When will it all end?

SnuggyBear

Who cares what other countries are doing? Popele pick and choose whichever one they want to prove a point. We are in Ireland.

The facts are it's a small island, low population density, young population and its a wealthy country. Somehow we have been locked down for basically a year. We can't even leave the house unless it's essential. Bull**** now at this stage.

El_Duderino 09

SnuggyBear wrote: »

Who cares what other countries are doing? Popele pick and choose whichever one they want to prove a point. We are in Ireland.

The facts are it's a small island, low population density, young population and its wealthy country. Somehow we have been locked down for basically a year. We can't even leave the house unless it's essential. Bull**** now at this stage.

If the virus was unique to Ireland then there wouldn’t be much need to look to other countries for information. Given that it’s a global pandemic, international comparison is useful and that’s why we care what other countries are doing.

But you could have answers that question on your own. It shows the frustration is causing people to think irrationally.

drunkmonkey

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Anyway, I was responding to an OTT post about the “tyranny” were experiencing, totally ignoring the global pandemic context.

In what way is our Governments response any way ok, they've been told repeatedly to not have restrictions on healthy people yet they continue to abuse us at every turn, you might think that's OTT, it's not, this has gone on too long and these clowns should be tarred and feathered at the very least.

It's year 2 of the hostage situation and your acting like this is fine, just hang on another few weeks, light at the end of the tunnel, jabs are coming, freedom soon just not the freedom you used to know.

Morries Wigs

no supply no end of lockdown

El_Duderino 09

drunkmonkey wrote: »

In what way is our Governments response any way ok, they've been told repeatedly to not have restrictions on healthy people yet they continue to abuse us at every turn, you might think that's OTT, it's not, this has gone on too long and these clowns should be tarred and feathered at the very least.

It's year 2 of the hostage situation and your acting like this is fine, just hang on another few weeks, light at the end of the tunnel, jabs are coming, freedom soon just not the freedom you used to know.

Who repeatedly told government to not have restrictions on healthy people?

Abuse, hostage situation.... yes. I think you’re being OTT, to put it kindly.

El_Duderino 09

Morries Wigs wrote: »

no supply no end of lockdown

Lockdown will end in the next few weeks. If you mean restriction, then it’s less clear when they will end. We might get out of restrictions before winter and might not need them again next winter, but we might not get out of restrictions this summer or might need to reimpose restrictions next winter. Impossible to say at this stage.

Vaccine supply has been very disappointing. The suppliers keep lowering their estimated supply. AZ said they will now provide a third of their contracted vaccines at the end of March. We could have had 3 times as many AZ vaccines if they had been able to stick to the contract. That would look a lot better.

drunkmonkey

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Who repeatedly told government to not have restrictions on healthy people?

Abuse, hostage situation.... yes. I think you’re being OTT, to put it kindly.

Yes the WHO

It is abuse and we are being held hostage, you have empty with Government, I want to see them brought to justice for what they've done. They failed to protect the most as risk in fact their actions killed many people. We won't blame anyone though it's a global pandemic incompetence and tyranny are excusable.

RGS

The end is not in sight.
There will be no easing of restrictions in April. They laid the groundwork for that yesterday.
Vaccine supplies are not hitting targets but are actually dropping.
There is no guarantee we will get the vaccines we ordered on the agreed delivery dates.
Our ministers and NPHET cant resist a microphone and just waffle like they are sitting with their family at the kitchen table, unaware their words and actions have consequences for the nation.

There is no positivity from NPHET or government. It's the same old stick just blame the public.

SnuggyBear

RGS wrote: »

The end is not in sight.
There will be no easing of restrictions in April. They laid the groundwork for that yesterday.
Vaccine supplies are not hitting targets but are actually dropping.
There is no guarantee we will get the vaccines we ordered on the agreed delivery dates.
Our ministers and NPHET cant resist a microphone and just waffle like they are sitting with their family at the kitchen table, unaware their words and actions have consequences for the nation.

There is no positivity from NPHET or government. It's the same old stick just blame the public.

Agreed, it's very grim looking at the minute. This time next year might be looking a bit better.

El_Duderino 09

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Yes the WHO

It is abuse and we are being held hostage, you have empty with Government, I want to see them brought to justice for what they've done. They failed to protect the most as risk in fact their actions killed many people. We won't blame anyone though it's a global pandemic incompetence and tyranny are excusable.

So just to clarify, your position is that the restrictions wen too far and they also didn’t go far enough to protect the most vulnerable.

The abusive hostage situation should have gone further in some areas... OTT, and confused.

RGS

RGS wrote: »

The end is not in sight.
There will be no easing of restrictions in April. They laid the groundwork for that yesterday.
Vaccine supplies are not hitting targets but are actually dropping.
There is no guarantee we will get the vaccines we ordered on the agreed delivery dates.
Our ministers and NPHET cant resist a microphone and just waffle like they are sitting with their family at the kitchen table, unaware their words and actions have consequences for the nation.

There is no positivity from NPHET or government. It's the same old stick just blame the public.

Was wondering same. Unbelievable if nothing gets eased in April, the tone changed yesterday alright. It’s a roller coaster living here now.

seansouth36

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Conservative approach? They've sucked the good out of everything, destroyed communities, subjected people to horrifying last days on earth cut off from all family and faces, wrecked business beyond repair, made half a million people unemployed, mentally abused the nation with non stop propaganda and that's only the tip of the iceberg, that's not conservatism that's Tyranny.

Again you sound like a teenage girl calling her parents 'tyrants' because they won't let her go the teenage disco. I've been to countries that are tyrannical; the population is afraid of the midnight knock on the door; relatives being 'disappeared', people being murdered in custody. The fact that I can get past the 5km rule by putting a bag of groceries in the back seat of the car, does not suggest 'tyranny', rather a government struggling to deal with a pandemic. Your hysterical nonsense suggest someone who has led a very sheltered existence, and can't face reality.

El_Duderino 09

RGS wrote: »

The end is not in sight.
There will be no easing of restrictions in April. They laid the groundwork for that yesterday.
Vaccine supplies are not hitting targets but are actually dropping.
There is no guarantee we will get the vaccines we ordered on the agreed delivery dates.
Our ministers and NPHET cant resist a microphone and just waffle like they are sitting with their family at the kitchen table, unaware their words and actions have consequences for the nation.

There is no positivity from NPHET or government. It's the same old stick just blame the public.

It’s interesting. This is a doom and gloom post - You claim there isn’t even an end in sight. But none of the usuals posters will call your post doom and gloom because you’re criticising the current approach.

If you had said there is no end in sight and weren’t critical of the current approach, then you’d be doom and gloom. I find that interesting.

Whether you like it or not, the vaccine is being rolled out. The big problem is supply. Everyone in the world wants 2 doses and they want them yesterday. We’re in the top 10% in the world in vaccination rate, but some people will tell you we’re terribly behind.


It’s not certain when we’ll reopen or how completely we’ll reopen this summer. but we’ll begin reopening during the summer. The seasonal effect is probably the biggest effect at the moment. That’s probably why some other countries are reimposing lockdowns

Hellrazer

RGS wrote: »

Our ministers and NPHET cant resist a microphone and just waffle like they are sitting with their family at the kitchen table, unaware their words and actions have consequences for the nation.

There is no positivity from NPHET or government. It's the same old stick just blame the public.

And the worst part of this is that when the vaccine supply ramps up they WILL take all the credit for it. They`ll be patting themselves on the back and giving themselves wage increases more wage increases!!!

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

That’s true. We weren’t out of it excepting when we were. And that led to us going back into it.

There is an end in sight. A quick look at the news would show that the end is certainly within sight. It might not be as close as we want though.

I’ll point out that people give out about “doom and gloom” merchants and your post is the epitome of that.

.

There is doom and gloom because there is no messaging at all from Government about HOW we will get out of this. No positivity. Have a read of the UK's roadmap (below) to ease restrictions..... note the positivity, the clarity, the actual plan, its clear and concise, no faffing or blustering.

We have no plan and the restrictions make no sense, we don't have a nuanced approach to these restrictions (some counties have no rise in cases and no deaths yet they are in lockdown within 5km). So you have widespread frustration and increasing anger.

2500 construction have already gone to the UK for work, and I imagine they will be followed by thousands of workers and younger people later this Summer. Any single person under the age of 35 I have spoken to is going to leave Ireland as soon as flight restrictions end.

The Government are meant to lead but they are proving themselves inept and unable to make decisions of any kind.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/prime-minister-sets-out-roadmap-to-cautiously-ease-lockdown-restrictions

El_Duderino 09

[Deleted User] wrote: »

There is doom and gloom because there is no messaging at all from Government about HOW we will get out of this. No positivity. Have a read of the UK's roadmap (below) to ease restrictions..... note the positivity, the clarity, the actual plan, its clear and concise, no faffing or blustering.

We have no plan and the restrictions make no sense, we don't have a nuanced approach to these restrictions (some counties have no rise in cases and no deaths yet they are in lockdown within 5km). So you have widespread frustration and increasing anger.

2500 construction have already gone to the UK for work, and I imagine they will be followed by thousands of workers and younger people later this Summer. Any single person under the age of 35 I have spoken to is going to leave Ireland as soon as flight restrictions end.

The Government are meant to lead but they are proving themselves inept and unable to make decisions of any kind.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/prime-minister-sets-out-roadmap-to-cautiously-ease-lockdown-restrictions

The uk is leading the world in vaccination. They are in a better position to make predictions. We’re struggling with vaccine supply so can’t make similar predictions.

You might be happier if the government spaffed off a set of words and said we’d reopen fully on any old date, 10 July for example. Then they could just change it when we get close to the date. But I don’t think It would actually make you happier.

Maybe it would make you happy if you can’t deal with the reality that things are uncertain at the moment.

Lundstram

Keep hearing about this "seasonal effect". Strange because last summer Ireland was the most restricted country in Europe last summer, and we continue to be.

They shut down Kildare for a whole month, Laois and Offaly weren't far behind but now have some counties with very low numbers but opening them up a little will not be entertained? Why?

Another easy ride for MM on RTE yesterday, the presenter way out of her depth. Nice cosy little chat. Waste of time.

Remember the Irish laughing at the whole Brexit process? Silly Brits wanting out of the EU. I was one of them. Who's laughing now.

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

The uk is leading the world in vaccination. They are in a better position to make predictions. We’re struggling with vaccine supply so can’t make similar predictions.

You might be happier if the government spaffed off a set of words and said we’d reopen fully on any old date, 10 July for example. Then they could just change it when we get close to the date. But I don’t think It would actually make you happier.

Maybe it would make you happy if you can’t deal with the reality that things are uncertain at the moment.

The Government plan should be based on hospital numbers (ICU, admissions and deaths)......... not on cases. This would be very easy to articulate i.e. "when we get to below 400 cases in hospital or 50 in ICU" we can allow people play golf and go hiking, get a haircut. Its giving people something clear, something definitive. That's what people are crying out for!

You come across as very combative in all your posting, constantly defensive. I did not address you personally in any of my posts yet in both your replies you have made it about me? ("if you can't deal with the reality").


This is not about me. This is about the country I live in, this is about people I see suffering all around me. This is about the despair of small business owners, of people who are afraid to seek help if they are on the edge, of cancelled hospital appointments for children with chronic illnesses who are getting worse, of people who cannot pay their car loan and mortgage on €350 a week. NONE of those people are me, but I am worried about them and the Government should be too.
There are more ways to die than Covid!

aido79

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Yes the WHO

It is abuse and we are being held hostage, you have empty with Government, I want to see them brought to justice for what they've done. They failed to protect the most as risk in fact their actions killed many people. We won't blame anyone though it's a global pandemic incompetence and tyranny are excusable.

Criticising a government is the easiest thing in the world to do. What exactly do you think they should have done? Try and put a little bit of thought into it. Please don't come out with nonsense like protect the elderly without a little bit of detail on how this could be done realistically.

El_Duderino 09

Lundstram wrote: »

Keep hearing about this "seasonal effect". Strange because last summer Ireland was the most restricted country in Europe last summer, and we continue to be.

They shut down Kildare for a whole month, Laois and Offaly weren't far behind but now have some counties with very low numbers but opening them up a little will not be entertained? Why?

Another easy ride for MM on RTE yesterday, the presenter way out of her depth. Nice cosy little chat. Waste of time.

Remember the Irish laughing at the whole Brexit process? Silly Brits wanting out of the EU. I was one of them. Who's laughing now.

You don’t believe it’s seasonal?

Baseball72

Lundstram wrote: »

Keep hearing about this "seasonal effect". Strange because last summer Ireland was the most restricted country in Europe last summer, and we continue to be.

They shut down Kildare for a whole month, Laois and Offaly weren't far behind but now have some counties with very low numbers but opening them up a little will not be entertained? Why?

Another easy ride for MM on RTE yesterday, the presenter way out of her depth. Nice cosy little chat. Waste of time.

Remember the Irish laughing at the whole Brexit process? Silly Brits wanting out of the EU. I was one of them. Who's laughing now.

Fair play to the Brits for securing supplies of the vaccine and it's roll out - its impressive.

However, as Covid-19 begins to recede in the UK, Brexit - and the chaos that it is, will be front and centre - they got the vaccine's right - but Brexit and its effect on trade is every bit the disaster that it was predicted to be - and then some.

gozunda

drunkmonkey wrote: »

In what way is our Governments response any way ok, they've been told repeatedly to not have restrictions on healthy people yet they continue to abuse us at every turn, you might think that's OTT, it's not, this has gone on too long and these clowns should be tarred and feathered at the very least.

It's year 2 of the hostage situation and your acting like this is fine, just hang on another few weeks, light at the end of the tunnel, jabs are coming, freedom soon just not the freedom you used to know.

Do you not believe that vaccinations are coming or maybe you don't think they work?

And where does it say things won't go back to normal when the pandemic is over?

Do you think its all a big conspiracy across the world?

snowcat

Deleted User wrote: »

The Government plan should be based on hospital numbers (ICU, admissions and deaths)......... not on cases. This would be very easy to articulate i.e. "when we get to below 400 cases in hospital or 50 in ICU" we can allow people play golf and go hiking, get a haircut. Its giving people something clear, something definitive. That's what people are crying out for!

You come across as very combative in all your posting, constantly defensive. I did not address you personally in any of my posts yet in both your replies you have made it about me? ("if you can't deal with the reality").


This is not about me. This is about the country I live in, this is about people I see suffering all around me. This is about the despair of small business owners, of people who are afraid to seek help if they are on the edge, of cancelled hospital appointments for children with chronic illnesses who are getting worse, of people who cannot pay their car loan and mortgage on €350 a week. NONE of those people are me, but I am worried about them and the Government should be too.
There are more ways to die than Covid!

This is very true. Vaccines or not the virus is not going away and will be with us for a long time if not for ever. Vaccines do not prevent contracting the virus they just prevent hospitalisation and death. There will be cases going forward in vaccinated persons but they should be fine but they will test positive. With the vaccination program progressing far less attention should be paid to case numbers, ICU and hospitalisations should be the priority. As long as they are declining everything is under control

El_Duderino 09

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The Government plan should be based on hospital numbers (ICU, admissions and deaths)......... not on cases. This would be very easy to articulate i.e. "when we get to below 400 cases in hospital or 50 in ICU" we can allow people play golf and go hiking, get a haircut. Its giving people something clear, something definitive. That's what people are crying out for!

You come across as very combative in all your posting, constantly defensive. I did not address you personally in any of my posts yet in both your replies you have made it about me? ("if you can't deal with the reality").

...

And you just made those numbers up, and you’re suggesting the government make up similar numbers. If numbers are just made up then they can be changed based on nothing too.

I addressed you because I was addressing your points. Something that comes across clearly is that different people have different approaches. When I ask a question and the honest answer is “I don’t know”’then I’m ok with that answer. Some people can’t handle that uncertainty and would prefer a made up answer delivered with certainty.

You’re asking for a made up answer (numbers or dates), delivered clearly and with certainty. I’d prefer the realistic answer, even if the honest answer is “I don’t know yet”.

Lundstram

Baseball72 wrote: »

Fair play to the Brits for securing supplies of the vaccine and it's roll out - its impressive.

However, as Covid-19 begins to recede in the UK, Brexit - and the chaos that it is, will be front and centre - they got the vaccine's right - but Brexit and its effect on trade is every bit the disaster that it was predicted to be - and then some.

Not at all. They got a good deal at the end of last year. They'll be fine.

They have a government who listen to their people. Here in Ireland, if a referendum doesn't go as planned, we do it again.

The UK has put the EU to shame.

mightyreds

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

And you just made those numbers up, and you’re suggesting the government make up similar numbers. If numbers are just made up then they can be changed based on nothing too.

I addressed you because I was addressing your points. Something that comes across clearly is that different people have different approaches. When I ask a question and the honest answer is “I don’t know”’then I’m ok with that answer. Some people can’t handle that uncertainty and would prefer a made up answer delivered with certainty.

You’re asking for a made up answer (numbers or dates), delivered clearly and with certainty. I’d prefer the realistic answer, even if the honest answer is “I don’t know yet”.

You think "I don't know" will cut it, they are on massive salary's they have a full years data, "I don't know" doesn't cut it.

Risteard81

Lundstram wrote: »

Keep hearing about this "seasonal effect". Strange because last summer Ireland was the most restricted country in Europe last summer, and we continue to be.

They shut down Kildare for a whole month, Laois and Offaly weren't far behind but now have some counties with very low numbers but opening them up a little will not be entertained? Why?

Another easy ride for MM on RTE yesterday, the presenter way out of her depth. Nice cosy little chat. Waste of time.

Remember the Irish laughing at the whole Brexit process? Silly Brits wanting out of the EU. I was one of them. Who's laughing now.

I was lucky enough to have a vote in the Brexit referendum. I am proud to say that I voted for Brexit. I have never considered the so-called "EU" to be a positive thing or force for good. The sovereignty and unity of the 32-County Irish Republic is inalienable and non-judicable. Brussels has no right to pass laws for us. (Nor does London, of course.)

drunkmonkey

aido79 wrote: »

Criticising a government is the easiest thing in the world to do. What exactly do you think they should have done? Try and put a little bit of thought into it. Please don't come out with nonsense like protect the elderly without a little bit of detail on how this could be done realistically.

It doesn't require a whole lot of thought to come up with a better plan.
From the very start they've made a balls of it, who precisely are we not to blame for the nursing homes, someone I'd assume advised by NPHET ordered the untested patients to be sent back into nursing homes. At an absolute minimum those patients should have been tested. There will be an enquiry into this yet as it was a crazy decision.

That's just one thing, do we really need to go through every decision to show their ludicrous approach to everything. I can't think of anything they've got right.
Isolating the sick - fail
Contact tracing - fail
Cancer diagnosis - fail
€9 meals - fail
Meaningful christmas - fail
Birth rate - fail
Vaccine procurement - fail
Living with Covid plan - fail

and on and on it goes, where does it end nobody knows.

gozunda

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The Government plan should be based on hospital numbers (ICU, admissions and deaths)......... not on cases. This would be very easy to articulate i.e. "when we get to below 400 cases in hospital or 50 in ICU" we can allow people play golf and go hiking, get a haircut. Its giving people something clear, something definitive. That's what people are crying out for!
...

This is not about me. This is about the country I live in, this is about people I see suffering all around me. This is about the despair of small business owners, of people who are afraid to seek help if they are on the edge, of cancelled hospital appointments for children with chronic illnesses who are getting worse, of people who cannot pay their car loan and mortgage on €350 a week. NONE of those people are me, but I am worried about them and the Government should be too.
There are more ways to die than Covid!

Did you come up with that yourself of the top of your head or?

Where do you get that the governments plan here is based on "cases"?

Even the UK have detailed set tests or criteria which will dictate if and when their restrictions will be rolled back.

There is no simplified number solution such as
'numbers are X you can have your haircut'

And no - hospital numbers alone are not the best indicator as there is a known lag time between initial infection and hospitalisations.

The governments plan much like the UK is based on a number of factors

1. Disease prevalence (case numbers/incidence) is brought to much lower levels that can be managed and controlled by public health and that the reproduction number (“R” number) is such that we can be confident we can continue to suppress the disease e.g. at or below

2. Hospital and critical care occupancy are reduced to low levels to protect the health service and allow for the safe resumption of non-COVID-19 care.

3. Ongoing and steady progress on the vaccination programme such that the most vulnerable are protected through vaccination.

4. Emerging information on variants of concern.

As to the rest- no one I know wants restrictions. And no one I know wants to die from Covid or even get it.

Are restrictions necessary? Yes they are imho.

You talk of people people playing golf, go hiking, getting a haircut. And as nice as these things are - they do not equate to the second part of your comment which tbf comes across as a rant. And yes I know people are genuinely struggling but wringing our hands doesn't help.

It also ignores that as the vaccination rate increases - then restrictions will be rolled back. Demanding that we ignore that and instead opt for some bizarre pop bingo to decide when to open things up is well frankly bizarre.

aido79

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It doesn't require a whole lot of thought to come up with a better plan.
From the very start they've made a balls of it, who precisely are we not to blame for the nursing homes, someone I'd assume advised by NPHET ordered the untested patients to be sent back into nursing homes. At an absolute minimum those patients should have been tested. There will be an enquiry into this yet as it was a crazy decision.

That's just one thing, do we really need to go through every decision to show their ludicrous approach to everything. I can't think of anything they've got right.
Isolating the sick - fail
Contact tracing - fail
Cancer diagnosis - fail
€9 meals - fail
Meaningful christmas - fail
Birth rate - fail
Vaccine procurement - fail
Living with Covid plan - fail

and on and on it goes, where does it end nobody knows.

And you're suggesting they could have got all of these things right with no restrictions?