COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

hmmm

ixoy wrote: »

The message about supply restrictions currently isn't getting through.

I think the HSE need to publish two figures prominently. Number of vaccines delivered by the manufacturers & number of vaccines administered.

They had it on a slide last week, along with number of vaccines delivered to the vaccination centres. I understand why the latter was on the slide, but it's perhaps overcomplicating things.

If they can say something like "we've administered 95% of vaccines received" it'll help to deal with the "why aren't we vaccinating a million people a week and training every job bloggs to do it?"

hmmm

Deleted User wrote: »

In theory once the viral vector and mRNA vaccines have been proven to work, the responses in either cohort should be similar irrespective of manufacturer? Eg. all mRNA vaccines should have similar performance once the ability of mRNA to deliver protein is established and similarly for the viral vector?

Not an expert, but the secret sauce in the mRNA platforms appears to be the nanoparticle coatings and not the underlying nucleo-whatevers which the coatings protect. Each company has different coatings with different performance characteristics e.g. Moderna not needing the same cold temperatures as Pfizer. I think of it like a chocolate smartie.

The impression I get is that if the vaccine works the efficacy should be generally the same (if they are targeting the same part of the virus), but if the coating isn't up to scratch the vaccine will simply not work. Fascinating technology, would love to hear more.

St.Spodo

Varadkar just told the Dáil that AstraZeneca approval on 29 January will allow 100,000 vaccinations per week from February.

ixoy

hmmm wrote: »

If they can say something like "we've administered 95% of vaccines received" it'll help to deal with the "why aren't we vaccinating a million people a week and training every job bloggs to do it?"

It would, although we'd be hit with:

- "Why can't we order more like Israel?!" (Israel is the new NZ)
- "Germany got loads more than their allowance"
- "Why aren't we asking AZ/Pfizer for more? This is a national crisis!" (yeah, because Ireland's the only one looking for the vaccine).

Still I think it's something that should be easy enough to do and might stop some questions.

Russman

St.Spodo wrote: »

Varadkar just told the Dáil that AstraZeneca approval on 29 January will allow 100,000 vaccinations per week from February.

Wouldn't that still leave us well short of the 1.4m they were talking about yesterday being done by end of March ?

Jeez, they really need to sit down together and get "on message" at this stage.

hynesie08

Russman wrote: »

Wouldn't that still leave us well short of the 1.4m they were talking about yesterday being done by end of March ?

Jeez, they really need to sit down together and get "on message" at this stage.

It's 700k by the end of March, then 1.5 mil in q2.

is_that_so

Russman wrote: »

Wouldn't that still leave us well short of the 1.4m they were talking about yesterday being done by end of March ?

Jeez, they really need to sit down together and get "on message" at this stage.

Feb & March = 9 weeks X 50K AZN, 9 X 50K Pfizer, 9 X 10K Moderna + (9 X 10K J&J) + 200K (approx) Pfizer for January and maybe 20K Moderna is not far off that at about 1.2m or so shots in my back of the envelope guess.

is_that_so

hynesie08 wrote: »

It's 700k by the end of March, then 1.5 mil in q2.

Fully vaccinated I think they said, so 1.4m shots.

eoinbn

is_that_so wrote: »

Feb & March = 9 weeks X 50K AZN, 9 X 50K Pfizer, 9 X 10K Moderna + (9 X 10K J&J) + 200K (approx) Pfizer for January and maybe 20K Moderna is not far off that at about 1.2m or so shots in my back of the envelope guess.

Zero chance we are getting 9 weeks of J&J from Feb-March. Hopefully it comes on stream in March at some stage. AZ will probably be more like 7 weeks of supply.
BioNtech's factory in Marburg is how we reach 1.4m doses by the end of March.

is_that_so

eoinbn wrote: »

Zero chance we are getting 9 weeks of J&J from Feb-March. Hopefully it comes on stream in March at some stage. AZ will probably be more like 7 weeks of supply.
BioNtech's factory in Marburg is how we reach 1.4m doses by the end of March.

That's why it's in parentheses! My point is that 1.4m is not an impossible target.

CIARAN_BOYLE

is_that_so wrote: »

Feb & March = 9 weeks X 50K AZN, 9 X 50K Pfizer, 9 X 10K Moderna + (9 X 10K J&J) + 200K (approx) Pfizer for January and maybe 20K Moderna is not far off that at about 1.2m or so shots in my back of the envelope guess.

I think Astra Zenaca is supposed to ramp up after an initial 50k a week. Pfizer too in March.

is_that_so

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

I think Astra Zenaca is supposed to ramp up after an initial 50k a week. Pfizer too in March.

Yeah, I'm just guessing numbers off current and initial potential supplies. I think that 1.4m is achievable anyway.

Russman

is_that_so wrote: »

That's why it's in parentheses! My point is that 1.4m is not an impossible target.

I agree 1.4m should be very doable, I was just wondering about Leo saying 100k per week from Feb. Even allowing 9 weeks for Feb/Mar, we'd still need to have had 500k done in Jan for that to be correct.

Meh, its all academic till we know for sure about AZ/Oxford anyway.

Apogee

hmmm wrote: »

Not an expert, but the secret sauce in the mRNA platforms appears to be the nanoparticle coatings and not the underlying nucleo-whatevers which the coatings protect. Each company has different coatings with different performance characteristics e.g. Moderna not needing the same cold temperatures as Pfizer. I think of it like a chocolate smartie.

The impression I get is that if the vaccine works the efficacy should be generally the same (if they are targeting the same part of the virus), but if the coating isn't up to scratch the vaccine will simply not work. Fascinating technology, would love to hear more.

This is an excellent summary of the application of lipid nanoparticles with mRNA vaccines from Derek Lowe, with additional links in the blog post:
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2021/01/11/rna-vaccines-and-their-lipids

Godot.

St.Spodo wrote: »

Varadkar just told the Dáil that AstraZeneca approval on 29 January will allow 100,000 vaccinations per week from February.

The 29th is a Friday. Will we be getting first deliveries on Feb 1st?

This report says a wait until mid February for EU deliveries which would be disappointing https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/12/covid-vaccine-astrazeneca-jab-could-be-distributed-in-eu-by-mid-february.html

Gael23

AZ to be approved on January 29th

Stark

Yeah mid February for first delivery assuming approval in late January. No rush like

stephenjmcd

Godot. wrote: »

The 29th is a Friday. Will we be getting first deliveries on Feb 1st?

This report says a wait until mid February for EU deliveries which would be disappointing https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/12/covid-vaccine-astrazeneca-jab-could-be-distributed-in-eu-by-mid-february.html

As per Prof Butler last Thursday they are already talking with AstraZeneca with the view of having significant quantities ready for delivery when approval is given.

Varadkar said today they are inquiring the possibility of having AstraZeneca in the country and distributed before approval so that its ready to go.

Delivery isn't something the EU are involved in, each country arranges delivery with the supplier

Stark

Ok that's much more reassuring.

is_that_so

HSE briefing has just started.
https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0114/1189719-live-updates-covid/

Gael23

https://www.breakingnews.ie/covid-vaccine/covid-19-vaccination-clinics-cancelled-at-dublin-hospital-as-doses-fail-to-arrive-1064436.html

Godot.

stephenjmcd wrote: »

As per Prof Butler last Thursday they are already talking with AstraZeneca with the view of having significant quantities ready for delivery when approval is given.

Varadkar said today they are inquiring the possibility of having AstraZeneca in the country and distributed before approval so that its ready to go

That's amazing news. A big feather in the government's cap if we're effectively getting it 2 weeks sooner than a lot of the rest of the EU due to good planning.

stephenjmcd

Godot. wrote: »

That's amazing news. A big feather in the government's cap if we're effectively getting it 2 weeks sooner than a lot of the rest of the EU due to good planning.

No idea about the 2 weeks sooner stuff, personally I think whoever made that comment in the EU was guessing because they also go onto say delivery schedules are between member states and supplier.

There does seem to be engagement with AstraZeneca, if it were in the country ready to go it would be fantastic

is_that_so

Private hospitals deal done.

stephenjmcd

stephenjmcd wrote: »

As per Prof Butler last Thursday they are already talking with AstraZeneca with the view of having significant quantities ready for delivery when approval is given.

Varadkar said today they are inquiring the possibility of having AstraZeneca in the country and distributed before approval so that its ready to go.

Delivery isn't something the EU are involved in, each country arranges delivery with the supplier

Not possible - everything we do in Ireland is sh*te

AdamD

77300 Vaccinations completed to date according to HSE weekly press conference

is_that_so

4000 trained for vaccinations. 57,481 cumulative total of vaccinations up to last Sunday. 77,300 up to today. Buffer being reduced to a minimum.

Gael23

AZ were originally supposed to start deliveries late last year so if they have kept up production despite delays then supply should in theory come on stream quite quickly

Dressoutlet

is_that_so wrote: »

Private hospitals deal done.

As in for administering the vaccine for the HSE
Or can we go and pay for a vaccine in a private hospital?

is_that_so

Dressoutlet wrote: »

As in for administering the vaccine for the HSE
Or can we go and pay for a vaccine in a private hospital?

The vaccine is free. Private entities can't buy it. You'll have to see when it's your turn.