Government flip flops / school closures

deiseindublin

Is that the plan? Have the unions veto it?

WHERE ARE NPHET?
I'm actually gobsmacked at this, thought it was just media but it's ****ing nuts.

zeebre12

acequion wrote: »

Are people getting on to their unions? ASTI voted to strike over way less, remember!! I've just mailed mine.

This is something that teachers have to fight and not cave in on. With the transmission rates out there at the moment there is no way that schools are safe places. I think this is the single most absurd ministerial decision since this started and that's saying something!

What choice do nurses or other essential workers have? Sometimes you just have to get on with it and stop whinging.

wirelessdude01

deiseindublin wrote: »

Is that the plan? Have the unions veto it?

WHERE ARE NPHET?
I'm actually gobsmacked at this, thought it was just media but it's ****ing nuts.

Guessing NPHET will be listening to this saying this isn't what we all agreed would happen yesterday.

rainbowtrout

notwhoyouthink wrote: »

I don't think that is quite fair. If she were to issue an edict, schools would be complaining that it was overly restrictive. She is giving them the discretion and requisite flexibility to make their own arrangements. What might work for an urban school, won't work for a rural school, and so forth.

All it requires is a bit of rejigging of the timetable, and some blended learning. Teachers worked wonders in September, and all they need to do is repeat that. I really don't see what the fuss is all about TBH.

Spoken by someone who has never put a school timetable together.

lulublue22

acequion wrote: »

Are people getting on to their unions? ASTI voted to strike over way less, remember!! I've just mailed mine.

This is something that teachers have to fight and not cave in on. With the transmission rates out there at the moment there is no way that schools are safe places. I think this is the single most absurd ministerial decision since this started and that's saying something!

Emailed my union earlier - not expecting much from them to be honest.

djemba djemba

It is like the department and minister don't trust us to work from home.

amacca

km79 wrote: »

Clearly being made up as she goes along
No idea of the implications for people on the ground
scary

Or Strategy.....see if enough outrage provoked from enough students, parents, teachers, unions to give them cover to row back on decision

Remember Norma is not making decisions for herself, she is being told what to do and is eminently expendable (in a political sense), they can slot another placeholder in there it this goes tits up .......education was always go8ng to be controversial this year, putting your best most competent person in there only makes sense if they are a threat and you want rid of them, but putting in someone like Norms is nearly a win win for them.....if it works out, well and good...and you might have curbed the healy raes in Kerry (although that's unlikely)....its a bit of a master stroke from Martin in a way, it was always going to be a cluster****, if this works grand, if it doesnt f all blowback for them or time to repair fences afterwards.

2011abc

notwhoyouthink wrote: »

I don't think that is quite fair. If she were to issue an edict, schools would be complaining that it was overly restrictive. She is giving them the discretion and requisite flexibility to make their own arrangements. What might work for an urban school, won't work for a rural school, and so forth.

All it requires is a bit of rejigging of the timetable, and some blended learning. Teachers worked wonders in September, and all they need to do is repeat that. I really don't see what the fuss is all about TBH.

Clearly the 'who you think' in your name is someone posting from FFG HQ Social Media Division ...

wirelessdude01

djemba djemba wrote: »

It is like the department and minister don't trust us to work from home.

Wait and see some principals demanding that all teaching takes place from the classroom. Already aware of some principals who have emailed their staff indicating this.

Smacruairi

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Wait and see some principals demanding that all teaching takes place from the classroom. Already aware of some principals who have emailed their staff indicating this.

To be fair, I wouldn't demand it, I'd offer it to staff if theyre allowed to, to mitigate all the IT issues staff can have. One thing is for certain, I'll be adopting a much slower pace this time.

alroley

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Wait and see some principals demanding that all teaching takes place from the classroom. Already aware of some principals who have emailed their staff indicating this.

Already heard talk of this from my principal.

FairCity12

zeebre12 wrote: »

What choice do nurses or other essential workers have? Sometimes you just have to get on with it and stop whinging.

Nurses expect to be working in environments where sickness is 'the norm'.

Teachers don't.

Nurses do not spend almost 6 hours a day in a confined space with 30 people from different home situations.

Teachers do.

Random sample

Looking at the wording ‘leaving certs will be allowed to attend’. I wonder will principals allow space in school to be supervised form online learning?

Warbeastrior

FairCity just don't engage is the best way to deal with those types.

Rosita

zeebre12 wrote: »

What choice do nurses or other essential workers have? Sometimes you just have to get on with it and stop whinging.

But teachers have a choice. There's online teaching. Not relevant to point out people who cannot work online. Missing the point spectacularly.

km79

Well given that students will be in the building and there will likely be staff out absent too then the S and S side of thins will still have to operate so it may be easier to stay in the building for some days!

It is a mess for the entire school community. I GUARANTEE you Joe Duffy will be full of LC students and parents complaining about the risks involved. And demanding a full TT of remote learning instead

wirelessdude01

Question, was there any mention at the presser why it is 3 days and not the full 5 days?

Really it should either be no one in or the 6th years in as per usual. Purely from a timetabling point of view this adds a huge strain on principals.

djemba djemba

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Question, was there any mention at the presser why it is 3 days and not the full 5 days?

Really it should either be no one in or the 6th years in as per usual. Purely from a timetabling point of view this adds a huge strain on principals.

I would have thought that would be one of the first questions asked to the minister.

And schools with SEN classes will be there 5 days anyway

lulublue22

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Question, was there any mention at the presser why it is 3 days and not the full 5 days?

Really it should either be no one in or the 6th years in as per usual. Purely from a timetabling point of view this adds a huge strain on principals.

3 days on site 2 online - genuinely who knows prob thought she’d soften the issue by having reduced days. she has managed to create a huge cluster xuck

wingnut

What the hell are we supposed to do with our own kids. We are both teachers (like many I know) and have kids in primary, ECCE and a childminders. Maybe we could do a couple of hours a day in shifts but the logistics are going to be insane.

Msbookeeper

Any chance the Trade Unions can cooperate on this, personally still waiting on a permanent contract so haven't joined one or the other but whichever actually makes a stand ill be filling my application with.

This is too much, no effective contact tracing, significant community spread of new variant and the inequity of requiring some colleagues to run the gambit of catching the virus.

Nora, hand in your resignation this is like a scene from the office.

amacca

lulublue22 wrote: »

3 days on site 2 online - genuinely who knows prob thought she’d soften the issue by having reduced days.

It will be left To local arrangements.....blame falls back on schools/teachers that way.

Smacruairi

Is this an attempt by the govt to push us into strike so that A there's no one in the schools, and B they don't have to pay a wage, or is it a push for 3 days knowing everyone is angry and they row back and it seems less harsh going to remote without any guidance or investment in that at all.

Like is it incompetence or masterful politics? Surely they couldn't be that callous?
If it wasn't kids lives and welfare I'd be calling for everyone to have the equivalent of blue flu from Monday. It's shameful,but how do you combat this.

amacca

I see they've not consulted unions either if tui to be believed.....deliberately trying to back unions into corner to provoke reaction and not have students in school but place blame elsewhere

Leadership people.....thats what this is.

lulublue22

amacca wrote: »

I see they've not consulted unions either if tui to be believed.....deliberately trying to back unions into corner to provoke reaction and not have students in school but place blame elsewhere

Leadership people.....thats what this is.

According to INTO release they weren’t consulted either.

lawred2

wingnut wrote: »

What the hell are we supposed to do with our own kids. We are both teachers (like many I know) and have kids in primary, ECCE and a childminders. Maybe we could do a couple of hours a day in shifts but the logistics are going to be insane.

every parent has this or a variant of this problem

it's a complete mess

antgal23

I think principals will contact parents and staff to see who plans to come in next Monday

If numbers are low due to whatever reason principals will stay shut

joebloggs32

lulublue22 wrote: »

According to INTO release they weren’t consulted either.

They told the unions what was happening after they had the decision made. In their minds this accounts for "consulting" with the unions.

The TUI told them they were opposed to it, but Norma still pressed ahead.

wirelessdude01

antgal23 wrote: »

I think principals will contact parents and staff to see who plans to come in next Monday

If numbers are low due to whatever reason principals will stay shut

I'd imagine they'll have to remain open regardless.

Treppen

amacca wrote: »

I see they've not consulted unions either if tui to be believed.....deliberately trying to back unions into corner to provoke reaction and not have students in school but place blame elsewhere

Leadership people.....thats what this is.

"When being chased by a tiger you only have to be faster than the other guy". Kanye West