The way forward for LC2021

Str8outtaWuhan

how do teachers feel about this

surely next yrs 5th yrs will need help as they never sat a JC

https://www.thejournal.ie/schools-fifth-years-leaving-certificate-norma-foley-5380481-Mar2021/

Random sample

Str8outtaWuhan wrote: »

how do teachers feel about this

surely next yrs 5th yrs will need help as they never sat a JC

https://www.thejournal.ie/schools-fifth-years-leaving-certificate-norma-foley-5380481-Mar2021/

It’s what I have been expecting. I hope for my subject that they get the same reduction as this years 6th years had announced in august.

Mardy Bum

Random sample wrote: »

It’s what I have been expecting. I hope for my subject that they get the same reduction as this years 6th years had announced in august.

It is only fair. Indeed, the exams for the next few three years should be altered in some fashion. Otherwise, rushed and short sighted teaching to the test will replace any sort of meaningful learning for students.

wirelessdude01

Mardy Bum wrote: »

It is only fair. Indeed, the exams for the next few three years should be altered in some fashion. Otherwise, rushed and short sighted teaching to the test will replace any sort of meaningful learning for students.

Realistically if things go back to "normal" from the next school year you have to make accommodations for current 5th years, transition years and also this years 3rd years as they won't have sat a state exam previously then it comes to their leaving cert Also possibly this years 2nd years as well as they have had two disrupted years when it comes to next years junior cert.

jimmytwotimes 2013

Str8outtaWuhan wrote: »

how do teachers feel about this

surely next yrs 5th yrs will need help as they never sat a JC

https://www.thejournal.ie/schools-fifth-years-leaving-certificate-norma-foley-5380481-Mar2021/

Some have, some havent

Those who did TY sat the JC

noplacehere

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Realistically if things go back to "normal" from the next school year you have to make accommodations for current 5th years, transition years and also this years 3rd years as they won't have sat a state exam previously then it comes to their leaving cert Also possibly this years 2nd years as well as they have had two disrupted years when it comes to next years junior cert.

The current second years are well behind where I would expect them to be academically and if I’m honest with their characteristics as a cohort. I find many have not had the usual first year characteristics rubbed off them and ‘grown up’ as you would expect a second year group to have done by this stage. I am concerned about them going forward.

On a personal level my current TYs have pretty much had the worst secondary school experience you could have imagined as they had disruption in 1st-3rd year for a multitude of reasons including covid. We were all hoping to give them a brilliant TY.... now they are going into 5th year with four years of ugh behind them

ETA: academically in terms of the curriculum required for the exam. Not in terms of ability as such

Bobtheman

We shall have many reports and newspaper articles about the loss our youth have experienced
But there will be **** all extra resources in mental health. Nor will society ever tackle some of the real culprits of mental health
1) the booze industry
2) gambling
3) **** housing and childcare
4) Facebook and other social media that wreck kids lives

But yet tons of newsprint about mental health and seek help! But there is **** all help available

snor

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Some have, some havent

Those who did TY sat the JC

None of next years 5th years will have sat the JC - regardless of whether they did TY or not.,

Rosita

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

I still think it take a monumental increase in numbers for them to amend any part of the school reopening.

Firstly, I would say that based on what's happening in Europe a monumental increase in quite possible.

Secondly, I think we have passed the stage of 'not an inch' when it comes to schools. They are no longer defending a perfect record. Also, the heavy lifting has been done on state exams, and there are only seven weeks left anyway.

More crucially to not bring the remaining students back on 12 April would not involve a really active decision. 'As you were' is always most attractive to policymakers. I think it could go either way right now.

jimmytwotimes 2013

snor wrote: »

None of next years 5th years will have sat the JC - regardless of whether they say TY or not.,

Yes, this years 5th have tho, that's the group I was referring to. Surely they'll be sitting the LC next year with altered papers. After that you'd hope the LC will run its normal course.

Bobtheman

Next weeks figures will determine a lot. If much higher plus various vacinne issues. The government has failed to do enough side deals and now medical issues with the vaccines.
Beware the Ides of March!!

Str8outtaWuhan

Bobtheman wrote: »

Next weeks figures will determine a lot. If much higher plus various vacinne issues. The government has failed to do enough side deals and now medical issues with the vaccines.
Beware the Ides of March!!

They'll have teacher digging plague pits before they admit they have to shut schools again.

Rosita

Str8outtaWuhan wrote: »

They'll have teacher digging plague pits before they admit they have to shut schools again.

I think the question, if it arises, will be more about a full return post-Easter than closing of schools. Though it is worth noting that we read many times since September posts from people saying schools would never close in the first place. But they did.

With the B117 variant now dominating and Europe on the cusp of another wave I would keep an open mind on what might happen.

Bobtheman

Str8outtaWuhan wrote: »

They'll have teacher digging plague pits before they admit they have to shut schools again.

We have heard many such predictions before

carr62

Could anyone advise me on the project aspect of accredited grades please? My son is working on his Agricultural Science project, and finding it tough going. He has decided to opt for accredited grade in the subject, and we thought he needed to get the project finished and although it wont be sent away for marking, his teacher will mark it as part of the accredited grade process. When he went into this exam portal at the weekend, he tells me he read something along the lines of " coursework elements may not be included in accredited grades" Can anyone shed any light? It would be a big relief to not spend any more time on the project when he could be studying the subjects he is actually going to be sitting exams in.

am_zarathustra

carr62 wrote: »

Could anyone advise me on the project aspect of accredited grades please? My son is working on his Agricultural Science project, and finding it tough going. He has decided to opt for accredited grade in the subject, and we thought he needed to get the project finished and although it wont be sent away for marking, his teacher will mark it as part of the accredited grade process. When he went into this exam portal at the weekend, he tells me he read something along the lines of " coursework elements may not be included in accredited grades" Can anyone shed any light? It would be a big relief to not spend any more time on the project when he could be studying the subjects he is actually going to be sitting exams in.

This is up to the teacher.

Personally, I would want the project in front of me and having been corrected, even by myself, to help me assess an accredited grade. Students are certainly completing all coursework/projects as normal in our school. We are being asked to accredit a grade specifically for the coursework components too so it would be difficult to do that without the completed work.

LW2018

Still awaiting details from the SEC/DES regarding orals. I sent them an email this morning and they asked me to give them a ring. Couldn’t answer anything.... awaiting this document and didn’t know when it would be ready. I had heard yesterday that it was to land on the desks no later than today.... didn’t seem to happen. DVRs won’t be sent to the schools for the recording - likely to be laptops and USB sticks. Couldn’t answer about wearing masks or not etc... seemed to think it would be at the school’s discretion. Was told the person was under the impression there would be some form of guidelines for each language but that a training / conference would only be needed for the marking element of them (evenings and weekends after Easter... recruitment forms sent out to those who examine usually.

Teachers are being very accommodating, from my experience in my own school and from talking with friends in other schools, but no support or guidance from SEC/DES, you can understand how it might be daunting for teachers facilitating these...

Is it also unlikely we’ll know the changes to the papers by the 22nd?

History Queen

LW2018 wrote: »

Is it also unlikely we’ll know the changes to the papers by the 22nd?

It just isn't good enough if that's the case. The same ****e over and over and over again. It's bloody pathetic.

As regards the orals I'm not familiar enough with the process to comment but from what you posted it sounds like another farce.

Random sample

LW2018 wrote: »

Is it also unlikely we’ll know the changes to the papers by the 22nd?

They said the week of the 22nd, so I’m expecting that to be a Friday night drop on the 26th.

I can’t believe we are still waiting to hear about the orals. I had told mine I would know today. I hate telling them lies.

Wombatman

The way numbers are going I'm beginning to think the June LC exam may not go ahead countrywide. Students should approach AG assessments as if they will be their only marks and not be easing off in some subjects expecting to fully target them in the exams.

History Queen

Wombatman wrote: »

The way numbers are going I'm beginning to think the June LC exam may not go ahead countrywide. Students should approach AG assessments as if they will be their only marks and not be easing off in some subjects expecting to fully target them in the exams.

I'd be shocked if they didn't with reduced numbers sitting the exam and increased centres. Numbers are reducing overall albeit slowly.

Bobtheman

Even if numbers get higher they should plough away. Sure if you can have the nation classified as an essential worker and woodies open you can do the LC in June
It would want to be worse figure wise than January

Rosita

Have to laugh at the Minister on the news saying that we are on course to have schools back in full after Easter before adding "but we always caveat this with the reality that Covid is still...."

Is she serious? She had never ever ever previously "caveated" things before. Remember her cringey "schools are safe, schools are safe" interviews a few months back.

Rosita

History Queen wrote: »

I'd be shocked if they didn't with reduced numbers sitting the exam and increased centres. Numbers are reducing overall albeit slowly.

Case numbers in the last week have actually increased for the first time since January.

km79

One week until Easter holidays and we have no further information on Orals or exam papers

History Queen

Rosita wrote: »

Case numbers in the last week have actually increased for the first time since January.

I stand corrected, I didn't realise that.

km79

Lcvp link modules written exam set for Saturday 8th May. Morning session .
I wonder will we have another precedent being set .......

Str8outtaWuhan

km79 wrote: »

Lcvp link modules written exam set for Saturday 8th May. Morning session .
I wonder will we have another precedent being set .......

Teachers working Saturdays for no pay. Computer science teachers apparently have to be on site for the saturday exam.

Newbie20

I’m just after hearing about the set up for the orals. The examiner and student are not allowed to wear a mask. Are this crowd for real? Another Friday evening document sent to management I believe. Jesus they are some disgrace.

Aquals

Newbie20 wrote: »

I’m just after hearing about the set up for the orals. The examiner and student are not allowed to wear a mask. Are this crowd for real? Another Friday evening document sent to management I believe. Jesus they are some disgrace.

No way the ASTI and TUI are going to stand for this surely?! No Leaving Cert oral is worth that risk.

wirelessdude01

Plug needs to be pulled.

Newbie20

This simply has to be the department hoping the unions will pull the plug on it isn’t it? It’s just a disgrace. I’m so annoyed. My wife is supposed to be doing them but she’s going to say to school that she’ll do them with masks or not at all.

Northern lassie

There will be perspex screens between examiner and student.

rossean

Northern lassie wrote: »

There will be perspex screens between examiner and student.

Hardly sufficient, especially given the increased transmissibility associated with the B117 variant.

I had offered to help facilitate these exams but I will be withdrawing from the process unless masks are worn by all.

Aquals

Northern lassie wrote: »

There will be perspex screens between examiner and student.

Perspex screens only protect against spit droplets etc - they do absolutely nothing for virus particles in the air. Just like air particles can move around the screen, so can viral particles!

If it was me, I'd do the orals and just ask students to wear masks.

Northern lassie

There will also be a distance of at least 2m between examiner and student.

Aquals

Northern lassie wrote: »

There will also be a distance of at least 2m between examiner and student.

Again, not that much of a mitigating factor against an airborne virus.

If this has been done by the department, in the hope that the unions pull the plug on it, then that’s extremely cynical and should be shown up for what it is.

Newbie20

It’s hard to see at this stage how it is anything other than a cynical move. Why wasn’t this put out there weeks ago. French Orals starting next weekend in our school. The Department is just a shambles. They are treating schools with such disrespect. A lot of the orals probably won’t go ahead now, which of course suits them. Less correcting.

Bobtheman

Newbie20 wrote: »

It’s hard to see at this stage how it is anything other than a cynical move. Why wasn’t this put out there weeks ago. French Orals starting next weekend in our school. The Department is just a shambles. They are treating schools with such disrespect. A lot of the orals probably won’t go ahead now, which of course suits them. Less correcting.

The department has always treated schools with disdain unless it's the latest bull **** PR thing by the Department such as transgender toilets or uniforms. Or allowing the heathens out of RE and making the ludicrous suggestion that they be offered another subject? Unless it's a piece of bull like this they don't give a ****.

History Queen

Newbie20 wrote: »

It’s hard to see at this stage how it is anything other than a cynical move. Why wasn’t this put out there weeks ago. French Orals starting next weekend in our school. The Department is just a shambles. They are treating schools with such disrespect. A lot of the orals probably won’t go ahead now, which of course suits them. Less correcting.

I don't know that it is cynical. There were interviews being conducted in my ETB all year with the same setup re no masks, perspex screens and 2m distancing. I think it is compliant with public health advice, that being said, I wouldn't feel comfortable doing it myself.

Wombatman

Orals could be done in school but over zoom, where examiner and student are in different rooms. Recording sent to the SEC for grading. Easy game.

Leftwaffe

Anyone doing the Oral aide? Got word About it this morning. Much work in it? Haven’t read the document.

Bobtheman

Numbers climbing
I can see a stay put on return of 1-3 rd year

km79

Bobtheman wrote: »

Numbers climbing
I can see a stay put on return of 1-3 rd year

3rd Years will 100% be back April 12th
The sensible approach would be send either 1st or 2nd years only back with them and then another staggered two weeks for remainder
I expect all will be back on April 12th though

TheValeyard

Bobtheman wrote: »

Numbers climbing
I can see a stay put on return of 1-3 rd year

Been a lot of talk about this in the school this morning. Depends how the Easter break goes.

Aquals

Do TYs really need to be back after Easter?

alroley

km79 wrote: »

3rd Years will 100% be back April 12th
The sensible approach would be send either 1st or 2nd years only back with them and then another staggered two weeks for remainder
I expect all will be back on April 12th though

Would 2nd years not be more important? They could actually be doing a junior cert.

Random sample

Leftwaffe wrote: »

Anyone doing the Oral aide? Got word About it this morning. Much work in it? Haven’t read the document.

Depends on the size of your school and the numbers sitting exams.

km79

alroley wrote: »

Would 2nd years not be more important? They could actually be doing a junior cert.

I would agree but the perception of getting “exam “ classes back is important politically . And that’s all that really matters . Optics

TheValeyard

I'd cancel all exams for first and second years this summer. Concentrate on teaching.