COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

afatbollix

afatbollix wrote: »

The other thing with the Oxford vaccine is that they were testing all trial people every week for Covid. Symptoms or not.

The other vaccines only tested if they had covid after getting major symptoms after a check up.

I personally feel this has skewed the numbers.

I think all vaccines will e much of a muchness when all is said and done. Once they have the mechanism to deliver the protein, the immune system does the rest

TheChizler

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The data suggests 7 out of 10 won’t get ill. The other 3 out 10 will get mild illness

And that's 7 out of 10 that would have got ill with no intervention, not just out of everyone vaccinated.

GreeBo

hmmm wrote: »

I doubt we will ever be vaccinating under-18s for Covid. I suspect, and this is just speculation on my part based on some chatter, that when we get to vaccinating people at very low-risk (under 35s with no known pre-conditions perhaps) there will be an argument made to not vaccinate them and re-open as the small risk of side-effects from mass vaccination of this group outweighs their risk from Covid. At that stage you will have an endemic infection, with a mixture of natural and vaccine immunity.

I don't think we can afford to have large cohorts will getting infected, even if they are not getting sick is not chances for the virus to mutate.

Micky 32

GreeBo wrote: »

I don't think we can afford to have large cohorts will getting infected, even if they are not getting sick is not chances for the virus to mutate.

So a permanent lockdown then? Or maybe forever social distancing etc? Right?


It’s obvious some are constantly looking for excuses for this not to end. It’s going to end whether some like it or not and that will be sometime in the last quarter of the year.

Polar101

(apologies if posted before)

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/dublin-hospital-gave-leftover-vaccines-to-16-relatives-of-staff-1.4460718

The Coombe maternity hospital had 16 relatives of staff vaccinated with "leftover" vaccines, including two children of the hospital's manager.

Not the best way to choose who gets vaccinated first.

SuperSean11

Sure Irelands built on nepotism what did you expect

Wolf359f

Polar101 wrote: »

(apologies if posted before)

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/dublin-hospital-gave-leftover-vaccines-to-16-relatives-of-staff-1.4460718

The Coombe maternity hospital had 16 relatives of staff vaccinated with "leftover" vaccines, including two children of the hospital's manager.

Not the best way to choose who gets vaccinated first.

It's one thing to let doses made up go to waste, but now in 4 weeks time, they need their second dose, so that technically prevents double the people from getting their first dose.
Why did didn't contact local GP's or dentists and offer them the vaccine, I dunno

josip

Wolf359f wrote: »

It's one thing to let doses made up go to waste, but now in 4 weeks time, they need their second dose, so that technically prevents double the people from getting their first dose.
Why did didn't contact local GP's or dentists and offer them the vaccine, I dunno

Have you ever tried to contact a GP after 6?

..from 9.30pm onward I personally made every effort to prioritise and identify additional frontline workers and followed all measures available to me at the time,” he said

So presumably he didn't know before 9.30pm that they would have vaccines left over?
But what a co-incidence that it was all relatives that got them.
The optics of this are terrible and would make you wonder how much of this is going on in the other hospitals that we're unaware of.

Stark

Possible it could have been handled better. I'd still prefer to see relatives/friends get them than the vaccines going in the bin though.

Wolf359f wrote:

It's one thing to let doses made up go to waste, but now in 4 weeks time, they need their second dose, so that technically prevents double the people from getting their first dose.

Well they don't technically need the second dose, as in they're not going to die without it. I imagine certainly, the younger relatives could do without it and probably still have decent protection.

plodder

Polar101 wrote: »

(apologies if posted before)

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/dublin-hospital-gave-leftover-vaccines-to-16-relatives-of-staff-1.4460718

The Coombe maternity hospital had 16 relatives of staff vaccinated with "leftover" vaccines, including two children of the hospital's manager.

Not the best way to choose who gets vaccinated first.

Can't the vaccine be stored in normal fridges for 5 days? There's no excuse then for handing it out willy nilly to friends and family.

Actually, after being diluted the vaccine has to be used within 6 hours. So, they would have had to discarded if they couldn't find people to use them on.

franciscanpunk

What vacine are the likes of israel, Bahrain and the UAE using or is it a combination?

Obviusly I know they are all safe and tested alrrady but its an interesting live trial to see what impact it will have on hospital rates over the next few months

Neamhshuntasach

I get the skepticism in the HSE to deliver when there is a lot of history that shows mismanagement. But from anything I have heard in regards to the vaccination program progress which would be first hand from people involved. I have no worries at all we'll get this right and once production ramps up we'll be right there with any country in the EU. So much nonsense posted here about a slow start and only working Monday to Friday and admin staff getting it posted in here etc. A lot seem very quick to blame the HSE even when what they are doing makes complete sense or when some hiccup is out of their control.

Anyways my wife will get her second shot this Wednesday and there has been a massive uptake. And to some peoples annoyance, I know of cleaners who have got it. Which I think is brilliant. Vaccinating an entire hospital should be in it's own tier in my opinion. Everyone and any one who could potentially get Covid who works in there.

Stark

franciscanpunk wrote: »

What vacine are the likes of israel, Bahrain and the UAE using or is it a combination?

Obviusly I know they are all safe and tested alrrady but its an interesting live trial to see what impact it will have on hospital rates over the next few months

Israel is all Pfizer-Biontech afaik.

Bahrain started with Sinopharm but added Pfizer-Biontech as a second choice some time afterwards.

UAE are using Pfizer in Dubai (it has its own health authority) and Sinopharm everywhere else.

Harry Palmr

Stark wrote: »

Possible it could have been handled better. I'd still prefer to see relatives/friends get them than the vaccines going in the bin though.

They could have vaccinated admin staff before their own families.

dublin_paul

https://twitter.com/FineGael/status/1350729714554572800

This is great, I'm very optimistic that this will have further revisions that pushes everything forward. According to this, there should be a strong argument to drop most restrictions in May/June!

Stark

Nice, love that they include the approval assumptions in the new graph. Looks like they're going on the assumption that Astrazenaca is going to be approved but not making assumptions on other vaccines so it could well be accelerated.

Multipass

Polar101 wrote: »

(apologies if posted before)

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/dublin-hospital-gave-leftover-vaccines-to-16-relatives-of-staff-1.4460718

The Coombe maternity hospital had 16 relatives of staff vaccinated with "leftover" vaccines, including two children of the hospital's manager.

Not the best way to choose who gets vaccinated first.

The master of the hospital should lose his job, it’s an absolute disgusting abuse of his position.
In fact he should lose his job twice, also for having any vaccines ‘left over’, when the whole goddamn country is locked up waiting for them. Inept as well as corrupt.

ACitizenErased

Yeah I’m not a fan of the relatives getting the extra doses, thats a bit ridiculous

lbj666

dublin_paul wrote: »

https://twitter.com/FineGael/status/1350729714554572800

This is great, I'm very optimistic that this will have further revisions that pushes everything forward. According to this, there should be a strong argument to drop most restrictions in May/June!

Thats basically the green party lads excel one that he had to take down and put up again with FG. I am not as impressed, we need better infographics by now, no breakdown of 4-12 is just going to confuse the hell out of people.


And in contrast, UK hoping end of the june everyone over 18. Granted thats in expectation of J&J coming along, so they have found at least another month they can pull away from all their neighbours.

https://news.yahoo.com/over-18s-could-vaccine-end-195948288.html

hotmail.com

His two children got the vaccine. Unbelievable.

This will undermine the vaccine rollout as people were already suspicious that the elite would receive the vaccine first and jump the queue.

Leftover is a farce as well. No one will believe that.

Neamhshuntasach

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Yeah I’m not a fan of the relatives getting the extra doses, thats a bit ridiculous

True. Like surely there was someone else in the hospital environment that could of got it. A non covid patient even.

There are extras everywhere it would seem. Some vials get the 5 or even 6 doses. So there are always some left over as the planning was based on the 4. And once on site, they can't go back or be transported elsewhere. They need to be used or dumped. I'm all for giving the extra to others, but calling in family members is a step too far. The misses joked about trying to get me one of the spares that would go to waste otherwise. But as much as I'd take one, I wouldn't in those circumstances as surely there is someone more vulnerable than me within walking distance of the injection site.

lbj666

Multipass wrote: »

The master of the hospital should lose his job, it’s an absolute disgusting abuse of his position.
In fact he should lose his job twice, also for having any vaccines ‘left over’, when the whole goddamn country is locked up waiting for them. Inept as well as corrupt.

He could have easily rang up a few GPs he knew. Yup its not on.

Something to take solace in is much of the commotions at the minute are at macro level.
The blurry line between group 1 and 4 should really have been ironed out though.

Gerianam

It will increase confidence in the vaccine, though. It clearly works when he wanted to protect his children.

franciscanpunk

Stark wrote: »

Israel is all Pfizer-Biontech afaik.

Bahrain started with Sinopharm but added Pfizer-Biontech as a second choice some time afterwards.

UAE are using Pfizer in Dubai (it has its own health authority) and Sinopharm everywhere else.

Thanks, very interesting. Will try track Israel hospitalisation rates if i can over the coming weeks and months and see what level of restrictions they are at when they have reached different rates of vacxinations of the population. If they can keep up their supply of vaccines they will be a great study.

Wolf359f

Neamhshuntasach wrote: »

I get the skepticism in the HSE to deliver when there is a lot of history that shows mismanagement. But from anything I have heard in regards to the vaccination program progress which would be first hand from people involved. I have no worries at all we'll get this right and once production ramps up we'll be right there with any country in the EU. So much nonsense posted here about a slow start and only working Monday to Friday and admin staff getting it posted in here etc. A lot seem very quick to blame the HSE even when what they are doing makes complete sense or when some hiccup is out of their control.

Anyways my wife will get her second shot this Wednesday and there has been a massive uptake. And to some peoples annoyance, I know of cleaners who have got it. Which I think is brilliant. Vaccinating an entire hospital should be in it's own tier in my opinion. Everyone and any one who could potentially get Covid who works in there.

Why would people be annoyed with that? A cleaner in a hospital is a considered a healthcare worker. In that environment, yes they would need it. Unless Nurses and doctors will be emptying bins and cleaning up on wards?
As some have mentioned before, who do you think fixes hospital beds, changes light bulbs etc... there's a lot more working in hospitals that people think and every single one of them should be vaccinated well before relatives!!!!!

ACitizenErased

If cleaners got it over the manager's kids there'd be no issue

Wolf359f

lbj666 wrote: »

He could have easily rang up a few GPs he knew. Yup its not on.

Something to take solace in is much of the commotions at the minute are at macro level.
The blurry line between group 1 and 4 should really have been ironed out though.

I'm in Dublin, My mother is elderly, can I sign her up and get a call 24/7 and I'll have her there for the extra dose within an hour? Would be better optics than just giving it to relatives ffs.

franciscanpunk

Gerianam wrote: »

It will increase confidence in the vaccine, though. It clearly works when he wanted to protect his children.

I actually thought this myself, we need a good scandal of rich people getting early access to draw lots of outrage in people to get demamding the vaccine, anything to drive up the desire for people to want to get it.

lbj666

Wolf359f wrote: »

I'm in Dublin, My mother is elderly, can I sign her up and get a call 24/7 and I'll have her there for the extra dose within an hour? Would be better optics than just giving it to relatives ffs.

The point was on 8th January most GPs werent jabbed , could easily have invited some.

Happydays2020

Neamhshuntasach wrote: »

I get the skepticism in the HSE to deliver when there is a lot of history that shows mismanagement. But from anything I have heard in regards to the vaccination program progress which would be first hand from people involved. I have no worries at all we'll get this right and once production ramps up we'll be right there with any country in the EU. So much nonsense posted here about a slow start and only working Monday to Friday and admin staff getting it posted in here etc. A lot seem very quick to blame the HSE even when what they are doing makes complete sense or when some hiccup is out of their control.

Anyways my wife will get her second shot this Wednesday and there has been a massive uptake. And to some peoples annoyance, I know of cleaners who have got it. Which I think is brilliant. Vaccinating an entire hospital should be in it's own tier in my opinion. Everyone and any one who could potentially get Covid who works in there.

On what grounds could anyone be annoyed with a cleaner, Porter or a caterer getting the vaccine?