COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Sconsey

Amirani wrote: »

So which of the groups ahead should they be ahead of do you think?

Looking at the groups, I don't think it's bizarre at all.

Glad you asked

They have decided on a blanket vaccination of all over 65's (as group 5 I think). Even though the HSE describe the 60 - 69 as 'High Risk' and (for example) cystic fibrosis patients as 'very high risk'.

So the HSE say a group is very high risk and exremely vulnerable, as defined here. But the government has decided to put a huge cohort of less vulnerable/critical ahead of them (the healthy over 65's).

I would be putting the very high risk ahead of the healthy over 65's, as per the HSE guidance of vulnerability.

Solar2021

Deleted User wrote: »

Called on your bs and retreat to "its all speculation", trying to both sides an argument where the preponderance of evidence is on one side

The overwhelming view is that the observed mutations are not sufficient to impact the vaccine effectivness yet you are peddling sh*te

How is it BS

If no one knows?

The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence what so ever that it is correct

Cork2021

Solar2021 wrote: »

How is it BS

If no one knows?

The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence what so ever that it is correct

You know it’s BS!
It’s widely known the vaccines will work and we’ll be out of this mess at some stage this autumn

Solar2021

Solar2021 wrote: »

How is it BS

If no one knows?

The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence what so ever that it is correct

A strain is supposedly partial/vaccine evading right now
I think its a valid discussion

Can we not discuss the failure of a vaccine?

Just two pieces of prize BS dressed up as facts.

An its not opinion, its expert views based on the analysis of the mutations in the strain

Amirani

Sconsey wrote: »

Glad you asked

They have decided on a blanket vaccination of all over 65's (as group 5 I think). Even though the HSE describe the 60 - 69 as 'High Risk' and (for example) cystic fibrosis patients as 'very high risk'.

So the HSE say a group is very high risk and exremely vulnerable, as defined here. But the government has decided to put a huge cohort of less vulnerable/critical ahead of them (the healthy over 65's).

I would be putting the very high risk ahead of the healthy over 65's, as per the HSE guidance of vulnerability.

Fair point. Based on those distinctions, I can see how you could say that those with particular medical conditions should be above the 65-69 cohort. The priority rationale seems to be that 65-69 are at greater risk of death, and that certain medical conditions are at higher risk of hospitalisation, but not sure of their basis for that?

Given the only category between the 2 is Key Workers (related to vaccine program - which would be small), then I'd say there will be little difference in timing. They'll essentially be done at the same time is my guess, but your argument is definitely valid.

Solar2021

Cork2021 wrote: »

You know it’s BS!
It’s widely known the vaccines will work and we’ll be out of this mess at some stage this autumn

If it's widely known current vaccines work against all strains and mutations

Why are Porton Down and many other BSL-3 labs all around the world testing right now

Should we tell them Cork2021 said they will work?

lbj666

seamie78 wrote: »

Important to remember that all the groups are not the same size, some are quite small and could be done in a week or two when things are ramped up

And group 3 other health care and 6 essential vaccine staff will be administered on an separate work stream to the mass vaccination GP/Pharmacy stream.

So really the at risk under 65, are after over 70 and over 65 via the GP/Pharmacy/Mass Vaccine stream.
Everyone over 65 is at risk and rightfully so given the statistics. If they were to fit group 7 in there that would mean splitting the under 65 and 70 groups into say at risk and severe risk, that is time consuming admin/GP wise and far more hassle than its worth.

sideswipe

Used to enjoy reading this thread, it always seemed a sanctuary from the madness of the likes of the relaxation of restrictions thread.....alas no longer.

LessOutragePlz

sideswipe wrote: »

Used to enjoy reading this thread, it always seemed a sanctuary from the madness of the likes of the relaxation of restrictions thread.....alas no longer.

Sadly this is true for me too, people will use any excuse to undermine the efficacy of the vaccines, it's really sad that they have nothing better to do than to try to instill fear and doubt in people's minds in relation to the vaccines, when they are the only positive thing about this whole sh1t show at the moment.

ACitizenErased

My father (diabetic healthcare worker) just got vaccinated at the CUH. A real relief.

atahuapla

Micky 32 wrote: »

“Taoiseach Micheál Martin said up to 135,000 people will be vaccinated with two doses of the Covid-19 vaccine by the end of February.“

Infuriating. That's 2.75% of the population. :mad:

Where is the urgency? Where is the national call for any available medical personnel (retired nurses, dentists, vets, medical corps, civil defence etc) to aid in 24/7 rollout?

2.75% by end of Feb is unacceptable.

Solar2021

Solar2021 wrote: »

If it's widely known current vaccines work against all strains and mutations

Why are Porton Down and many other BSL-3 labs all around the world testing right now

Should we tell them Cork2021 said they will work?

Thats what science does - it confirms, then revises the knowledge when different information crops up. Because a lab is testing the new strain does not mean they believe its an issue. Still does not mean its not important to test

atahuapla

atahuapla wrote: »

Infuriating. That's 2.75% of the population. :mad:

Where is the urgency? Where is the national call for any available medical personnel (retired nurses, dentists, vets, medical corps, civil defence etc) to aid in 24/7 rollout?

2.75% by end of Feb is unacceptable.

How are they going to vaccinate more than 135,000 people with two doses each if we are getting 40,000 per week of the Pfizer vaccine.

Of course we may have Moderna and AZ approved by then which will revise that projection up, but we cant commit to vaccinating people with vaccines we dont have

zuutroy

Unacceptable. Farmers should be distilling it from potatoes in wooden sheds. Typical Ireland etc etc.

Deeper Blue

Solar2021 wrote: »

You have Matt Hancock, Secretary of State for Health for the UK

Saying he is 'incredibly worried'

A man who has direct contacts with Porton Down lab, who are one of the tops infectious disease labs in the world, growing the bloody thing the last few weeks



Experts at Oxford



But no our epidemiologist El Sueno and our Chief Medical Virologists Hmmmz who also qualified from the College of Boards.ie, 9 ago months say it's like winning the lotto and I may go to Bermuda

Lads lets's be real here, ye don't have a clue what ye are talking about, just like me.

None of ye are virologists or medically qualified, ye read Reddit/Lancet/Google and the journals just like I do.

To summarise, your posts are mostly conjecture while the reasonable posters in the thread are actually reading beyond the Twitter headlines.

As an aside, leave out the childish personal digs next time please. Ta

Hmmzis

hmmm wrote: »

Interesting Twitter thread. Nothing that hasn't already been discussed, but UK strain unlikely to much impact on vaccines, South African might, either way best to vaccinate as it should give some protection even in a worst case.

https://twitter.com/jbloom_lab/status/1346442049663340544

That's a brilliant paper and an amazing amount of work in a very short period of time. Even with the limited amount of sera they had it shows very clearly how different human immune responses are (after a natural infection). The affinity maturation over time is also nicely evident, for those who had a germinal center response I'm assuming (the 1/3ish of the cohort lines up with the Rockefeller University study about antibody maturation).

This could give a glimpse into how the SA variant (and the Brazilian equivalent) might affect efficacy of vaccines. There might be some reduced efficacy but most of the convalescent sera were still neutralizing (that's if we also are ignoring the cell mediated part of the immune system).

Now I'd like to see the Sinovac phase 3 results form Brazil to see how a purely antibody mediated vaccine induced response looks like against their viral lineages that include changes to the 484 site.

atahuapla

Deleted User wrote: »

How are they going to vaccinate more than 135,000 people with two doses each if we are getting 40,000 per week of the Pfizer vaccine.

Of course we may have Moderna and AZ approved by then which will revise that projection up, but we cant commit to vaccinating people with vaccines we dont have

I retract my fury and anger and downgrade it to general frustration.

Apogee

Good news and first of many.

Irish Times wrote:

A 95-year-old Dublin woman, who lost her husband to coronavirus, has become the first nursing home resident in the country to receive a Covid-19 vaccination. Maura Byrne, who survived the disease, received the first dose of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine at Hollybrook Lodge, the residential care unit managed by St James’s Hospital in Dublin. The State-run care facility in Inchicore is the first nursing home in the country to receive vaccinations. Ms Byrne was the first resident at the care home to be vaccinated on Tuesday. “I feel great at the moment,” said the great-grandmother after receiving the vaccine. She encouraged others to take the vaccine when it becomes available to them.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/dublin-woman-95-becomes-first-nursing-home-resident-in-the-state-to-be-vaccinated-1.4450758

ShineOn7

sideswipe wrote: »

Used to enjoy reading this thread, it always seemed a sanctuary from the madness of the likes of the relaxation of restrictions thread.....alas no longer.

I just had the exact same thought

My subconscious actually just said "yikes!" as I scrolled some recent posts

Latest squabble is someone posting nonsense about the vaccines not working against the new variant I think?

This has being - robustly - debunked. Any posts contrary to this should be regarded as conspiracy and nothing more

ShyMets

ShineOn7 wrote: »

I just had the exact same thought

My subconscious actually just said "yikes!" as I scrolled some recent posts

Latest squabble is someone posting nonsense about the vaccines not working against the new variant I think?

This has being - robustly - debunked. Any posts contrary to this should be regarded as conspiracy and nothing more

Unfortunately once the vaccines started being rolled out the cranks were alwayds going to make an appearance

plodder

hmmm wrote: »

Interesting Twitter thread. Nothing that hasn't already been discussed, but UK strain unlikely to much impact on vaccines, South African might, either way best to vaccinate as it should give some protection even in a worst case.

https://twitter.com/jbloom_lab/status/1346442049663340544

That's quite reassuring - and certainly not a justification for some of the panic about the SA strain lately.

I see also that St John Ambulance in the UK are training teams of 'volunteer vaccinators' who I presume are not professional clinicians. Anyone know are we doing this too?

Melanchthon

plodder wrote: »

I see also that St John Ambulance in the UK are training teams of 'volunteer vaccinators' who I presume are not professional clinicians. Anyone know are we doing this too?

As far as I know we aren't, and if we were the process should have started a month or more ago like it did in the UK.

Vicxas

Only 135,0000 by the end of Feb, that seems very low to me.

plastic glass

Melanchthon wrote: »

As far as I know we aren't, and if we were the process should have started a month or more ago like it did in the UK.

Probably a stupid question here but what exactly are the defence forces doing right now? Should they not be deployed to help here? Or for contract tracing, or to help with testing etc?

Hmmzis

plodder wrote: »

That's quite reassuring - and certainly not a justification for some of the panic about the SA strain lately.

I see also that St John Ambulance in the UK are training teams of 'volunteer vaccinators' who I presume are not professional clinicians. Anyone know are we doing this too?

If the HSE will do something like this here, I'll happily volunteer.

unplayable

can anyone give a valid reason why we are so slow to administer the vaccine?

Cork2021

Vicxas wrote: »

Only 135,0000 by the end of Feb, that seems very low to me.

That’s just the Pfizer vaccine. Moderna will be approved tomorrow and we’ll get batches of that, how much I don’t know but it’ll add to our Pfizer totals. Sometime in the next week or so I think AstraZeneca will apply to the EMA for approval once they send on the data about quality abs this will be the game changer! Hopefully by middle of February we’ll have 3 vaccines being administered

ACitizenErased

unplayable wrote: »

can anyone give a valid reason why we are so slow to administer the vaccine?

Because we can't pull vaccine supply out of thin air?

plodder

Melanchthon wrote: »

As far as I know we aren't, and if we were the process should have started a month or more ago like it did in the UK.

I thought I remember hearing the same, that we were only using professional staff and thinking maybe that's not as great as it sounds. Administering a vaccine is not that hard I'm told, and you'd think volunteers could do it in larger centres where there are medical professionals already.

JacksonHeightsOwn

unplayable wrote: »

can anyone give a valid reason why we are so slow to administer the vaccine?

Because we don't have that many actual doses to begin with.