18 months for Carragaline stabbing

take everything

Necro wrote: »

There are much more pertinent things in life to be worrying about is my own view.

Wow.

V8 Interceptor

Necro wrote: »

There are much more pertinent things in life to be worrying about is my own view.

????

Guffy

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

I agree racism doesnt come into it. I agree how horrendous it was. Posters here on the other hand are trying to repeat the lies of racist white supremacists like Gearoid Murphy

I find it hard to ignore the racist language used in the attack to be honest. I think to do so is being naive.

To say racism doesn't come into it would imply that the attacker would have also attacked a black child and that the victim was selected as someone in the wrong place at the wrong time as opposed to being a white child in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The length of the sentence is scandalous for an assault alone but when you add the language used by the attacker both during and after the attack implying it as a race crime or a hate crime compounds it.

I don't necessarily subscribe to the what if the roles were reversed argument. From a quick google there have been homophoboc attacks where the perps have been given a shorter sentence. I recall one in galway in 2013 where a former friend of mine was sentenced to 9 months for a serious assault and using homphobic language during this. His defence was the victim offered him a blow job (in a known cruising spot).

I think that our sentencing in general is broken tbh, not that the courts are any more lenient on immigrants or ethnic minority citizens. Just look at all of the scum bags being brought up with charge sheets as long as their arms every week.

Quantum Erasure

Guffy wrote: »

I find it hard to ignore the racist language used in the attack to be honest. I think to do so is being naive.

I listened to the video once and couldn't make out any racism, what exactly was said?

coinop

Necro wrote: »

There are much more pertinent things in life to be worrying about is my own view.

Wow...we were all well aware of the political leanings of the admins and mods of this site but I'm a bit stunned to see you dismiss this racial aspect of this attempted murder so casually. This beats Dav's infamous "right wing opinions are dangerous" gaffe. Screencap that quote folks for when it inevitably gets edited or when the backpedaling begins.

Tipperary animal lover

This is the type of text that was going around after the beating, but it DEFINITELY wasn't anything to do with race; there's videos of the lad beating another white lad a few days before this but the young fellas family didn't want to press charges as they where fearful for their son.

Hamachi

Tipperary animal lover wrote: »

This is the type of text that was going around after the beating, but it DEFINITELY wasn't anything to do with race; there's videos of the lad beating another white lad a few days before this but the young fellas family didn't want to press charges as they where fearful for their son.

That screenshot from Twitter is truly disturbing. One can only hope that it’s not a commonly held belief amongst a segment of the youth population.

It’s certainly a ‘pertinent’ issue for Irish society if this type of mentality is festering.

corks finest

Kivaro wrote: »

Some of the quotes from the article above:


From the Judge:


The fact that this guy gets 1 1/2 years for such an attack is appalling and it is indeed an indictment of the justice system in Ireland. It is stacked against victims in this country.

It is curious that there was no mention of the racial aspect of this case i.e. black gang setting upon a single white male with his girlfriend, and the racial abuse that the victim endured during the attack and stabbing, which was recorded by the gang.

It's a disgrace and the main reason this toe tag didn't get serious time is he's coloured, I can personally say that the victim of the attack has went thorough the mill, his self confidence is shot, don't give a feck what ppl think its the truth, he lives near me, and I sincerely doubt that this will ever leave his mind,
This animal demeaned him, stole, stabbed and boasted publicly about his deeds as did the other scrotes, this country is gone too bloody PC

corks finest

Guffy wrote: »

I find it hard to ignore the racist language used in the attack to be honest. I think to do so is being naive.

To say racism doesn't come into it would imply that the attacker would have also attacked a black child and that the victim was selected as someone in the wrong place at the wrong time as opposed to being a white child in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The length of the sentence is scandalous for an assault alone but when you add the language used by the attacker both during and after the attack implying it as a race crime or a hate crime compounds it.

I don't necessarily subscribe to the what if the roles were reversed argument. From a quick google there have been homophoboc attacks where the perps have been given a shorter sentence. I recall one in galway in 2013 where a former friend of mine was sentenced to 9 months for a serious assault and using homphobic language during this. His defence was the victim offered him a blow job (in a known cruising spot).

I think that our sentencing in general is broken tbh, not that the courts are any more lenient on immigrants or ethnic minority citizens. Just look at all of the scum bags being brought up with charge sheets as long as their arms every week.

Racism did come into it despite what you think, I live local and this crap prior to the attack was happening local and including the bus held up and the white female driver threatened with the rape etc, and the same culprit got his mates to record him and post another attack on another white total innocent kid 2 days prior in Ballincollig

weldoninhio

Necro wrote: »

There are much more pertinent things in life to be worrying about is my own view.

Is that your view on all racism? Or just black on white racism??

Hamachi

corks finest wrote: »

I can personally say that the victim of the attack has went thorough the mill, his self confidence is shot, don't give a feck what ppl think its the truth, he lives near me, and I sincerely doubt that this will ever leave his mind

I can only imagine. The poor lad will carry the mental scars of that act of unbelievable savagery for life. It’s one of the most cowardly and vicious attacks I’ve ever seen. I’m not sure how he can recover from that psychologically. He has a long road ahead of him to regain some sort of equilibrium.

It takes an extraordinary degree of crassness to deflect or downplay the trauma that poor kid has suffered.

Tipperary animal lover

corks finest wrote: »

It's a disgrace and the main reason this toe tag didn't get serious time is he's coloured, I can personally say that the victim of the attack has went thorough the mill, his self confidence is shot, don't give a feck what ppl think its the truth, he lives near me, and I sincerely doubt that this will ever leave his mind,
This animal demeaned him, stole, stabbed and boasted publicly about his deeds as did the other scrotes, this country is gone too bloody PC

I can agree 100% with you cork finest, my husband is an old friend of the young fellas father, they're a very quiet family and this really knocked the the young lads self confidence, this was an on going occurrence weekends before this beating and it took for the quiet young fella to be horrendously beating for it to stop.

grassylawn

Tipperary animal lover wrote: »

This is the type of text that was going around after the beating, but it DEFINITELY wasn't anything to do with race; there's videos of the lad beating another white lad a few days before this but the young fellas family didn't want to press charges as they where fearful for their son.

My feeling is that that is a sockpuppet designed to stir up racist feelings in white people.

I don't see a racist immigrant calling themselves 33rd dail. That sounds like an Irish person.

Acosta

Tipperary animal lover wrote: »

This is the type of text that was going around after the beating, but it DEFINITELY wasn't anything to do with race; there's videos of the lad beating another white lad a few days before this but the young fellas family didn't want to press charges as they where fearful for their son.

Yeah that type of fake horse**** was going around afterwards.

Riesen_Meal

Tipperary animal lover wrote: »

This is the type of text that was going around after the beating, but it DEFINITELY wasn't anything to do with race; there's videos of the lad beating another white lad a few days before this but the young fellas family didn't want to press charges as they where fearful for their son.

You know this post was made up and they doxxed it back to some NP lad?

Sharing fake tweets like that to stir hatred is nearly worse than the hatred itself IMO...

Hamachi

Fieldog wrote: »

Sharing fake tweets like that to stir hatred is nearly worse than the hatred itself IMO...

Seriously?

Cop on to yourself and have some respect for the poor kid and his family.

Faugheen

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

You're wrong there,

Oh do inform me, oh wise one?

Any discussion of a case before the courts leaves that case open to being thrown out. You’re telling me a subreddit about a case before the courts wasn’t being monitored by a solicitor for the defendant?

You’ve only told me I’m wrong but with no basis to back that up. I assume you can.

Omackeral

Faugheen wrote: »

Oh do inform me, oh wise one?

Any discussion of a case before the courts leaves that case open to being thrown out. You’re telling me a subreddit about a case before the courts wasn’t being monitored by a solicitor for the defendant?

You’ve only told me I’m wrong but with no basis to back that up. I assume you can.

The reason for the nightly close of r/Ireland was related to the US elections. They reckoned there was an army of bots infesting the subreddit every night. It wasn’t closed outright, it went down every evening at a specific time.

Also, the subreddit wasn’t about a case, it was a singular thread on it. The subreddit is about all things Ireland. Wouldn’t make sense to close the whole thing over it. Be easier to just nuke the thread.

TomTomTim

Omackeral wrote: »

The reason for the nightly close of r/Ireland was related to the US elections. They reckoned there was an army of bots infesting the subreddit every night. It wasn’t closed outright, it went down every evening at a specific time.

Also, the subreddit wasn’t about a case, it was a singular thread on it. The subreddit is about all things Ireland. Wouldn’t make sense to close the whole thing over it. Be easier to just nuke the thread.

Yeah, I'm not sure where this court case theory comes from. I think there was two times within a few months when they did the over night shutdowns, and I don't ever remember a court case being used as an excuse.

Maxpfizer

I suppose it's quite a depressing look into the way things are going with our society.

These kids filmed themselves beating and stabbing another lad and posted it up on social media. They didn't even try to hide it. Then tried to use the understandable outrage from the local community as a defense in court. He'll be walking free in 18 months and we should probably be wondering if it would happen again.

Yet, the conversation mainly seems to be "was this racism"?

Does it really matter?

I don't really understand the mentality of people who's first response to a situation like this is to make sure that, no matter what, everybody knows that this wasn't a racist attack. Like that's supposed to be reassuring in some way?

One poster in particular here seems mostly interested in making sure that, above all else, everyone knows that the attack had nothing to do with race. Is Joeytheparrot psychic? At BEST you could say we don't have overwhelming evidence to prove that the attack had a racial element. Does anybody really know the motivations behind the attack?

I think it says a lot about us when we hear about some kid being stabbed in the street and his attackers are brazen enough to share the footage on the internet and we don't really even bat an eye. There are much more pertinent things to be worrying about after all.

Someone suggested that the attacker was a racist though? That will not stand!

Our first reaction to hearing someone was stabbed is "but was it a racist stabbing"?
The reaction to hearing someone was stabbed in a racially motivated attack is "how can I prove that race wasn't a factor"?
Or the reaction is to look at the races of the victim and the perpetrator and to build up a narrative from there.

If one is worried about the far right using incidents like this to push ideology and narrative then surely one is equally worried about identity being used in other incidents? It would seem strange to be worried about the far right using non-white on white attacks to rile up the public while being unconcerned about this happening when a white person attacks someone who is not white.

We're so far gone that "was it racist" is the most important question here apparently.
You could be attacked in the street, stabbed, filmed, humiliated online and then your attacker is out and about in 18 months, probably getting some sweet government hand outs.
Yet, nobody really cares about that, or about you.
What's most important is that at least the people who did that to you definitely, definitely, weren't racists. That must be comforting to know.

I certainly wouldn't want to be stabbed and left for dead only to find out that "the far right" had used the incident to score cheap and meaningless points online. That would just be terrible. Imagine it!
Some deadbeat skinhead racist who can barely form a coherent thought might have his prejudices confirmed! He might get an afternoon of "I was right, told you so" gloating on Facebook and Reddit before is inevitable ban! How awful!
Forget the stabbing! We gotta make sure nobody could possibly think that race was a factor.

Something is very, very, wrong with this kind of situation and our collective reaction to it.
The way we shrug off the very real violence and open sharing of that act of violence and get right into a conversation about racism.

osarusan

Maxpfizer wrote: »

Yet, the conversation mainly seems to be "was this racism"?

Does it really matter?

It obviously does matter to plenty of people on this thread, whose interest in the incident very much depends on whether it can be portrayed as race-related or not.

It has been said repeatedly on the thread that there are racist comments on the video. I have watched it, sickening as it was, but didn't hear any racist comments, at least in the video I saw.

Omackeral

Posts disappearing without comment I see. Actually proves a lot of what’s being insinuated

Necro

weldoninhio wrote: »

Is that your view on all racism? Or just black on white racism??

All racism. I simply don't go into a situation viewing it through that lens.

Not sure why that's so upsetting to some.

Already stated my views on the crime, it was horrific and the offender should have been locked up for a long long time.

Maxpfizer

osarusan wrote: »

It obviously does matter to plenty of people on this thread, whose interest in the incident very much depends on whether it can be portrayed as race-related or not.

It has been said repeatedly on the thread that there are racist comments on the video. I have watched it, sickening as it was, but didn't hear any racist comments, at least in the video I saw.

I think it's kind of irrelevant. We don't really know the motivations of those who committed the crime. It just seems like people look at the race, gender, sexual orientation or religion of those involved in any given incident and then form a narrative based on that.

What's most disturbing to me is that we live in a time where a group of people will actually record evidence of themselves assaulting and almost killing another person and will go out and share that evidence. Like it's just a normal event to record and share.

Similar to when there was a story about two women being attacked on a bus in London. Nobody is asking how the hell we are in a situation where a bunch of kids are perfectly comfortable beating up two women on public transport and running off into the night. Instead it's a debate on whether or not the attack was homophobic.

Strange because, in relative terms, we don't live in a particularly violent society so the acts of violence alone should be enough to outrage us. Especially the very open and almost performative nature of the violence. Instead it's almost like the violence is not such a big deal really but the motivations behind it could possibly be a big deal if we've got an "ism" or a "phobia" attached.

I think there was a thread here about youths in North Dublin beating people up in a park and there was a lot of humming and hawing about the circumstances of the area and the idea that listen these kids are poor and don't have any prospects etc. Right, but they are still victimizing people. I suspect if those kids were caught on Facebook posting far right nonsense or racially abusing people on Twitter then there would be FAR less sympathy for their lack of education or lack of decent upbringing or role models etc.

Riesen_Meal

Hamachi wrote: »

Seriously?

Cop on to yourself and have some respect for the poor kid and his family.

Are you for real?

I'm on the kids side here, this tweet was proved to be fake as someone went to reset the password on the account and it was linked to one of them NP nutters...

grassylawn

Fieldog wrote: »

Are you for real?

I'm on the kids side here, this tweet was proved to be fake as someone went to reset the password on the account and it was linked to one of them NP nutters...

He thinks you were saying you thought the tweet was worse than the attack. Not sure how he took that from it, but sometimes read what they expect to be said and not what's written down.

Hamachi

grassylawn wrote: »

He thinks you were saying you thought the tweet was worse than the attack. Not sure how he took that from it, but sometimes read what they expect to be said and not what's written down.

I don’t need you to interpret my posts. I’m not sure who ‘they’ are, but I don’t have any affiliation.

I’m disgusted by the savagery of this attack. The attempts of several posters to deflect from or downplay the horrific nature of the incident, in case it fans the flames of their imagined far right insurgence, is at best tone deaf and at worst, appallingly disrespectful to the victim and his family.

The previous poster has clarified that he unequivocally supports the poor lad. That’s good enough for me.

V8 Interceptor

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

I listened to the video once and couldn't make out any racism

If you watched a video of a gang of Irish lads cutting a black boy up on the ground would you make out any racism?

coinop wrote: »

Wow...we were all well aware of the political leanings of the admins and mods of this site but I'm a bit stunned to see you dismiss this racial aspect of this attempted murder so casually. This beats Dav's infamous "right wing opinions are dangerous" gaffe. Screencap that quote folks for when it inevitably gets edited or when the backpedaling begins.

We have no recourse. They have the power and can be as hypocritical as they wish.

corks finest

Tipperary animal lover wrote: »

I can agree 100% with you cork finest, my husband is an old friend of the young fellas father, they're a very quiet family and this really knocked the the young lads self confidence, this was an on going occurrence weekends before this beating and it took for the quiet young fella to be horrendously beating for it to stop.

Yes you're 100 pc ref the kids background, nice ordinary family, the attackers were feral delinquents without proper parental supervision, who were acting the bollox in Ballincollig, carrigaline, mount oval for at least 2 years, posting their nastiness and racism regular, and the only reason they weren't taken to task was the colour of their skin, no other

Kermit.de.frog

Don't care whether racist attack or not. 18 months is clearly ridiculous. Honestly there should be protests and marches over the so-called "justice system" in this country.

Even if they do go to jail and get longer sentences sure it's 3 meals a day, comfy bed, television etc...home from home for them.

Kid gloves everywhere.

Jokeshop.