now operating and all forgotten about.

Mongfinder General

crossmolinalad wrote: »

And what about the nuclear waste???

Nuclear Energy - Our misunderstood friend. Here is a short educational video on how nuclear waste is dealt with. I’m sure that it will put your mind at ease.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aVPCTzTe-84

Stovepipe

it will be French nuclear power via the Celtic interconnector that is in planning right now.[/QUOTE]

Absolutely spot on. When you switch on the kettle at the ad break, the UK grid loans us power, literally for about 20 minutes at a time and they in turn get power from the French grid. So,your kettle has been boiled by nuclear power, regardless of what the ads might claim. The grid operators have it down to a fine art and can chop and change power demand at very short notice. They don't need to have all the local power stations running powerplants on standby all night. If we had a nuclear power plant of our own, we could cope with our own peak demand and loan power to the UK grid in turn. Apart from that,industrial gas turbines, running on natural gas are very efficient and their exhaust gases can be scrubbed clean of most of the toxins.

Stovepipe

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

We can't really continue as is though, so something needs to change, if we carry on at the rate we're going there'll be nothing left of the earth in a few years.
So much power and consumption of resources is wasted on crap that we don't need.

Well, instead of constantly lashing the West for polluting the planet, they might have a go at China for burning millions of tons of coal, Indonesia and Brazil for happily destroying their own rain forests and India and Pakistan for chopping up ships on beachs and polluting their own marine environment, on top of allowing millions of tons of untreated sewage flow into the sea. It isnt always the West's fault.

ted1

jetfiremuck wrote: »

They could repurpose it to operate as an incinerator to electric . I know it would take money ,however considering that a facility like this would never get planning today, it would ensure employment etc going forward.

l

Look at Covanta and the objections there..............now operating and all forgotten about.

They’d need to level it. As the technology is vastly different. Also The Covanto plant works because it’s in Dublin where the fuels is. Trucking hundreds of trucks a week to the midlands isn’t feasible.

Hamsterchops

suicide_circus wrote: »

Build a nuclear plant and stop relying on dirty fossil fuels and unreliable renewables

Apparently even a small reactor like those found in a nuclear submarine would have more than enough power for the entire country!

We should get one.

Akrasia

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

You are missing the point, nuclear power is a bridge to

1. immediately stop using fossil fuels

2. buy time (2-3 decades) for renewables (wind, pv) and grids to improve which they are but at this rate it be decades


Compare that to the cost of continuing to burn fossil fuels while renewables have not caught up.

edit: While the rest are talking about going green the French are using above approach and growing their renewables now, and actually are the greenest country in europe.

Eh, it would take a decade minimum to design build and commission a nuclear power station in Ireland, it’s far from an immediate solution even if there was the political will do do it immediately (which there isn’t)

In 10 years time, battery technology will have improved with Solid state batteries offering the potential of an exponential improvement in capacity and lifespan while using much cheaper materials. (First commercial Production is due to start in 2024) https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20201208005250/en/QuantumScape-Releases-Performance-Data-for-its-Solid-State-Battery-Technology

At the same time, solar PV is dropping in price and improving in efficiency and we will have finished many offshore wind farms currently in development.

A nuclear plant could well be obsolete before it gets turned on

timmyntc

Akrasia wrote: »

Eh, it would take a decade minimum to design build and commission a nuclear power station in Ireland, it’s far from an immediate solution even if there was the political will do do it immediately (which there isn’t)

In 10 years time, battery technology will have improved with Solid state batteries offering the potential of an exponential improvement in capacity and lifespan while using much cheaper materials. (First commercial Production is due to start in 2024) https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20201208005250/en/QuantumScape-Releases-Performance-Data-for-its-Solid-State-Battery-Technology

At the same time, solar PV is dropping in price and improving in efficiency and we will have finished many offshore wind farms currently in development.

A nuclear plant could well be obsolete before it gets turned on

We are always going to need baseload generation from something other than wind/solar. There can be days at a time with little to no wind or solar generation - completely infeasible to have enough storage to cover that either.

The alternative is to import power in those situations - leaves us very dependent on others for energy security, and as most of Europe moves towards more renewables, expect similar things to happen there too.

A lack of forward planning here in Ireland will leave us increasingly less energy-secure in the future. Nuclear & LNG are definitely worth investing in long term.

beachhead

Royal Legend wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/1211/1183760-eirgrid-warning-outages/

So we are shutting two Peat Power Stations in the next week, Brexit is looming and lo and behold now Eirgrid are projecting that power outages may happen if there is not enough wind to drive the turbines.
Am I missing something here in regards to the future planning of electricity demand in our country, now that we have Electric Post office vans and Electric Bin trucks to come, how exactly are we going to cope?

Warnings about power outages are not new.We have an expanding economy thanks to yankee data centres these days which has acclerated power consumption.Power capacity would not be a problem even it wasn't for the green gougers in the '70s blocking a nuclear power plant construction in Wexford.

KevRossi

suicide_circus wrote: »

Build a nuclear plant and stop relying on dirty fossil fuels and unreliable renewables

Not going to happen for very obvious reasons so strike that one off.

Topgear on Dave

Its a fight to get apartments built above 4 or 5 stories in Dublin City centre (despite a housing crisis) and some of you guys want to build a nuclear power plant.

Lads, do you know this country at all :pac::D

screamer

Meanwhile lets build some more data centres.
this really is Ireland all out, no foresight, planning, fallback plans. make a decision without thinking through the consequences and spend an age and fortune trying ti remedy it.

Atlantic Dawn

We are not even anywhere near 5% of cars on the road being electric and the power infrastructure is collapsing, the government should start giving grants to petrol cars until the mess is sorted.

whisky_galore

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

We are not even anywhere near 5% of cars on the road being electric and the power infrastructure is collapsing, the government should start giving grants to petrol cars until the mess is sorted.

This.
Everything to be "clean energy" and "green".
An electric car in every garage.

Nothing but greenwashing rhetoric, fairytales of offshore wave energy and the windmills that nobody wants spoiling their views.

shesty

beachhead wrote: »

Warnings about power outages are not new.We have an expanding economy thanks to yankee data centres these days which has acclerated power consumption.Power capacity would not be a problem even it wasn't for the green gougers in the '70s blocking a nuclear power plant construction in Wexford.

This right here.
Data centres are huge users of electrictiy.
As for nuclear, we are not socially advanced enough as a society in this country to take on the responsibility of nuclear plants.

Jinglejangle69

Green party are a bunch of little ego driven entitled kids voted in by the same student types so far removed from three real world.

Think they know better than all of us plebs just trying to do a days work.

The fact we're closing down plants and our demand is just about been met says it all.

Jinglejangle69

ted1 wrote: »

They have it.

No they don't.

Two hospitals I work in lost power this year.

Generators had to take over.

Bonniedog

According to experts, this state is facing into a major energy crisis, due to the coming together of several factors:

(a) the closure of the Corrib field by 2030 (Greens managed to stop all licensing for any further exploration)

(b) possible threats to gas from Scotland on foot of a hard Brexit and EU deciding it is not "secure" or some such bollox; and

(c) Whether the state is allowed construct a connector to France which has been awaiting our overlord's approval in Brussels for a good while now.

Greens closing fossil fuel exploration off shore, while at same time being seen to be main movers in destroying the peat generating stations, says it all. We all know from 2007 - 2011 that they are incompetent fanatics. Their real triumph is forcing that on the other parties depsite only winning 7%.

Sharknose

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Thats just plain wrong

I posted earlier link to eirgrid showing peak usage around 7,000 MW

Largest submarine nuclear reactor in US Ohio class subs is 220 MW
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio-class_submarine

Ohio Class Submarine

Propulsion:
1× S8G PWR nuclear reactor[1]
2× geared turbines; 35,000 shp (26 MW)[1]

Marcos

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

No they don't.

Two hospitals I work in lost power this year.

Generators had to take over.

That is scary.

Eric Cartman

Its either nuclear of fossil fuels, theres no real alternative. This is the greens silly agenda at work, and you know well theyll use it as an excuse to increase electricity costs.

The greens want everyone cycling from their government built apartment to their jobs.

The Continental Op

Marcos wrote: »

That is scary.

I'm fairly sure the power generators and ESB Networks know what circuits Hospitals are on and make sure they are the very last to go off.

ED E

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Two hospitals I work in lost power this year.

We didnt brown out though. Power losses were very likely due to events on the network. Medical devices have BBUs to cover the time between utility loss and gen spin up. Its not ideal but its not a catastrophe either.

Eric Cartman

shesty wrote: »

This right here.
Data centres are huge users of electrictiy.
As for nuclear, we are not socially advanced enough as a society in this country to take on the responsibility of nuclear plants.

We are as long as they arent run by the government. A state run nuclear plant would be a disaster

ED E

BTW the biggest threat to our grid is often a certain group trying to steal copper like happened in Dublin in 2016 causing a large explosion. Also impacts the phone network.

ED E

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We are as long as they arent run by the government. A state run nuclear plant would be a disaster

All nuclear would be a disaster, they're nearly all wayyy over budget all over europe. If you think the NCH is bad a plant of three small reactors would be orders of magnitude worse.

shesty

Would a private one be any better though?
The wink and the nudge culture we have just makes me think we have a long way to go before we could seriously consider ourselves grown up enough to take on nuclear power.I mean the carnage over getting a site and permission to construct it alone would be ridiculous.Look at the fighting that went on over Eirgrid's plans to run lines to the North and West, to their Interconnector and to the development of Corrib, and the new children's hospital.I mean at one point I had leaflets in the door of my house listing 10 points for the cable not to be built and included claims like the Interconnector cable would give us all cancer, or it wasn't buried deep enough so there was danger to local farmers ploughing their fields and hitting it (when it mainly runs under the main street of the town so I fail to see how this is an issue...). I just don't see how would ever achieve building a nuclear station, let alone run it.

Eric Cartman

ED E wrote: »

All nuclear would be a disaster, they're nearly all wayyy over budget all over europe. If you think the NCH is bad a plant of three small reactors would be orders of magnitude worse.

Not all nuclear, some gas, some hydro, some interconnector, some wind, but building a 2-4 reactor site in the midlands to supply half our energy needs built and run privately would be ideal