Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) **Mod warning in OP 22/01**

average_runner

hesaidshesaid wrote: »

Or, it’s a handy way to see if numbers are rising and curb them somewhat in the hopes of keeping schools open for longer.

ETA: This will only work if people stick to the restrictions during the Easter hols.

Kids need a break at Easter in fairness. They be working hard at home during lockdown.


Teachers also need the break. Working from home is tougher as you focus more without breaks or interruptions.

JDD

I'm not sure kids - primary anyway - need the Easter break to be honest. My middle child is happy enough to be back at school and is full of energy. Nothing like what she'd be like at say, the last two weeks before Christmas or summer break when they all go a bit doolally.

The oldest, also primary, is due back next Monday. She gets her homeschooling work done by 11am every morning and literally chomping at the bit to get back to school. She misses her friends massively and is bored of the seesaw work. She'll only be in school for nine days before the Easter holidays after not being in school for nearly 12 weeks. It seems absurd.

Now, I realise teachers have been working hard since Christmas, and perhaps they need the break. I won't get into the argument of whether teaching remotely or teaching in the classroom is more tiring - I'm not a teacher so I will take your word for it that teaching remotely is more draining. But if that is the argument, then that should be called out, rather than dressing it up to say that Easter holidays are needed by the children.

jrosen

Well my eldest won’t be back anyway until after Easter and he certainly doesn’t need the Easter break. I’m actually dreading another school break where he has no school work to occupy even some of the day. His teachers were asked not to give work over the last midterm.

The primary kid will be delighted with the break but definitely not needed. He’s done by 11 most days, some days 10.30am.

All in all it’s just going to be a period of 2 weeks where they have nothing to do, which is usually welcomed

the kelt

Lillyfae wrote: »

Are you blaming a child for having parents who don’t care about their education?

Where in that does it say or even indicate they blame the child?

They even mention the parents not responding?

Lillyfae

the kelt wrote: »

Where in that does it say they blame the child?

They even mention the parents not responding?

Right here:

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

I have one kid who hasn't logged onto any zoom calls, even registered with Google classroom and their parents haven't responded to a single email myself and the principal have sent. Broadband isn't an issue as they are constantly gaming with others in the class.

I'll be damned if I'm going back over things just because they didn't even bother pretending to engage. They are the only one in my class who didn't.

average_runner wrote: »

Teachers also need the break. Working from home is tougher as you focus more without breaks or interruptions.

I have my own opinion about the length of school holidays, primary secondary and university all have unnecessarily lengthy holidays in the summer- cutting them would definitely weed out the beauts that only go into teaching for the holidays. But that's something that should be discussed longer term and not just this year, and not at this late stage. It has been tough for everyone, not least parents trying to work and home school.

Chopper Dave

JDD wrote: »

I'm not sure kids - primary anyway - need the Easter break to be honest. My middle child is happy enough to be back at school and is full of energy. Nothing like what she'd be like at say, the last two weeks before Christmas or summer break when they all go a bit doolally.

.

Fully agree. Quite apart from the fact that there will be nothing to do during the holidays under current restrictions, I really don't see the kids the main reason we have to have a break. Mine are able to get up later and are finishing a lot earlier than they would were they in school so they have plenty of rest and plenty of free time. They're fed up for sure but they're not tired in the way they might normally be at this point of the year.

Deeec

We are looking forward to the Easter hols in our house.

The routine of homeschooling and trying to work at the same time is exhausting. I think we all need a break from the routine we have had for the last 9 weeks.

deliege

Chopper Dave wrote: »

Fully agree. Quite apart from the fact that there will be nothing to do during the holidays under current restrictions, I really don't see the kids the main reason we have to have a break. Mine are able to get up later and are finishing a lot earlier than they would were they in school so they have plenty of rest and plenty of free time. They're fed up for sure but they're not tired in the way they might normally be at this point of the year.

This has been our constant experience over lockdowns and homeschooling - that the work to be done only keeps them busy for a short time when compared to the school day. And even then, they have progressed faster than at school. Our kids are rather "gifted" we're told, so that might play a part of course. But in turn this helped us understand some of their difficulties at school, especially with the younger one (ADHD, bright but very easily bored, and in a class of 29 kids his way to alleviate boredom was apparently to pester all around him... ).

Anyway... There are ways to keep them busy / entertained in an educational way, for parents to find which is more suitable to each kid.

In our house at the moment the official primary school stuff in complemented by French, coding (Scratch, CodaKid), "gardening", thematic history (music, painting, cooking,...), phonics, music etc. Not pushing them much, note: once done with the basic school tasks, they usually want to get tablet or video gaming time. And they have to earn it, 30' at a time - by getting one new egg on "Reading eggs", or watching a new episode of RTE school hub or a documentary and telling me about its content, or doing one page of French exercise, writing a card or drawing something (lots of tutorials, be it on youtube or on Twinkl) or ... imagination is the limit!

JDD

deliege wrote: »

This has been our constant experience over lockdowns and homeschooling - that the work to be done only keeps them busy for a short time when compared to the school day. And even then, they have progressed faster than at school. Our kids are rather "gifted" we're told, so that might play a part of course. But in turn this helped us understand some of their difficulties at school, especially with the younger one (ADHD, bright but very easily bored, and in a class of 29 kids his way to alleviate boredom was apparently to pester all around him... ).

Anyway... There are ways to keep them busy / entertained in an educational way, for parents to find which is more suitable to each kid.

In our house at the moment the official primary school stuff in complemented by French, coding (Scratch, CodaKid), "gardening", thematic history (music, painting, cooking,...), phonics, music etc. Not pushing them much, note: once done with the basic school tasks, they usually want to get tablet or video gaming time. And they have to earn it, 30' at a time - by getting one new egg on "Reading eggs", or watching a new episode of RTE school hub or a documentary and telling me about its content, or doing one page of French exercise, writing a card or drawing something (lots of tutorials, be it on youtube or on Twinkl) or ... imagination is the limit!

I don't mean this to sound snarky, but do both parents have full time jobs? If so, have you cloned yourselves?

Locotastic

JDD wrote: »

I don't mean this to sound snarky, but do both parents have full time jobs? If so, have you cloned yourselves?

Time, availability and energy after being in work all day is the limit in my house!

We are happy to get the basics, assigned work and a good walk once a day covered. Kids are free to do what they like after that.

I'd love an Easter break but between using all available days off and leave for trying to juggle two parents working full time while homeschooling I'm afraid I'll have to settle for just the easter Monday.

deliege

JDD wrote: »

I don't mean this to sound snarky, but do both parents have full time jobs? If so, have you cloned yourselves?

Full time for my husband. 2/3rd time for me (have reduced last october, was full time before). We're also lucky in the fact that both of our jobs allow us to be quite flexible on schedule (i.e. not call-centre like, and not too much time spent on zoom etc). Some work to do with US teams so working evenings are common, even before covid.

For us flexibility is key, for our kids too - there is therefore days when they do less and time when they do more. If we need quiet time for a long call or to focus on some tasks they might have more screen time. If weather is good then more time outside playing in the garden. If they aren't done with the minimum stuff during the week they know it's going to be done during the week-end - or the "holidays" - we all know it and accept it. And so far it's working rather well.

But my original post was not to "brag" (sorry if it seemed like that). Just to say there are quite a lot of ways to keep kids busy in an educational or creative way that doesn't necessarily require to be on top of them all day long...

average_runner

Deeec wrote: »

We are looking forward to the Easter hols in our house.

The routine of homeschooling and trying to work at the same time is exhausting. I think we all need a break from the routine we have had for the last 9 weeks.

Same here, we have taken Easter week off to spend it with them. Most of the street have taken the week off. Plenty of cycles and fun in the park with them. Also they will play with the kids on the street. Be in their element doing that.

Zaney

We’ve had to use up our leave during lockdown. Plus I used to be able to work some overtime and then take time off in lieu, but all overtime has been cancelled since March 2020.

My children will be in childcare 9 to 6 over Easter and I’ll be catching up on work. We will have the long Easter weekend off and that’s good enough.

Finding normal weekends tough and monotonous. Nobody in this house wants two weeks off with nowhere to go and unable to visit family and friends.

Dreading the summer to be honest if there are no camps for the children and potentially no travel.

iamwhoiam

deliege wrote: »

Full time for my husband. 2/3rd time for me (have reduced last october, was full time before). We're also lucky in the fact that both of our jobs allow us to be quite flexible on schedule (i.e. not call-centre like, and not too much time spent on zoom etc). Some work to do with US teams so working evenings are common, even before covid.

For us flexibility is key, for our kids too - there is therefore days when they do less and time when they do more. If we need quiet time for a long call or to focus on some tasks they might have more screen time. If weather is good then more time outside playing in the garden. If they aren't done with the minimum stuff during the week they know it's going to be done during the week-end - or the "holidays" - we all know it and accept it. And so far it's working rather well.

But my original post was not to "brag" (sorry if it seemed like that). Just to say there are quite a lot of ways to keep kids busy in an educational or creative way that doesn't necessarily require to be on top of them all day long...

Not as easy if you have toddlers or babies at home , or looking after a child with special needs or a grandparent . Many parents are working full time and trying to juggle schooling , baby , phone calls etc

deliege

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Not as easy if you have toddlers or babies at home , or looking after a child with special needs or a grandparent . Many parents are working full time and trying to juggle schooling , baby , phone calls etc

I don't think I gave any advice or opinion about that ?
Of course toddlers needs almost constant attention. This is not so long in the past for me.
Special needs too (though this description encompasses many aspects, both my kids fall under the "special needs" category actually!).
Of course full time and some sort of jobs are not helping to deal with kids.

BUT THIS IS NOT the case for ALL. We see it here almost every day: some kids do well remotely, some don't. Some need their time-off (holidays etc), some less so and would rather trade this time for other activities (be it more education or more work). All circumstances differ, and all of us have to find the best way for our personal situation & personality.

I was, again, just giving examples of activities to explore to someone who was remarking that stuff sent from school was not filling the time enough. I strongly believe that we live in the "best of time" for this darn lockdown, thanks to internet and various tools using it (of course there wouldn't probably have been such lockdown otherwise - just thousands and thousands more deaths everywhere...).

Stateofyou

the kelt wrote: »

Where in that does it say or even indicate they blame the child?

They even mention the parents not responding?

That poster has form in taking other's comments and twisting it up just to be inflammatory, seems to amuse them - and they don't even live here in Ireland yet strangely spend every day on this site commenting on a school system that's nothing to do with them, often attacking parents and teachers. Wirelessdude doesn't say that or imply it at all.

Edit: Worth it to tell the likes of Lilyfae off, I'm out of this toxic thread. Best of luck everyone.

History Queen

Lillyfae wrote: »

Right here:





I have my own opinion about the length of school holidays, primary secondary and university all have unnecessarily lengthy holidays in the summer- cutting them would definitely weed out the beauts that only go into teaching for the holidays. But that's something that should be discussed longer term and not just this year, and not at this late stage. It has been tough for everyone, not least parents trying to work and home school.

Do you think we need to increase our contact time with students considering they have one of the highest number of teaching hours in Europe? Or should we shorten holidays just to appease those who begrude them?

Lillyfae

Stateofyou wrote: »

That poster has form in taking other's comments and twisting it up just to be inflammatory, seems to amuse them - and they don't even live here in Ireland yet strangely spend every day on this site commenting on a school system that's nothing to do with them, often attacking parents and teachers. Wirelessdude doesn't say that or imply it at all.

All of my family are in Ireland. I have nieces and nephews that are in the school system and friends and family who are teachers in Ireland. I am Irish. I have the same right to post and have an opinion here as you do, or someone from Armenia for that matter

Wirelessdude outright said what he said- i quoted his comment in full, twice. I twisted absolutely nothing. It's not even the first time he's said questionable things about children.

Lillyfae

History Queen wrote: »

Do you think we need to increase our contact time with students considering they have one of the highest number of teaching hours in Europe? Or should we shorten holidays just to appease those who begrude them?

Have you a source for that? I genuinely didn't know that that was the case, but don't really see how it could be.

Stateofyou

Lillyfae wrote: »

All of my family are in Ireland. I have nieces and nephews that are in the school system and friends and family who are teachers in Ireland. I am Irish. I have the same right to post and have an opinion here as you do, or someone from Armenia for that matter

Wirelessdude outright said what he said- i quoted his comment in full, twice. I twisted absolutely nothing. It's not even the first time he's said questionable things about children.

You have kids in another school system and I imagine there is enough going on where you are. Are you as invested in what's happening there where you actually live? You spend so much time here, that I imagine if you spent half the amount of time paying attention to your own community, you'd be at nothing else all day between the two activities. Of course anyone has a right to post here, and when I was living abroad I came to boards off and on too, just to have a read of things from time to time. But spending all day every day on a specific thread to discuss school reopening and goings on which you're not a part of, is the strange part. And you don't just merely post either, you attack and twist things up and like posts that trash teachers which gets those posters pulled up or banned. Where is the sense or normalcy in spending your days, every day, doing this.

Teacher2020

Lillyfae wrote: »

Have you a source for that? I genuinely didn't know that that was the case, but don't really see how it could be.

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=EAG_WT_ORG
Irish primary schools have 905 hours of contact time per year.
For comparison, Finland who are on a pedestal when it comes to education have 677 hours of contact time.
Our days are quite condensed in comparison to the UK system which I have worked in.

History Queen

Lillyfae wrote: »

Have you a source for that? I genuinely didn't know that that was the case, but don't really see how it could be.

Longer days.
The OECD Education at a glance 2019.

"Ireland has above-average teachers’ statutory salaries (starting at about USD 36 6001
) and longer
teaching hours (905 hours per year in primary education and 726 hours in secondary schools) and
instruction time (about 8 200 hours). This is reflected in a relatively high cost of education per student."

Full text available at

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.oecd.org/education/education-at-a-glance/EAG2019_CN_IRL.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwia1Pb036DvAhUBTxUIHZtFD_sQFjAAegQIAxAD&usg=AOvVaw2gLmuNPbQxY4fTPzFirOP7&cshid=1615208411987

Crocodile Booze

Lillyfae wrote: »

Wirelessdude outright said what he said- i quoted his comment in full, twice. I twisted absolutely nothing. It's not even the first time he's said questionable things about children.

Not really fair to talk about another poster who is probably busy offline working, whilst you're obviously not.

Seems underhanded and bitter. Just sayin...

average_runner

History Queen wrote: »

Do you think we need to increase our contact time with students considering they have one of the highest number of teaching hours in Europe? Or should we shorten holidays just to appease those who begrude them?

To improve things i would suggest cutting summer hols to match Europe and then get the physical education in to match europe also.


We spend the highest teaching hours but is it done the right way?



We don't teach languages correctly. Some schools are good on the mental health side of things and physical education, but alot are lacking massively on it.



The one thing i notice about private schools, is the focus on kids mental and physical side.

average_runner

History Queen wrote: »

Longer days.
The OECD Education at a glance 2019.

"Ireland has above-average teachers’ statutory salaries (starting at about USD 36 6001
) and longer
teaching hours (905 hours per year in primary education and 726 hours in secondary schools) and
instruction time (about 8 200 hours). This is reflected in a relatively high cost of education per student."

Full text available at

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.oecd.org/education/education-at-a-glance/EAG2019_CN_IRL.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwia1Pb036DvAhUBTxUIHZtFD_sQFjAAegQIAxAD&usg=AOvVaw2gLmuNPbQxY4fTPzFirOP7&cshid=1615208411987

But its all about quality and not quantity.!!

Teacher2020

average_runner wrote: »

But its all about quality and not quantity.!!

Yet you want us to spend more time teaching even though we are apparently terrible at it? Why?

History Queen

average_runner wrote: »

To improve things i would suggest cutting summer hols to match Europe and then get the physical education in to match europe also.


We spend the highest teaching hours but is it done the right way?



We don't teach languages correctly. Some schools are good on the mental health side of things and physical education, but alot are lacking massively on it.



The one thing i notice about private schools, is the focus on kids mental and physical side.

Please outline what your solution will offer that is better than what we currently offer? By what metric are we performing poorly?

We consistently score well in Pisa and have timetabled wellbeing and physical education. What problem are you trying to solve?

History Queen

average_runner wrote: »

But its all about quality and not quantity.!!

Where is our quality lacking?

average_runner

Teacher2020 wrote: »

Yet you want us to spend more time teaching even though we are apparently terrible at it? Why?

Never said your terrible at it, so stop trying to twist a post.


What i said was never use quantity in terms of time to say how good something is.


As i said above we could move to the european hours and spend more time on mental and physical education.

History Queen

average_runner wrote: »

Never said your terrible at it, so stop trying to twist a post.


What i said was never use quantity in terms of time to say how good something is.


As i said above we could move to the european hours and spend more time on mental and physical education.

Do you know what hours are currently being spent on mental and physical education?