2020/21 NBA season + Olympics

jk23

Corvo wrote: »

I'm pretty sure LeBron said a few weeks ago he doesn't care about individual awards, but for a man that doesn't, he sure looks like hes pushing for an MVP.

No Davis last night either! I would have thought the resting would be the other way round!

He has it more or less sewn up now...nearly halfway through the games now he is definitely getting it

LuckyLloyd

Corvo wrote: »

I'm pretty sure LeBron said a few weeks ago he doesn't care about individual awards, but for a man that doesn't, he sure looks like hes pushing for an MVP.

No Davis last night either! I would have thought the resting would be the other way round!

In fairness, he did say he was disappointed to lose out last year.

He's playing out of his mind. We are privileged to witness this. Surely this is the last year he can do this?

chopperbyrne

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Surely this is the last year he can do this?

Just like Tom Brady, I think LeBron has a few years left in him yet, and Lakers could well win again this year, and maybe even next year, depending on how post season trades go.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

In fairness, he did say he was disappointed to lose out last year.

He's playing out of his mind. We are privileged to witness this. Surely this is the last year he can do this?

I think it depends what you define as "this", if that means exactly how he is currently playing then he probably can't as the schedule will be longer next year, he'll lose a little more athleticism, maybe higher injury risk and so forth

However, given how he continues to reinvent himself subtly without sacrificing his game, I can't see a scenario where he's not elite ie Top 10 for another 3 years.

Duncan did it to an extent where he had one of the highest Defensive win shares in the league the year he retired, I can see LBJ doing something similar where he retires having led the league in assists at 40 for example.

My thoughts are he retires when he is clearly not the best player on a championship team. Once AD is clearly Batman, then I think he calls it a day.

Coneygree

I think if Bronny can develop into a player NBA teams will be wiling to take a gamble on, then he'll stay around until he's in the league. He's made it no secret he'd like to play on the same team as his son. If LeBron keeps up this level of form, that's years draft will be a side piece to the LeBron sweepstakes!!

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

Coneygree wrote: »

I think if Bronny can develop into a player NBA teams will be wiling to take a gamble on, then he'll stay around until he's in the league. He's made it no secret he'd like to play on the same team as his son. If LeBron keeps up this level of form, that's years draft will be a side piece to the LeBron sweepstakes!!

It’s interesting, he’ll definitely get drafted for the reasons you mention alone

Imagine being in the front office trying to decide at what point do we forego the more talented player to draft Bronny so you can have the most marketable athlete in the game for a yearlong family swansong.

Let’s see the NBA work that into the Draft Lottery

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

So good down the stretch again, clutch 3 in the 4th to tie it up.

Great draw of the defence in OT to kick to the corner and then the interception at the end leading to a 1pt win

3 OT wins on the bounce without AD

Great win against the Pelicans

LaVine and Coby in that form consistently...

46 and 30 points.

First duo in NBA history to both hit 8+ threes in a game. 17 threes between them.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

Deleted User wrote: »

Great win against the Pelicans

LaVine and Coby in that form consistently...

46 and 30 points.

First duo in NBA history to both hit 8+ threes in a game. 17 threes between them.

Big fan of White since his college days but he is just so streaky. Jacked up 17 3's himself last night.

Great to watch when he's on but I'd say as a coach/fan he is frustrating at times.

Livia Scarce Peppercorn

Livia Scarce Peppercorn wrote: »

Big fan of White since his college days but he is just so streaky. Jacked up 17 3's himself last night.

Great to watch when he's on but I'd say as a coach/fan he is frustrating at times.

I have never toed-and-froed on a player so much.

I convince myself that he'll never be a point guard and is more suited to shooting guard.

Then he'll come out and have a couple of great games at PG and I'll think "****, he's only 20, he still has a lot of learning ahead of him".

Then I'll post this...

Deleted User wrote: »

We (Bulls) are in desperate need of a PG.

Then he'll come out and play like he played last night :pac:


One thing I am consistent on though...I do not want to get rid of him - far too much talent and potential in someone that only turns 21 next week.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

Deleted User wrote: »

I have never toed-and-froed on a player so much.

I convince myself that he'll never be a point guard and is more suited to shooting guard.

Then he'll come out and have a couple of great games at PG and I'll think "****, he's only 20, he still has a lot of learning ahead of him".

Then I'll post this...



Then he'll come out and play like he played last night :pac:


One thing I am consistent on though...I do not want to get rid of him - far too much talent and potential in someone that only turns 21 next week.

My exact thoughts too, a less bouncy LaVine perhaps. If you could get Lonzo without giving him up, I'd be interested in seeing that pair.


The Bulls need some Vets more than almost any team in the league

https://twitter.com/statmuse/status/1359719196540563460

pjohnson

I think the Lakers are playing LeBron too much tbh. Now obviously he is delivering well but the fact is he is 36, they dont want him gassed out for play offs by over using him now.


I would be dangling Schröder to see if anyone would offer up a good alternate for James to ease his minutes. I dont think Schröder has done as well as many expected.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

pjohnson wrote: »

I think the Lakers are playing LeBron too much tbh. Now obviously he is delivering well but the fact is he is 36, they dont want him gassed out for play offs by over using him now.


I would be dangling Schröder to see if anyone would offer up a good alternate for James to ease his minutes. I dont think Schröder has done as well as many expected.

He hasn’t made any progression and he’s been a little inefficient at times but that was known. Lack of efficiency is primarily driven by a massive dip in his 3pt% so hopefully that is a little variance and things balance out.

Not sure what’s out there but whatever it is you’d probably need to be taking on a contract. He’s 15.5m expiring so unless you’re sure the guy you want you’ll want next year, it might be better to stand pat.

Lowry was a trade I read but it meant sending KCP & Harrell in the other direction but he’s in final year too so not terrible. Something like that would depend on how confident you are of what buyouts will be available and your chances of luring them to the Lakers

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

A potential trade I could get onboard with that I think suits both teams might be Schroder, Kuzma & picks-if required- for D’Angelo Russell.

I think Russell could progress under LBJ’s tutelage, back closer to his Nets form. It would also give Russell plenty of scoring opportunity against 2nd units and take some offensive load off LBJ plus you have extra legit 3 pt shooting.

On the T-wolves side you have the opportunity to let Edwards off the lease and see what he can do as primary wing alongside a pass heavy guard like Rubio who can help him defensively.

Kuzma owed 13m through 3-4 years which isn’t ideal but not so bad you can’t sell it as he’s not that old.
Lakers might feel Russell is worth a shot if the T-wolves think that KAT isn’t enamoured by the Russell pair but might be happy if he likes what he sees from Edwards.

There’s the Russell history of course but I think that could be gotten over on both sides provided Swaggy P isn’t signed as an FA :pac:

kmart6

Not a hope in hell that's happening.

ButtersSuki

Livia Scarce Peppercorn wrote: »

A potential trade I could get onboard with that I think suits both teams might be Schroder, Kuzma & picks-if required- for D’Angelo Russell.

I think Russell could progress under LBJ’s tutelage, back closer to his Nets form. It would also give Russell plenty of scoring opportunity against 2nd units and take some offensive load off LBJ plus you have extra legit 3 pt shooting.

On the T-wolves side you have the opportunity to let Edwards off the lease and see what he can do as primary wing alongside a pass heavy guard like Rubio who can help him defensively.

Kuzma owed 13m through 3-4 years which isn’t ideal but not so bad you can’t sell it as he’s not that old.
Lakers might feel Russell is worth a shot if the T-wolves think that KAT isn’t enamoured by the Russell pair but might be happy if he likes what he sees from Edwards.

There’s the Russell history of course but I think that could be gotten over on both sides provided Swaggy P isn’t signed as an FA :pac:

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

kmart6 wrote: »

Not a hope in hell that's happening.

LOL, yeah I know it’s not happening. Me getting on board with it is very different to thinking it could actually be executed.
T-wolves not giving up after 1 season, that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t though.

*FWIW and why I don’t think its a bad idea for the T-wolves to move on and why this type of package would be enough.

Russell had plenty of opportunity with KAT out to lead the TWolves but ended up with
19.5ppg, with a 0.042 ws/48, 0.4 VORP, 0.4 BPM owed 30m for 3 years

Compare with
Schroder 14.4 ppg with a 0.102 ws/48, 0.0 VORP, -2.0 BPM 15m for 1 year
Kuzma 10.9 ppg with a 0.104 ws/48, 0.2 VORP, -0.9 BPM 13m for 3+1 years

Key figure here is the win shares, Russell really has regressed. He has scope to improve but despite efficient enough shooting the numbers and eye test show a guy with no interest and not worth close to 90m over the next 3 years.

As I said, I don’t think it happens but it really isn’t as crazy as it seems when you actually look at the production hence my hypothetical scenario.

ButtersSuki

pjohnson wrote: »

I think the Lakers are playing LeBron too much tbh. Now obviously he is delivering well but the fact is he is 36, they dont want him gassed out for play offs by over using him now.


I would be dangling Schröder to see if anyone would offer up a good alternate for James to ease his minutes. I dont think Schröder has done as well as many expected.

Well one thing you can be sure of is it's not happening without his input or approval. Despite his claims that he doesn't care about individual awards it's very clear he does and he's absolutely gunning for MVP this year for the narrative that would create round his GOAT legacy.

It's a very dangerous game to be putting up minutes like that at his age. I know he's in incredible shape and is a supreme athlete, but there really is zero need for him to be playing these minutes in a shortened season coming so close after the Finals.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Well one thing you can be sure of is it's not happening without his input or approval. Despite his claims that he doesn't care about individual awards it's very clear he does and he's absolutely gunning for MVP this year for the narrative that would create round his GOAT legacy.

It's a very dangerous game to be putting up minutes like that at his age. I know he's in incredible shape and is a supreme athlete, but there really is zero need for him to be playing these minutes in a shortened season coming so close after the Finals.

It’s been a little out of necessity too, they had 3 OT wins with AD out. It’s a very competitive race for the top few places in the West.

He’s surely chasing it but this isn’t Westbrook MVP year or anything, he is doing what his team requires for an easier path come playoff time. It’s still a win first situation.

It’s really a false narrative anyway, despite playing 3 games of 40+ mins he is still only averaging 34.7 mins a game which is his 2nd lowest of his career after last year which was 34.6

Assuming no injury to AD he’ll end the year with his lowest regular season mins average and I’m guessing the lowest of any MVP ever.

ButtersSuki

Livia Scarce Peppercorn wrote: »

It’s been a little out of necessity too, they had 3 OT wins with AD out. It’s a very competitive race for the top few places in the West.

He’s surely chasing it but this isn’t Westbrook MVP year or anything, he is doing what his team requires for an easier path come playoff time. It’s still a win first situation.

It’s really a false narrative anyway, despite playing 3 games of 40+ mins he is still only averaging 34.7 mins a game which is his 2nd lowest of his career after last year which was 34.6

Assuming no injury to AD he’ll end the year with his lowest regular season mins average and I’m guessing the lowest of any MVP ever.

By advanced stats even with chasing it he’s behind Embiid and Jokic. But neither of those have his profile, the LA media, Klutch and LeBron himself pushing the narrative.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

ButtersSuki wrote: »

By advanced stats even with chasing it he’s behind Embiid and Jokic. But neither of those have his profile, the LA media, Klutch and LeBron himself pushing the narrative.

I saw something a couple of weeks ago that had Jokic as a 41% probability which is too high but I agree LBJ isn’t my pick.

Jokic & Embiid for me too. I think Jokic could win if the Nuggets get homecourt but I don’t see Embiid winning.

jk23

I have him as MVP really because of the teams record and his overall performance has been impressive when AD has been out. There was a straw poll taken lately in the US and he is ahead of Jokic and Embid ...

https://fansided.com/2021/02/11/lebron-james-mvp-favorite-espn-straw-poll/amp/

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

jk23 wrote: »

I have him as MVP really because of the teams record and his overall performance has been impressive when AD has been out. There was a straw poll taken lately in the US and he is ahead of Jokic and Embid ...

https://fansided.com/2021/02/11/lebron-james-mvp-favorite-espn-straw-poll/amp/

https://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/mvp.html

Numbers have
Jokic 39.6%
Embiid 14.5%
LBJ 14.4%

I’d have Jokic as the favourite but not by that much. LBJ really has the narrative going for him and I think that’s fair enough. He has been great with AD out, his production is great and his team are winning.

If the Nuggets get 4th, it’ll be close, any lower and it’s LBJ’s

jk23

Livia Scarce Peppercorn wrote: »

https://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/mvp.html

Numbers have
Jokic 39.6%
Embiid 14.5%
LBJ 14.4%

I’d have Jokic as the favourite but not by that much. LBJ really has the narrative going for him and I think that’s fair enough. He has been great with AD out, his production is great and his team are winning.

If the Nuggets get 4th, it’ll be close, any lower and it’s LBJ’s

Do you think LeBron deserves it? How do you think it will affect the goat debate? I am going to say yes but I agree with you about Jokic, has been fantastic ..but is a bit of a victim of the Nuggets not upgrading their roster this year to keep up with the two LA sides.

ButtersSuki

Jeez, miracles never cease. The NBA gave LeBron a warning for flopping after his “hilarious” flop in the Grizzlies game last week.

Next he’ll be called for a travel or a technical for complaining. :rolleyes:

ButtersSuki

jk23 wrote: »

Do you think LeBron deserves it? How do you think it will affect the goat debate? I am going to say yes but I agree with you about Jokic, has been fantastic ..but is a bit of a victim of the Nuggets not upgrading their roster this year to keep up with the two LA sides.

No. But that doesn’t mean he won’t get it as he’ll have a better narrative than Jokic who plays for a small market team that are barely .500 at the moment.

tyivpc5qjx0f2b

jk23 wrote: »

Do you think LeBron deserves it? How do you think it will affect the goat debate? I am going to say yes but I agree with you about Jokic, has been fantastic ..but is a bit of a victim of the Nuggets not upgrading their roster this year to keep up with the two LA sides.

Yeah they should be creating a Beal focused package if they feel this is the time to win. I don’t hate waiting but Harris hasn’t progressed and there are question marks over Porter Jr.
If I really felt Porter would be a legit 3rd best player next year then fair enough but this is Millsaps last year too so that needs to be considered.

I mean I honestly don’t think the GOAT debate will change even if he wins MVP & another title.
I don’t mean it won’t change the credentials but I think the group willing to change their opinions now is pretty small.

If you have LBJ, things can pretty much only go up unless a Dallasesque thing happens so you’re set and if you have MJ you have potential future LBJ success already considered and 6-0 reigns supreme for you.

I don’t think much else he does changes the debate for people watching things unfold now tbh.

*Sorry didn’t answer MVP piece, if standings/stats stay the same then yes he should win but if the Nuggets get homecourt then I’d have Jokic.
Embiid is out for me because he doesn’t make his teammates that much better

jk23

ButtersSuki wrote: »

No. But that doesn’t mean he won’t get it as he’ll have a better narrative than Jokic who plays for a small market team that are barely .500 at the moment.

That flop versus the grizzlies was actually embarrassing. I know there are superstar calls but that one was ridiculous.

Kevin Garnett came out with a comment a few days ago also saying that he doesn't think guards from 20 years ago would be able to play in today's game which is correct on terms of how the game has changed but...

It's also very disrespectful to the guards in the 90s some of them I think would have been good on either era but I suppose Garnett played in both eras so he can give an accurate summation

jk23

Livia Scarce Peppercorn wrote: »

Yeah they should be creating a Beal focused package if they feel this is the time to win. I don’t hate waiting but Harris hasn’t progressed and there are question marks over Porter Jr.
If I really felt Porter would be a legit 3rd best player next year then fair enough but this is Millsaps last year too so that needs to be considered.

I mean I honestly don’t think the GOAT debate will change even if he wins MVP & another title.
I don’t mean it won’t change the credentials but I think the group willing to change their opinions now is pretty small.

If you have LBJ, things can pretty much only go up unless a Dallasesque thing happens so you’re set and if you have MJ you have potential future LBJ success already considered and 6-0 reigns supreme for you.

I don’t think much else he does changes the debate for people watching things unfold now tbh.

I really think if the clippers can get Kyle Lowry they would have a fantastic chance they need to have some cap space to either retain Zubac or get a serviceable big though.

I was always a Jordan is the goat guy but I have been influenced by the media a bit it's been so much in your face by espn/YouTube/sports sites lately that you start to doubt and believe maybe Jordan isn't the goat.

The narrative is not only about LeBron but about Jordan playing against plumbers/ white guys which is absolutely ridiculous as the NBA was full time professional league well into Jordans title wins....