George Nkencho shooting *Mod warning Added to OP*

NIMAN

No mention on the news tonight.

I think that's good handling of it by rte.
Don't get involved.
Let it pass, let the investigation run it's course.
Don't report any protests.

It'll gradually fade away until social media jumps on the next bandwagon.

Steve012

Aubrey Faint Limo wrote: »

Anyone know when the funeral is on? Should be wonderful, expecting a guard of honour, a call to arms, a bit of hate speech, clashing with Gardai. All that good stuff.

sonic's cold on a new years, would Garda be even present man? never thought they would unless called if something kicked off.

Gothic Insanity

Gothic Insanity wrote: »

Papers seemed to confirm today a broken jaw and nose.

Which you don't get in a knife attack. He could also have slash wounds to the face.

Would you hire a security guard with visible slash injuries on his face?

Mad_maxx

Amirani wrote: »

Essentially this. Social media has really just laid bare how stupid a notable cohort of the population can be. You'll only drive yourself insane in by caring what people are saying on it, because so much of it is just made up of idiots and by people playing politics to those idiots.

As we've seen again and again, it's not representative of wider society (thank ****).

it doesnt have to be representative , the media is not representative of broader public opinion either yet has a vastly more disproportionate influence over government policy

Hercule Poirot

I don't understand how BLM is now a movement in Ireland

America yes, there have been countless incidents where black men were killed unlawfully by the cops - while the likes of George Floyd may not have been the Sunday school angels they were made out to be at the same time they did not deserve to die the way they did and while the movement didn't change my life one way or another I was generally supportive of an end to the systemic racism that exists in America

But here's the thing, Ireland is not a racist country - yes there'll be people who tell black jokes and share racist memes on WhatsApp, I'm not saying that no one in Ireland is a racist - but as a nation, as a state, we are bending over backwards to accommodate ethnic minorities - sometimes too much in my honest opinion.

There is no need for a BLM movement here, we are not America - but if this nonsense continues - if people George Nkencho are held up as examples of police brutality, racial bias then quite simply we are fùcked

Hamachi

Hamachi wrote: »

Same here. Good to see the fund for Wayne increasing steadily. One of the true victims in this scenario will at least have the comfort of knowing that many people support him.

It would be great if there was also a way to convey thanks to the Garda who did a stellar job, protecting Irish society from a violent criminal.

Write to the minister for justice (who by the way has zero real life experience) and the commissioner.

When a person writes in, the Garda in question gets a copy of the letter and it can mean a lot.

oldtimeyfella

Deleted User wrote: »

Which you don't get in a knife attack. He could also have slash wounds to the face.

Would you hire a security guard with visible slash injuries on his face?

A machete to the face could easily break you nose and jaw amoung other injuries.

corks finest

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Which you don't get in a knife attack. He could also have slash wounds to the face.

Would you hire a security guard with visible slash injuries on his face?

Saw his face not nice

corks finest

corks finest wrote: »

Saw his face not nice

There's a picture doing the rounds that is not him, it's an English football fan.

corks finest

piplip87 wrote: »

Credit must go to the employers around Blanchardstown area. Letting all the protesters take two hours off everyday to protest outside the Garda Station..

That'll be the ruination of them and WORK

NIMAN

corks finest wrote: »

Saw his face not nice

Where did you see it?

Or was it the picture of the football fan in England again.

RWCNT

RWCNT wrote: »

A lot of people on Twitter going full steam with the narrative of his brother calling for the death of the Guard off the back of the video with incorrect subtitles.

The lad clearly says "And I want that fed, whoever he was, that shot him. I want him termina..I want his contract terminated". He even corrected himself mid-sentence to clarify. Granted, the end bit of "When we find him...*crowd cheers*" is ominous-sounding but it's not the blatant incitement to violence that the subtitling makes it out to be.

Reminds me of when Ozzy was up in court in America because some young lad killed himself after listening to his album and a lawyer was insisting in court that the final line of "Paranoid" by Black Sabbath was "I tell you to end your life" and not "I tell you to enjoy life".

Whatever about the man who died, his bereaved family don't deserve to be misquoted and attacked.

Yep, that changes everything. He absolutely meant 'contract terminated' because that's absolutely how normal people say 'fired'

corks finest

[Deleted User] wrote: »

There's a picture doing the rounds that is not him, it's an English football fan.

Not this, and it's the side of his face

Gothic Insanity

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Which you don't get in a knife attack. He could also have slash wounds to the face.

Would you hire a security guard with visible slash injuries on his face?

Knife or no knife he assaulted someone and still did a lot of damage.

Personally I would find work if I had suitable work for any employee, that's what any good employer would do.

This guy didn't deserve to be injured!!

Spanish Eyes

You would think that Mam and/or Dad in their grief would demand that this circus be shut off. Can’t understand it myself, how a sibling could just go out with a megaphone a day later and foment anger at our Gardai.

It is awful, and the support from those who should know better is disgusting. Tell the truth. Truth matters to all of us.

oldtimeyfella

oldtimeyfella wrote: »

A machete to the face could easily break you nose and jaw amoung other injuries.

My point is, the scars a machete to the face could leave horrific visible scarring that a broken nose wouldn't.

Renjit

jrosen wrote: »

I actually don’t think there should ever be a case where a fundraising account can be started and cashed out when the person it’s started for is a criminal.
Granted anyone can start one but once concerns are raised I believe it should be frozen and monies refunded if and when criminal liability is recognized

That's not how profit making works. gofundme gets the cut out of every fundraiser :pac:

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

My point is, the scars a machete to the face could leave horrific visible scarring that a broken nose wouldn't.

It would likely kill you.

weldoninhio

tara73 wrote: »

so if the shots were no warning shots, it's safe to say that there are in general several shots (like 5 here) from a professional gun and a professionally trained person necessary to bring a human being down, from a very short distance, which has a knife in his hands like here (not a gun themselvves), that it's no danger anymore?


Sorry, but I still can't bring myself to believe this. somethings not right with this.

You shoot until the threat is neutralised. You can see from the video the 5th shot, 3rd one to hit him, is the one that puts him to the ground

Burkie1203

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

You would think that Mam and/or Dad in their grief would demand that this circus be shut off. Can’t understand it myself, how a sibling could just go out with a megaphone a day later and foment anger at our Gardai.

It is awful, and the support from those who should know better is disgusting. Tell the truth. Truth matters to all of us.

The father hadn't been mentioned at all

The brother says he now has to look after his mother and family. I presume he will now become a 100 conviction petty career criminal who never sees the inside of the Joy.

Mimon

Amirani wrote: »

Essentially this. Social media has really just laid bare how stupid a notable cohort of the population can be. You'll only drive yourself insane in by caring what people are saying on it, because so much of it is just made up of idiots and by people playing politics to those idiots.

As we've seen again and again, it's not representative of wider society (thank ****).

Don't know about that, did you see how many people voted for SF in the last election.

malinheader

Granadino wrote: »

Were they anti immigration? What heritage are we losing? Most of our population haven’t bothered their arse to even revive our language over the last 100 years or so...

They most certainly probably would be anti immigration when it is for mostly a social welfare aspect and not for work. And some chance reviving our language, our government would probably put more effort into learning the language of our migrants for multiculturalism of course.

RWCNT

Burkie1203 wrote: »

"I want him finished"

"When we find him .... yeah"


Thats a fairly blatant and direct message. Why would they want to find him?



You can try dress it up any way you want. Its a clear threat.

https://twitter.com/EmmaMurphy12150/status/1345027279919984640?s=19

I can't refer back to the original video as it's been taken down, but I believe he said "I want him finished" after saying "I want his contract terminated", so I took it in that sense. I admit the "When we find him" doesn't sound great, but it's in the context of a speech where he says he wants justice for his brother and the termination of the guard's employment. You can choose to take it a number of ways, it's nowhere near the level of the statement "I want him dead" which was falsely attributed to him in the video.

To be honest, I wouldn't be shocked in the slightest if that's what the guy is thinking. His brother has just died - I'd probably be completely in denial of everything and filled with blind fury myself. But an attempt to misquote him as openly saying "I want him dead" is disgusting.

@Punisher/the Twitter vid from Burkie - Your comment/the vid has nothing do with what I'm saying, so I have no comment. For all I know the family are a right shower, doesn't mean they should be misquoted as openly calling for the death of public servants.

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Yep, that changes everything. He absolutely meant 'contract terminated' because that's absolutely how normal people say 'fired'

"I want his contract terminated" means "I want him fired". What do you think it means? "Contract terminated" isn't some sort of hip hop slang for "murdered".

ElJeffe

corks finest wrote: »

That'll be the ruination of them and WORK

Work is like kryptonite to these lads

gozunda

RWCNT wrote: »

Hmm, nope. You've unilaterally decided that it does and deemed it hate speech as such - burden of proof still on you, and you still can't prove it. Document you've taken the definition from names all manner of protected characteristics and occupation not included anywhere - completely absent, as it is in any definition of hate speech that I (and presumably also you, since you've yet to produce one) have ever laid eyes on. Since my examples fall within your interpretation of the definition you've shared, maybe libellous or defamatory is a better description of the statements then? I'm not sure. Certainly not hate speech or a hate crime though, as it's not motivated by prejudice against any protected characteristic, which is what defines hate crime in any example I've ever seen. You're right though, this is semantics - and I think we agree that those sorts of statements are definitely not doing any good. I just don't agree that they constitute hate speech. The subtitling on that video is inaccurate. He's not saying "I want him dead..." - he's saying "I want that fed...", fed being a slang for a police officer.

Nope. Lol Now you're just copying what I've said on your previous comment. Perhaps it would be more constructive to be less concerned as to what you think the UN / Irish definition does include or otherwise and take a look at the more relevant issue of why a group promoting, spreading and inciting specific hate speech against another group are bizarrely being given a free pass for similar

The fact that you are also relying on the unpassed Irish bill's phrase ie 'protected characteristic' to uphold your opinion is moot. As detailed calling others '****ers' or similar is not the same as claiming that an entire group are 'racists' and 'killing all black people' of wtte

This from the UN document referred to is perhaps most relevant

There is no international legal definition of hate speech, and the characterization of what
is ‘hateful’ is controversial and disputed...

Rather than prohibiting hate speech as such, international law prohibits the incitement
to discrimination, hostility and violence (referred to here as ‘incitement’). Incitement is a
very dangerous form of speech, because it explicitly and deliberately aims at triggering
discrimination, hostility and violence...

Hate speech that does not reach the threshold of incitement is not something that international law requires States to prohibit. It is important to underline that even when not prohibited, hate speech may to be harmful. ..

Addressing hate speech, therefore, requires a coordinated response that tackles the
root causes and drivers of hate speech, as well as its impact on victims and societies
more broadly.

It would appear that our own proposed legislation on hate speech atm ignores the broader but no less important issues of incitement to discrimination, hostility and violence which is found in the descriptions of the Garda Síochána as 'racists' and 'killers of black people'

That needs to be addressed as a matter of apparent urgency considering

An Ri rua

Burkie1203 wrote: »

"I want him finished"

"When we find him .... yeah"


Thats a fairly blatant and direct message. Why would they want to find him?

You can try dress it up any way you want. Its a clear threat.

https://twitter.com/EmmaMurphy12150/status/1345027279919984640?s=19

Look, we're all victims of cameras, recordings, instant tweets, texts, posts we regret etc.
Give his brother the benefit of the doubt tonight. If my brother was shot dead, by anyone, for any reason, I might be expressing similar anger. As would many men. They are in shock and hurting. Their brother met the business end of the ERU. Boots should not be wiped on him now, nor his family.
I am sure senior Gardaí are monitoring such chatter and well aware that it's best to let such anger rún its course, within reason. He's grieving, wants revenge. He's bound to say stupid things, even though frightening and worrying to the Garda's family (and Garda family).
The Guards de-escalate and turn a blind eye regularly. If they didn't, we'd have street battles and quasi internment. They let some threats slide.

NewMan1982

gozunda wrote: »

Nope. Lol Now you're just copying what I've said on your previous comment. Perhaps it would be more constructive to be less concerned as to what you think the UN / Irish definition does include or otherwise and take a look at the more relevant issue of why a group promoting, spreading and inciting specific hate speech against another group are bizarrely being given a free pass for similar

The fact that you are also relying on the unpassed Irish bill's phrase ie 'protected characteristic' to uphold your opinion is moot. As detailed calling others '****ers' or similar is not the same as claiming that an entire group are 'racists' and 'killing all blacks' of wtte

This from the UN document referred to is perhaps most relevant



It would appear that our own proposed legislation on hate speech atm ignores the broader but no less important issues of incitement to discrimination, hostility and violence which is found in the descriptions of the Garda Síochána as 'racists' and 'killers of black people'

That needs to be addressed as a matter of apparent urgency considering

Btw I made mo mention of any video btw.

Take it to PM lads. It’s a petty side argument

Gothic Insanity

Gothic Insanity wrote: »

Knife or no knife he assaulted someone and still did a lot of damage.

Personally I would find work if I had suitable work for any employee, that's what any good employer would do.

This guy didn't deserve to be injured!!

I think you have picked me up wrong.

I'm trying to point out that his injuries could be much further reaching and the effects of his injuries much longer lasting than a broken nose and jaw.

Burkie1203

weldoninhio wrote: »

You shoot until the threat is neutralised. You can see from the video the 5th shot, 3rd one to hit him, is the one that puts him to the ground

The bodycam video posted earlier from the states, there is other angles from the 2nd officer and 7 shots were fired and the dude with the knife still got up.

My father is a retired Garda. My earliest childhood memories are listening to my mother on the phone at 1 or 2am and trying to determine from her reaction how serious it was.

Some times it was just a fractured finger or something minor but other times it was a broken arm or ribs. He retired when his 30 years was done because my mother couldn't take it any more. He has been to dozens of funerals of colleagues who retired in their 60s and never made 70. My father was 70 last year. I'm convinced if he had done his 40 years he would be living in glasnevin cemetery now

Spanish Eyes

NIMAN wrote: »

No mention on the news tonight.

I think that's good handling of it by rte.
Don't get involved.
Let it pass, let the investigation run it's course.
Don't report any protests.

It'll gradually fade away until social media jumps on the next bandwagon.

For once RTE have cottoned on to the zeitgeist of our nation at long last. A lot done, more to do though.

But less is definitely more in this particular case. It will be a SM thing solely now. Let us hope it doesn’t escalate.