Connacht Team Talk Thread VI - Some like it TOH

freyners

Strand1970 wrote: »

Just curious do you think Connacht would play a game in Sligo if the rovers were to upgrade the showgrounds in a few years. They plan to lenghten the pitch which would also achieve the criteria for rugby.

Ya i could see A games or pre-season games there like how they occasionally use Buccs for the same. Lease with the SG might mean all league and europe games are held in the sportsground but given the showgrounds is a higher capacity stadium (in terms of stands) compared to buccs you could see a league game there. Really depends on contracts, etc.

Disadvantage is there are enough journalists who already incorrectly use the showgrounds to refer to the sportsground and it would only give them a justification:D

b.gud

Strand1970 wrote: »

Just curious do you think Connacht would play a game in Sligo if the rovers were to upgrade the showgrounds in a few years. They plan to lenghten the pitch which would also achieve the criteria for rugby.

It would be great to see games played at other venues around the province to help grow the game, however I'd imagine that at most it would be a pre-season warm-up game. It's worth remembering that Connacht are, at least in theory, still redeveloping the sportsground so they would probably be looking to get as much use, and revenue, out of the redevelopment as possible.

Again to be clear I think it would be great to see games played around the province but not sure if we would see many of them and as Ki said definitely no major ones

RonnieL

Looks like a very exciting proposal for Sligo. I'm sure the Connacht branch would do the market research to determine how best to use it if it were to be built. Do Munster fans think the Thomand/Musgrave approach works? I don't know how having two grounds would impact season ticket sales for example. I assume there would have to be the option of a sportsground ticket, a showgrounds ticket, and an every game ticket?

Strand1970

The showgrounds would only be available during the soccer off season from November to March at best. A dragons or Italian team might be possibility I honestly think a game up here would sell out quickly and be a massive PR success for connacht.

salmocab

Strand1970 wrote: »

The showgrounds would only be available during the soccer off season from November to March at best. A dragons or Italian team might be possibility I honestly think a game up here would sell out quickly and be a massive PR success for connacht.

Heard mention on the radio the other day so not sure of any details, that Sligo rugby club are going to use it if it’s done up. I assume it helps with funding.

Strand1970

That should help funding alright having in theory a multi sports venue. Maybe 1 or 2 AIL games might be played there but rovers will be focusing on revenue like concerts and other gigs.

Zzippy

FACECUTTR wrote: »

James Cronin would make a nice signing. Has done very well this season and has that bit of niggle and abrasiveness. If McCallister is going he would be a fantastic replacement. Marshall would have been worth a punt for a year too if DTM and Murphy had not re-signed. He looked sure to get a few ireland caps before he picked up a few injuries.

I'd take him in a heartbeat but the reality is if Munster couldn't afford to keep him, we definitely couldn't afford to sign him.

siltirocker

ki wrote: »

Yes it's Connacht Rugby not Galway rugby. Plus Sligo is a major contributor to the local talent pool.

And it's something that for periods get's lost. I played underage, and again later as an adult for a year with Sligo RFC, and played junior schools with Sligo Grammar and Summerhill. And I found the Sligo disillusionment with Connacht at times was very high. For periods it was arguably Munster territory. Well maybe not that strong in rhetoric, but y'get my point.

I remember going to buy a Connacht jersey in 2008 or 2009, and Elverys, a key Connacht sponsor then, did not have a single piece of Connacht merch in the main shop in the Wine Street Car Park. But a whole section of Munster clobber. Even the progress promoted, maybe not so much with the rugby club, but 100% in the Grammar it was to get to Limerick, not Galway. For a period there the better Sligo lads joined Munster set up not Connacht's. Sean Henry, Niall Kenneally, and Cathal Sheridan come to mind. I think Sheridan even once said in the press a Munster jersey was always the one wanted from Santa.

Now that doesn't seem to be the case at all anymore, but it all stemmed from being felt left behind by Galway. And while that was addressed in the Elwood days, and with Lam certainly, I feel it's taken maybe a slight step back. So I'd 100% encourage games in Showgrounds and Dubarry Park.

ClanofLams

I think it’s important to generally have one home stadium. But definitely would like to see Sligo used a bit when redeveloped, maybe one big pre season friendly and one interpro a year on a rotating basis if possible would make sense or one European game a season. If they were to move a regular season game, it’s important it’s a significant one and not one seen as a less appealing fixture.

RonnieL

RonnieL wrote: »

Looks like a very exciting proposal for Sligo. I'm sure the Connacht branch would do the market research to determine how best to use it if it were to be built. Do Munster fans think the Thomand/Musgrave approach works? I don't know how having two grounds would impact season ticket sales for example. I assume there would have to be the option of a sportsground ticket, a showgrounds ticket, and an every game ticket?

It's very different from the Munster situation.

There you have two cities with the primary city/population centre not hosting the games.

Sligo is over two hours from the core support area.
It would really at best have be a 1 game a season situation and then you're facing into effectively giving home advantage for that game.

Would be good for say pool games in the Challenge Cup or the likes.
It doesn't impact season ticket holders either then.

Strand1970

Yes connacht would be playing away but still in front of connacht fans. It would be a huge PR coup and broaden the fan base. The revenue would have to add up to make it happen so it will never be an interpro game. Its a few years away but there is no harm trying it for a season or 2 and see if it becomes a fixture. The dream game would be vs ulster only being 20 miles away

thomond2006

Zzippy wrote: »

I'd take him in a heartbeat but the reality is if Munster couldn't afford to keep him, we definitely couldn't afford to sign him.

Money probably came into it but Munster have young prospects at LH joining the seniors next season.

ShineyShiney

thomond2006 wrote: »

Money probably came into it but Munster have young prospects at LH joining the seniors next season.

With Jack McGrath currently out and Connacht with a McAlister ( I'd keep him) sized hole in our loosehead ranks I'm sure both Ulster and ourselves would be a least mildly interested if he wanted to remain in Ireland. Probably not a huge amount of cash available in either province so an over seas move more likely.

I think Munster are nuts not keeping him, mind you loughman is ok the other two are pure speculation imo

gilberto_eire

gilberto_eire wrote: »

It's very different from the Munster situation.

There you have two cities with the primary city/population centre not hosting the games.

Sligo is over two hours from the core support area.
It would really at best have be a 1 game a season situation and then you're facing into effectively giving home advantage for that game.

Would be good for say pool games in the Challenge Cup or the likes.
It doesn't impact season ticket holders either then.

Considering Season Tickets include all European Pool matches, the idea would have an impact on Season ticket holders

Anyway, I'd be considerable pissed off if Connacht moved anything, other than Pre-season games from the Sportsground.

Host preseason matches all over Connacht for all I care.
They already do some out reach, by hosting open training sessions in different counties.

They do represent all 5 counties, but their home is in Galway, and they'd be doing themselves a disadvantage by hosting meaningful matches away from their home ground.

FYI gilbert_eire, I agree with everything you're saying, apart from the last sentence.

ClanofLams

For some reason I thought it was bigger, just saw it’s a 6000 seater. Given the financial loss be hard to move a big game there.

A big pre season friendly every year would be ideal I guess. Pat Lam’s Bristol or the like.

Anyway ground won’t be complete for couple of years at least.

siltirocker

Meaningless games in sister stadia don't work though. A singular prestige one, across sports, though has always been beneficial.

Connacht even went down that route 10 years ago, with pre-season games, and it was a damp squib. Troy Nathan and Mike Roberts vs Rotherham won't pull in the disenfranchised, marginalised, curious, etc as much as Muldoon and O'Concrete against Ulster!

I am not saying I have thee answer but meaningless pre season games didn't work before. And in cases of using other provincial grounds by other teams around Europe, its always been one of the big ones with a big marketing campaign. Connacht have 6 massive home games a year. Giving 1 a year to Athlone, and then Sligo on a rotation basis will, perhaps, only yield positives.

And look, without sounding too harsh: Galway fans should just deal with it. Connacht represents more than just Galway City. A Galway voice shouldn't be worth more than a Leitrim voice, which I think some fans, unconsciously albeit, think it does.

ShineyShiney

siltirocker wrote: »

Meaningless games in sister stadia don't work though. A singular prestige one, across sports, though has always been beneficial.

Connacht even went down that route 10 years ago, with pre-season games, and it was a damp squib. Troy Nathan and Mike Roberts vs Rotherham won't pull in the disenfranchised, marginalised, curious, etc as much as Muldoon and O'Concrete against Ulster!

I am not saying I have thee answer but meaningless pre season games didn't work before. And in cases of using other provincial grounds by other teams around Europe, its always been one of the big ones with a big marketing campaign. Connacht have 6 massive home games a year. Giving 1 a year to Athlone, and then Sligo on a rotation basis will, perhaps, only yield positives.

And look, without sounding too harsh: Galway fans should just deal with it. Connacht represents more than just Galway City. A Galway voice shouldn't be worth more than a Leitrim voice, which I think some fans, unconsciously albeit, think it does.

Waste of time imo, nothing against Sligo or any other part of the province. Most of these ideas are about gain for the location proposed not gain for Connacht Rugby whose priority has to be building game day experience so that attendances grow.

siltirocker

ShineyShiney wrote: »

Waste of time imo, nothing against Sligo or any other part of the province. Most of these ideas are about gain for the location proposed not gain for Connacht Rugby whose priority has to be building game day experience so that attendances grow.

The preseaon tours a decade ago, along with Heineken Cup qualification, were directly related to Connacht's average attendances almost tripling so I can't agree with you there.

serfboard

siltirocker wrote: »

The preseaon tours a decade ago, along with Heineken Cup qualification, were directly related to Connacht's average attendances almost tripling so I can't agree with you there.

I went to the one against Wasps in Athlone a couple of years ago - it was great. Mind you, it was a cracking day, so that might have coloured my impression.

I'd be up for, at least once a season, travelling away to a home match - if that doesn't sound too contradictory.

Zzippy

Not putting down Sligo, but why would Connacht play a game in a soccer stadium they would have to pay to rent, just because it's there? It makes no financial sense to play anything other than a preseason friendly outside of Galway. And given our finances, we need every penny we can save.

Strand1970

At the minimum connacht would have to break even on moving a game. Ideally one game elsewhere a season would be great and create a buzz but the reality is connacht need ever penny they can get. The notion of moving preseasons games would not work. It's like moving a FBD league game to a large local club and hoping you might get a bigger crowd. Is there any update on connacht own plans? Can part of the government funding be drawn down to go ahead with the new pitch?

Bazzo

Strand1970 wrote: »

At the minimum connacht would have to break even on moving a game. Ideally one game elsewhere a season would be great and create a buzz but the reality is connacht need ever penny they can get. The notion of moving preseasons games would not work. It's like moving a FBD league game to a large local club and hoping you might get a bigger crowd. Is there any update on connacht own plans? Can part of the government funding be drawn down to go ahead with the new pitch?

Last I remember hearing about it was back in January. Andy Friend mentioned it in the press release following his new contract:

Andy Friend wrote:

There’s a hugely exciting few years ahead for Connacht, both on the field with the squad we have and off the field with the redevelopment of the Sportsground

Pretty sure it was also confirmed somewhere at some stage that the government funding was still in place, but can't remember where.

siltirocker

Zzippy wrote: »

Not putting down Sligo, but why would Connacht play a game in a soccer stadium they would have to pay to rent, just because it's there? It makes no financial sense to play anything other than a preseason friendly outside of Galway. And given our finances, we need every penny we can save.

Playing in places like Sligo will lead to an increase in support which will lead to increased revenues. Like it has before. We are not talking about an unknown hypothetical. Those games in Athlone were attended by folk from Carrick to Portumna. Those same people then began setting up buses and trips to Galway regularly. Our average attendance went from 1,800 - 4,500 in only 2 years. (Granted HC had a lot to do with that). The games in Athlone, were highlighted in the PGB surveys, as key to this.

Disillusionment across the province is growing. And some of the comments here support that. Having a game or two in places like Athlone or Sligo will reinforce and grow the fan base, and the amounts travelling down to the Sportsground. This has literally worked before, and IMO there is no reason it won't again.

I get there is opinions one way or another on it why it may or may not work, but towards that, again I'll stress: this has worked before. And could be a good tactic to address the growing distance some fans have.

Zzippy

siltirocker wrote: »

Playing in places like Sligo will lead to an increase in support which will lead to increased revenues. Like it has before. We are not talking about an unknown hypothetical. Those games in Athlone were attended by folk from Carrick to Portumna. Those same people then began setting up buses and trips to Galway regularly. Our average attendance went from 1,800 - 4,500 in only 2 years. (Granted HC had a lot to do with that). The games in Athlone, were highlighted in the PGB surveys, as key to this.

Disillusionment across the province is growing. And some of the comments here support that. Having a game or two in places like Athlone or Sligo will reinforce and grow the fan base, and the amounts travelling down to the Sportsground. This has literally worked before, and IMO there is no reason it won't again.

I get there is opinions one way or another on it why it may or may not work, but towards that, again I'll stress: this has worked before. And could be a good tactic to address the growing distance some fans have.

Those were pre-season games. Connacht rely heavily on matchday revenue, and season ticket sales are based on regular season games being held in the Sportsground.
Also, correlation =/= causation. You acknowledged those pre-season games came when we qualified for HEC. IMO that had a far bigger impact on the increase in season tickets and attendance.

siltirocker

Zzippy wrote: »

Those were pre-season games. Connacht rely heavily on matchday revenue, and season ticket sales are based on regular season games being held in the Sportsground.

I think the bigger picture, even in terms of revenue, is to get new fans or reinvigorate those who are jaded. A game in Dubarry for example with 5k covers the potential reduction in season ticket holders prices for getting 23 games instead of 24 (or 5 interpros/European vs 6). In one scenario Connacht potentially gain more fans and that will lead to increased merch and attendances.

The only way I see revenue being an issue here is if current season ticket holders would protest, even with a price reduction or transport arrangement, allowing one of the 24 regular/6 larger games be played elsewhere, which would, in many eyes I imagine, cement even more so the Galway vs the rest mentality.

Zzippy wrote: »

Also, correlation =/= causation. You acknowledged those pre-season games came when we qualified for HEC. IMO that had a far bigger impact on the increase in season tickets and attendance.

You're opinion is that it was far greater, but the study ran by the PGB found that the most significant attendance increase was from outside of Galway. I can't recall but it was around the 1800 mark, up from 300-400, with just as many of those noting the outreach such as games outside Galway, as their key reasoning. (Particularly families).


Simply put, we can go around in circles, but I see no evidence, in fact to the contrary, that pulling 1 of the 6 bigger games out of Galway once a year or two to somewhere like Sligo or Athlone, will damage supporter numbers or revenue. It has worked previously for Connacht, and it has worked with others too like Toulon and Biarritz.

Lost Ormond

Strand1970 wrote: »

Just curious do you think Connacht would play a game in Sligo if the rovers were to upgrade the showgrounds in a few years. They plan to lenghten the pitch which would also achieve the criteria for rugby.

They may but as others have said it would only ever really be smaller games as it wouldnt be worthwhile across so many reasons to move bigger games. Just like Cork doesnt see interpros, european games of Munsters.

ki wrote: »

Yes it's Connacht Rugby not Galway rugby. Plus Sligo is a major contributor to the local talent pool.

But like in Munster they will be games of lesser significance.

Sligo have been a good contributor to the squad and talent pool but that doesnt mean the set up now or ever has been Galway Rugby not Connacht Rugby.

b.gud wrote: »

It would be great to see games played at other venues around the province to help grow the game, however I'd imagine that at most it would be a pre-season warm-up game. It's worth remembering that Connacht are, at least in theory, still redeveloping the sportsground so they would probably be looking to get as much use, and revenue, out of the redevelopment as possible.

Again to be clear I think it would be great to see games played around the province but not sure if we would see many of them and as Ki said definitely no major ones

How many pro teams use multiple home venues for their main team?
Very few. Munster are one of the few and its really politics and a unique factor that isnt the case here that Cork is the bigger city but doesnt have the main stadium.
Connacht aim to stay playing in the sportsground all through the redevelopment and wont have to move out during the works.
I dont see the benefits of moving games especially league/european games following the redevelopment as it would make zero sense financially

RonnieL wrote: »

Looks like a very exciting proposal for Sligo. I'm sure the Connacht branch would do the market research to determine how best to use it if it were to be built. Do Munster fans think the Thomand/Musgrave approach works? I don't know how having two grounds would impact season ticket sales for example. I assume there would have to be the option of a sportsground ticket, a showgrounds ticket, and an every game ticket?

Munster fans just accept the Thomond/Musgrave approach. Its always been the way with Munster home games that games were split between Limerick and Cork like in old days you would have 1 home interpro in Limerick and if there was a second it would be in Cork. Munsters whole political set up within the branch is also split Limerick/Cork as well.
two grounds certainly would affect season ticket sales, corporate sales with games outside of your biggest market, walk up crowds
Munster do have those split season tickets as well as combined and i dont see Connacht doing it as they wouldnt get as much income IMO by moving these games then if they stayed in Galway and maybe played an odd friendly or maybe 1 league game a year in Sligo.

Strand1970 wrote: »

That should help funding alright having in theory a multi sports venue. Maybe 1 or 2 AIL games might be played there but rovers will be focusing on revenue like concerts and other gigs.

Sligo RFC wouldnt need to move and why would they. moving would lose them €€€ from their own bar, function room etc on match day and they dont need that ground for their games.

siltirocker wrote: »

And it's something that for periods get's lost. I played underage, and again later as an adult for a year with Sligo RFC, and played junior schools with Sligo Grammar and Summerhill. And I found the Sligo disillusionment with Connacht at times was very high. For periods it was arguably Munster territory. Well maybe not that strong in rhetoric, but y'get my point.

I remember going to buy a Connacht jersey in 2008 or 2009, and Elverys, a key Connacht sponsor then, did not have a single piece of Connacht merch in the main shop in the Wine Street Car Park. But a whole section of Munster clobber. Even the progress promoted, maybe not so much with the rugby club, but 100% in the Grammar it was to get to Limerick, not Galway. For a period there the better Sligo lads joined Munster set up not Connacht's. Sean Henry, Niall Kenneally, and Cathal Sheridan come to mind. I think Sheridan even once said in the press a Munster jersey was always the one wanted from Santa.

Now that doesn't seem to be the case at all anymore, but it all stemmed from being felt left behind by Galway. And while that was addressed in the Elwood days, and with Lam certainly, I feel it's taken maybe a slight step back. So I'd 100% encourage games in Showgrounds and Dubarry Park.

Henry, Kenneally ended up with Munster through going to Limerick for third level and being picked up through AIL and it was nothing to do with being left behind by Galway.
Moving games out of Galway doesnt make financial sense.

ClanofLams wrote: »

I think it’s important to generally have one home stadium. But definitely would like to see Sligo used a bit when redeveloped, maybe one big pre season friendly and one interpro a year on a rotating basis if possible would make sense or one European game a season. If they were to move a regular season game, it’s important it’s a significant one and not one seen as a less appealing fixture.

I wouldnt be moving any of your biggest home games and biggest money earners from your main ground. that doesnt make sense

Lost Ormond

Strand1970 wrote: »

Yes connacht would be playing away but still in front of connacht fans. It would be a huge PR coup and broaden the fan base. The revenue would have to add up to make it happen so it will never be an interpro game. Its a few years away but there is no harm trying it for a season or 2 and see if it becomes a fixture. The dream game would be vs ulster only being 20 miles away

How much would it really broaden the fan base
Ulster may be 20 miles away but how much of the rugby support in Ulster is that close?
If revenue doesnt add up for an interpro game i dont see how it would add up for the games that are not as well attended in Galway.

siltirocker wrote: »

Meaningless games in sister stadia don't work though. A singular prestige one, across sports, though has always been beneficial.

Connacht even went down that route 10 years ago, with pre-season games, and it was a damp squib. Troy Nathan and Mike Roberts vs Rotherham won't pull in the disenfranchised, marginalised, curious, etc as much as Muldoon and O'Concrete against Ulster!

I am not saying I have thee answer but meaningless pre season games didn't work before. And in cases of using other provincial grounds by other teams around Europe, its always been one of the big ones with a big marketing campaign. Connacht have 6 massive home games a year. Giving 1 a year to Athlone, and then Sligo on a rotation basis will, perhaps, only yield positives.

And look, without sounding too harsh: Galway fans should just deal with it. Connacht represents more than just Galway City. A Galway voice shouldn't be worth more than a Leitrim voice, which I think some fans, unconsciously albeit, think it does.

Connacht would be paying to use these new grounds in Sligo, Rent etc. There is commitments to Galway and Sportsground and losing one of your biggest home games to a venue that isnt much bigger/is smaller isnt really a better option is it?
Its not like welsh sides playing the double header in the millenium or london sides playing games in twickenham etc where they get 2/3/4 times what their ground can hold...
Im not sure how many positives moving your biggest games around will bring.

siltirocker wrote: »

Playing in places like Sligo will lead to an increase in support which will lead to increased revenues. Like it has before. We are not talking about an unknown hypothetical. Those games in Athlone were attended by folk from Carrick to Portumna. Those same people then began setting up buses and trips to Galway regularly. Our average attendance went from 1,800 - 4,500 in only 2 years. (Granted HC had a lot to do with that). The games in Athlone, were highlighted in the PGB surveys, as key to this.

Disillusionment across the province is growing. And some of the comments here support that. Having a game or two in places like Athlone or Sligo will reinforce and grow the fan base, and the amounts travelling down to the Sportsground. This has literally worked before, and IMO there is no reason it won't again.

I get there is opinions one way or another on it why it may or may not work, but towards that, again I'll stress: this has worked before. And could be a good tactic to address the growing distance some fans have.

I really dont see how disillusionment is growing around the province because all the games are in the venue and city that nearly all home games have ever been. If disillusionment is growing its nothing to do with home games solely being in Galway.
And as someone who has worked match days in Sportsground for years i dont see all these numbers from Portumna etc not coming anymore because of any disillusionment with whats in place now....

siltirocker

Lost Ormond wrote: »

Im not sure how many positives moving your biggest games around will bring..

One game, not games. And as mentioned before introducing new fans leads to a larger fan base and more revenue. Which would far negate the cost of one game being moved.

Lost Ormond wrote: »

I really dont see how disillusionment is growing around the province because all the games are in the venue and city that nearly all home games have ever been. If disillusionment is growing its nothing to do with home games solely being in Galway.
And as someone who has worked match days in Sportsground for years i dont see all these numbers from Portumna etc not coming anymore because of any disillusionment with whats in place now....

Not the point made. I didn't state this was because of having all the home games in Galway.

I said its a way of addressing disillusionment in the province, as it did before, but i didn't say it was the source.

siltirocker

To be honest, without digging deep into too many semantics and particulars (of which I above most am guilty of), the points have been made. Maybe no need for us to continue on it, as I think it will just see a lot of points repeated ad nauseam.

People believe moving a bigger game will negatively effect revenue, and I think it this will be negated by the increase in revenue generated in the intermediate term by that game leading to more fans. Some agree, some disagree. Fair enough.

Has anyone heard of anything on the new signing front?

KBurke85

In relation to matches in Sligo, it could be 6-7 years before the stadium upgrade etc is completed. Lets worry about where to play matches when the time comes.