When will it all end?

Micky 32

Beasty wrote: »

I don't think any of the vaccines claim immunity at all. They claim to suppress symptoms.

That isn’t really known for sure yet until more data is collected. There was some preliminary data saying it may reduce transmission by 60/70% but not verified yet.

martingriff

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah but some people think we won’t need any restrictions, even next winter, without herd immunity. I think the way we can likely achieve that is through herd immunity.

Ya if we have herd immunity i don't believe any restriction will be needed. Limited ones like masks and what s limits in shops I say will be needed without it

GT89

mightyreds wrote: »

This is the second part of what i'd like to understand, pre covid how did these people deal with flu season? I've never been in this position so not sure

Likely in a sane rational way due to the lack of media fear mongering

Samsonsmasher

First of all the restrictions are a joke especially in the area serviced by Dublin bus and DART.
I travel regularly to meet friends and dates.
Bus drivers were hyper zealous a few months ago but now I joke with them and I openly travel with no mask. I have had a few Karens having a go at me but I tell them to fk off. Same on the train. The train inspectors and security guys treat it as a joke. The ones who enforce mask wearing move on to the next carriage and I of course take my mask off again.
Some dork of a Garda ordered me to go home St Patrick's Day at a station but he wasn't there to stop me the day after!
Secondly it appears to me a silent majority - why they are silent when their jobs businesses mortgages etc are a disaster I don't know - clearly don't believe in this crap.
For fun I tell people to stay 2m apart.
Two guys were moving stuff out of a shop today and I told them to put it down because they weren't distancing. We had a good laugh before I was on my way.
Again the Gardaí are embarrasing with pairs of them chatting or driving around aimlessly.
Can they not see the city is boarded up and people have nothing to do?
People still wear masks in queues and socially distance like obedient slaves even though pedestrians walk right through them and when they enter supermarkets they are on top of eachother.
A lot of people giving out about Dr Ronan will not protest and attack others who are calling for an end to this madness.
Whenever this fiasco ends the aftermath will be like an ice bath - the social economic and political fall out will be an astronomical wake up call.
The sharks who planned to make a killing are saying nothing but once things get back to normal there will be no mercy and no mercy in return.
The people now on pup payment wearing masks etc will get a rude shock.
And while they deserve pity they don't deserve very much of it. They were warned and they laughed at the activists and protestors and "conspiracy" theorists who told them they needed to open up.

Kermit.de.frog

Cool story bro.

Dr. Bre

This ends when the money runs out so hopefully soon

ujjjjjjjjj

Dr. Bre wrote: »

This ends when the money runs out so hopefully soon

Ran out a longtime ago but since the EU will just keep printing it will be grand, sure we can just roll it over etc etc......

Unfortunately the reality is bar the EU suddenly deciding to keep everyone bailed out forever (and totally trashing the already pressurised Euro) at some point in the coming years the EU will insist on budgetary restraint.

Then guess what happens....Well you don't have to look too far back in history to see how that one turned out.

gozunda

martingriff wrote: »

I agree with the poster vaccinating the vulnerable should be the task for now and the herd immunity which I felt the poster was saying. Once the most vulnerable are vaccinated we can loosen the restriction to limits in shops, social distancing, and hand gel use in shops

Where are you getting that or is that just an opinion?

johnire

You sound really charming (not)

Samsonsmasher wrote: »

First of all the restrictions are a joke especially in the area serviced by Dublin bus and DART.
I travel regularly to meet friends and dates.
Bus drivers were hyper zealous a few months ago but now I joke with them and I openly travel with no mask. I have had a few Karens having a go at me but I tell them to fk off. Same on the train. The train inspectors and security guys treat it as a joke. The ones who enforce mask wearing move on to the next carriage and I of course take my mask off again.
Some dork of a Garda ordered me to go home St Patrick's Day at a station but he wasn't there to stop me the day after!
Secondly it appears to me a silent majority - why they are silent when their jobs businesses mortgages etc are a disaster I don't know - clearly don't believe in this crap.
For fun I tell people to stay 2m apart.
Two guys were moving stuff out of a shop today and I told them to put it down because they weren't distancing. We had a good laugh before I was on my way.
Again the Gardaí are embarrasing with pairs of them chatting or driving around aimlessly.
Can they not see the city is boarded up and people have nothing to do?
People still wear masks in queues and socially distance like obedient slaves even though pedestrians walk right through them and when they enter supermarkets they are on top of eachother.
A lot of people giving out about Dr Ronan will not protest and attack others who are calling for an end to this madness.
Whenever this fiasco ends the aftermath will be like an ice bath - the social economic and political fall out will be an astronomical wake up call.
The sharks who planned to make a killing are saying nothing but once things get back to normal there will be no mercy and no mercy in return.
The people now on pup payment wearing masks etc will get a rude shock.
And while they deserve pity they don't deserve very much of it. They were warned and they laughed at the activists and protestors and "conspiracy" theorists who told them they needed to open up.

Scotty #

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Ran out a longtime ago but since the EU will just keep printing it will be grand, sure we can just roll it over etc etc....

Was about to say the same thing. Another 2 trillion printed (in the form of bonds) just before Christmas will keep us afloat well into 2022.

Things would be different if we weren't all in the same boat but we are, so printing money is not so much an issue.

landofthetree

Nphet and the authorities are doing a fantastic job in making people doubt vaccines. :mad:

Scotty #

landofthetree wrote: »

Nphet and the authorities are doing a fantastic job in making people doubt vaccines. :mad:

ypres5

landofthetree wrote: »

Nphet and the authorities are doing a fantastic job in making people doubt vaccines. :mad:

I must say congratulations are warranted, this shower of ****ing idiots have managed to twist the vaccines into a negative. i cant tell anymore whether or not they're stupid or malicious or both

ujjjjjjjjj

landofthetree wrote: »

Nphet and the authorities are doing a fantastic job in making people doubt vaccines. :mad:

Great to see the Irish win !! Anyway back to topic.....that NPHET headline is concerning if true.

We all know the vaccines are not a silver bullet but will get death and hospitalisations down massively and then even for the most risk averse out there we must move on.

What concerns me is what is the point of them saying that ? (assuming it is true) , the only point I can see is it being used as a prelude for more caution and possibly longer restrictions etc etc.

I am not expecting Covid to pose no risk going forward but with vaccinations the relative risk is nothing that could concern any sane person so we move on.

Therefore once we have adults vaccinated over a certain age (x) and we can debate that age forever we draw a line and move on and lift all restrictions entirely.

It doesn't mean you don't continue to monitor and watch but without this approach there will never be an end to this.

ypres5

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Great to see the Irish win !! Anyway back to topic.....that NPHET headline is concerning if true.

We all know the vaccines are not a silver bullet but will get death and hospitalisations down massively and then even for the most risk averse out there we must move on.

What concerns me is what is the point of them saying that ? (assuming it is true) , the only point I can see is it being used as a prelude for more caution and possibly longer restrictions etc etc.

I am not expecting Covid to pose no risk going forward but with vaccinations the relative risk is nothing that could concern any sane person so we move on.

Therefore once we have adults vaccinated over a certain age (x) and we can debate that age forever we draw a line and move on and lift all restrictions entirely.

It doesn't mean you don't continue to monitor and watch but without this we approach there will never be an end to this.

Let's be honest nphet have never displayed any sense of moderation when slapping on restrictions and I doubt they're going to develop one any time soon. post vaccine campaign their advice will be to have restrictions as strict as they can get away with

ypres5

Scotty # wrote: »

brilliant in depth rebuttal, you really destroyed his argument with facts and logic

ujjjjjjjjj

Scotty # wrote: »

Was about to say the same thing. Another 2 trillion printed (in the form of bonds) just before Christmas will keep us afloat well into 2022.

Things would be different if we weren't all in the same boat but we are, so printing money is not so much an issue.

The problem is we ain't all in the same boat.....if you keep just printing Euro money like it is some monopoly money factory it does kinda impact things.....keep doing it and the Euro continues to slide against othe major currencies and then all hell breaks loose....

At somepoint soon the EU will have to put the brakes on and it will be like hitting a brickwall economically.

Micky 32

It seems the Sunday Independent obviously needed to fill a blank gap in their paper with a doom and gloom headline.

A good poster in another thread pointed out that the letter about the warning of limited protection from vaccines was written a month ago before the evidence of the vaccine effectiveness was becoming evident.

gormdubhgorm

Samsonsmasher wrote: »

First of all the restrictions are a joke especially in the area serviced by Dublin bus and DART.
I travel regularly to meet friends and dates.
Bus drivers were hyper zealous a few months ago but now I joke with them and I openly travel with no mask. I have had a few Karens having a go at me but I tell them to fk off. Same on the train. The train inspectors and security guys treat it as a joke. The ones who enforce mask wearing move on to the next carriage and I of course take my mask off again.
Some dork of a Garda ordered me to go home St Patrick's Day at a station but he wasn't there to stop me the day after!
Secondly it appears to me a silent majority - why they are silent when their jobs businesses mortgages etc are a disaster I don't know - clearly don't believe in this crap.
For fun I tell people to stay 2m apart.
Two guys were moving stuff out of a shop today and I told them to put it down because they weren't distancing. We had a good laugh before I was on my way.
Again the Gardaí are embarrasing with pairs of them chatting or driving around aimlessly.
Can they not see the city is boarded up and people have nothing to do?
People still wear masks in queues and socially distance like obedient slaves even though pedestrians walk right through them and when they enter supermarkets they are on top of eachother.
A lot of people giving out about Dr Ronan will not protest and attack others who are calling for an end to this madness.
Whenever this fiasco ends the aftermath will be like an ice bath - the social economic and political fall out will be an astronomical wake up call.
The sharks who planned to make a killing are saying nothing but once things get back to normal there will be no mercy and no mercy in return.
The people now on pup payment wearing masks etc will get a rude shock.
And while they deserve pity they don't deserve very much of it. They were warned and they laughed at the activists and protestors and "conspiracy" theorists who told them they needed to open up.

You seem very influenced by Americanisms and the Internet anyway. I am not sure that is a good thing.

If I was you, I would bookmark the above post come back to it in 10 years time. Then give an appraisal of what you thought of yourself as you will have matured a bit by then.

Scotty #

ypres5 wrote: »

brilliant in depth rebuttal, you really destroyed his argument with facts and logic

'Vaccines offer limited protection'... this can't be news to you. Myself and several other users have been saying it on this thread for weeks. It's literally what the thread is about.

ujjjjjjjjj

Micky 32 wrote: »

It seems the Sunday Independent obviously needed to fill a blank gap in their paper with a doom and gloom headline.

A good poster in another thread pointed out that the letter about the warning of limited protection from vaccines was written a month ago before the evidence of the vaccine effectiveness was becoming evident.

Thanks for sharing that so probably just more 'quality' journalism then really helping to not stir up the fear and hysteria.......

Micky 32

Scotty # wrote: »

'Vaccines offer limited protect'... this can't be news to you. Myself and several other users have been saying it on this thread for weeks. It's literally what the thread is about.

No they don’t offer limited protection , the current evidence emerging suggests otherwise. There’s only 12 ish % vaccination and the results are showing already. Varadkar himself said they protect near 100% serious illness and death. Scotty hate to tell you this, it’s the begining of the end.

ypres5

Scotty # wrote: »

'Vaccines offer limited protect'... this can't be news to you. Myself and several other users have been saying it on this thread for weeks. It's literally what the thread is about.

but the protection it offers is protection enough as can be seen in countries ahead of us in the vaccine rollout and from past experience nphet usually come out with statements like that when they're preparing to serve the public a particularly hot mug of piss

Charles Babbage

GT89 wrote: »

Well if someone has irrational fear of catching a virus or reckons they are vulnerable they can stay at home but they need to stop telling the rest of us to stay at home and put our lives on hold just to suit them.

People cannot "stay at home", they have to go hospitals and medical appointments, they have to eat. We all have to take responsibility for others, I cannot drive at 200Kmh for the craic, I have to pay taxes towards all sorts of layabouts. Unless you are a sociopath this is not a major problem.

Beasty wrote:

I don't think any of the vaccines claim immunity at all. They claim to suppress symptoms. Herd immunity may not be viable. We don't even know how long any immunity from having had this virus lasts. There are plenty of examples of people having caught this twice. And all of that is before considering mutations. I think this is going to be a case of finding a way to live with this disease certainly for the next few years as hopefully they develop a vaccine that can offer immunity.

Vaccines are not tested for immunity, they are tested to stop people gettig ill. However, the results from Israel and Britain show that transmission is greatly reduced, perhaps by three-quarters. Some combination of vaccines may reduce transmission even further. If you get almost everyone vaccinated and transmission is greatly reduced, then the virus cannot circulate easily, and modest measures plus quick reaction to any cases might keep it at bay.

bucketybuck

Charles Babbage wrote: »

People cannot "stay at home", they have to go hospitals and medical appointments

Assuming of course that their treatments haven't been postponed due to the all consuming covid monster.

Remember kids, if it isn't covid then you don't matter.

Charles Babbage

bucketybuck wrote: »

Assuming of course that their treatments haven't been postponed due to the all consuming covid monster.

Remember kids, if it isn't covid then you don't matter.

Don't be so callous, it isn't funny to mock ill people. We need to eliminate Covid precisely so that the health service has the capacity for other treatments.

AlekSmart

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Depends on what difference we want to make. To reduce harm and increase chances of lifting restrictions and keeping them off, we just need to vaccinate the older age groups. To achieve herd immunity, which will mean well most likely be able to confidently return to normal, we’ll need young people vaccinated too.

I suppose it's a bit like ending World Hunger,and supporting World Peace...WE all embrace the ethos,then wait around a while until it comes down to the individual,the PFffft...gone in a puff of smoke !

There's a BIG chunk of humanity that does'nt want any vaccine...whatcha goin to do with them ?

AlekSmart

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Don't be so callous, it isn't funny to mock ill people. We need to eliminate Covid precisely so that the health service has the capacity for other treatments.

"We" needed to eliminate a lot more than Covid,since back in 2009, the HSE itself outlined it's dreadful position in ICU terms.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/publications/clinical-strategy-and-programmes/towards-excellence-in-critical-care-report.pdf

R3.The number of critical care beds should be increased by 45% from 289 to 418 beds. This will need to increase sequentially to 579 over the period 2010 to 2020.

R15.Every critical care unit should have 24/7 cover by a dedicated consultant with an agreed minimum level of intensive care training and accreditation.

Those are but two,of a skipload of recommendations,but they represent two which could well have allowed Ireland to have had a far better response from Day 1 of this Pandemic.

My point is that "We" had 12 YEARS to take some heed of the Report's recommendations did'nt "WE" ?

Kermit.de.frog

Every country has suffered the same problem of ICU capacity.

Look at Paris at the moment having to airlift patients out of the region because there is no capacity left.

These problems are not unique to Ireland. They are worldwide and that is why governments have taken the action they have taken to prevent being overwhelmed.

GT89

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Every country has suffered the same problem of ICU capacity.

Look at Paris at the moment having to airlift patients out of the region because there is no capacity left.

These problems are not unique to Ireland. They are worldwide and that is why governments have taken the action they have taken to prevent being overwhelmed.

Explain Florida so. No lockdown in Florida but a very similar amount of cases and deaths to locked down California.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/despite-their-differing-approaches-california-and-florida-have-experienced-almost-identical-outcomes-in-covid-19-case-rates-01615659826