George Nkencho shooting *Mod warning Added to OP*

Fighting Tao

Fighting Tao wrote: »

No idea, and he may have if the liberal (or content provider) didn’t cut the clip to suit their agenda.

Have you retracted everything that you ever said was wrong?

Not everything, but my voice doesn't have the potential to influence an aggressive mob.

I've certainly walked back on wrong things I've said where the potential for damage was clear.

That's just responsible behaviour. Personal responsibility. Remember that old term?

Sir Oxman

doublejobbing 2 wrote: »

Here's a question for all those I've seen on social media questioning the peaceful resolution of other cases involving manic knifemen.

Have any of these people the slightest piece of proof that armed Gardai in these instances were circa 3 feet from an attacking knifeman, as appears to be the case in the video we saw, and still refused to shoot the man?

Or in the vast majority of the cases, was the sight of armed Gardai within firing distance enough to persuade them to disarm? Something that should have crossed George's mind when the gun wielding Gardai decided tasers and gas were the best option first?

Various idiots have contrasted the response of the Blanch ERU to an incident they were a part of some months ago.

https://www.thesun.ie/news/5570770/taxi-driver-suspected-killing-wife-tried-take-life/

The fact this man seems to have incapacitated himself by way of suicide attempt by the time the guards reached him, and thus was likely in no physical condition to lunge out, seems lost on them.

There is lots of fake news from various extreme sides for sure.

I've seen many, many verified social media accounts (politicians, organisations etc) post absolutely ridiculous comparisons of AGS action in various situations (all white thugs) against this one. Never any context mentioned for that would fcuk up their agenda.
That is clearly spreading fakery - facts and truth and context yet again sacrificed to fit an extreme.

The much larger reach of these 'respectable' voices and their false, fake equivalences is by magnitudes more dangerous than most of the other cretins.

iebamm2580

iebamm2580 wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/518620081515968/videos/394546905169549/?__so__=watchlist&__rv__=video_home_www_playlist_video_list

So this guy wants land, i have uncle farmers who wouldn't give me a bit of land but this guy want to rock up and get land, he talks about Ireland being complicit in slave trade as 100 people here were compensated when slavery was abolished, talks about knowing your history, he should maybe realize Ireland was still under British rule when slavery was abolished.

Let him do like we did. Work, save, buy. Admittedly with the help of a mortgage, but that’s what homeowners do.

afro man

Tippex wrote: »

misunderstood [/sarcasm][/QUOTE

Very Misunderstood indeed :rolleyes:

Lux23

Lux23 wrote: »

So it is wrong to label a person that hasn't been convicted of anything a thug?

No, no it’s not.

<snip>

The guy last week was an absolute thug.

The little bastards that last year set fire to property in my village are thugs.

THUGS
THUGS THUGS

For Thugs Sake!

Asus X540L

Even if the 100 people who were compensated had names like Murphy, O'Brien, O'Flaherty etc that's still 100 people out of around 8 million at the time, or 0.0000125 of the population. But don't let that get in the way of your racist outbursts and attempts to get free land!

This is almost tony Montana - "first you get the land, then you get the power, then you get the wimmin"!

gozunda

Lux23 wrote: »

So it is wrong to label a person that hasn't been convicted of anything a thug?

I'd say its nothing to do with whether he's dead or otherwise tbf

And you don't have to be convicted of anything or otherwise to be described as such ...

This is the online Dictionary definition...

noun

a violent, lawless, or vicious person, especially one who commits a crime such as assault, robbery, or murder: (example) It wasn't uncommon for hired thugs to intimidate shop owners until they paid up.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/thug.

If it upsets you - report the newspaper for doing so ..

Edit: the definition of a crime - before you bring it up.

Crime: the intentional commission of an act usually deemed socially harmful or dangerous and specifically defined, prohibited, and punishable under criminal law.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/crime-law


Please note - you committ a crime when you do something like assault another person and put them in hospital

Baggly

Mod

Lux23, dont post in this thread again.

Ive deleted the Paddy Jackson stuff from the thread. It has no place here and was OT.

Everyone else please stop referring back to it and return to the topic of the thread.

Thanks.

Donald Trump

Lux23 wrote: »

I think my argument is that they shouldn't label anyone a thug until they are at least convicted, and even at that I still think it is a hateful word.

They didn't label anyone though. Thug beats up shopkeeper is perfectly fine. Because someone who beats up a shopkeeper is a thug - coming under the very definition of the word.



It would be different had they said "Thug George beats up shop keeper". Do you see the difference?


When they printed the headline, it could refer to anyone. Male/female/black/white. The one thing we know is that it was a thug.



Hypothetically, a person called George could be suspected, charged and found not guilty of committing an assault. In other words the "prosecution" would not be able to prove that it was George who did it. George says "it wasn't me". George could not claim he was incorrectly labelled a thug. Because he says it wasn't him that did it. But whoever did do it was a thug.

weldoninhio

Lux23 wrote: »

So it is wrong to label a person that hasn't been convicted of anything a thug?

Thug isn’t a legal term. You can call anyone you like a thug if they exhibit thuggish behaviour. Same as idiot if someone does something stupid. I believe the idiot that jet skied to the Isle of Man during lockdown was labelled an idiot by the press.

donkey balls

10000maniacs wrote: »

Today with Philip Boucher-Hayes giving a good hearing to the narrative that George Nkencho was an upstanding member of the community, the killing was wicked and callous and justice needs to be done.
Only one lesson needs to be learnt here. Don't lunge at a policeman with a knife, especially if you have stabbed someone else already with it.

This the same Boulmer Hayes that verified Pams story all those years ago?

Pixel Eater

Asus X540L wrote: »

Even if the 100 people who were compensated had names like Murphy, O'Brien, O'Flaherty etc that's still 100 people out of around 8 million at the time, or 0.0000125 of the population. But don't let that get in the way of your racist outbursts and attempts to get free land!

God that video is ridiculous! You're right, 100 people out of over 8 million is an infinitesimal amount plus surely they'd have been mostly British landowning class, not Irish at all.

I also find the fact that he's complaining that Gardaí are mostly white bizarre and, ironically, quite racist. The indigenous Irish are white; it's like going to Korea and complaining about all the Asians!

average hero

Nobody is going to like this post because I am going to try to be balanced.

Firstly, it is a tragedy what happened. RIP to George. Also, I hope the shooter can come to terms with the shooting. That is not an easy thing to do, either.

The guard in question made a decision to fire his weapon when he felt that there was a risk to life and limb. By all accounts, the young man was carrying a weapon and had not complied with garda requests. That puts him in dangerous territory - no matter his race. Lunging as he reportedly did means that the garda made a split second decision. If he had not, we may have been mourning a garda.

The protests have backfired. They will not speed up any investigation. What they HAVE done is spread a horrible stereotype about African immigrants in particular throughout social media. Videos of crimes are being shared and that is furthering social divide. The protestors or organisers need to understand that these protests are counter-productive. The actions of beating people up and attacking a Spar shop provides the material for far-right lunatics. It is Propaganda 101 and the protestors are allowing that to happen.

I am also sick to death of the narrative that the black community are 'less than'. The black community is a great community however they should be held to the same standards as the Irish, the Polish, the Chinese and the Muslim community. They are entitled to the same rights but must comply with the same responsibilities. That means not intimidating communities like the recent protests and integrating into our laws and customs.

I refuse to believe that black people will not, cannot or are not able to abide by our laws. THAT narrative is racist and horribly destructive. But as a society we must hold that community to the same standard that we want to hold ourselves at. Anything else is racist.

Beechwoodspark

Asus X540L wrote: »

Even if the 100 people who were compensated had names like Murphy, O'Brien, O'Flaherty etc that's still 100 people out of around 8 million at the time, or 0.0000125 of the population. But don't let that get in the way of your racist outbursts and attempts to get free land!

This is almost tony Montana - "first you get the land, then you get the power, then you get the wimmin"!

Wouldn’t be surprised if the Tony Montana speech is where that gobsheen got his little “we need land” brain fart from !

gypsy79

average hero wrote: »

Nobody is going to like this post because I am going to try to be balanced.

Firstly, it is a tragedy what happened. RIP to George. Also, I hope the shooter can come to terms with the shooting. That is not an easy thing to do, either.

The guard in question made a decision to fire his weapon when he felt that there was a risk to life and limb. By all accounts, the young man was carrying a weapon and had not complied with garda requests. That puts him in dangerous territory - no matter his race. Lunging as he reportedly did means that the garda made a split second decision. If he had not, we may have been mourning a garda.

The protests have backfired. They will not speed up any investigation. What they HAVE done is spread a horrible stereotype about African immigrants in particular throughout social media. Videos of crimes are being shared and that is furthering social divide. The protestors or organisers need to understand that these protests are counter-productive. The actions of beating people up and attacking a Spar shop provides the material for far-right lunatics. It is Propaganda 101 and the protestors are allowing that to happen.

I am also sick to death of the narrative that the black community are 'less than'. The black community is a great community however they should be held to the same standards as the Irish, the Polish, the Chinese and the Muslim community. They are entitled to the same rights but must comply with the same responsibilities. That means not intimidating communities like the recent protests and integrating into our laws and customs.

I refuse to believe that black people will not, cannot or are not able to abide by our laws. THAT narrative is racist and horribly destructive. But as a society we must hold that community to the same standard that we want to hold ourselves at. Anything else is racist.

I agree with you to a point. But you have grouped black people together. What is clear from this is that there are actually two groups within your black group (black and Nigerian)

Watch District 9 to understand this has been an issue for years. Not new. New to Ireland maybe

yourdeadwright

Isn't it just amazing that no one gave a crap when Mark Hennessy was shot ,
No one questioned if what the Garda done was right ,

Ash.J.Williams

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Isn't it just amazing that no one gave a crap when Mark Hennessy was shot ,
No one questioned if what the Garda done was right ,

because he was right?

yourdeadwright

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

because he was right?

Of course he was and it was the same situation a man with a knife threating to stab someone ,

piplip87

https://www.thejournal.ie/hamburg-irishman-shot-4651300-May2019/?section=comment#comments

Irishman shot in Germany for approaching police with a knife.

I dont recall any protests or claiming that Irish people gave discrimination in Germany

Donald Trump

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Isn't it just amazing that no one gave a crap when Mark Hennessy was shot ,
No one questioned if what the Garda done was right ,

In that case, I don't think the Guard knew that the girl had been killed. At that point, Hennessy was a random fella in a car with a knife stabbing himself? Not putting anyone else in obvious danger in the moment the shot was fired.

Twitter conclusion -Tumbleweeds. No outpouring of shite.


In this case, man with a knife was threatening and it looks like they were lunging and trying to decapitate Guards
Twitter conclusion - Random Africans should be given free land and property in Ireland


I'm not saying the Guard was wrong in Hennessy case. Not at all. Just perplexed how someone could think that that incident was justified and think the recent one deserves some form of retribution against the Guard

ThunbergsAreGo

average hero wrote: »

I am also sick to death of the narrative that the black community are 'less than'. The black community is a great community however they should be held to the same standards as the Irish, the Polish, the Chinese and the Muslim community. They are entitled to the same rights but must comply with the same responsibilities. That means not intimidating communities like the recent protests and integrating into our laws and customs.

I refuse to believe that black people will not, cannot or are not able to abide by our laws. THAT narrative is racist and horribly destructive. But as a society we must hold that community to the same standard that we want to hold ourselves at. Anything else is racist.

I think that is the big issue people have here. It's not that black are less than, that's ludicrous. A person is a person regardless of gender and race. However as you said they should be responsible for their actions. If you assault someone and refuse to comply with instructions to put down a deadly weapon, then there may be consequences, regardless of race.

Indeed the only people constantly bringing up race in this are mostly the left.

The grouping of black people as one homogenous group is ridiculous. Within this there are multiple nationalities, cultures, religions and attitudes. Many of which conflict with each other. Also as mentioned by another poster, there is one nationality that appears unnaturally drawn to crime, and it is really unfair to group all together. Just like we wouldn't group an Irish man and a Greek in NZ together.

yourdeadwright

Donald Trump wrote: »

In that case, I don't think the Guard knew that the girl had been killed. At that point, Hennessy was a random fella in a car with a knife stabbing himself? Not putting anyone else in obvious danger in the moment the shot was fired.

Twitter conclusion -Tumbleweeds. No outpouring of shite.


In this case, man with a knife was threatening and it looks like they were lunging and trying to decapitate Guards
Twitter conclusion - Random Africans should be given free land and property in Ireland


I'm not saying the Guard was wrong in Hennessy case. Not at all. Just perplexed how someone could think that that incident was justified and think the recent one deserves some form of retribution against the Guard

Incorrect

Hennessy was the main suspect at time for her disappearance (they did not know she was dead) and he told the Garda that she was under the blanket he had In the back seat and that he would stab her if they didn't let him go ,

So a man with a knife saying he was going to use it , in this case it was a man with a knife trying to use it so they where very similar

Tchaikovsky

gypsy79 wrote: »

Watch District 9 to understand this has been an issue for years. Not new. New to Ireland maybe

Massive alien insects are also a problem seemingly. Bloody Prawns!

RWCNT

Tippex wrote: »

I cannot believe that posters are getting hung up on the term Thug.
From the time I was growing up (I'm 46 btw) the term thug was always used to describe someone that had done something wrong i.e. threatened someone or bet the crap out of them.

From what I understand the word has some racial undertones in America, I think I saw another poster share an article from the states talking about it. There seemed to be a bit of a thing in the 90s of black hip hop artists trying to reclaim it e.g. Bone-Thugz-N-Harmony, Tupac's group "Thug Life". I don't think the overwhelming majority in this part of the world would make that association, but Americanisation of culture seems quite rampant particularly among the youth so not entirely surprised to see someone making that connection.

iebamm2580 wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/518620081515968/videos/394546905169549/?__so__=watchlist&__rv__=video_home_www_playlist_video_list

So this guy wants land, i have uncle farmers who wouldn't give me a bit of land but this guy want to rock up and get land, he talks about Ireland being complicit in slave trade as 100 people here were compensated when slavery was abolished, talks about knowing your history, he should maybe realize Ireland was still under British rule when slavery was abolished.

Does anyone know who the guy in this vid is or if he's part of some organisation or other? I'm not sure that he's demanding land or businesses be handed over for free here as is being represented. He could basically be making the point that black people need to build more of a stake in society in order to be treated equally. Whether you agree with that or the idea that they're not treated equally in the first place, it's not the same as demanding free stuff. Shocking as it may be to some, personal responsibility is not a foreign concept to all BLM-type protesters. The actor John Boyega said during a speech at a BLM rally over the summer that he thinks black men need to improve their communities by staying out of trouble with the law and raising their children properly, for example. That said, I don't know if this dude is part of some outfit that has a stated aim of seeking reparations or whatever.

tayto lover

iebamm2580 wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/518620081515968/videos/394546905169549/?__so__=watchlist&__rv__=video_home_www_playlist_video_list

So this guy wants land, i have uncle farmers who wouldn't give me a bit of land but this guy want to rock up and get land, he talks about Ireland being complicit in slave trade as 100 people here were compensated when slavery was abolished, talks about knowing your history, he should maybe realize Ireland was still under British rule when slavery was abolished.

Goes to show the arrogance of some of these immigrants.
They think we’re soft touches.
They wouldn’t have got half of what the get for nothing here in any other country so now they’ll start demanding.

iebamm2580

RWCNT wrote: »

From what I understand the word has some racial undertones in America, I think I saw another poster share an article from the states talking about it. There seemed to be a bit of a thing in the 90s of black hip hop artists trying to reclaim it e.g. Bone-Thugz-N-Harmony, Tupac's group "Thug Life". I don't think the overwhelming majority in this part of the world would make that association, but Americanisation of culture seems quite rampant particularly among the youth so not entirely surprised to see someone making that connection.




Does anyone know who the guy in this vid is or if he's part of some organisation or other? I'm not sure that he's demanding land or businesses be handed over for free here as is being represented. He could basically be making the point that black people need to build more of a stake in society in order to be treated equally. Whether you agree with that or the idea that they're not treated equally in the first place, it's not the same as demanding free stuff. Shocking as it may be to some, personal responsibility is not a foreign concept to all BLM-type protesters. The actor John Boyega said during a speech at a BLM rally over the summer that he thinks black men need to improve their communities by staying out of trouble with the law and raising their children properly, for example. That said, I don't know if this dude is part of some outfit that has a stated aim of seeking reparations or whatever.

I think this guy when mentioning Ireland is not innocent in the slave trade is your gimme gimme blm supporter.

Donald Trump

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Incorrect

Hennessy was the main suspect at time for her disappearance (they did not know she was dead) and he told the Garda that she was under the blanket he had In the back seat and that he would stab her if they didn't let him go ,

So a man with a knife saying he was going to use it , in this case it was a man with a knife trying to use it so they where very similar

What you said does not contradict what I said. They did not know she was dead at that point.


He was of course a suspect, but to use the George supporter logic, hadn't been convicted of anything. Ergo, effectively a random fella on his own in a car with a knife. Stabbing himself. That was the only thing the guard who fired knew at that moment. I don't think the Guard had had Hennessy's "mental health" history faxed through either at that point.



To repeat again, I have no problems with the Guard shooting Hennessy.

Omackeral

Seriously, why is the “black community” a thing here? What’s a London geezer, a Nigerian bus driver, a young fella born and bred in Cabra, a South American student and an American office worker got in common with each other? I really really am at odds with this idea of a homogenous black community. Do they mean African? Or Nigerian?

gypsy79

Omackeral wrote: »

Seriously, why is the “black community” a thing here? What’s a London geezer, a Nigerian bus driver, a young fella born and bred in Cabra, a South American student and an American office worker got in common with each other? I really really am at odds with this idea of a homogenous black community. Do they mean African? Or Nigerian?

In my opinion what people ranting about is a Nigerian problem

Most other "black" people who move to Ireland have a great attitude to life. But like anything there are exceptions on both sides

weldoninhio

Omackeral wrote: »

Seriously, why is the “black community” a thing here? What’s a London geezer, a Nigerian bus driver, a young fella born and bred in Cabra, a South American student and an American office worker got in common with each other? I really really am at odds with this idea of a homogenous black community. Do they mean African? Or Nigerian?

Seems to be mainly Nigerian. I was speaking to an ex who is Malawi and she thinks its ridiculous that gangs are attacking shops and innocent people. Apparently Nigerians don't have a great reputation on the continent of Africa either, according to her.