George Nkencho shooting *Mod warning Added to OP*

jrosen

You cant really make people integrate though. Ive lived away and even Irish people seek out other Irish people, tend to live in certain neighborhoods where the % of Irish is high.

But I would agree, if you move to a country and it doesnt work for you, your not happy there, the values conflict with yours, the way of life conflicts with how you want to live there is nothing making you stay. If you choose to move to another country you by default agree to the rules and ways of that country.

malinheader

Deleted User wrote: »

How do you enforce integration in a non racist way? This is unclear.

Elephant in the room.

If you're willing to settle in a new country and add to society you shouldn't need being forced to integrate.

Jamie2k9

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/jackfchambers/status/1345451909390462976

https://twitter.com/jackfchambers/status/1345451911730880517

Don't really know who Jack Chambers is, to be honest, but he seems fairly level headed.

Mad_maxx

Lumen wrote: »

There are numerous examples from the past decade or so to counter this.

Irish Water is a classic privatisation play from the centre right.

Michael Noonan stating government policy was to increase property prices.

Bertie and McCreevy.

Even the position on immigration (to keep this vaguely on topic) is economically conservative, in the sense that they want to keep the labor market well supplied to suppress wages and maintain competitiveness.

They may not be right wing enough for your tastes on specific policies but they're not left wing, they're promoting a kind of mainstream, non divisive populism which is not anchored on left-right politics.

i know they are not left wing , they are not SF , i said they were centre left

doublejobbing 2

bubblypop wrote: »

We do not have the death penalty in this country, this was unfortunately an outcome that could have been prevented.

.

Yet pretty much every hard leftist in this country agrees with mass executions/ execution after show trial of "enemies of the people" as was done in the USSR and China by the 10's of million. They oppose what they see as heavy handed Garda tactics (our Gardai are probably one of the least confrontational in the entire world) yet they laud absolute police states like Venezuela, Cuba, North Korea etc. I've been to Vietnam and there is hardly a soul on the streets of Hanoi after midnight, bar trucks full of police patrolling the streets and inspecting/ closing the few late night venues open. I got the impression it is counter coup operations to prevent arms/ men being mved/ taking position by nightfall.

I saw one lad on FB ranting that assault and brandishing a weapon is not a death penalty offence.

Yet he is a mentally ill radical communist who has previously called civil servants collaborators of the "blueshirt" regime who will be shown the same mercy as will be shown to Varadkar etc when these loons apparently seize power. He and his movement have literally called for labour camps and mass executions of their political opponents. It is literal Gemma O'Doherty territory.

Ish66

I see the Go Fund Me Page, Set up yesterday in support of this knife wielding joy to society has raised Zero, Nada, Not a sausage.
That proves how badly this person will be missed. Move On...
https://ie.gofundme.com/f/george-nkencho-commemorative-plaque?qid=739213b6eeb56900e08e5544866c228d

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Don't really know who Jack Chambers is, to be honest, but he seems fairly level headed.

Young FF TD based in Castleknock. That is exactly the type of message public representatives and community leaders in the area need to be putting out to quell tensions instead of inciting.

Well done Jack.

ohnonotgmail

Ish66 wrote: »

I see the Go Fund Me Page, Set up yesterday in support of this knife wielding joy to society has raised Zero, Nada, Not a sausage.
That proves how badly this person will be missed. Move On...
https://ie.gofundme.com/f/george-nkencho-commemorative-plaque?qid=739213b6eeb56900e08e5544866c228d

well that GFM is at €900 but there are others that are 10K+

Akesh

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Don't really know who Jack Chambers is, to be honest, but he seems fairly level headed.

I would say Fianna Fail are just pretending to care as usual. Another party full to the hilt of awful populist nut cases. Just remember, FF introduced the hate crime bill via Senator Fiona O'Loughlin.

Mad_maxx

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Bríd Smith is some piece of work

"On the Tragic death of George Nkencho
The killing of George Nkencho by armed gardai on Wednesday 30 December in Blanchardstown has, inevitably, generated a lot of debate, some of it very angry, on social media. This is my response.
After offering our condolences to all the family who have lost a loved one and our sympathy to the shop worker who was injured in this tragic series of events, there are certain questions that need to be asked.
Why was it necessary for the gardai to shoot and kill George Nkencho? There were at least 12 trained gardai on the scene. Why could they not disarm and detain him, as they have done with numerous other suspects – men with swords, members of the Kinnehan and Hutch gangs and so on – without shooting him? Second, if shooting was essential, and we do not accept that it was, why was he not shot in the legs to bring him down? Why was he shot at least 3 times (apparently 5 shots were fired)? George Nkencho was evidently mentally disturbed so why was no psychiatric social worker brought to the scene to de-escalate the situation? All these questions need to be asked and seriously investigated.
One point that needs to be clarified straight away is that raising these questions is not ‘supporting’ George Nkencho or his wielding a knife or attacking a shop worker. Widely differing claims are being made about George , such as that he had 32 criminal convictions but these are not reported in the media and are contradicted by friends and neighbours, plus while there was an altercation in the EuroSpar shop and the shop worker was injured he was NOT slashed in the face. But these are not the issue. Whatever George Nkencho may have done or not done in the past does not justify his killing.
Was race or rather racism a factor? Some people on social media are confidently asserting that racism has nothing to do with it. What makes them so sure? Institutional racism does not openly declare itself but it shows up in different practice and different responses and this killing is an example of such a different response and that too needs to be investigated. We know from a huge amount of experience, not just in the US but in Britain, France and round the world that racist attitudes can be embedded in police forces as in the wider society. Why should it be different in Ireland given, for example, the record of anti-Traveller racism in the gardai. Reports from the local Black Community suggest they do have experience of racist attitudes from the police and have been subject to racism in school.
Lastly, regardless of whatever racism there may have been from the gardai, there is no disputing the blatant racism in some of the social media commentary. The far right, anti-migrant Irish Freedom Party, posted video footage of the protest march through Blanchardstown on Thursday and called it ‘unacceptable’. The match was peaceful protest. For the Irish Freedom Party, who themselves have held rallies and marches against mask wearing and the Covid restrictions, what was unacceptable was that these were Black people marching and they called for them to be deported. To the Irish so-called Freedom Party I say what I find unacceptable is your racism and the same applies to any comments on social media which suggest it is alright for George Nkencho to be killed because we should ’look after our own’ and such like.
I, and People Before Profit, will always oppose such racism and argue for a united response of all working people to injustice whether it is about housing, access to health and education, women’s rights, workers’ rights such as Debenhams, student nurses, or police brutality.
#JusticeForGeorgeNkencho
#BlackLivesMatter

From her Facebook page

Racism from the Gardai in this instance apparently

What a joke she is

shes poison that one

Mad_maxx

dirkmeister wrote: »

Bríd Smith is some piece of work.

I’m convinced at this stage that anyone still asking why he wasn’t shot in the leg is deliberately trying to stoke tensions.

Brid Smith is actively committed to the overthrow of the state at all times , we really should not surprised by her


"what else can you expect from a pig only a grunt " etc

Ish66

Ish66 wrote: »

I see the Go Fund Me Page, Set up yesterday in support of this knife wielding joy to society has raised Zero, Nada, Not a sausage.
That proves how badly this person will be missed. Move On...
https://ie.gofundme.com/f/george-nkencho-commemorative-plaque?qid=739213b6eeb56900e08e5544866c228d

Pretty sure such a thing would never be made. I imagine that's someone looking to try and pocket a few euro off the back of this.


I might make one too, to get george on a stamp. Set it at 30k and see can i use it towards a mortgage.

Sir Oxman

Gothic Insanity wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/george-nkencho-shooting-inquiry-will-look-at-graduated-use-of-force-1.4448355

Finally a little sense about this! Even though there maybe elements some may not be happy with.

"Scattered public order incidents followed, including outside the Hartstown Eurospar where Mr Nkencho had attacked the manager. A small group of young people banged on the shutters as staff and customers hid inside."

No mention of what every single person heard and seen - spitting at the ordinary shoppers and workers shuttered inside while racist abuse was thrown at them.

No mention of alighting on Blanch S/C intimidating shoppers and workers alike, more shuttered premises.

No mention of attacking/intimidating people and guards outside the CircleK, or drivers on the street or stopping and spitting and kicking at buses outside Blanch S/C

No mention of the Nkencho brother rabble rousing on a megaphone using incendiary language.

The Irish Times is yet again failing to report fully due to impartiality.

titan18

Akesh wrote: »

I would say Fianna Fail are just pretending to care as usual. Another party full to the hilt of awful populist nut cases. Just remember, FF introduced the hate crime bill via Senator Fiona O'Loughlin.

I'm not sure. None of their leaders (Chambers is highest profile I've seen) have come out but it's some of the local councillors and TDs who have. I haven't seen a pipe off FG, and SF had one member alright who had a blog on their site.

Even if it's only pretending anyway, it's better than I've seen off anyone else

Cilldara_2000

titan18 wrote: »

I'm not sure. None of their leaders (Chambers is highest profile I've seen) have come out but it's some of the local councillors and TDs who have. I haven't seen a pipe off FG, and SF had one member alright who had a blog on their site.

Even if it's only pretending anyway, it's better than I've seen off anyone else

Tbf Jack Chambers is a local TD and the SF blogger is also a local TD.

doublejobbing 2

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't really know who Jack Chambers is, to be honest, but he seems fairly level headed.

https://www.fiannafail.ie/most-disadvantaged-school-in-west-dublin-refused-deis-status-ff/

Nah. Same somebody elses fault whingebag as the lot of them when highlighting the wastes of space the parents of one local school.

More than three quarters of the students at Powerstown school are from homes where the main breadwinner is unemployed. It has the second highest number of migrant pupils of any school in the country, at 91%.

That was from 2015, the economy was still in poor shape but not like it was in 2011.

A national school in 2015 with 91% migrant background and 75% from a home with no working adult. No doubt some of the kids of these wasters who were there in 2015 were the 13 to 17 year olds running amok on NYE 2020.

Lumen

titan18 wrote: »

I'm not sure. None of their leaders (Chambers is highest profile I've seen) have come out but it's some of the local councillors and TDs who have. I haven't seen a pipe off FG, and SF had one member alright who had a blog on their site.

Even if it's only pretending anyway, it's better than I've seen off anyone else

Jack Chambers is, in my opinion, an unimaginative little geebag who's only in FF because his daddy has party connections. If he's right about anything it's by complete accident. He's the Ryan Tubridy of FF.

newcavanman

NIMAN wrote: »

No mention on the news tonight.

I think that's good handling of it by rte.
Don't get involved.
Let it pass, let the investigation run it's course.
Don't report any protests.

It'll gradually fade away until social media jumps on the next bandwagon.

The way RTE ignored it, you would think it was a scandel involving RTE celebs at an illegal party, or some bad taste joke about Catholisim

AngeloArgue

I'm sure many of those that are angered and protesting have seen the shaky and blurry video taken at some distance. It can appear that the first gunshot can be heard while Nkencho is at the front door facing away from the Gardaí.
I know a brief, shaky, blurred image from a distance does not give a full story. But to some it could be interpreted as him being shot at first with his back turned away.
In no way am I claiming that this is what happened. But I can see how many could interpret it to be as such.

not yet

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't really know who Jack Chambers is, to be honest, but he seems fairly level headed.

He is the local TD for D15.

givyjoe

Lumen wrote: »

Jack Chambers is, in my opinion, an unimaginative little geebag who's only in FF because his daddy has party connections. If he's right about anything it's by complete accident. He's the Ryan Tubridy of FF.

Harsh but fair.

givyjoe

AngeloArgue wrote: »

I'm sure many of those that are angered and protesting have seen the shaky and blurry video taken at some distance. It can appear that the first gunshot can be heard while Nkencho is at the front door facing away from the Gardaí.
I know a brief, shaky, blurred image from a distance does not give a full story. But to some it could be interpreted as him being shot at first with his back turned away.
In no way am I claiming that this is what happened. But I can see how many could interpret it to be as such.

A simple explanation to this is that he was trying to enter the house, which obviously puts those inside at risk.

AngeloArgue

AngeloArgue wrote: »

I'm sure many of those that are angered and protesting have seen the shaky and blurry video taken at some distance. It can appear that the first gunshot can be heard while Nkencho is at the front door facing away from the Gardaí.
I know a brief, shaky, blurred image from a distance does not give a full story. But to some it could be interpreted as him being shot at first with his back turned away.
In no way am I claiming that this is what happened. But I can see how many could interpret it to be as such.

I'm not saying that's what happened either, but there are occasions where shooting someone in the back can be justified.

titan18

AngeloArgue wrote: »

I'm sure many of those that are angered and protesting have seen the shaky and blurry video taken at some distance. It can appear that the first gunshot can be heard while Nkencho is at the front door facing away from the Gardaí.
I know a brief, shaky, blurred image from a distance does not give a full story. But to some it could be interpreted as him being shot at first with his back turned away.
In no way am I claiming that this is what happened. But I can see how many could interpret it to be as such.

Sure, I can see the logic on that but if the lad had murdered 14 of the guards and the remaining one killed him, the same crowd protesting now would still be protesting

Sir Oxman

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Bríd Smith is some piece of work

"On the Tragic death of George Nkencho
The killing of George Nkencho by armed gardai on Wednesday 30 December in Blanchardstown has, inevitably, generated a lot of debate, some of it very angry, on social media. This is my response.
After offering our condolences to all the family who have lost a loved one and our sympathy to the shop worker who was injured in this tragic series of events, there are certain questions that need to be asked.
Why was it necessary for the gardai to shoot and kill George Nkencho? There were at least 12 trained gardai on the scene. Why could they not disarm and detain him, as they have done with numerous other suspects – men with swords, members of the Kinnehan and Hutch gangs and so on – without shooting him? Second, if shooting was essential, and we do not accept that it was, why was he not shot in the legs to bring him down? Why was he shot at least 3 times (apparently 5 shots were fired)? George Nkencho was evidently mentally disturbed so why was no psychiatric social worker brought to the scene to de-escalate the situation? All these questions need to be asked and seriously investigated.
One point that needs to be clarified straight away is that raising these questions is not ‘supporting’ George Nkencho or his wielding a knife or attacking a shop worker. Widely differing claims are being made about George , such as that he had 32 criminal convictions but these are not reported in the media and are contradicted by friends and neighbours, plus while there was an altercation in the EuroSpar shop and the shop worker was injured he was NOT slashed in the face. But these are not the issue. Whatever George Nkencho may have done or not done in the past does not justify his killing.
Was race or rather racism a factor? Some people on social media are confidently asserting that racism has nothing to do with it. What makes them so sure? Institutional racism does not openly declare itself but it shows up in different practice and different responses and this killing is an example of such a different response and that too needs to be investigated. We know from a huge amount of experience, not just in the US but in Britain, France and round the world that racist attitudes can be embedded in police forces as in the wider society. Why should it be different in Ireland given, for example, the record of anti-Traveller racism in the gardai. Reports from the local Black Community suggest they do have experience of racist attitudes from the police and have been subject to racism in school.
Lastly, regardless of whatever racism there may have been from the gardai, there is no disputing the blatant racism in some of the social media commentary. The far right, anti-migrant Irish Freedom Party, posted video footage of the protest march through Blanchardstown on Thursday and called it ‘unacceptable’. The match was peaceful protest. For the Irish Freedom Party, who themselves have held rallies and marches against mask wearing and the Covid restrictions, what was unacceptable was that these were Black people marching and they called for them to be deported. To the Irish so-called Freedom Party I say what I find unacceptable is your racism and the same applies to any comments on social media which suggest it is alright for George Nkencho to be killed because we should ’look after our own’ and such like.
I, and People Before Profit, will always oppose such racism and argue for a united response of all working people to injustice whether it is about housing, access to health and education, women’s rights, workers’ rights such as Debenhams, student nurses, or police brutality.
#JusticeForGeorgeNkencho
#BlackLivesMatter

From her Facebook page

Racism from the Gardai in this instance apparently

What a joke she is

When a thundering, opportunistic, race baiting disgrace shows you what they are, believe them.

AngeloArgue

AngeloArgue wrote: »

I'm sure many of those that are angered and protesting have seen the shaky and blurry video taken at some distance. It can appear that the first gunshot can be heard while Nkencho is at the front door facing away from the Gardaí.
I know a brief, shaky, blurred image from a distance does not give a full story. But to some it could be interpreted as him being shot at first with his back turned away.
In no way am I claiming that this is what happened. But I can see how many could interpret it to be as such.

Even if he was, they can't let a knife weiled, threatening man wander into a house with people inside.

"Man murders family as Gardai chat about weather" isn't a great headline, either.

Guerillabear

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/jackfchambers/status/1345451909390462976

https://twitter.com/jackfchambers/status/1345451911730880517

I’m no Jack Chambers fan but at least he is supporting the shopkeeper and the Gardaí.

Funkfield

Lumen wrote: »

Jack Chambers is, in my opinion, an unimaginative little geebag who's only in FF because his daddy has party connections. If he's right about anything it's by complete accident. He's the Ryan Tubridy of FF.

I'm pretty sure Ryan Tubridy is the Ryan Tubridy of Fiana Fail

Calhoun

The child protection group on facebook put out a statement tonight on it, those trying to turn it into a race issue are definitely not winning hearts and minds i think they might have over played their hand.

Also for those who are putting down Brid Smith this is par for the course for the likes of people before profit and other champagne socialists, its there area of politics. Its kinda why they aren't very popular but i don't get being overly outraged as this is what they do.

Beltby

givyjoe wrote: »

A simple explanation to this is that he was trying to enter the house, which obviously puts those inside at risk.

Or, he turned away after getting sprayed, realised it hadn't worked, went berserk and tried to slice open a garda.