Trump v Biden 2020,The insurrection (pt 6) Read OP

Overheal

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Why would he need to be pulled out? Leave him there, Biden would still be president.

They’re disinfecting the whole place with sunlight and bleach that morning though:

https://twitter.com/thedailybeast/status/1336890621831864320?s=21

Christy42

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Trump has the backing and authority now to mobilise others to do the destruction for him. He’s got nothing to lose in his mind the democrats did a witch hunt against him for 4 years and he may seek revenge. Trump can flip the revenge switch on at any time and things will become chaotic. Trump state of mind will decide the future course of America here.

You only need to see the look of some of the people in the crowd yesterday who are just a step away from shooting at people who support biden.. In their minds the democrats are threat to the Republic. This is scary stuff that people should be mindful of here. Maybe i am more concerned than i should be, and Trump and his armed supporters willl fade away we’ll see.

I’m left leaning outlook kind of person and side more with democrats views i think? Some policies of theres over the years have being worrying. Thats for another time

A court case won't stop that. They have been in court and got nothing. You have 0 evidence that your random show trial will make Trump accept the result after they haven't accepted the previous 50. Finally the case the supreme Court didn't see didn't even make an allegation of fraud. No one has tried to show the supreme court any fraud so how could they have stopped it?

PropJoe10

namloc1980 wrote: »

Another loss for Trump, this time in the Georgia Supreme Court. This is getting beyond ridiculous at this stage.

.

He's achieving what he set out to do. Make it look like he's fighting the "good fight", keep his base riled up, and raise millions to pay off his campaign debts in the process. Plus, he's already undermining Biden's presidency. Whatever you say about Trump - he may be an idiot, but he knows exactly how to keep his idiot base engaged.

PropJoe10

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

If you not recognized this a unique situation. President declining to leave office that’s opens the door for the military to remove him. Why do you think happens if he declines to go? That’s why i think there should be a unique court event to air this out before its too late. Just hope Trump accepts defeat here, because if he refuses to open the doors to Biden in Jan things will get chaotic.

I understand where you're trying to go with that, but that's not how the justice system works at all. Cases will be assessed on merit - and the fact that Trump has now lost 59 out of 60 lawsuits will tell you a lot about the merits of what he's trying to do.

HalloweenJack

At one point can the Trump team be declared vexatious litigants?

PropJoe10

HalloweenJack wrote: »

At one point can the Trump team be declared vexatious litigants?

Was only talking about that here earlier. Surely it has to get to a point where they're entirely wasting court time and resources. I also read somewhere that they're now declining to pay somewhere for their requested recount. Truly the best people.

Cheerful Spring2

PropJoe10 wrote: »

I understand where you're trying to go with that, but that's not how the justice system works at all. Cases will be assessed on merit - and the fact that Trump has now lost 59 out of 60 lawsuits will tell you a lot about the merits of what he's trying to do.

I understand that. We have to see matters for what they are right now on both sides.

It be a an event broadcast on Fox News so his allies and defenders will follow the rebuttals, the replies from the lawyers, and see the actual weaknesses with the fraud process. Trump on his own not an actual threat, there's 71 million people who voted for him. Right now, lot of them think there some plot and treason involved to stop the fraud being reported. The argument being established for them in their own brains whether or not you like! There not following the court cases Trump losing as there not shown on TV.

Many right now see it Trump just a nuisance, but it can get very scary if that loyal support for Trump takes up arms to keep their guy in power. Its a scenario that may or not occur obviously, but i think Trump claims do need to be torn apart in court in front of everyone for it to calm down. Maybe i am wrong in thinking that. The best case scenario here Trump just goes in Jan without hassle and this will be a distance memory in time.

Overheal

They’ve already been torn down though. That’s the problem. It’s now to the point where anyone still left in disbelief does so at their own religion. There is no longer anything else for the law or the facts to do for them, they will never accept it even if we give the matter 10 years. Like being convinced Hillary is a criminal and an indictment is just around the corner every week.

PropJoe10

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

I understand that. We have to see matters for what they are right now on both sides.

It be a an event broadcast on Fox News so his allies and defenders will follow the rebuttals, the replies from the lawyers, and see the actual weaknesses with the fraud process. Trump on his own not an actual threat, there's 71 million people who voted for him. Right now, lot of them think there some plot and treason involved to stop the fraud being reported. The argument being established for them in their own brains whether or not you like! There not following the court cases Trump losing as there not shown on TV.

Many right now see it Trump just a nuisance, but it can get very scary if that loyal support for Trump takes up arms to keep their guy in power. Its a scenario that may or not occur obviously, but i think Trump claims do need to be torn apart in court in front of everyone for it to calm down. Maybe i am wrong in thinking that. The best case scenario here Trump just goes in Jan without hassle and this will be a distance memory in time.

Again, I understand where you're trying to go there, but there's nothing at all that could persuade Trump supporters that he's talking crap, in any context. They are beyond any sort of redemption.

Sure his "lawyers" haven't even argued fraud in court. It's only him spouting nonsense about that on Twitter. If there was a court case to demonstrate that he is in fact full of sh!t, then his supporters would just claim that it's been staged by the left and that the judges are part of the "deep state". That's where we are now, and it's hard to see any way back from it.

everlast75

https://twitter.com/KlasfeldReports/status/1338169306199314434?s=19

The embarrassment...

salmocab

It wouldn’t matter if this went to the SC Trump wouldn’t accept the finding and his supporters will believe what he says, Rudi could hand count himself say Biden won and still they wouldn’t accept it.

ohnonotgmail

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

I understand that. We have to see matters for what they are right now on both sides.

It be a an event broadcast on Fox News so his allies and defenders will follow the rebuttals, the replies from the lawyers, and see the actual weaknesses with the fraud process. Trump on his own not an actual threat, there's 71 million people who voted for him. Right now, lot of them think there some plot and treason involved to stop the fraud being reported. The argument being established for them in their own brains whether or not you like! There not following the court cases Trump losing as there not shown on TV.

Many right now see it Trump just a nuisance, but it can get very scary if that loyal support for Trump takes up arms to keep their guy in power. Its a scenario that may or not occur obviously, but i think Trump claims do need to be torn apart in court in front of everyone for it to calm down. Maybe i am wrong in thinking that. The best case scenario here Trump just goes in Jan without hassle and this will be a distance memory in time.

every piece of evidence thats trumps lawyers have presented and judges have adjudicated on has been done publicly. you seem to keep ignoring that. None of their losses so far (and there have been a LOT, 59 at the last count) have made one bit of difference to trumps position that the election was stolen. Your show trial will similarly have no effect except to make trump feel that his claims have legitimacy. they dont.

namloc1980

everlast75 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/KlasfeldReports/status/1338169306199314434?s=19

The embarrassment...

They don't care. MAGA devotees lie like the rest of us breathe air.

What.Now

Overheal wrote: »

They’re disinfecting the whole place with sunlight and bleach that morning though:

https://twitter.com/thedailybeast/status/1336890621831864320?s=21

I want to see that. Teams of cleaners in white coats going in with bleach in their
hands.

Cheerful Spring2

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

I understand that. We have to see matters for what they are right now on both sides.

It be a an event broadcast on Fox News so his allies and defenders will follow the rebuttals, the replies from the lawyers, and see the actual weaknesses with the fraud process. Trump on his own not an actual threat, there's 71 million people who voted for him. Right now, lot of them think there some plot and treason involved to stop the fraud being reported. The argument being established for them in their own brains whether or not you like! There not following the court cases Trump losing as there not shown on TV.

Many right now see it Trump just a nuisance, but it can get very scary if that loyal support for Trump takes up arms to keep their guy in power. Its a scenario that may or not occur obviously, but i think Trump claims do need to be torn apart in court in front of everyone for it to calm down. Maybe i am wrong in thinking that. The best case scenario here Trump just goes in Jan without hassle and this will be a distance memory in time.

Let's be realistic, if they weren't dismissed and presented fully. The Trump crowd would still believe there was fraud, they'd probably believe it to be more credible if anything. Giving it more air time does not help.

Overheal

namloc1980 wrote: »

They don't care. MAGA devotees lie like the rest of us breathe air.

[citation needed]

ohnonotgmail

Overheal wrote: »

[citation needed]

they also never specified what orifice they breathe it through.

Leroy42

CS2, you seem to be under the mistaken impression that the court cases were thrown out without any review of what was presented, I assume by biased judges.

That is certainly the story that Trump wants you to believe. But each case was given court time, the plaintiff was given the ability to present the evidence to back up their claim. In 59 out of 60 they failed to meet even the most basic level.

You know the joke that every con in prison claims that the attorney/judge/court screwed them? This is exactly the same.

THere entire 'reason' (it isn't evidence) is that it just seems wrong. That they thought earlier in the night they had won so that must be true. Or that normally when person wins State A & B they normally win. (even that has been shown to be false).

They don't have any actual evidence. It is akin to going to court to say that things just aren't fair.

eagle eye

PropJoe10 wrote:

Again, I understand where you're trying to go there, but there's nothing at all that could persuade Trump supporters that he's talking crap, in any context. They are beyond any sort of redemption.

I don't agree with this unless you are talking about the present as in right now.
It just takes a good sell to get them to talk and then go easy on them and be friendly and respectful. If you get them to the point where they say that you are not a bad guy then you can bring them out of the mire over time.

Cheerful Spring2

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

every piece of evidence thats trumps lawyers have presented and judges have adjudicated on has been done publicly. you seem to keep ignoring that. None of their losses so far (and there have been a LOT, 59 at the last count) have made one bit of difference to trumps position that the election was stolen. Your show trial will similarly have no effect except to make trump feel that his claims have legitimacy. they dont.

I playing devil's advocate here and peer at events from all angles and if i was testifying for Trump i would be looking into the issues discussed below more closely.

Statistical, the democrats managed to lose seats during the 2020 election!

Unusual in a way, the mail in voters neglected to tick the voting boxes for the democrat candidates along with Biden. Is this evidence many of the voters are not actual democrats and did not give an actual crap about the party? Was it a just an individual who despised Trump who signed a ballot?. Nobody knows and not discussed yet. You would think the mail in votes would be overwhelming democrat on the page though, but did not occurr and thats odd factor to be considered here when looking at these mail votes that swung the swing states for Biden.

Not entirely true either, this election had no reported issues. Accepted the evidence not big enough at this stage to overturn the election

We know in an important Swing state area the voting machine acted up and the software switched many thousands of votes to Biden that were belonging to Trump. This is claimed to be just a human error due to an uploading of software later. Why would anyone be uploading a new software program on election day? Software should be certified and be in place months and be uploaded days before the election day surely?. It very strange reporting here least for me a human error occurred during the counting process. The fact the later found the error in the software does not mean it could not have happened somewhere else and escaped detection.

Trump main argument is the election mail in votes were not counted on election day. Counted stopped for a number of hours that night, and when it resumed heading into Wednesday, The new ballots counted by dominion tabulation system put Biden ahead. If there is errors and fraud you have to manually check the software of the voting machines., For as i know the judges have not granted Trump team access to this election software to be checked. In a way it is false to claim the judges have all the information and Trump has too.

Cheerful Spring2

Deleted User wrote: »

Let's be realistic, if they weren't dismissed and presented fully. The Trump crowd would still believe there was fraud, they'd probably believe it to be more credible if anything. Giving it more air time does not help.

We had years of lengthy arguments, senate/court hearings, tv news discussions about Russia gate, tampering with elections by foreign actors and Ukraine. Now the other side not interested in holding a trial where red states, Trump, and republicans dispute the election result. That’s amusing to me. If you want to show Trump allegations are fruitless you shred the arguments inside a court where everyone can see it taking place.

Overheal

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

We had years of lengthy arguments, senate/court hearings, tv news discussions about Russia gate, tampering with elections by foreign actors and Ukraine...

...none of which involved not inaugurating the President.

Cheerful Spring2

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

We had years of lengthy arguments, senate/court hearings, tv news discussions about Russia gate, tampering with elections by foreign actors and Ukraine. Now the other side not interested in holding a trial where red states, Trump, and republicans dispute the election result. That’s amusing to me. If you want to show Trump allegations are fruitless you shred the arguments inside a court where everyone can see it taking place.

The courts reviewed the files and judged there was no case to answer. There is no case to answer.

"There was election fraud and the proof is Florida and Ohio have never both voted for the loser"

Apart from 1960

"We were winning at 2am but lost - proof of fraud"

Winning the votes counted at 2am. In places where republicans did not permit postal votes to be processed in advance.

These are the best arguments presented. The rest is pure nonsense and has been in front of about 60 judges so far. That looks likely every opportunity has been given to advance their case. The truth is there is no case

Smee_Again

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

If you want to show Trump allegations are fruitless you shred the arguments inside a court where everyone can see it taking place.

This is exactly what happened though, Trump's team of lawyers went to court and in all cases except 1 lost, sometimes in front of judges appointed by Trump.

You seem to be calling for some sort of a reverse show trial initiated by the plaintiff and not the state just to placate Trump's supporters who, lets be honest here, won't pay attention, understand or believe in the detail anyway.

Besides, show trials are not exactly good for democracy.

Also they create a precedence for ridiculous cases to not be dismissed.

everlast75

Smee_Again wrote: »

This is exactly what happened though, Trump's team of lawyers went to court and in all cases except 1 lost, sometimes in front of judges appointed by Trump.

You seem to be calling for some sort of a reverse show trial initiated by the plaintiff and not the state just to placate Trump's supporters who, lets be honest here, won't pay attention, understand or believe in the detail anyway.

Besides, show trials are not exactly good for democracy.

I've searched through the last number of pages for a decent point to all this protestation and there is none.

Trump et al got dumped on by every judge, appointee of Trump and not.

The SCOTUS is not obligated to take every case anyone wants it to. That's why there is the petition to *ask* it if it thinks the case is worthy of hearing.

It said it is not worth hearing. To be clear, *THREE* of Trump's appointees said **** off.

Now, if your case has been bounced out of 50 odd Court rooms, what makes you think that

A) SCOTUS should hear it and
Your case has any merit whatsoever and would win, even if it was heard.

That's some grade A counter-fact delusional nonsense right there.

No one else is buying this conspiratorial Uncle Vinny court room nonsense. Move on to ****.

ohnonotgmail

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

I playing devil's advocate here and peer at events from all angles and if i was testifying for Trump i would be looking into the issues discussed below more closely.

Statistical, the democrats managed to lose seats during the 2020 election!

Unusual in a way, the mail in voters neglected to tick the voting boxes for the democrat candidates along with Biden. Is this evidence many of the voters are not actual democrats and did not give an actual crap about the party? Was it a just an individual who despised Trump who signed a ballot?. Nobody knows and not discussed yet. You would think the mail in votes would be overwhelming democrat on the page though, but did not occurr and thats odd factor to be considered here when looking at these mail votes that swung the swing states for Biden.

Not entirely true either, this election had no reported issues. Accepted the evidence not big enough at this stage to overturn the election

We know in an important Swing state area the voting machine acted up and the software switched many thousands of votes to Biden that were belonging to Trump. This is claimed to be just a human error due to an uploading of software later. Why would anyone be uploading a new software program on election day? Software should be certified and be in place months and be uploaded days before the election day surely?. It very strange reporting here least for me a human error occurred during the counting process. The fact the later found the error in the software does not mean it could not have happened somewhere else and escaped detection.

Trump main argument is the election mail in votes were not counted on election day. Counted stopped for a number of hours that night, and when it resumed heading into Wednesday, The new ballots counted by dominion tabulation system put Biden ahead. If there is errors and fraud you have to manually check the software of the voting machines., For as i know the judges have not granted Trump team access to this election software to be checked. In a way it is false to claim the judges have all the information and Trump has too.

no, it isn't. You are just adding nonsense to the nonsense you spouted yesterday. You have said nothing new. none of your posts have added to the discussion.

astrofool

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

We had years of lengthy arguments, senate/court hearings, tv news discussions about Russia gate, tampering with elections by foreign actors and Ukraine. Now the other side not interested in holding a trial where red states, Trump, and republicans dispute the election result. That’s amusing to me. If you want to show Trump allegations are fruitless you shred the arguments inside a court where everyone can see it taking place.

To go to trial you need evidence, they have not shown any evidence, so their cases have not been able to go to trial.

Do you understand what is required to be able to go to trial? (serious question, as you just seem to be repeating a broken understanding of how the justice system works, over and over again, despite everyone telling you how it works, and there being many books on the subject explaining this).

In the cases with Russian interference, there was lots of evidence available, so they went to trial, lots of people have been convicted of a crime based on that evidence.

You are being led like a sheep by the trump administration.

Tony EH

Some people on here seem to believe that one can simply make any old spurious claim and take to court. Even to the highest court in the land. To call that naive is putting very politely indeed.

The fact of the matter is that Trump and his entourage have absolutely nothing to qualify as a case and, furthermore, the courts system over there have been extremely patient with their nonsense in that regard. As they have shown themselves to be little more than time wasting exercises.

Gunmonkey

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

We had years of lengthy arguments, senate/court hearings, tv news discussions about Russia gate, tampering with elections by foreign actors and Ukraine. Now the other side not interested in holding a trial where red states, Trump, and republicans dispute the election result. That’s amusing to me. If you want to show Trump allegations are fruitless you shred the arguments inside a court where everyone can see it taking place.

Kind of like the 59 court cases that have been thrown out/ruled against Trump over the past month and a bit, you mean? Because I remember (and I'm sure others do too) watching Rudys "star witness" slurring her way through a hearing giving "evidence".

But a case in front of the SCOTUS is pointless now as they have shown that the Trump appointees wont break ranks and support Trump 100% because he gave them the jobs. Now they are "traitors" and member of the "deep state" with no "loyalty to Trump"