Bought car from dealer online

katiek102010

Took delivery week before Christmas. Car is faulty, they have it back in for repair.

I'm really really not happy. Log book and finance paperwork all arrived and I have an awful replacement car in the meantime. To be honest I have log book in my possession longer than the car I bought along with replacement car

What are my rights regarding telling them keep it and getting my old faithful back

endacl

Did you not get your mechanic to look over it before ... oh...

...

walshtipp

Have a look at the below pages.

https://www.ccpc.ie/consumers/cars/your-rights-if-things-go-wrong/

https://www.ccpc.ie/consumers/shopping/faulty-goods/

Your standard consumer rights should apply. From what I understand you are entitled to a repair or replacement. But a refund would be at the dealers discretion.

Does the car have a major fault?

katiek102010

endacl wrote: »

Did you not get your mechanic to look over it before ... oh...

...

No. As I said I bought it online and took delivery of it

MrMusician18

Would distance selling, 14 day unconditional right of return not apply here?

jimmycrackcorm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Would distance selling, 14 day unconditional right of return not apply here?

Probably too late now as it's likely 14 days since the OP took delivery of the car.
Note: you have to inform the retailer you wish to cancel in this period. But then you also have an additional 14 day from that point to return.

Under the CRD, you have 14 calendar days to change your mind without having to give a reason. This right to cancel is also known as the ‘cooling-off period’.

Your right to cancel begins from the moment you place the order. However, your ‘cooling-off period’ will depend on the type of purchase you made, as follows:

Products (goods): Starts the moment you receive the product. You have 14 days to tell the trader you want to cancel and then a further 14 days to return the products. You may have to pay for the cost of returning the products.

Normal rules apply otherwise.

katiek102010

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Probably too late now as it's likely 14 days since the OP took delivery of the car.
Note: you have to inform the retailer you wish to cancel in this period. But then you also have an additional 14 day from that point to return.

Under the CRD, you have 14 calendar days to change your mind without having to give a reason. This right to cancel is also known as the ‘cooling-off period’.

Your right to cancel begins from the moment you place the order. However, your ‘cooling-off period’ will depend on the type of purchase you made, as follows:

Products (goods): Starts the moment you receive the product. You have 14 days to tell the trader you want to cancel and then a further 14 days to return the products. You may have to pay for the cost of returning the products.

Normal rules apply otherwise.

Tried to buy could only deal with the one particular sales guy and he was either on leave or they were closed.

Is there any allowance made for Bank Holidays etc?

I'm really really peed off, I took delivery on 17th

katiek102010

walshtipp wrote: »

Have a look at the below pages.

https://www.ccpc.ie/consumers/cars/your-rights-if-things-go-wrong/

https://www.ccpc.ie/consumers/shopping/faulty-goods/

Your standard consumer rights should apply. From what I understand you are entitled to a repair or replacement. But a refund would be at the dealers discretion.

Does the car have a major fault?

A number of faults. I strongly suspect the wheel bearings as I can hear the noise over the engine plus the floor of the car is vibrating.

I can 100% guarantee that if I was able to test drive prior I would not have purchased, however due to covid I couldn't.

I was looking for this specific make and spec of car as an automatic for a long time. They are quite rare and had resigned to possibly importing next year when this one popped up

Covit

katiek102010 wrote: »

A number of faults. I strongly suspect the wheel bearings as I can hear the noise over the engine plus the floor of the car is vibrating.

I can 100% guarantee that if I was able to test drive prior I would not have purchased, however due to covid I couldn't.

I was looking for this specific make and spec of car as an automatic for a long time. They are quite rare and had resigned to possibly importing next year when this one popped up

What is it ?

katiek102010

Covit wrote: »

What is it ?

172 focus diesel auto. The worst part is another popped up Christmas week in a local dealership

Covit

katiek102010 wrote: »

172 focus diesel auto. The worst part is another popped up Christmas week in a local dealership

Focus can be troublesome

jimmycrackcorm

katiek102010 wrote: »

Tried to buy could only deal with the one particular sales guy and he was either on leave or they were closed.

Is there any allowance made for Bank Holidays etc?

I'm really really peed off, I took delivery on 17th

No. There is no allowance.

katiek102010 wrote: »

A number of faults. I strongly suspect the wheel bearings as I can hear the noise over the engine plus the floor of the car is vibrating.

I can 100% guarantee that if I was able to test drive prior I would not have purchased, however due to covid I couldn't.

I was looking for this specific make and spec of car as an automatic for a long time. They are quite rare and had resigned to possibly importing next year when this one popped up

Why didn't you reject the car when you got it then? It doesn't make sense to say you'd 100% guarantee that you wouldn't have purchased but then keep it when you actually get it.

In any case, it's not unusual to buy a second-hand car and need the dealer to fix things under warranty.

Suckit

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/shopping/shopping_online.html#le52ba
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/cars/buying_a_used_car.html#l6fa1c

It seems you would be covered for a lot of things, and delivery on the 17th would probably be covered by Christmas day New Years Day and maybe others (if they were closed).
I would ask in the motors forum, they know their stuff there and will probably be able to give you a lot more information than here.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=47

katiek102010

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

No. There is no allowance.



Why didn't you reject the car when you got it then? It doesn't make sense to say you'd 100% guarantee that you wouldn't have purchased but then keep it when you actually get it.

In any case, it's not unusual to buy a second-hand car and need the dealer to fix things under warranty.

I rang 3 times over next 2 days and got no response, I was leaving messages and getting told I needed to speak with the sales guy. Funny how he was there why I was querying to buy it. I also got another family member to test drive to confirm my suspicions.

I then got finance paperwork through from an email address and I emailed that back, the response gave a phone number to ring.

I got through on that but it was for repairs only and they said due to Christmas closure etc they couldn't pick it up till 29th, which they did late that afternoon but I kept getting told I had to speak with the sales guy about rejection. Someone told me then he's not back till tmrw.

Does it mean anything that they have possession of the car currently

katiek102010

Suckit wrote: »

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/shopping/shopping_online.html#le52ba
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/cars/buying_a_used_car.html#l6fa1c

It seems you would be covered for a lot of things, and delivery on the 17th would probably be covered by Christmas day New Years Day and maybe others (if they were closed).
I would ask in the motors forum, they know their stuff there and will probably be able to give you a lot more information than here.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=47

Thanks i have just posted

jimmycrackcorm

Suckit wrote: »

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/shopping/shopping_online.html#le52ba
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/cars/buying_a_used_car.html#l6fa1c

It seems you would be covered for a lot of things, and delivery on the 17th would probably be covered by Christmas day New Years Day and maybe others (if they were closed).
I would ask in the motors forum, they know their stuff there and will probably be able to give you a lot more information than here.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=47

Where are you getting this idea from? The obligation is on the consumer to send their notification to the retailer within the 14 days. It's irrelevant if the business is closed at any point in that period. It might be argued that the post office is closed so you can't post a notice, but that can't be said for an email which is equally valid and very pertinent when it comes to online sales.

katiek102010

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Where are you getting this idea from? The obligation is on the consumer to send their notification to the retailer within the 14 days. It's irrelevant if the business is closed at any point in that period. It might be argued that the post office is closed so you can't post a notice, but that can't be said for an email which is equally valid and very pertinent when it comes to online sales.

I did email but it was the people who organised the finance. No email for the sales guy I seemingly needed to speak too. Calls not returned and then he was on leave, only back tomorrow

jimmycrackcorm

katiek102010 wrote: »

I rang 3 times over next 2 days and got no response, I was leaving messages and getting told I needed to speak with the sales guy. Funny how he was there why I was querying to buy it. I also got another family member to test drive to confirm my suspicions.

I then got finance paperwork through from an email address and I emailed that back, the response gave a phone number to ring.

I got through on that but it was for repairs only and they said due to Christmas closure etc they couldn't pick it up till 29th, which they did late that afternoon but I kept getting told I had to speak with the sales guy about rejection. Someone told me then he's not back till tmrw.

Does it mean anything that they have possession of the car currently[/QUOTE]

Unless it is seriously unfit for purpose, then normal consumer rights apply. They are entitled to make repairs. I've heard numerous stories of brand new cars having faults the day they were driven out of the showroom and had to be repaired.

It's crappy when these things happen, but you'll have a long uphill struggle to try to simply refuse the car back and get your money back.

Suckit

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Where are you getting this idea from? The obligation is on the consumer to send their notification to the retailer within the 14 days. It's irrelevant if the business is closed at any point in that period. It might be argued that the post office is closed so you can't post a notice, but that can't be said for an email which is equally valid and very pertinent when it comes to online sales.

From this:

Faulty goods

Under the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act, 1980 all products must meet certain conditions of quality, performance and durability. This means that when you buy something it has to be:

Of satisfactory (merchantable) quality - this means of reasonable and acceptable standard, taking into account other factors such as durability and price
Fit for the purpose you bought it for – they should work and do what they are reasonably expected to do
As described - they must match any description given in an advert or other information provided by the seller at the time of sale

The same rules apply for products or services you bought online.

Under consumer law you are entitled to certain remedies when something you buy is not of merchantable quality, fit for purchase or as described. A remedy can be in the form of a repairs, replacements and refunds.

If the fault appears within the first 6 months, it is assumed that the problem existed when you received the goods and it’s up to the seller to prove otherwise. If the fault appears after the first 6 months, you may be asked to prove that the problem existed when you received it.

You can find more information about guarantees and warranties and repairs, replacements and refunds.

And this from that link, and much more consumer rights would cover them also.

Before you ask, I did not say entitled to replacement, I said they are covered for many things. But with lockdown in place I would hazard a guess that much would be in the buyers favour, including the 14 days distance selling. But OP has gone to motors forum now anyway for better advice.

Suckit

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Unless it is seriously unfit for purpose, then normal consumer rights apply. They are entitled to make repairs. I've heard numerous stories of brand new cars having faults the day they were driven out of the showroom and had to be repaired.

It's crappy when these things happen, but you'll have a long uphill struggle to try to simply refuse the car back and get your money back.

I don't think you are correct under lockdown and if seller hasn't replied from buyers initial emails.

I would bet you that the buyer would win in court (with or without covid) and ONLY on the proof that buyer has emailed and tried to contact seller with the 14 days without reply.

Mjolnir

Op you bought a second hand car your threshold for it not being of merchantable quality is a lot lower than a brand new one. As a second hand car it's assumed it has wear and tear, some of that has become apparent in a fault. The garage have taken it back to repair, fulfilling their obligation, regards your rights as a consumer.

You had 14 calander days from the day of delivery to inform them in writting of your change of mind. This includes email, with the added benefit of an email being considered as recieved on the first opportunity reasonably available to read it ( opening of next business day if after hours). Following 14 days to arrange delivery.

There is to my knowledge no allowance for bank Holidays.

You said you believe what is a perishable part to be at fault, there for the car is still fit for purpose if the repair sorts the issue.

spaceHopper

Ring and ask to speak to the general manger, tell them you tried to contact them and kept getting told to speak to somebody who was not available, tell them you want your money back and they can pick up the loaner car.

Also go onto sites like trustpilot and give them a bad review,tell the manager you are going to do too. Also go onto twitter and give them hell. Web sales of cars is new they are trying to build trust and won't want bad reviews.

Dav010

spaceHopper wrote: »

Ring and ask to speak to the general manger, tell them you tried to contact them and kept getting told to speak to somebody who was not available, tell them you want your money back and they can pick up the loaner car.

Also go onto sites like trustpilot and give them a bad review,tell the manager you are going to do too. Also go onto twitter and give them hell. Web sales of cars is new they are trying to build trust and won't want bad reviews.

Neither will they want to accept returns from consumers which they don’t have to accept. At the moment the op would do well to allow them to make good on the car and then drive it for a while before pulling the trigger. Threatening them may not achieve what you expect.

Mjolnir

Dav010 wrote: »

Neither will they want to accept returns from consumers which they don’t have to accept. At the moment the op would do well to allow them to make good on the car and then drive it for a while before pulling the trigger. Threatening them may not achieve what you expect.

I've never understood why people think threatening a business is the right road to go.

The op clearly stated they think its a perishable part thats at fault on a used car. That doesn't fall within the realm of not being fit for purpose or not of merchantable quality in the slightest and they are making good with repairing the issue.

Genuinely couldn't agree more. Take it repaired then if issues reappear several more times it could be argued its not fit for purpose.

Markcheese

Perishable part , ?
He bought a less than 3 year old car from a dealer ,
You'd expect in to be in more or less perfect knick unless sold as otherwise ..

Dav010

I know. Every business has certain percentage of unhappy customers, it’s hard to please everyone. There will always be crackpots who go ballistic rather than allowing the business the opportunity to rectify the problem. It’s why I don’t go by the 5 star and 1 star reviews, the in between ones tend to be more measured and considered.

Dav010

Markcheese wrote: »

Perishable part , ?
He bought a less than 3 year old car from a dealer ,
You'd expect in to be in more or less perfect knick unless sold as otherwise ..

New cars occasionally have to go back to dealers to have problems sorted. Chill out a bit, let the garage sort it out.

Mjolnir

Markcheese wrote: »

Perishable part , ?
He bought a less than 3 year old car from a dealer ,
You'd expect in to be in more or less perfect knick unless sold as otherwise ..

The op believes an issue to be a wheel bearing, they would fall under the category of perishable parts. Not in the eyes of the law I'm afraid there is a much higher threshold for merchantable quality due to it being second hand. I don't recall op mentioning the millage either it could be rather high for the year.

Mjolnir

Dav010 wrote: »

I know. Every business has certain percentage of unhappy customers, it’s hard to please everyone. There will always be crackpots who go ballistic rather than allowing the business the opportunity to rectify the problem. It’s why I don’t go by the 5 star and 1 star reviews, the in between ones tend to be more measured and considered.

This I'd read the reviews ignore the clear crank and crackpots, then make up my mind.

L1011

Markcheese wrote: »

Perishable part , ?
He bought a less than 3 year old car from a dealer ,
You'd expect in to be in more or less perfect knick unless sold as otherwise ..

If it is, in fact, a wheel bearing; I have had one of these wear out (on a car-based light commercial vehicle being used for vastly less than its load limit; admittedly not a pure car) within 13 months from new before - its usage related, primarily mileage.

As to whether a second hand car being sold with a worn wheel bearing is of merchantable quality - I've no idea. Just pointing out that they are wear parts and can go well before 3 years.

walshtipp

It is absolutely not acceptable to sell a car with worn wheel bearings. It is a very dangerous problem. If a bearing collapsed while driving that wheel would lock up and depending on what speed you are travelling, could cause an accident.