George Nkencho shooting *Mod warning Added to OP*

BattleCorp

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Irrelevant - that's not what's pertinent here. You don't even know what you would have done differently unless you were the member(s) of AGS in question.

Irrelevant as this poster is, presumably, not a trained STOC member.

Again, the question is irrelevant as it asks the poster to engage in speculation on the basis of a lack of personal knowledge as I outlined above.

I don't agree. I feel my questions are relevant.

We are all speculating here, and you are no different.

The poster I was replying to stated in an earlier post that the Gardai had other options (shoot in arm/leg/not at all) and I wanted to see if the poster was willing to give their opinion on what the Gardai should have done.

You don't have to be a member of the ASU to have an opinion on something that the ASU do/did.

FreudianSlippers

gozunda wrote: »

No I don't believe it is a debate based diametrically on those two view points.

The discussion has covered the incident in its totality. Not just the shooting but everything to do with the incident and what has happened after.. And whilst issues of racism have certainly been discussed - a lot of that deals with the various allegations of same by third parties before many of the facts of the incident were fully known.

Interestingly a recent article in The Irish Examiner stated that it was understood that -



https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/spotlight/arid-40201541.html

Details released of the GSOC inquiry seems to be much the same from what has been detailed in the official statements todate.

I'm not disputing that at all - I'm saying what I've seen on this thread in fairness. What I have also said is that this should open the question as to whether there is a racial bias in AGS and I don't see the harm in looking. Everyone else jumping up and down and throwing themselves around the place on this thread to make the equivocal and absurd claim that there is no racism makes me want to investigate it even more.

FreudianSlippers

BattleCorp wrote: »

I don't agree. I feel my questions are relevant.

We are all speculating here, and you are no different.

The poster I was replying to stated in an earlier post that the Gardai had other options (shoot in arm/leg/not at all) and I wanted to see if the poster was willing to give their opinion on what the Gardai should have done.

You don't have to be a member of the ASU to have an opinion on something that the ASU do/did.

Of course you do. It's manifestly irrelevant what Joe Bloggs on the street would do in such a situation; what's relevant is objectively from the training and procedures what that person with equal training and experience should have done.

Whether or not race was a motivating factor in this case may or may not be relevant, but in the broader scheme it would seem that there is a lot of effort being put in on this thread by people either members of AGS, wannabe members of AGS or just have hard-ons for cops to state that there is no issue of racism whatsoever in AGS.

I find that more than a bit suspicious in terms of the agenda of these posters.

mynamejeff

Vieira82 wrote: »

So let's see if I get this. I post an opinion, never mentioned race or individual. You and so many others charge at Ad Hominems.

But if i do it "oh you're using Ad Hominems" you guys are hilarious, you can do and say whatever you want attack, shame, tell others to shut up. But no one can do the same at you as you all behave like snowflakes... Typical again, of your kind...

But again, I will just stop answering you out of respect of other users that are trying to engage in an actual discussion, thing you obviously lack the capacity for...

You really should not use phrases you don't understand in a discussion , it does not reflect well even on you Ad hominems :pac::pac::pac:

FreudianSlippers

gozunda wrote: »

No I don't believe it is a debate based diametrically on those two view points.

The discussion has covered the incident in its totality. Not just the shooting but everything to do with the incident and what has happened after.. And whilst issues of racism have certainly been discussed - a lot of that deals with the various allegations of same by third parties before many of the facts of the incident were fully known.

Interestingly a recent article in The Irish Examiner stated that it was understood that -



https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/spotlight/arid-40201541.html

Details released of the GSOC inquiry seems to be much the same from what has been detailed in the official statements todate.

BTW thanks for a reasoned and coherent post, which seems to be sorely lacking on this thread.

BattleCorp

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

The circumstances of the shooting are a matter for GSOC. If you want to engage in daylight AGS fellatio on this website, that's your business. However, you're engaging in pure speculation as much as anyone else on here - in fact, you cannot factually state either way whether or not there is racism in AGS or not, whether race was a motivating factor in the shooting or whether the individuals were racist themselves.

Unless in fact you're claiming to be that person or persons, in which case I'd advise you to step away from your internet connections.

So, it's idle speculation when I ask a poster a question about their opinion but it's not idle speculation when you ask questions about racism in the Gardai (post #6949).

And I've lost respect for you when you stated that I am engaging in AGS fellatio. I've said earlier in the thead that I think they took the right course of action. Where have I............sucked their cock?

WrenBoy

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'm not disputing that at all - I'm saying what I've seen on this thread in fairness. What I have also said is that this should open the question as to whether there is a racial bias in AGS and I don't see the harm in looking. Everyone else jumping up and down and throwing themselves around the place on this thread to make the equivocal and absurd claim that there is no racism makes me want to investigate it even more.

I would never oppose ensuring there is no racism in the practices of AGS, however its the timing and implication of calling for that now.
Whether we like it or not it is connecting racism with what happened in the George Nkencho incident and thats not fair in my opinion. People are rightly upset by the incident and the calls of racism that came after directed at AGS and Ireland by extension. You can hardly blame people for getting a bit tetchy about the topic.

Sir Oxman

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Of course you do. It's manifestly irrelevant what Joe Bloggs on the street would do in such a situation; what's relevant is objectively from the training and procedures what that person with equal training and experience should have done.

Whether or not race was a motivating factor in this case may or may not be relevant, but in the broader scheme it would seem that there is a lot of effort being put in on this thread by people either members of AGS, wannabe members of AGS or just have hard-ons for cops to state that there is no issue of racism whatsoever in AGS.

I find that more than a bit suspicious in terms of the agenda of these posters.

Did I read you saying you have read the last 20 posts or 20 of a near 7,000 post thread?
And you come to that conclusion?
I can say I haven't read (or maybe cannot recall) any posts or significant amount of posts that state that there is unequivocally no racist members of AGS.

I can state unequivocally that public figures, politicians etc stated publicly within hours of the incident that racism was a motivation or they heavily implied that.
And that is how the discussion began here on how the incident was deemed racist with zero evidence.
The incident, not that every single member of AGS was not racist.

Ted_YNWA

Vieira82 wrote: »

when it's from the likes of you and your "agenda" or kind of arguments, I read only the first one then I no longer waste time with your kind. Out of respect for the other users, this is my last reply to you. Have a great time writing on the walls ok?

Threadbanned

tayto lover

Vieira82 wrote: »

That's definitely the likely outcome of this, if everything that was in Prime time is anything to follow from...

There really can’t be any other outcome.
They tried other means to subdue him before shooting him and only fired the shots when he attacked them.

Ted_YNWA

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Not that I want to row in your the idiotic "ad hominem" tit-for-tat that's going on here, but you can see how calling me a racist is not only a ****ing idiotic thing to do but also... you guessed it!

Listen bubblypop, when you answer all those questions for me then maybe I'll think about answering them for you.

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

BTW thanks for a reasoned and coherent post, which seems to be sorely lacking on this thread.

Mod

Threadbanned,

We are obviously beneath you to engage with civilly

BattleCorp

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Of course you do. It's manifestly irrelevant what Joe Bloggs on the street would do in such a situation; what's relevant is objectively from the training and procedures what that person with equal training and experience should have done.

Whether or not race was a motivating factor in this case may or may not be relevant, but in the broader scheme it would seem that there is a lot of effort being put in on this thread by people either members of AGS, wannabe members of AGS or just have hard-ons for cops to state that there is no issue of racism whatsoever in AGS.

I find that more than a bit suspicious in terms of the agenda of these posters.

No, you don't need to be an ARU expert to have an opinion on something they do. For instance, it's common knowledge that police forces around the world (including ours) are trained to shoot at the centre mass of a target and not the arms and legs. The reason for this is that it's the best way to neutralise a threat. So, it's perfectly acceptable for me to respond to another poster regarding why the ARU didn't shoot the guy in the arms and legs (like he/she questioned).

I haven't made a big deal about the race thing either way. I personally don't think there was a race element to the shooting but I'm fine with someone asking that question.

Vieira82

Ted_YNWA wrote: »

Mod

Threadbanned,

We are obviously beneath you to engage with civilly

gotta love a forum mod distributing bans out of nowhere to users simply stating a point of view, being massively attacked and then the mod bans them but let the others with the hate speech on the forum.

BEAUTIFULL MAN!!!! AHAHAHAHA! HONESTLY LOVE IT!!!

GO FREEDOM OF SPEECH GO! Protect the right wing snowflakes, burn the ppl with opinions!!! GO GO GO! :

CtevenSrowder

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Irrelevant - that's not what's pertinent here. You don't even know what you would have done differently unless you were the member(s) of AGS in question.

Irrelevant as this poster is, presumably, not a trained STOC member.


Again, the question is irrelevant as it asks the poster to engage in speculation on the basis of a lack of personal knowledge as I outlined above.

This isn't a court of law pal.

Asus X540L

Haven't checked this thread in a few days and I have to say it's gone completely round the twist.

I had no idea what people are on about the last few pages

Ted_YNWA

Vieira82 wrote: »

gotta love a forum mod distributing bans out of nowhere to users simply stating a point of view, being massively attacked and then the mod bans them but let the others with the hate speech on the forum.

BEAUTIFULL MAN!!!! AHAHAHAHA! HONESTLY LOVE IT!!!

GO FREEDOM OF SPEECH GO! Protect the right wing snowflakes, burn the ppl with opinions!!! GO GO GO! :

Mod

GO GO GO away for a week.

mynamejeff

Asus X540L wrote: »

Haven't checked this thread in a few days and I have to say it's gone completely round the twist.

I had no idea what people are on about the last few pages

na I reckon the mods have done well there and the problem is sorted

The_Kew_Tour

You know when you see a or even a few :D:D often that the poster is actually annoyed and pretending to be calm but is actually raging behind it all

jimmycrackcorm

Vieira82 wrote: »

gotta love a forum mod distributing bans out of nowhere to users simply stating a point of view, being massively attacked and then the mod bans them but let the others with the hate speech on the forum.

BEAUTIFULL MAN!!!! AHAHAHAHA! HONESTLY LOVE IT!!!

GO FREEDOM OF SPEECH GO! Protect the right wing snowflakes, burn the ppl with opinions!!! GO GO GO! :

Where is the hate speech?
Who is being right wing?

WrenBoy

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Where is the hate speech?
Who is being right wing?

Everyone is right wing by default, then you have to prove your not. Thats the way it seems to be working at the minute as far as I can tell.

weldoninhio

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Of course you do. It's manifestly irrelevant what Joe Bloggs on the street would do in such a situation; what's relevant is objectively from the training and procedures what that person with equal training and experience should have done.

Whether or not race was a motivating factor in this case may or may not be relevant, but in the broader scheme it would seem that there is a lot of effort being put in on this thread by people either members of AGS, wannabe members of AGS or just have hard-ons for cops to state that there is no issue of racism whatsoever in AGS.

I find that more than a bit suspicious in terms of the agenda of these posters.

I'm no fan of AGS, my posting history will show that. Unless someone was in danger, or I needed insurance documents filled out by them I wouldn't bother calling them if I was burgled/assaulted. Complete waste of time and would only add to my frustration as past interactions have proven.

But looking at the video of the incident I can't see any racial angle, they did everything they could until he was a clear threat to the Gardai at the scene. Thats not to say there are no racist Gardai, I'm sure out of 15k there are some racists in it. But this case is not a reason to bring it up, especially to stir it up, as some of our public representatives have done.

ThunbergsAreGo

Asus X540L wrote: »

Haven't checked this thread in a few days and I have to say it's gone completely round the twist.

I had no idea what people are on about the last few pages

Have you ever, ever felt like this?
Have strange things happened...

biko

suicide_circus wrote: »

The Indo using a photo of George N as a child is utterly ridiculous.

screamer wrote: »

See photos of him as a child now circulating on media with more on the story accompanying them.

Sir Oxman wrote: »

Did RTE or other media show child prictures of Hennessy a few years ago?

That is pretty strange alright. I don't remember seeing that happen for any others adults that have died in connection with Garda action.
It didn't happen for 27yo John Carthy.
It didn't happen for 20yo Terence Wheelock.

Possibly they wanted underhandedly to convey a feeling of innocence, or less conspiratorially will do anything to sell papers/get clicks.

biko

biko wrote: »

That is pretty strange alright. I don't remember seeing that happen for any others adults that have died in connection with Garda action.
It didn't happen for 27yo John Carthy.
It didn't happen for 20yo Terence Wheelock.

Possibly they wanted underhandedly to convey a feeling of innocence, or less conspiratorially will do anything to sell papers/get clicks.

I wouldn’t even say this is RTÉ/print media’s fault, this would probably have been the family. I assume it’s the photos they were given in an effort to do exactly as you said.

newmember2

bubblypop wrote: »

?
The member who shot him has to justify every shot.

There was 5 bullets fired with some hitting him and some not...how do they determine in which order the bullets hit or missed the target.

punisher5112

You would think many would be grateful to be in such a safe country compared to the USA especially.....

Obviously us racist Irish should be ashamed of ourselves and as we oppressed so many we should be ashamed.....


I do wonder do they actually teach the kids history or does any of these actually have a few brain cells to rub together to make 2...... Where they could actually read up on Irish heritage and history and how we were actually oppressed but I suppose it will never fit in with the NGO agenda etc...

newmember?

newmember? wrote: »

There was 5 bullets fired with some hitting him and some not...how do they determine in which order the bullets hit or missed the target.

Every shot means every time he pulled the trigger.
He must justify every time he pulled the trigger

punisher5112

punisher5112 wrote: »

You would think many would be grateful to be in such a safe country compared to the USA especially.....

Obviously us racist Irish should be ashamed of ourselves and as we oppressed so many we should be ashamed.....


I do wonder do they actually teach the kids history or does any of these actually have a few brain cells to rub together to make 2...... Where they could actually read up on Irish heritage and history and how we were actually oppressed but I suppose it will never fit in with the NGO agenda etc...

Why don't you stop making it about racism?

tayto lover

bubblypop wrote: »

Why don't you stop making it about racism?

Nobody should make it about racism. I agree with you.
However many so-called politicians, university lecturers and the media have done so quite openly. Even In what they have omitted as well as what they have said.
They have stoked the very fires of racism.

I have sent emails of complaint to universities, newspapers and the national broadcaster this week.

BattleCorp

newmember? wrote: »

There was 5 bullets fired with some hitting him and some not...how do they determine in which order the bullets hit or missed the target.

Forensics, witness statements, Garda statements, available footage etc. A mish-mash of all that probably.