Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) **Mod warning in OP 22/01**

plodder

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0314/1203878-coronavirus-ireland/

That marked the fifth day in a row that the five-day moving average, which charts the progress of the disease while smoothing out daily and weekend fluctuations, had increased.

The figures also showed that the 73% of the new cases were in people aged under 45 and the median age of those newly diagnosed was 29.

Has to be related to schools.

If they are serious about keeping them open I think they are going to have to vaccinate teachers asap.

pwurple

plodder wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0314/1203878-coronavirus-ireland/


Has to be related to schools.

If they are serious about keeping them open I think they are going to have to vaccinate teachers asap.

Not sure why you say that. The epidemiology shows the data. Available here.

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/surveillance/covid-19outbreaksclustersinireland/

0 clusters associated with schools. All clusters are identified in the reports there.

Of the 340 cases currently in hospital, approximately 100 are members of the travelling community. This seems to be a very large proportion of our national infection rate at the moment.


Primary school reopening has had zero effect so far. Good protocols in place, well managed.

km79

https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0314/1203889-niac-recommends-suspension-of-use-of-astrazeneca-vaccin/

Uh oh

plodder

pwurple wrote: »

Not sure why you say that. The epidemiology shows the data. Available here.

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/surveillance/covid-19outbreaksclustersinireland/

0 clusters associated with schools. All clusters are identified in the reports there.

Of the 340 cases currently in hospital, approximately 100 are members of the travelling community. This seems to be a very large proportion of our national infection rate at the moment.


Primary school reopening has had zero effect so far. Good protocols in place, well managed.

I hope you are right, but what do you think is the cause of the increase then?

wirelessdude01

NIAC recommended suspension of AZ vaccine.

Lashes28

What's actually considered an outbreak in a school? There's 5 cases in Ballinrobe in Mayo. If you had 5 cases of chicken pox in a school wouldn't that be classed as an outbreak?

wirelessdude01

Lashes28 wrote: »

What's actually considered an outbreak in a school? There's 5 cases in Ballinrobe in Mayo. If you had 5 cases of chicken pox in a school wouldn't that be classed as an outbreak?

2 or more.

plodder

Lashes28 wrote: »

What's actually considered an outbreak in a school? There's 5 cases in Ballinrobe in Mayo. If you had 5 cases of chicken pox in a school wouldn't that be classed as an outbreak?

I know a primary teacher who is a close contact of a case in the school. She is isolating now and obviously not attending school. I guess that doesn't count as an outbreak either, but the school still has to find a sub for her.

P2C

So if there was a 18 th with 40 people at the party on a Saturday night. Most of those school gong age. It ends up a superspreader event. All the kids are in different schools in the town but the common denominator is that they were all at the party. That would be put down as a party or community outbreak. Now if there was one student identified as not being in attendance at the party and only came in contact with someone at school or break time that would be a school transmission. The vast majority of cases associated with schools at the moment are from mixing outside school at 18th party’s, sharing lifts, household mixing and meeting downtown at break time and after school . I can see groups of teenager everywhere at the moment


quote="Lashes28;116575586"]What's actually considered an outbreak in a school? There's 5 cases in Ballinrobe in Mayo. If you had 5 cases of chicken pox in a school wouldn't that be classed as an outbreak?[/quote]

penny piper

Is it true that if you have a student in class who attends for a coronavirus test after 4pm that it's put down to community transmission?

and do other teachers on here feel anything has been done since Christmas to improve health/safety issues in school?

Both my children (for those who don't know who are adult secondary teachers) say absolutely nothing has been done in their schools in Dublin...and it was just a case of getting children back to school as the government had promised.

Considering the fact that the vaccine astra zenica has now been suspended... it's a very worrying situation (safety wise) especially with more children expected back at school...uk variant highly transmissible.....and many more people circulating.....

Locotastic

plodder wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0314/1203878-coronavirus-ireland/


Has to be related to schools.

If they are serious about keeping them open I think they are going to have to vaccinate teachers asap.

It still won't stop kids spreading it, vaccination of teachers will do very little to prevent that. And people who are vaccinated can still contract and transmit covid.

Widdensushi

Locotastic wrote: »

It still won't stop kids spreading it, vaccination of teachers will do very little to prevent that. And people who are vaccinated can still contract and transmit covid.

Vaccination of healthcare staff seems to have cut the amount of people catching it in hospital right back.

am_zarathustra

Widdensushi wrote: »

Vaccination of healthcare staff seems to have cut the amount of people catching it in hospital right back.

Numbers are different, once 5th years are back you could be in contact with 100 students a day in a short period of time, all of whom are up and moving in between, before and after school and are in a non medical setting. A nurse might only be in contact with a few patients in a medical setting in full ppe she has been trained to use.

They are not comparible. Where vaccinations might help is if all the students are back there will be an issue with staffing when staff have to isolate. At the moment given it's just 6th years it easy to have them somewhere for an hour if someone is out, they'll study away or go get coffee. You cant do this with junior classes. But again that will depend on rates in the community and how people behave over easter. There has to be an understanding that there is a point of outbreak, either amping staff or students, that will lead to school closures and our behaviour will dictate that.

wirelessdude01

penny piper wrote: »

Is it true that if you have a student in class who attends for a coronavirus test after 4pm that it's put down to community transmission?

and do other teachers on here feel anything has been done since Christmas to improve health/safety issues in school?

Both my children (for those who don't know who are adult secondary teachers) say absolutely nothing has been done in their schools in Dublin...and it was just a case of getting children back to school as the government had promised.

Considering the fact that the vaccine astra zenica has now been suspended... it's a very worrying situation (safety wise) especially with more children expected back at school...uk variant highly transmissible.....and many more people circulating.....

We all know nothing has changed. Actually that is a lie. The DES now don't want all the windows open in the classroom during class time so actually things are now worse than they were before Christmas.

combat14

seen other countries suspend astra vaccine too due to blood clot fears

how is this going to affect irelands vaccine rollout now and reopening of country next month?

penny piper

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

We all know nothing has changed. Actually that is a lie. The DES now don't want all the windows open in the classroom during class time so actually things are now worse than they were before Christmas.

So now that means in schools with some rooms that don't have windows and were relying on keeping the door open for ventilation are they suppose to close the door with a full class in?
My son is teaching in a room like this....
Why was that decision made by the DES? and have the Unions gone asleep?

wirelessdude01

penny piper wrote: »

So now that means in schools with some rooms that don't have windows and were relying on keeping the door open for ventilation are they suppose to close the door with a full class in?
My son is teaching in a room like this....
Why was that decision made by the DES? and have the Unions gone asleep?

I'm sure your kids can read the documents like the rest of have. Also I'd be very surprised if their school(s) haven't outlined to them as hat is required as regards doors and windows and then what the school expects.

I know in our school that we've been told that minimum of 50% of the classroom windows have to be open at all times. If the teacher decides that they want more then it is their choice. Parents have been told all of this and told that given the circumstances that any complaints regarding cold will not be tolerated. I told all my parents/guardians to ensure that appropriate layers of clothing are worn.

Think the reasoning behind the windows is to quieten the likes of the Joe Duffy callers and all the twitter warriors moaning about how their kids are cold. We've seen it on this and previous threads people giving out about how cold it was with windows open and also the flip side of people giving out that the windows weren't open.

penny piper

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

I'm sure your kids can read the documents like the rest of have. Also I'd be very surprised if their school(s) haven't outlined to them as hat is required as regards doors and windows and then what the school expects.

I know in our school that we've been told that minimum of 50% of the classroom windows have to be open at all times. If the teacher decides that they want more then it is their choice. Parents have been told all of this and told that given the circumstances that any complaints regarding cold will not be tolerated. I told all my parents/guardians to ensure that appropriate layers of clothing are worn.

Think the reasoning behind the windows is to quieten the likes of the Joe Duffy callers and all the twitter warriors moaning about how their kids are cold. We've seen it on this and previous threads people giving out about how cold it was with windows open and also the flip side of people giving out that the windows weren't open.

I'm sure they are aware ...we live in Leitrim ....and two of my children teach in Dublin ...I was really just asking the question there out of my own general curiousity...thanks..

Icyseanfitz

The start of next week will show what the repercussions of bringing back primary and 6th years is.

pwurple

plodder wrote: »

I hope you are right, but what do you think is the cause of the increase then?

Did you read the link?

Locotastic

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

The start of next week will show what the repercussions of bringing back primary and 6th years is.

LC and half of primary back 2 weeks now, special education back a month now. We'd be seeing it by now if there was a big amount of cases due to schools.

There has not been a spike in cases, that's not to say there's been none but it certainly hasn't led to any spike in case numbers.

During week 9 2021 there were

- 15 outbreaks associated with University/college or third level students
- 10 COVID-19 outbreaks associated with childcare facilities
- no COVID-19 outbreaks associated with school children +/- staff

combat14

Locotastic wrote: »

LC and half of primary back 2 weeks now, special education back a month now. We'd be seeing it by now if there was a big amount of cases due to schools.

There has not been a spike in cases, that's not to say there's been none but it certainly hasn't led to any spike in case numbers.

During week 9 2021 there were

- 15 outbreaks associated with University/college or third level students
- 10 COVID-19 outbreaks associated with childcare facilities
- no COVID-19 outbreaks associated with school children +/- staff

- no COVID-19 outbreaks associated with school children +/- staff

and we all know how accurate the word "associated" with is


its the big overall picture that matters and numbers seem to be stabilising instead of dropping - numbers in hospitals up again slightly today .. there is a third wave starting in europe and we are once again at a tipping point here .. the fun potentially starts when even more students go back this week at a very delicate time

is_that_so

combat14 wrote: »

- no COVID-19 outbreaks associated with school children +/- staff

and we all know how accurate the word "associated" with is


its the big overall picture that matters and numbers seem to be stabilising instead of dropping - numbers in hospitals up again slightly today .. there is a third wave starting in europe and we are once again at a tipping point here .. the fun potentially starts when even more students go back this week at a very delicate time

No point looking at hospital numbers at the weekend, as there'll be few discharges till Monday.

Icyseanfitz

Locotastic wrote: »

LC and half of primary back 2 weeks now, special education back a month now. We'd be seeing it by now if there was a big amount of cases due to schools.

There has not been a spike in cases, that's not to say there's been none but it certainly hasn't led to any spike in case numbers.

During week 9 2021 there were

- 15 outbreaks associated with University/college or third level students
- 10 COVID-19 outbreaks associated with childcare facilities
- no COVID-19 outbreaks associated with school children +/- staff

its 2 weeks after the return, its only now it would start causing an increase

Hold My Hand

Great to see no Covid deaths in Ireland today.

Locotastic

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

its 2 weeks after the return, its only now it would start causing an increase

Special education are back a month now.

Dickie10

only 2 weeks after 3 we should see if cases rise.

shtpEdthePlum

It doesn't just spontaneously happen out of nothing.

The phased reopening is such that very low numbers started attending special schools a month ago. More started attending a fortnight ago while the numbers were beginning to start levelling off and now tomorrow, as the numbers are sustaining at this (still relatively high) level, all of primary will go back.

This is a much higher level of mixing than before. Obviously if a small amount of mixing is happening with middling numbers, there won't be a huge immediate increase. If you add to that more mixing with low numbers, that won't cause much of a spike either. Even though you can see that in Leister, where there was the most widespread transmission, they had a lot of cases detected in schools and the cases are staying comparatively high.

It'll obviously be this and subsequent returns which have the most impact because the cases are still persistently higher they really should be. The lack of mitigation measures and apparent need to plough on with reopening regardless of whether it makes sense is hard to understand.

I suppose they just figure with the elderly vaccinated, if they have the "great success" that is keeping schools open at any cost, they can shrug off repercussions faced by parents and children who are collateral damage during the next year.

Here's just a tiny reminder of what that approach looked like in Germany. I trust the absolute **** in charge here much, much less than that government.

Icyseanfitz

Locotastic wrote: »

Special education are back a month now.

No they are not, they where back for a day before schools broke for midterm

Locotastic

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

No they are not, they where back for a day before schools broke for midterm

Which amounted to 2 days for some schools.