When will it all end?

niallo27

Pinch Flat wrote: »

The lombardy region of Italy was overwhelmed in march 2020. And that's a system with more ICU beds per head of population than us. We have a very weak and precarious health system - I dont understand why people cant see this here - we came close to running out of ICU beds in late January. At that point, people simply die in greater numbers as theres no where to treat them. Or if there's any sort of incident no where for people to go.

It was in lombardy for months with zero restrictions, name me a country whose health system collapsed since even the most basic restrictions were brought in. We don't come close to running out of beds, we still had the private hospitals. I'm not saying we should have not intervened but the narrative that we were on the brink of collapse is bull****.

JDxtra

Deleted User wrote: »

Lack of enforcement has got us to where we are now with stubbornly high numbers. Truncheons should be cracking skulls. There are people who will simply carry on partying knowing nobody will do anything about it. I can't believe the amount of people who still think their birthday is special and exempt and literally make up their own social distancing rules to justify a party or some sort of social gathering.

People forget that the virus has changed. All the early advice about social distancing is gone. You'll catch this virus breathing someone else's air. Being forced into an office or any work environment with people who, lets face it they are work colleagues who can literally be up to God knows what in their own time. What happens when someone is forced back to work knowing it is unsafe and their life or long term health is in serious danger and they die or get long term health problems?

I guess my point is the government is completely powerless. NPHET are completely powerless, they can't say its safe to go back to work or socialise because its not.

The only way out of this situation is strong enforcement. I'm talking truncheons cracking skulls and locking our borders. Make this a safe covid free island.

It's not right to say "truncheons should be cracking skulls".

We're in an incredibly long lockdown, and it's obvious that these are not effective for extended periods. Can you not understand that many normal, otherwise rule abiding citizens have had enough and want to live just a little?

The numbers are as good as the government will get them until higher numbers are vaccinated or there is some other external factor (e.g. seasonal changes). They need a new approach. One that doesn't involve literally destroying the country.

Monster249

JDxtra wrote: »

It's not right to say "truncheons should be cracking skulls".

We're in an incredibly long lockdown, and it's obvious that these are not effective for extended periods. Can you not understand that many normal, otherwise rule abiding citizens have had enough and want to live a little?

No he doesn't understand that and neither do the NPHET overlords. That's the problem when you don't take a holistic approach to things.

JDxtra

JDxtra wrote: »

It's not right to say "truncheons should be cracking skulls".

We're in an incredibly long lockdown, and it's obvious that these are not effective for extended periods. Can you not understand that many normal, otherwise rule abiding citizens have had enough and want to live just a little?

The numbers are as good as the government will get them until higher numbers are vaccinated or there is some other external factor (e.g. seasonal changes). They need a new approach. One that doesn't involve literally destroying the country.

My point is with a strong enforcement, particularly locking down our borders, we could be in a position to open up the country. If they had done this for the last wave as people (experts included) had been calling for we would be in a very positive position now perhaps even in a position to welcome tourists under the much rumoured vaccine certificate program.

FromADistance

JDxtra wrote: »

It's not right to say "truncheons should be cracking skulls".

We're in an incredibly long lockdown, and it's obvious that these are not effective for extended periods. Can you not understand that many normal, otherwise rule abiding citizens have had enough and want to live just a little?

Exactly. The vast vast majority of people are law abiding and sticking as best as they can to guidelines. However there is a limit to my tolerance... no one is going to stop me from heading the local park for fresh air and exercise and to be quite honest, I couldn't care less if it's outside my 5km.

AdamD

Pinch Flat wrote: »

The lombardy region of Italy was overwhelmed in march 2020. And that's a system with more ICU beds per head of population than us. We have a very weak and precarious health system - I dont understand why people cant see this here - we came close to running out of ICU beds in late January. At that point, people simply die in greater numbers as theres no where to treat them. Or if there's any sort of incident no where for people to go.

Its also the oldest region in Europe, was hit the earliest in Europe and was hit when we knew the least about the virus.

So not in anyway comparable. To suggest similar could happen with the greater knowledge we have of the virus now, with better treatments, with nursing homes and HCWs vaccinated, in a much much younger country, is frankly laughable.

Scotty #

AdamD wrote: »

Its also the oldest region in Europe, was hit the earliest in Europe and was hit when we knew the least about the virus.

So not in anyway comparable.

It's a shining example of what happens when the virus is allowed run free.

We do have the knowledge now, that's why we lockdown. It's why France and Poland are locking down today.

Pinch Flat

AdamD wrote: »

Its also the oldest region in Europe, was hit the earliest in Europe and was hit when we knew the least about the virus.

So not in anyway comparable. To suggest similar could happen with the greater knowledge we have of the virus now, with better treatments, with nursing homes and HCWs vaccinated, in a much much younger country, is frankly laughable.

A new variant emerged in December which was much more virulent and its effects unknown. So we had no choice buy to act as we did. The numbers escalated here exponentially very quickly and it would have been a real tragedy if people started dieing in ambulances in hospital car parks.

Micky 32

Scotty # wrote: »

It's a shining example of what happens when the virus is allowed run free.

We do have the knowledge now, that's why we lockdown. It's why France and Poland are locking down today.

I’m curious Scotty #. Seeing that you think the vaccines won’t work ( shyte talk BTW) do you reckon permanent lockdowns are the way forward to keep it under control? Is that your view?

ujjjjjjjjj

https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-comment/2021/0320/1204984-covid-analysis/

For anyone who doubts the role RTE has played in the hysteria generation this is worth a read. A very gently worded 'f**k off' to anyone who questions anything bring done at the moment after all it's illegal for RTE to be impartial so how could they possibly be..........

GazzaL

Deleted User wrote: »

Lack of enforcement has got us to where we are now with stubbornly high numbers. Truncheons should be cracking skulls. There are people who will simply carry on partying knowing nobody will do anything about it. I can't believe the amount of people who still think their birthday is special and exempt and literally make up their own social distancing rules to justify a party or some sort of social gathering.

People forget that the virus has changed. All the early advice about social distancing is gone. You'll catch this virus breathing someone else's air. Being forced into an office or any work environment with people who, lets face it they are work colleagues who can literally be up to God knows what in their own time. What happens when someone is forced back to work knowing it is unsafe and their life or long term health is in serious danger and they die or get long term health problems?

I guess my point is the government is completely powerless. NPHET are completely powerless, they can't say its safe to go back to work or socialise because its not.

The only way out of this situation is strong enforcement. I'm talking truncheons cracking skulls and locking our borders. Make this a safe covid free island.

The desperation of the pro-lockdown crowd is astounding. We've had the longest and strictest lockdown in the world, there's no plan to return to normality, and now you want to physically assault people who have lost over year of their lives?

GazzaL

GazzaL wrote: »

The desperation of the pro-lockdown crowd is astounding. We've had the longest and strictest lockdown in the world, there's no plan to return to normality, and now you want to physically assault people who have lost over year of their lives?

You've missed my point. Strict enforcement allows you to get back to normality.

What we have now is some strictness with an emphasis on people "doing the right thing" and in other areas they just turn a blind eye and Bury their heads in the sand. Specifically, this is all a complete waste of time if a proportion of the population are left to flaunt the guidelines and another proportion are allowed to come and go in and out of the country. It results in exactly what we have now which is stubbornly high numbers which will never get any better as long as these gaping holes in the guidelines are left unfixed.

GazzaL

Deleted User wrote: »

You've missed my point. Strict enforcement allows you to get back to normality. I mean 100% back to normality.

No it doesn't. Assaulting people who break the restrictions so that the stay locked in their homes is not normality. It won't eradicate COVID.

Kermit.de.frog

GazzaL wrote: »

We've had the longest and strictest lockdown in the world

No we haven't.

namloc1980

Deleted User wrote: »

Lack of enforcement has got us to where we are now with stubbornly high numbers. Truncheons should be cracking skulls. There are people who will simply carry on partying knowing nobody will do anything about it. I can't believe the amount of people who still think their birthday is special and exempt and literally make up their own social distancing rules to justify a party or some sort of social gathering.

People forget that the virus has changed. All the early advice about social distancing is gone. You'll catch this virus breathing someone else's air. Being forced into an office or any work environment with people who, lets face it they are work colleagues who can literally be up to God knows what in their own time. What happens when someone is forced back to work knowing it is unsafe and their life or long term health is in serious danger and they die or get long term health problems?

I guess my point is the government is completely powerless. NPHET are completely powerless, they can't say its safe to go back to work or socialise because its not.

The only way out of this situation is strong enforcement. I'm talking truncheons cracking skulls and locking our borders. Make this a safe covid free island.

Wanna be authoritarians like yourself would love to see that wouldn't you. A violent crackdown on the population for daring to step outside the official government message. I think we've jumped the shark at this stage.

GazzaL

GazzaL wrote: »

No it doesn't. Assaulting people who break the restrictions so that the stay locked in their homes is not normality. It won't eradicate COVID.

Yes it would. Proven to work in fact.

suicide_circus

Lockdowns should be short sharp circuit breaker (remember that phrase?) events, not a permanent state of stasis which becomes less and less plausible as time goes on.

namloc1980

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes it would. Proven to work in fact.

Maybe we should barricade people into their homes? Or better yet, summary execution for anyone found outside. That'd work.

suicide_circus

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes it would. Proven to work in fact.

Have you considered a move to some utopia like Putin's Russia? Might suit you better.

GazzaL

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes it would. Proven to work in fact.

Zero COVID is a complete fallacy. We have an open border which is impossible to shut. COVID is here to stay.

Unless you're advocating locking people in their homes until they die and banning all travel and trade in goods, as well as physically assaulting anyone who dares to break your fantasy, it is not achievable.

Your attitude and bloodlust for assaulting people is disgusting.

GazzaL

suicide_circus wrote: »

Have you considered a move to some utopia like Putin's Russia? Might suit you better.

He'd be laughed out of the country in Russia.

j@utis

"...100% back to normality" are you serious? That's not gonna happen for decades. Some people's psyche is altered forever.

ujjjjjjjjj

Deleted User wrote: »

You've missed my point. Strict enforcement allows you to get back to normality. I mean 100% back to normality.

Look to eradicate this virus and keep Ireland virus free you have to as a first step close our borders including the North and commit to.keeping them closed indefinitely. And that means no one....not essential travel, not anything.

You then to need to force everyone and I mean everyone to home quarantine for 2-3 weeks. Then we can probably eradicate it but we can't ever leave the island or let anyone in and that also means not a single person can cross the North to South border too.


Shall we get that in place ASAP ?

Or we can accept that just like many other corona viruses and the flu viruses and others this is now an endemic human virus which is not particularly dangerous to the vast majority of our population and we have to accept some illness and death from it but in time with herd immunity induced from spread and vaccination it will reduce in impact.

The only question I have for people like you is as follows:

At what point will you be happy to get back to normal (and here I mean absolutely no legal restrictions) ?

Is it zero covid and closed borders? Or is there some level of disease and death you can accept ?

growleaves

Laughing at loud at the idea that beating people to death is considered a reliable, proven method of realising a scientific hypothesis.

I'm not going to say I'm shocked, or that's it's bizarre or surreal etc., etc.

Basically everyone knows that murder and torture are wrong.

If you're in the position of claiming these things are scientific 'tools', you might want to draw back from your descent into corruption.

Because that's all it is. You are corrupt.

GazzaL

j@utis wrote: »

"...100% back to normality" are you serious? That's not gonna happen for decades. Some people's psyche is altered forever.

Most people will be back to normality very quickly, if not immediately.

There are unfortunately a few that have been mentally damaged by the constant stream of nonsense from NPHET.

FromADistance

GazzaL wrote: »

Zero COVID is a complete fallacy. We have an open border which is impossible to shut. COVID is here to stay.

Unless you're advocating locking people in their homes until they die and banning all travel and trade in goods, as well as physically assaulting anyone who dares to break your fantasy, it is not achievable.

Your attitude and bloodlust for assaulting people is disgusting.

It sure is a complete fallacy. And it's also a complete fallacy to think that Covid is going away anytime soon either, even after vaccines. People seem to think that a vaccine will provide immunity forever, it won't. Some people have even got it twice. The suitation that presented itself during the summer last year is probably the best case scenario we can look forward for a few years to come. In the meantime people need to get on with their lives, take precautions and stop the curtain twitching.

El_Duderino 09

niallo27 wrote: »

Only 3rd wave in Europe, we are 1 ahead of them. Another sucess story for nphet.

Well, you say that, but NPHET was advising we don’t open up ahead of Christmas, which caused the third wave and the spike which were still trying to reduce using a lengthy lockdown.

You don’t have to like NPHET, but blaming the for the time the government didn’t take their advice would the too rich.

We follow nphet’s advice and lockdown - don’t like lockdown, blame NPHET.
We ignore NPHET advice and open up for Christmas resulting in a spike, blame NPHET.

I imagine you can see the irony for yourself

ujjjjjjjjj

namloc1980 wrote: »

Maybe we should barricade people into their homes? Or better yet, summary execution for anyone found outside. That'd work.

Reducation camps could be a first step where you have to watch videos of George Lee and McConkey until you 'get it'.

alexonhisown

suicide_circus wrote: »

Lockdowns should be short sharp circuit breaker (remember that phrase?) events, not a permanent state of stasis which becomes less and less plausible as time goes on.

Circuit breakers will only work when daily cases are low and proper in-depth contact tracing can be done. Impossible to do proper tracing on 500/600 cases a day.

Kermit.de.frog

suicide_circus wrote: »

Lockdowns should be short sharp circuit breaker (remember that phrase?) events, not a permanent state of stasis which becomes less and less plausible as time goes on.

We aren't in a "lock down" though. A lock down is what China engaged in to regain control. Many magnitudes more restrictive on freedoms. I'm unaware of people's apartment blocks being welded here and permission being required to leave your front door.

We have restrictions that are not easy over time but nothing like as strict or enforced as they could be.