Man Shot by Gardai in Clonee

Mr_Muffin

people will always back/support their own. For example, if the kids in my local area are causing trouble everyone is outraged and calls for action on social media, but as soon as they find out their own kid is involved it quickly turns into "my little angel wouldn't do anything like that how dare you accuse him of being a little scumbag".

Same thing going on here. Guy rampages with a knife and all of a sudden protests are being organised in his defence.

olestoepoke

I feel for the Garda, traumatic enough experience, one stab or slash in the right place and you're toast. Then having to deal with the possible backlash. Will he be publicly named? I'm sure he didn't go into work yesterday morning thinking he'd take someones life. Awful situation for him and I hope he gets the support he needs to get through it.

seamus

No issues with McEntees tweet here tbh. The death of anyone by a Garda on duty should be considered a tragedy. It's not a statement on whether the death was avoidable, merely a statement that it's regrettable and that all persons are equal before the law, regardless of what they may have done.

It's kind of standard we should continue to hold the state to; justice is not served when a life is lost, and when it does happen it should only be when there are no other options.

begbysback

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

He was asked to drop his weapon , he was pepper sprayed and trasered and still tried to attack a guard. What else could they have done?

I don’t have the answer, I have no hostility management expertise. Someone else out there is responsible for situations like this where a man loses his life. My responsibility here is not to accept blindly, and ask if it was necessary.

um7y1h83ge06nx

BnB wrote: »

I think that's very unfair. Obviously as a Minister for justice she cannot just come out and tweet exactly what 99.99% of the people in the country think. She has to appear balanced. But her tweet very clearly says her thoughts are with everyone who was involved in the incident and not just the dead man's family. i.e. The innocent victims and the Gardai also.

I think to be honest, that she has handled it very well.

Describing his death as a tragedy implies a leaning towards him being a victim. He had the power to prevent this from happening. If he didn't rob that shop, if he didn't act aggressively with a weapon etc. I'm sure he would be alive today.

His death is his responsibility, nothing tragic about that.

zerosugarbuzz

THE_SHEEP wrote: »

I was just wondering, how long before the " shinners " were somehow brought into this debate ?

Suppose , gotta deflect somehow from the Minister for Justice , and her chucking of the Gardai under the bus .

We’re you now, as it goes I voted from them at the last two elections. Just agreeing with another posts comments on populism and politicians being out of touch with the opinions of the population.

Plumbthedepths

begbysback wrote: »

I don’t have the answer, I have no hostility management expertise. Someone else out there is responsible for situations like this where a man loses his life. My responsibility here is not to accept blindly, and ask if it was necessary.

So you feel more should have been done but don’t know what?
Easy to second guess the decision from the comfort of a keyboard without having to worry about consequences.

ThewhiteJesus

Weepsie wrote: »

Again a moderator of another forum. There's nothing hypocritical in what I said though. Nothing whatsoever.

No need for name calling but if it looks like a duck and all that. Apologies, I'll revert to thinking you're willfully ignorant

More name calling.
I'm glad you're not holding a gun you seem to have very little control.

sydthebeat

Flynn Immense Rationalization wrote: »

Describing his death as a tragedy implies a leaning towards him being a victim. He had the power to prevent this from happening. If he didn't rob that shop, if he didn't act aggressively with a weapon etc. I'm sure he would be alive today.

His death is his responsibility, nothing tragic about that.

Your definition of tragedy is wrong, therefore your reaction to it is disproportionate.

Its right to describe the incident as tragic. That doesn't absolve the victim of their responsibility for the situation.

ThewhiteJesus

begbysback wrote: »

I don’t have the answer, I have no hostility management expertise. Someone else out there is responsible for situations like this where a man loses his life. My responsibility here is not to accept blindly, and ask if it was necessary.

I agree, and as Sierra said a bit back, body cams would really really help in situations like this, for everyone involved.

Jimbob1977

Disappointed that The Lord Mayor of Dublin has effectively tried and sentenced the Gardai on social media.

It is unbecoming of the office.

Vulcan01

Tzardine wrote: »

For the person that said shoot the legs.

I just saw the video.

He was still standing and swinging the knife at gardai after 4 shots to the body.

The 5th shot took him down.

Surely this statement is full of holes.

Jinglejangle69

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

Disappointed that The Lord Mayor of Dublin has effectively tried and sentenced the Gardai on social media.

It is unbecoming of the office.

She needs removing.

carq

His death is not a tragedy.
It is regrettable or unfortunate but not a tragedy.

JeffKenna

ThewhiteJesus wrote: »

I agree, and as Sierra said a bit back, body cams would really really help in situations like this, for everyone involved.

Lucky we have footage of this situation and know the truth.

um7y1h83ge06nx

sydthebeat wrote: »

Your definition of tragedy is wrong, therefore your reaction to it is disproportionate.

Its right to describe the incident as tragic. That doesn't absolve the victim of their responsibility for the situation.

But you see this is where the narrative is going wrong. You describe him yourself as a "victim".

Although maybe I'm wrong and just "victim blaming" the poor lad.

THE_SHEEP

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

We’re you now, as it goes I voted from them at the last two elections. Just agreeing with another posts comments on populism and politicians being out of touch with the opinions of the population.

My apologies . I assumed ( wrongly ) you were " another one of those guys " , who use every opportunity to blame the " bad shinners " for everything .

Gruffalux

seamus wrote: »

No issues with McEntees tweet here tbh. The death of anyone by a Garda on duty should be considered a tragedy. It's not a statement on whether the death was avoidable, merely a statement that it's regrettable and that all persons are equal before the law, regardless of what they may have done.

It's kind of standard we should continue to hold the state to; justice is not served when a life is lost, and when it does happen it should only be when there are no other options.

That could be argued and I can see that. But I think the tone is wrong and is politically motivated.
To compare to another recent killing by Gardai to check tone -
Mark Hennessy murdered Jastine Valdez. He also carried a knife when confronted by gardai. George Nchenko had badly beaten a shop keeper (plus other savage attacks recently) and carried a knife.
Both Nchenko and Hennessy were violent criminals shot by gardai in the line of duty.
If the Minister of Justice had tweeted in response to Mark Hennessy's shooting ....

The events in Cherrywood yesterday were extremely traumatic and my thoughts are with everyone involved.

Mark Hennessy’s death is a tragedy, and I want to extend my sympathy to his family, friends and community and to all involved in yesterday’s events.

...I would have found that tweet to be very ''off''.

Leafyellow111

They are protesting outside the garda station in Blanchardstown, no social distancing of course. That's ok though, for some reason Covid doesn't spread at things like that so they can do it despite lockdown. Also Covid disproportionately harms non white people and spreads more among them because it's a racist virus.

Snake Plisken

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

Disappointed that The Lord Mayor of Dublin has effectively tried and sentenced the Gardai on social media.

It is unbecoming of the office.

She is not fit for office and she does a disservice to the Chinese community here who are a good hardworking community.

PukkaStukka

The narrative of this event is being disingenuously portrayed or conflated on Social Media by some as being a BLM issue and I'm relieved to see that many are calling this out as not being anything as such. It's absurd to claim this in a country that in itself is not inherently racist, with a routinely unarmed police force, and one where more Gardai have died in recent times than people it's confronted.

Be right back

Leafyellow111 wrote: »

They are protesting outside the garda station in Blanchardstown, no social distancing of course. That's ok though, for some reason Covid doesn't spread at things like that so they can do it despite lockdown. Also Covid disproportionately harms non white people and spreads more among them because it's a racist virus.

Is there many at it?

sydthebeat

Flynn Immense Rationalization wrote: »

But you see this is where the narrative is going wrong. You describe him yourself as a "victim".

Although maybe I'm wrong and just "victim blaming" the poor lad.

Again, it's your understanding of words that is incorrect.

You seem to think victim absolves any guilt... It's doesn't.

A victim is simply a person that's harmed.

A tragedy is an event which causes suffering.

Both these are true, without absolving that knife welder from the responsibility of causing the situation and resolution.

Plumbthedepths

JeffKenna wrote: »

Lucky we have footage of this situation and know the truth.

Unedited at that, which is rare when AGS are involved.Usually the citizen journalists only upload their recordings to show a certain narrative.

Snake Plisken

No social distancing here bring in the riot police and start arresting some of these absolute clowns

https://twitter.com/CentralCookie/status/1344600475434418177?s=19

Cilldara_2000

So much of the reaction to this is disappointing but luckily social media, whether here or twitter, is only a tiny subset of society, much of it well extreme.

The chest thumping "it's not a tragedy" brigade glorying in a man's death are as bad as the SJW, race card playing Trots on twitter. This is a tragedy. All reasonable people will see it as that but they will also reject the people trying to bring US style race politics into this incident.

sligojoek

Tpcl20 wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/man-dies-after-being-shot-by-garda%C3%AD-following-standoff-in-co-dublin-1.4447470

He was wielding a knife in his garden and the gardaí tried to subdue him with non-lethal force before they shot at him five times, hitting him three times and killing him.

His family were in the house at the time but have been brought elsewhere.

A crazy situation with a very unfortunate outcome. Stuff like this happens here rarely enough that it's still shocking to me. I hope this isn't a precedent, especially after seeing the force with which the stupid gurriers on the Luas throwing bottles were manhandled off it.

I know the Gardaí like everyone else are at the end of their tether at the moment, but there's a worrying increase in violent apprehensions of offenders. Fair enough if it's warranted, but that guy literally brought a knife to a gun fight.

"Literally brought a knife to a gunfight"

No he didn't. He brought a knife to a shop/post office to terrorise staff and steal money.

begbysback

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

So you feel more should have been done but don’t know what?
Easy to second guess the decision from the comfort of a keyboard without having to worry about consequences.

Same as you, no expertise in these situations, and second hand reports of the incident, with some out of context clips. My role here in a functional society is to earn money and pay tax, so we can have a police force, and believe me I pay more than average taxes. When a mans life is taken, by a member of the police force, which are held accountable to the general public, then yes, from the comfort of my keyboard I can question, challenge, and hold to account those who are accountable to me.

BnB

Flynn Immense Rationalization wrote: »

Describing his death as a tragedy implies a leaning towards him being a victim. He had the power to prevent this from happening. If he didn't rob that shop, if he didn't act aggressively with a weapon etc. I'm sure he would be alive today.

His death is his responsibility, nothing tragic about that.

Firstly, just to be clear, I am one of the 99% who believes the Gardai did their job here and I support them 100%. I am only defending Helen McEntee's tweet.

Let's face it, given her position she could not just come straight out and say what you have said above, as much as she may agree with it.

If you look at her tweet, she doesn't describe yer man's death as a tragedy.... She clearly describes the events in Hartstown as a tragedy and that her thoughts are with everyone involved. I think that is very carefully constructed to not try and glorify yer mans death and to say this was a sh1t situation for everyone involved including the mans family, his innocent victims and the Gardai that had to deal with it.

I just think, given her position, it is a carefully well constructed tweet.

Humberto Salazar

The pitchfork and firebrand mob has assembled. How quickly this has turned into a race issue. Certain left wing politicians must be delighted. It's quite disgusting. Let due process take place. A serious and tragic incident took place, it will be examined properly, not by politicians or baying crowds.