Pornhub

GreeBo

GreeBo wrote: »

PornHub weren't working with anyone who was producing anything you mentioned, the issue was user uploaded content, which they removed days before the cc companies withdrew their services.

If they were profiting from dodgy content, they're responsible. They're making it available.

Galwayguy35

Watched Pornhub now and again, I don't doubt the stuff was there but most people including myself wouldn't know it until this came to light because they don't go looking for rape videos.

Sounds like they cleaned the site up now so its probably the best one out there now.

Only a fool would pay for porn with all the free stuff these days.

km991148

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

If they were profiting from dodgy content, they're responsible. They're making it available.

I'm not sure (and too lazy to Google) but how did the user content work? Was it like YouTube model where you would make so much back in ad revenue?

Pauliedragon

Eric Cartman wrote: »

The entire porn industry is definitely rife with exploitation of women, sadly many are now of the view that stuff like onlyfans is any better, its still damaged women and girls trading flesh for money, how much that company profits off making young women believe its a harmless way to make money is sick. We’re definitely going to end up with a lot of suicides in future from women who are in their late teens and 20s now who believe this wont damage them mentally or in future career/ partner prospects.

It wasn't that long ago we had a vote and the people voted. My body, my choice was the slogan. If a woman wants to sell herself for money good luck to her as long as it's consensual. I used to work with women in a country where prostituation is legal and they had no issue with it. Their body and their choice. Any improper videos on that site should be prosecuted accordingly the rest let it up the the authorities. It's not up to us to decide what a person does for a living if it's legal.

GreeBo

Brian? wrote: »

Are they withholding their services?

Isn't that the entire point of the thread?

I also think that between them visa and MasterCard pretty much cover the credit card universe, do not sure what "other" providers poste4sv are referring to?
Non credit card payments are very different

nullzero

Wait... People pay for porn?

cdeb

GreeBo wrote: »

Isn't that the entire point of the thread?

No, it's not the entire point of the thread. Another point is that PornHub had lots of videos of illegal activities on its website and did practically nothing about them, despite specific complaints from the people being abused in the videos. There are also nuanced points being raised about the pros and cons of getting into (legit) porn.

We know PornHub acted because the card companies withheld services; I don't know if those services are still withheld now that action has been taken.

And ultimately, if two businesses have an agreement in place, and (hypothetically) one term of that agreement is that the customer (PornHub in this case) shall not use the supplier's services for anything illegal, then I still don't see why the credit card company shouldn't be entitled to act on this breach of its agreement.

GreeBo

cdeb wrote: »

No, it's not the entire point of the thread. Another point is that PornHub had lots of videos of illegal activities on its website and did practically nothing about them, despite specific complaints from the people being abused in the videos. There are also nuanced points being raised about the pros and cons of getting into (legit) porn.

We know PornHub acted because the card companies withheld services; I don't know if those services are still withheld now that action has been taken.

And ultimately, if two businesses have an agreement in place, and (hypothetically) one term of that agreement is that the customer (PornHub in this case) shall not use the supplier's services for anything illegal, then I still don't see why the credit card company shouldn't be entitled to act on this breach of its agreement.

Forgive me, but based on the OP the point of the thread is that visa and MasterCard withdrew their services from PornHub and that PornHub only acted after things got to this point.
PornHub removed any uncontrolled content before the two cc companies acted, yet they went ahead and removed the services anyway.

What else do the cc companies expect from PornHub? Is it right that they can risk a business closing down? Is it right that a basic service that is pretty much controlled by two companies in the world can be withdrawn from a legally operating entity? Why haven't they find the same to every other company in the same position? It's it right that they can play favourites? Isn't it a coincidence that they both did it at the same time?

cdeb

Well there's still a number of issues there. PornHub seem to have removed some videos before but they just get uploaded again because their content management is so bad (going off the NYT article and the number of content moderators cited already). That could be a factor. Is the content, or the content control, the issue? They're two different things. (And I still don't know if it's confirmed yet that services are still suspended)

The card companies say they are looking at other offenders, so it's not that PornHub is being singled out here.

You keep saying the entity is legally operating - but why don't you note the illegal content it facilitates and seems to do very little about? If that's a breach of Visa's terms, why shouldn't they take action? If that means PornHub suffer, maybe they should look at how to stay within their agreement with Visa? Or of course they could sue for loss of earnings - l think it's telling that they seem to have capitulated by removing all unverified content instead.

cdeb

I should add that it wouldn't surprise me if Visa/MasterCard/etc are subject to national laws on the restriction of and reporting of such activities as these, similar to how banks are subject to laws on reporting suspected money laundering. So that would be another reason for them to act (although the question then would be why now and not years ago)

Brian?

GreeBo wrote: »

Forgive me, but based on the OP the point of the thread is that visa and MasterCard withdrew their services from PornHub and that PornHub only acted after things got to this point.
PornHub removed any uncontrolled content before the two cc companies acted, yet they went ahead and removed the services anyway.

What else do the cc companies expect from PornHub? Is it right that they can risk a business closing down? Is it right that a basic service that is pretty much controlled by two companies in the world can be withdrawn from a legally operating entity? Why haven't they find the same to every other company in the same position? It's it right that they can play favourites? Isn't it a coincidence that they both did it at the same time?

The answer to all of your questions has been said more than once now:

1. They knowingly hosted videos of girls being raped. They knew because the girls complained and their complaints were ignored.

2. MasterCard and Visa did the morally correct thing and withdrew their services as those services had been used by Pornhub to profit from the rape or girls.

3. MasterCard and Visa are private companies and can refuse service to anyone they please.

4. **** Pornhub. They knowingly profited from the rape of girls.

When you’re defending the rights of a company that profited from the rape of girls, it’s pretty safe to say you’re on be wrong side.

km991148

km991148 wrote: »

I'm not sure (and too lazy to Google) but how did the user content work? Was it like YouTube model where you would make so much back in ad revenue?

No idea, but as the old marketing saying goes, if you're not paying for it, you're the product

Eric Cartman

Pauliedragon wrote: »

It wasn't that long ago we had a vote and the people voted. My body, my choice was the slogan. If a woman wants to sell herself for money good luck to her as long as it's consensual. I used to work with women in a country where prostituation is legal and they had no issue with it. Their body and their choice. Any improper videos on that site should be prosecuted accordingly the rest let it up the the authorities. It's not up to us to decide what a person does for a living if it's legal.

I would 100% agree that sick things like rape videos or underage girls should be removed. I doubt any rational human being could contest that. But similar to free speech of which I am a dedicated activist, freedom of expression or participating in ‘camgirl/onlyfans/pornhub videos etc...’ while legal and allowed, should it impact your future thats on you. Many girls seem to think its a free pass, do this while in college to earn drinking money and all is forgiven, well not so, similar to if I was declined a job for having picutres up in public with say mountains of cocaine or in the middle of a weed field, should you choose to sell flesh and employers in the furure say ‘no thanks’ , you should realise that was your own fault.

Mad_maxx

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Watched Pornhub now and again, I don't doubt the stuff was there but most people including myself wouldn't know it until this came to light because they don't go looking for rape videos.

Sounds like they cleaned the site up now so its probably the best one out there now.

Only a fool would pay for porn with all the free stuff these days.

Make sure you remember to update virus protection on your computer, free sites like those are crawling with them

Wibbs

Brian? wrote: »

The answer to all of your questions has been said more than once now:

1. They knowingly hosted videos of girls being raped. They knew because the girls complained and their complaints were ignored.

2. MasterCard and Visa did the morally financially correct thing and withdrew their services as those services had been used by Pornhub to profit from the rape or girls.

3. MasterCard and Visa are private companies and can refuse service to anyone they please.

4. **** Pornhub. They knowingly profited from the rape of girls.

When you’re defending the rights of a company that profited from the rape of girls, it’s pretty safe to say you’re on be wrong side.

I agree 100% save for that one change above. Pornhub rightfully got the beady eye on them and the CC companies rightfully pulled their pluge, but call me cynical... morals had little to do with it. Far more about the optics. Unless the same companies have also withdrawn their services from all the other aggregator porn sites that use them? Porn sites that chances are have the same sort of content. I'll bet they haven't.

Gruffalux

Hopefully the other sites with criminal content will also be targeted, but Pornhub is huge. It is a bigger site than Amazon or Netflix. That is astonishing to me. If I visited Pornhub as often as I visit Amazon (for work mostly) and Netflix (not for work) I would be blind.

GarIT

Gruffalux wrote: »

Hopefully the other sites with criminal content will also be targeted, but Pornhub is huge. It is a bigger site than Amazon or Netflix. That is astonishing to me. If I visited Pornhub as often as I visit Amazon (for work mostly) and Netflix (not for work) I would be blind.

No it's not. And it's not even the biggest porn site. This can be disproven with 2 mins of Google.

cdeb

GarIT wrote: »

No it's not. And it's not even the biggest porn site. This can be disproven with 2 mins of Google.

Just as a general observation, posts which direct you to a "two-minute Google" would be immeasurably improved by a direct link to Alexa or something along those lines.

Gruffalux

GarIT wrote: »

No it's not. And it's not even the biggest porn site. This can be disproven with 2 mins of Google.

Hmm. You are right. Seems it is 10th biggest website generally and two other porn sites are numbers 8 and 9. I was going by other google results that were saying worlds biggest porn site but maybe it is part of their own advertising.

Strumms

how does uploading a vid work ? If a bloke sends them a video, they reply with... ok here is xxxx euros, you’ll get paid 3 cent for every watch too, sign this release and jobs good... how can and do they verify that participants are of legal age...?

Scan of a passport or government ID ?

km991148

Wibbs wrote: »

I agree 100% save for that one change above. Pornhub rightfully got the beady eye on them and the CC companies rightfully pulled their pluge, but call me cynical... morals had little to do with it. Far more about the optics. Unless the same companies have also withdrawn their services from all the other aggregator porn sites that use them? Porn sites that chances are have the same sort of content. I'll bet they haven't.

Yeah, the more I think about it.. it's probably got as much to do with KYC compliance and money laundering checks than it has out if concern for victims of abuse.

Brian?

Brian? wrote: »

I follow a couple of young ladies on twitter who have been film while being gang raped

I'm in hysterics after reading that line. I know it wasn't meant to be funny but it's such a random thing to say. :pac:

GarIT

Strumms wrote: »

how does uploading a vid work ? If a bloke sends them a video, they reply with... ok here is xxxx euros, you’ll get paid 3 cent for every watch too, sign this release and jobs good... how can and do they verify that participants are of legal age...?

Scan of a passport or government ID ?

There is no communication. You click the button that says upload. Click on the video you want to upload. Give it a name and you're done.

The have changed things in the last week that only people who's account have been verified with government I'd can upload videos.

There is no upfront payment and you get €0.0000001 per view

Gruffalux

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm in hysterics after reading that line. I know it wasn't meant to be funny but it's such a random thing to say. :pac:

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/child-abuse-victim-says-porn-website-pornhub-profited-from-her-child-rape/news-story/7e3880aa4a94504acea7675bb8112cff

Gruffalux

Gruffalux wrote: »

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/child-abuse-victim-says-porn-website-pornhub-profited-from-her-child-rape/news-story/7e3880aa4a94504acea7675bb8112cff

I was laughing at the casual way in which it was said.

astrofool

cdeb wrote: »

Just as a general observation, posts which direct you to a "two-minute Google" would be immeasurably improved by a direct link to Alexa or something along those lines.

Given the type of search results in this case, probably not the type of link that boards would want to host

Brian?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'm in hysterics after reading that line. I know it wasn't meant to be funny but it's such a random thing to say. :pac:

I don't understand why it's funny.

GarIT

astrofool wrote: »

Given the type of search results in this case, probably not the type of link that boards would want to host

I don't think there would have been any problem linking to a list of the most popular websites. On which PornHub is around 30th in Ireland. While Amazon is only 9th somewhere between 10% and 25% of all the internet runs on their AWS servers and Netflix's content delivery network is the largest in the world, there was some month in the last few years where Netflix accounted for quite a big chunk of all the data transfer across the internet, the % of internet traffic made up by Netflix alone was in the double digit %

PornHub is tiny compared to the other internet giants.
According to Amazon's analysis bongacams and chaturbate are both more popular. https://www.alexa.com/topsites Based on the claimed number of videos and views Xhamster is also more popular than PornHub

cdeb

Boards still standing 30 minutes after posting the results anyway

So yeah, alexa has amazon.com as 9th, Netflix 20th, and PornHub doesn't make the top 50 (you can search individually for it and it's 56th), while Bongacams is in at 37.

But I think the point still stands that PornHub is a very big site with (until recently) some very dodgy videos and, it seems, very little will to do anything about them. Is there other big sites that could/should be targeted? Probably. (I'll not pretend to know where the illegal stuff is! ) But in the end of the day, even if Visa/MasterCard did what they did out of regulatory or financial rather than moral reasons, is the end result wrong? I don't think so.

Gruffalux

GarIT wrote: »

I don't think there would have been any problem linking to a list of the most popular websites. On which PornHub is around 30th in Ireland. While Amazon is only 9th somewhere between 10% and 25% of all the internet runs on their AWS servers and Netflix's content delivery network is the largest in the world, there was some month in the last few years where Netflix accounted for quite a big chunk of all the data transfer across the internet, the % of internet traffic made up by Netflix alone was in the double digit %

PornHub is tiny compared to the other internet giants.
According to Amazon's analysis bongacams and chaturbate are both more popular. https://www.alexa.com/topsites Based on the claimed number of videos and views Xhamster is also more popular than PornHub

Pornhub is not tiny. That is an odd thing to say. It is among the most visited websites in the world. Look at this list.

https://www.similarweb.com/top-websites/

and this one

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/ranking-the-top-100-websites-in-the-world/

and this

https://www.statista.com/chart/17613/most-popular-websites/

Adult entertainment websites are among the most well trafficked in the world, attracting an even greater number of visitors than household names such as Netflix, Amazon and Reddit, new research has found.

According to analysis from web hosting company Fasthosts, Xvideos and Pornhub are the two most popular adult entertainment websites, receiving an average of 3.14 and 2.85 trillion monthly visitors respectively.

The two pornography giants outrank Amazon (2.29 trillion), Netflix (2.21 trillion) and Reddit (1.34 trillion), highlighting the sheer scale of the modern pornography industry.

https://www.techradar.com/news/porn-sites-attract-more-visitors-than-netflix-and-amazon-youll-never-guess-how-many

No entity exemplifies this more than MindGeek, which with very little scrutiny or accountability, has quietly become the dominant porn company. The Montreal-based business is the owner of several of the sector’s most visited sites including Pornhub, RedTube and YouPorn. At least according to public financial records, MindGeek towers over the pornography industry in Europe and America.


MindGeek denies being the world’s largest porn company, a position that would justify growing scrutiny into its business, and points to rival WGCZ Holding, a Czech-registered company behind tube sites Xvideos and Xnxx that is owned by two French citizens who share a surname.

But internally, the company is less modest, say former employees. “Pornhub is the adult site with the most traffic on the planet, that’s the pitch we were making to clients,” says one former employee, who handled client accounts at MindGeek’s advertising network TrafficJunky. “They were making more money than anyone else [in the industry].”

Bandwidth data by network firm Sandvine confirms that Pornhub is the world’s most popular adult site. Rival Xvideos comes close, but MindGeek controls an entire network of related businesses, with arms such as TrafficJunky and age verification service AgeID strengthening its arsenal of top-ranking tube sites and subscription platforms.

https://www.ft.com/content/b50dc0a4-54a3-4ef6-88e0-3187511a67a2