When will it all end?

Parachutes

JMNolan wrote: »

Ah come on, the reasons are obvious. If you have any symptoms then you might have covid, or if you have no symptoms you might have covid, or if you test positive you might have covid, or if you test negative you might have covid. If you have recovered from covid you might have covid. If you have been vaccinated you might have covid. Preventing covid deaths is all that matters, the main thing is you must die from something else (although if you have had covid recently it means you are a covid related death).

Don’t forget you’re feeling absolutely fine and have no indication of having the big bad deadly virus? Asymptomatic and you have it

Ginger n Lemon

degsie wrote: »

Am I the only one who thinks that international travel in the middle of a global pandemic is ok a bit bizarre?

Whats bizarre about it? If you test negative before you go and before you come back, who are you killing? How are you contributing to covid deaths by travelling?

JMNolan

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Whats bizarre about it? If you test negative before you go and before you come back, who are you killing? How are you contributing to covid deaths by travelling?

A negative test is proof positive you have covid. Plus, the virus is very sensitive to distance, hence the 5km rule

Ginger n Lemon

Lundstram wrote: »

They say PCR tests arent 100% reliable hence the quarantine.

Negative result = Ah sure could be false, go lock yourself for two weeks.

Positive result = Stick that into the daily case figures immediately.

Sad but true.

All in all there have been no travel restrictions other than filling out a locator form in 2020. We also did not have any excess deaths in 2020, in fact we had less deaths in 2020 than prior years. If anything, mandatory locator form saved lives :rolleyes:

Ginger n Lemon

JMNolan wrote: »

A negative test is proof positive you have covid. Plus, the virus is very sensitive to distance, hence the 5km rule

Cant stop laughing.

On a more serious note, you need to get serious and tell us when will all of this end?

And no 2023 is not a good answer.

JMNolan

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Cant stop laughing.

On a more serious note, you need to get serious and tell us when will all of this end?

And no 2023 is not a good answer.

It's ended in my house already. As an adult I make my own life choices and as an adult with thick skin I don't really care what people say about those choices.

It all ends when we decide it's ended.

Ginger n Lemon

JMNolan wrote: »

It's ended in my house already. As an adult I make my own life choices and as an adult with thick skin I don't really care what people say about those choices.

It all ends when we decide it's ended.

I did not expect that response.

I am ashamed I had to ask the question... You are right.

JMNolan

I actually thought I was going insane recently until I read the UN declaration of human rights. Article 3 - Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person. Liberty is a human right, I'm horrified our own government is trying to take it away.

Parachutes

As myself and others have said on this thread repeatedly, It ends when we stop complying.

Harry Palmr

JMNolan wrote: »

A negative test is proof positive you have covid. Plus, the virus is very sensitive to distance, hence the 5km rule

What the holy feck?! The virus is distance sensitive to a few metres. The 5 KM rule has nothing to do with the virus as a microscopic entity within a damp exhaled environment it's to do with stopping infected people spreading the virus.

Parachutes

Parachutes wrote: »

As myself and others have said on this thread repeatedly, It ends when we stop complying.

Ha, fat chance of the Irish doing that. We’re all so eager to be loved and seen as the best so if we have to comply to be the best in the world at anything, that’s what we will do.
We will see come April 12th. If the restrictions aren’t lifted then in a meaningful way, I think we will have problems.
I find it very strange Retail Ireland, the VFI and Micheal O Leary aren’t banging down the governments door.

dalyboy

JMNolan wrote: »

I actually thought I was going insane recently until I read the UN declaration of human rights. Article 3 - Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person. Liberty is a human right, I'm horrified our own government is trying to take it away.

How can it be legal to impose €2000 foreign travel penalties (temporary or otherwise) when it is in direct contravention to article 3 of the UN declaration?
Im looking forward to someone legally challenging the 2k fine in court.

Lundstram

Harry Palmr wrote: »

What the holy feck?! The virus is distance sensitive to a few metres. The 5 KM rule has nothing to do with the virus as a microscopic entity within a damp exhaled environment it's to do with stopping infected people spreading the virus.

JMNolan

dalyboy wrote: »

How can it be legal to impose €2000 foreign travel penalties (temporary or otherwise) when it is in direct contravention to article 3 of the UN declaration?
Im looking forward to someone legally challenging the 2k fine in court.

Legally I'm sure they'll find a way. I was more reflecting on the morality of it. The fact that I can be stopped by a employee of the state and fined if I am more then 5km away from my house. It's mind boggling when you think about it.

nickkinneg

JMNolan wrote: »

Legally I'm sure they'll find a way. I was more reflecting on the morality of it. The fact that I can be stopped by a employee of the state and fined if I am more then 5km away from my house. It's mind boggling when you think about it.

Who will challenge it? - a big part of the population are just barely scraping by and worrying about putting food on the table and a roof over their head. Did read about people booking "dental appointments" in tenerife - they have wised up to that as well and closed that one off as well.

dalyboy

Deleted User wrote: »

Ha, fat chance of the Irish doing that. We’re all so eager to be loved and seen as the best so if we have to comply to be the best in the world at anything, that’s what we will do.
We will see come April 12th. If the restrictions aren’t lifted then in a meaningful way, I think we will have problems.
I find it very strange Retail Ireland, the VFI and Micheal O Leary aren’t banging down the governments door.

On this
I drove through swords village yesterday and was looking into Eddie Rockets window. The lights are on. Staff sitting twiddling their thumbs. Doors open. No take away customers.
They are not known for being a takeaway establishment so they’re down in business 90-95% imo . Normal sit down operation deemed illegal.

After last weeks pub vs FBD insurance I reckon a precedence will be set and an avalanche of claims from ALL industries will be incoming (like eg Eddie rockets etc)
The insurance companies may threaten the government eventually not the the SME’s etc themselves

If that happens I reckon there’ll be a swift rethink in government circles as to the reopening schedule . Hopefully

JMNolan

If you challenge it you're considered a nutter and dismissed. I'm genuinely baffled at what we're delighted to put up with

topdecko

JMNolan wrote: »

Legally I'm sure they'll find a way. I was more reflecting on the morality of it. The fact that I can be stopped by a employee of the state and fined if I am more then 5km away from my house. It's mind boggling when you think about it.

Don't know how it is mind boggling. Ireland has done pretty well to suppress a variant outbreak that was absolutely rampant at beginning of Jan and this is due to enforcement of 5K distance rules amongst other measures.
International travel in the midst of a pandemic - you can't seriously think that is an infringement of your rights. All those people going to Tenerife for fake dentist appointments are pathetic.
Several people i know work in critical care and are on their knees. Vulnerable people from wider local community have just barely survived a bout of this thing and you are on here banging on about being stopped by an employee of the State because you want to travel more than 5K....... that makes the mind boggle.

dalyboy

dalyboy wrote: »

On this
I drove through swords village yesterday and was looking into Eddie Rockets window. The lights are on. Staff sitting twiddling their thumbs. Doors open. No take away customers.
They are not known for being a takeaway establishment so they’re down in business 90-95% imo . Normal sit down operation deemed illegal.

After last weeks pub vs FBD insurance I reckon a precedence will be set and an avalanche of claims from ALL industries will be incoming (like eg Eddie rockets etc)
The insurance companies may threaten the government eventually not the the SME’s etc themselves

If that happens I reckon there’ll be a swift rethink in government circles as to the reopening schedule . Hopefully

Again, I was very surprised at that ruling, and honestly I was absolutely delighted. You’re right, it’ll do one or two things: they will pay out and the businesses will get to survive, or they won’t and they will will grab the government by the jewels anyway and really open their eyes to what’s going on with the economy.

Ginger n Lemon

topdecko wrote: »

Don't know how it is mind boggling. Ireland has done pretty well to suppress a variant outbreak that was absolutely rampant at beginning of Jan and this is due to enforcement of 5K distance rules amongst other measures.
International travel in the midst of a pandemic - you can't seriously think that is an infringement of your rights. All those people going to Tenerife for fake dentist appointments are pathetic.
Several people i know work in critical care and are on their knees. Vulnerable people from wider local community have just barely survived a bout of this thing and you are on here banging on about being stopped by an employee of the State because you want to travel more than 5K....... that makes the mind boggle.

If you think they are pathetic, what about all those people who gave up their rights and freedoms and locked themselves up for a year now? Ordering dominos, collecting PUP and walking around their home within 5km for months on end. I d say thats the truly pathetic bunch.

Tazz T

nickkinneg wrote: »

Who will challenge it? - a big part of the population are just barely scraping by and worrying about putting food on the table and a roof over their head. Did read about people booking "dental appointments" in tenerife - they have wised up to that as well and closed that one off as well.

Mickey o'leary will. He did in the past and only lost when the government admitted that the travel ban was advisory only. They can't argue that now. if things don't open up when infections are low, Ryanair may be able to do what our government can't.

JMNolan

topdecko wrote: »

Don't know how it is mind boggling. Ireland has done pretty well to suppress a variant outbreak that was absolutely rampant at beginning of Jan and this is due to enforcement of 5K distance rules amongst other measures.
International travel in the midst of a pandemic - you can't seriously think that is an infringement of your rights. All those people going to Tenerife for fake dentist appointments are pathetic.
Several people i know work in critical care and are on their knees. Vulnerable people from wider local community have just barely survived a bout of this thing and you are on here banging on about being stopped by an employee of the State because you want to travel more than 5K....... that makes the mind boggle.

Look, I respect your opinion but there's always pandemics, the hospitals are always packed at this time of year and people are always going to die. If you think that these lockdowns will keep people from dying then I've bad news for you. The fact the critical care is on its knees is due to mismanagement, or at least thats what people who i know in critical care are saying.

topdecko

topdecko wrote: »

Don't know how it is mind boggling. Ireland has done pretty well to suppress a variant outbreak that was absolutely rampant at beginning of Jan and this is due to enforcement of 5K distance rules amongst other measures.
International travel in the midst of a pandemic - you can't seriously think that is an infringement of your rights. All those people going to Tenerife for fake dentist appointments are pathetic.
Several people i know work in critical care and are on their knees. Vulnerable people from wider local community have just barely survived a bout of this thing and you are on here banging on about being stopped by an employee of the State because you want to travel more than 5K....... that makes the mind boggle.

Travel is accounting for what, less than 10% of cases? The problem is people not behaving themselves in this country so we are demonising the wrong thing here.
If we stopped sale of the drink I’d bet there’s be some fall off in numbers then.
The health service is on its knees, like it is every single winter because of constant underinvestment and useless management. The only difference is this year is half the staff are off sick with covid.

Ginger n Lemon

The real issue with going along with this hysteria and allowing government get hysterical and introduce multiple new laws and restrictions is that it genuinely takes courage to remove these after the "danger" has passed.

Hand on heart who in our political establishment going to say "okay there is no need for social distancing anymore"?

Its akin to early 2000s when terrorists threatened to drive up a truck with explosives up to Downing street. UK Govt then got these huge metal gates going at the entrance. nearly 20 years later - gates are still there and no such terrorist threat materialised. Are the gates still there? yes. Do they cost UK taxpayer money every year to maintain along with police at the gates? yes. Will the gates ever be removed? What do you think..

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

Travel is accounting for what, less than 10% of cases? The problem is people not behaving themselves in this country so we are demonising the wrong thing here.
If we stopped sale of the drink I’d bet there’s be some fall off in numbers then.
The health service is on its knees, like it is every single winter because of constant underinvestment and useless management. The only difference is this year is half the staff are off sick with covid.

I have a funny feeling not all of them are actually "sick".

Unless by sick you mean perfectly healthy sitting at home?

Tazz T

topdecko wrote: »

Don't know how it is mind boggling. Ireland has done pretty well to suppress a variant outbreak that was absolutely rampant at beginning of Jan and this is due to enforcement of 5K distance rules amongst other measures.
International travel in the midst of a pandemic - you can't seriously think that is an infringement of your rights. All those people going to Tenerife for fake dentist appointments are pathetic.
Several people i know work in critical care and are on their knees. Vulnerable people from wider local community have just barely survived a bout of this thing and you are on here banging on about being stopped by an employee of the State because you want to travel more than 5K....... that makes the mind boggle.

I agree that international travel should be stopped when figures are high as a precaution ( as they are at the moment), but the scapegoating of international travel and playing the blame game is not on when official HSPC figures show zero cases as a a result of travel in January. Testing before and after clearly means that its a negligible vector.

it is this scapegoating and reinforcing a false public perception that travel is responsible for every case of Covid in this country that will lead to the travel ban continuing when infections are low and the rest of the EU are travelling freely. That's not on.

SnuggyBear

SnuggyBear wrote: »

No need to feel sorry for me pal.
Here's a question for you. If you we're middle aged and had a new born son. For some reason you were given the choice to save your sons life or you die. Which would you chose?

I am middle aged, if mid 40s is middle aged.
The question is not 'would you give your life for the life of you're own child'
I can't imagine anyone not saving their own child.
You stated that the lives of people in their 80s are not as valuable as the lives of younger folk.

So where do you draw the line?

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Excuse me, but have you read my post in full? I was trying to convey how I feel, possibly as a result of being stuck inside for a year and also some realities that people do not want to accept.
Not all lives are equal, that’s another reality people in the western world don’t like to accept either. We all like to pretend we do in the new “super liberal” Ireland but it isn’t true. You might not like it, but it’s the way it is.
I’m 30 and suffering, but the 18 year olds stuck in their bedrooms at college are suffering, the parents working from home and homeschooling are suffering, front line workers are suffering. And for what? To protect the already infirm? All of us can’t have our own human rights and personal freedoms curtailed indefinitely in the name of keeping a few safe.

I'm afraid none of your posts mean anything when you come out with
'not all lives are equal'

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

I'm afraid none of your posts mean anything when you come out with
'not all lives are equal'

In an ideal world, all lives are equal.
We don’t live in an ideal world.

bucketybuck

topdecko wrote: »

Several people i know work in critical care

Several people I know aren't allowed to work anymore and are in danger of financial ruin.

But if it isn't Covid then who cares, right?