Brexit discussion thread XIV (Please read OP before posting)

Professor Moriarty

You Gov runs the same poll at least twice a month. "In hindsight, do you think that Britain was right or wrong to leave the EU". From February 3rd:

Right: 43%
Wrong: 45%
Don't Know: 12%

Interestingly, that 43% is the highest since May. the 45% is the lowest since September. So Brexit is increasingly being approved of by British people.

Sam Russell

Strazdas wrote: »

I'm trying to work out how all of this hasn't led to civil unrest, strikes and even riots on the streets.

I suppose the one big difference between this and the Poll Tax riots is 1990 is that the Poll Tax was very unpopular and seen as unfair, even among Conservative voters and Thatcher supporters. England thirty years later is much more polarised, with the right wing half of the country, plus the press fully behind Johnson's regime and the idea of Brexit. Maybe the Brexit ideology trumps everything, even people's very livelihoods. Perhaps too, millions are buying into the argument that to oppose Brexit is somehow an act of treachery and 'defying the will of the British (English) people'.

Poll tax was an attempt at voter suppression which was also an attempt at favouring shire councils at the expense of urban councils. Voting rights depended on paying the tax, while urban rates were more onerous. It was also a new tax that was regressive.

No wonder there were riots.

Strazdas

Leroy42 wrote: »

They are simply too deep into now. Even rejoiners know that to rejoin would involve serious capitulation to EU (Euro etc) and they have gone this far they simply have to let it play out.

Brexiteers simply can't accept even a smidgen of doubt, of regret. This is exactly what they wanted, and if not then its all the dastardly EU fault.

Any minute now it will all be worth it.

I do suspect too that Brexiteers' dislike of the others (Rejoiners, the SNP, the 'woke', liberals, the EU, foreigners, immigrants etc) is so burning and intense that they simply cannot abandon the ideology and admit it is a disastrous failure....it would almost be an act of surrender to the aforementioned.

CelticRambler

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

You Gov runs the same poll at least twice a month. "In hindsight, do you think that Britain was right or wrong to leave the EU". From February 3rd:

Right: 43%
Wrong: 45%
Don't Know: 12%

Interestingly, that 43% is the highest since May. the 45% is the lowest since September. So Brexit is increasingly being approved of by British people.

What about the don't knows? Surely, at this stage, there should be fewer and fewer people who can't figure out whether it was or was not a good idea?

Professor Moriarty

CelticRambler wrote: »

What about the don't knows? Surely, at this stage, there should be fewer and fewer people who can't figure out whether it was or was not a good idea?

The Don't Knows average about 12% consistently since 2016. The very odd outlier aside, sometimes can be 11% for a short while then 13/14% for a bit. But, overall, very little deviance from 12%

embraer170

At the end of the British media brainwashing will continue, and the EU will still be blamed for everything. I’m not quite sure what will have to change.

ancapailldorcha

Strazdas wrote: »

I'm trying to work out how all of this hasn't led to civil unrest, strikes and even riots on the streets.

I suppose the one big difference between this and the Poll Tax riots is 1990 is that the Poll Tax was very unpopular and seen as unfair, even among Conservative voters and Thatcher supporters. England thirty years later is much more polarised, with the right wing half of the country, plus the press fully behind Johnson's regime and the idea of Brexit. Maybe the Brexit ideology trumps everything, even people's very livelihoods. Perhaps too, millions are buying into the argument that to oppose Brexit is somehow an act of treachery and 'defying the will of the British (English) people'.

I think that it's a combination of having to live with covid and Brexit fatigue.

To the average voter who doesn't spend a lot of time engaging with Politics, Brexit must seem like some sort of interminable squabble and intolerable as to them, it's something that they voted for that was held up by a perpetually bickering House of Commons. Of course, anyone who read into the subject would know that there were too many differing pro-Brexit and anti-Brexit factions in the House for any form of it to be ratified until Johnson brought back that deal.

And then you have covid during the transition period so any sort of political sensitivity remaining among the populace at large has been reduced to numbness by the restrictions imposed by and the mishandling of the pandemic.

It's a dangerous state of affairs to have a country beaten and gaslit into this level of apathy by its own government. It gives Johnson a terrifying amount of power and a lot less resistance to its use or abuse. The problem is that the remain and leave divide has lingered and now become the norm with critics of the government being dismissed as fake news while the government continues to lavish its favourites with privileges, offices and valuable contracts.

Margaret Thatcher was a divisive figure in her own time but that was a time before the 24-hour news cycle and social media blasting people with information constantly. The poll tax issue was just the end of it. Today, people are just hoping for a return to something vaguely resembling normality. It's a recipe for disaster and there are certainly elements within the Conservative party who are more than willing to use the opportunity for their own ends be it Priti Patel and her ethnic nationalism, the Britannia Unchained brigade aspiring to denude the country of its workers' and environmental protections or just funnelling money into the pockets of people like Chris Grayling and Dido Harding.

Professor Moriarty

YouGov have this poll which they ask weekly. "How well or badly do you think the government are doing at negotiating/handling Britain’s exit from the EU?".

Very Well/Fairly Well December average: 27%

Very Well/Fairly Well January average: 39%

Very Well/Fairly Well February 3rd poll: 42%

So, in recent weeks, a lot more people have a favourable view of the governments handling of Brexit.

Strazdas

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I think that it's a combination of having to live with covid and Brexit fatigue.

To the average voter who doesn't spend a lot of time engaging with Politics, Brexit must seem like some sort of interminable squabble and intolerable as to them, it's something that they voted for that was held up by a perpetually bickering House of Commons. Of course, anyone who read into the subject would know that there were too many differing pro-Brexit and anti-Brexit factions in the House for any form of it to be ratified until Johnson brought back that deal.

And then you have covid during the transition period so any sort of political sensitivity remaining among the populace at large has been reduced to numbness by the restrictions imposed by and the mishandling of the pandemic.

It's a dangerous state of affairs to have a country beaten and gaslit into this level of apathy by its own government. It gives Johnson a terrifying amount of power and a lot less resistance to its use or abuse. The problem is that the remain and leave divide has lingered and now become the norm with critics of the government being dismissed as fake news while the government continues to lavish its favourites with privileges, offices and valuable contracts.

Margaret Thatcher was a divisive figure in her own time but that was a time before the 24-hour news cycle and social media blasting people with information constantly. The poll tax issue was just the end of it. Today, people are just hoping for a return to something vaguely resembling normality. It's a recipe for disaster and there are certainly elements within the Conservative party who are more than willing to use the opportunity for their own ends be it Priti Patel and her ethnic nationalism, the Britannia Unchained brigade aspiring to denude the country of its workers' and environmental protections or just funnelling money into the pockets of people like Chris Grayling and Dido Harding.

Some excellent points there. The gaslighting of the population and use of propaganda is horrible to watch.

I wonder btw if you can actually be a Tory voter / right winger in 2021 and not be a Brexit supporter? It's almost as if the ideology has become ingrained as part of their identity i.e. just as if you are a Sinn Fein voter, you support a united Ireland and if you support the Tories / Johnson in 2021, you automatically back Brexit.

Imreoir2

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

YouGov have this poll which they ask weekly. "How well or badly do you think the government are doing at negotiating/handling Britain’s exit from the EU?".

Very Well/Fairly Well December average: 27%

Very Well/Fairly Well January average: 39%

Very Well/Fairly Well February 3rd poll: 42%

So, in recent weeks, a lot more people have a favourable view of the governments handling of Brexit.

Its understandable.
When you have come to expect the pain and hardship of a no deal Brexit, the slow grinding downturn the current deal will bring seems relativly mild by comparrison.

People are willing to put up with an awful lot, a scapegoat now and then will do to keep them pacified. The EU made itself a nice scapegoat recently with its blunder over Article 16, some cathartic outrage later, and people settle back into their deminished lives and await the next scapegoat to vent their frustrations on.

Professor Moriarty

Strazdas wrote: »

Some excellent points there. The gaslighting of the population and use of propaganda is horrible to watch.

I wonder btw if you can actually be a Tory voter / right winger in 2021 and not be a Brexit supporter? It's almost as if the ideology has become ingrained as part of their identity i.e. just as if you are a Sinn Fein voter, you support a united Ireland and if you support the Tories / Johnson in 2021, you automatically back Brexit.

Policies are no longer of importance. Brexit has become an article of faith above all else. Johnson, Cummings and the Tories decided to create a them or us scenario built around populist nationalism Brexit and it has worked beautifully.

johnnyskeleton

Leroy42 wrote: »

I see David Frost is out saying that the EU are struggling to adjust to the reality that the UK is now an independent nation.

Adding this to my list of things Brexiteers say about the EU but really reveal more about themselves. The UK are struggling to adjust to the reality that they no longer benefit from EU membership, and possibly also the reality that if you spend 5 years doing nothing but critising your neighbours, maybe your neighbours wont exactly bend over backwards to accommodate you!

Strazdas

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Policies are no longer of importance. Brexit has become an article of faith above all else. Johnson, Cummings and the Tories decided to create a them or us scenario built around populist nationalism Brexit and it has worked beautifully.

The culture wars and a polarised society are a great way of rallying support behind both the Tories and Brexit. It's not so much the 1930s fascist playbook, it's much more the Trump playbook....that's who they have been taking lessons from.

ancapailldorcha

Strazdas wrote: »

Some excellent points there. The gaslighting of the population and use of propaganda is horrible to watch.

I wonder btw if you can actually be a Tory voter / right winger in 2021 and not be a Brexit supporter? It's almost as if the ideology has become ingrained as part of their identity i.e. just as if you are a Sinn Fein voter, you support a united Ireland and if you support the Tories / Johnson in 2021, you automatically back Brexit.

To be honest, I think the truth is just a bit banal. After the election, while leave vs remain was a key component of popular political discourse, for most of the electorate it was business as usual. 2017 saw both parties field appalling performers though only the Conservatives ditched theirs for 2019.

It's like the US where each party has their own strongholds though these are far from impregnable as we saw in 2019.

Akrasia

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

To be honest, I think the truth is just a bit banal. After the election, while leave vs remain was a key component of popular political discourse, for most of the electorate it was business as usual. 2017 saw both parties field appalling performers though only the Conservatives ditched theirs for 2019.

It's like the US where each party has their own strongholds though these are far from impregnable as we saw in 2019.

There is a pervasive narrative amongst Gen x through to millennials, that all politicians are the same

South Park did an episode where the kids were voting for the new school mascot between two candidates, a giant douche (John Kerry) and a Turd Sandwich (GW bush)
The central premise was, why is voting important when both choices are so awful

the political silos are getting more and more reinforced by technology that allows people to live in separate realities

If I google a question my results will not be the same as someone else googling the same question
People do not yet grasp this fact. To break free from control, we need to relearn how to properly think for ourselves

ujjjjjjjjj

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

YouGov have this poll which they ask weekly. "How well or badly do you think the government are doing at negotiating/handling Britain’s exit from the EU?".

Very Well/Fairly Well December average: 27%

Very Well/Fairly Well January average: 39%

Very Well/Fairly Well February 3rd poll: 42%

So, in recent weeks, a lot more people have a favourable view of the governments handling of Brexit.

Anyone I talk to in the UK in the last couple of weeks is generally quite upbeat. The vaccine roleout success is shifting minds over there at the moment and while there is still some discomfort about the overall handling of Covid they do seem to rowing in behind the vaccine success.

Don't underestimate it's ability to change minds and perceptions especially with the EU floundering on the roleout. The optics are not good for the EU.

It is a huge win for Boris atm regardless as to what the remain side thinks.

The trade issues, paperwork and other Brexit issues will get an airing but if the vaccine roleout continues apace and the UK starts lifting restrictions in March /April don't be surprised if Brexit issues take a back seat and public opinion continues to improve for Boris.

Peregrinus

It’s curious that the UK government’s good performance on vaccination, which is unrelated to Brexit or its implementation, should result in a more favourable view of the government’s handling of Brexit.

Curious, but perhaps not altogether surprising. Brexit is long-running and tediously detailed, and only the Brexit tragics such as ourselves will be following it closely at this stage. If people are given reason to think that their government may, after all, be a little bit competent, then they may be more open to accepting that, on the minutiae of an issue that they themselves don’t really understand, their government may be acting in a competent fashion. So the reward for doing well on vaccination is higher public satisfaction on a range of issues across the board, not just on vaccination.

Two things could derail this:

First, the practical effects of Brexit could continue to be awful, or could get worse, and the effect on the consumer or worker in the street could start to cumulate. The more people who have first hand experience of Brexit being sh!tty, the fewer people who will cut the government some slack on this on the grounds that they aren’t on top of the detail of Brexit but they know the government is good at vaccination. And actually I think there’s a reasonable chance that this will happen. The “teething problems” that people are pointing to in the past few weeks are mostly not teething problems at all; they’re more like chronic gum disease. The UK has chosen a Brexit which maximises barriers to trade; that has to be disruptive and painful; and I can’t see that the UK government has any very effective options for smoothing over that disruption or relieving that pain. If nothing else, a whole new raft of woes are going to hit the newspapers when the UK government starts to implement controls on imports that arise from Brexit but that they have given themselves a six-month grace period on because, apparently, they were unprepared.

Secondly, the shine could come off the vaccination success. I don’t think this is likely to happen and I devoutly hope it won’t, but it could. Count ye not yer chickens, etc, etc. The UK has made a number of choices along the way to generate its vaccine success which as far as I can tell are reasonable and justified choices but which haven’t played out yet, and there remains a risk that they won’t play out as well as public expectation demands. I’m thinking of things like the long delay between first and second doses — the UK is well ahead of all EU countries on number of people who have had first doses, but behind several major EU countries on numbers who are fully vaccinated. (The trials that were conducted, on the basis of which approval was granted, were on people who had a four-week gap between doses, so we have no data on how the vaccine behaves when administered in this fashion. So, there’s some degree of risk there. )

RobMc59

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Anyone I talk to in the UK in the last couple of weeks is generally quite upbeat. The vaccine roleout success is shifting minds over there at the moment and while there is still some discomfort about the overall handling of Covid they do seem to rowing in behind the vaccine success.

Don't underestimate it's ability to change minds and perceptions especially with the EU floundering on the roleout. The optics are not good for the EU.

It is a huge win for Boris atm regardless as to what the remain side thinks.

The trade issues, paperwork and other Brexit issues will get an airing but if the vaccine roleout continues apace and the UK starts lifting restrictions in March /April don't be surprised if Brexit issues take a back seat and public opinion continues to improve for Boris.

I agree with your opinion regarding the UK vaccine performance . Trade issues are becoming a real eye opener for many here,even those pro EU are increasingly incensed by the perception of 'dirty tricks'by the EU and subsequent apparent gloating about it.
Regardless of the EU coming to its senses at the last minute over the phantom article 16,its left a bad taste with many here,how von der leyen is still in office is also puzzling to many here.
On a different subject,the company I work for uses chemicals from Holland and Germany amongst others.They investigated sourcing them from the US but there are issues with transportation.At the beginning of January there was a short period of disruption to supply which did affect production at the facility.This has returned to normal now,with chemicals from all EU countries arriving on time,there are a number of chemicals now sourced from none EU countries however. Exports to EU countries have been unaffected.

Peregrinus

RobMc59 wrote: »

I agree with your opinion regarding the UK vaccine performance . Trade issues are becoming a real eye opener for many here,even those pro EU are increasingly incensed by the perception of 'dirty tricks'by the EU and subsequent apparent gloating about it.

Yeah, the "dirty tricks perpetrated by the EU" are mostly the application to the UK of the Canada-style rules that the UK was demanding. If anyone is getting incensed at the EU about this, they're getting incensed at the wrong people.

RobMc59 wrote: »

Regardless of the EU coming to its senses at the last minute over the phantom article 16,its left a bad taste with many here,how von der leyden is still in office is also puzzling to many here.

I agree that the stuff-up was shocking; all the more so since we have grown used to the EU to be the adult in the room in this particular relationship. But von der Leyen corrected it within hours. The Tory government is guilty of many much greater stuff-ups, which they have been much slower to correct and have often doubled down on; noboby observing that Johnson is still in office can be entirely surprised the vdL is too. [/QUOTE]

RobMc59 wrote: »

On a different subject,the company I work for uses chemicals from Holland and Germany amongst others.They investigated sourcing them from the US but there are issues with transportation.At the beginning of January there was a short period of disruption to supply which did affect production at the facility.This has returned to normal now,with chemicals from all EU countries arriving on time.Exports to EU countries have been unaffected.

Well, good. But note that you're talking about supplies imported into the UK. The UK hasn't yet implemented any of the import controls that arise out of Brexit and the TCA; it is unprepared, and has given itself a six-month grace period before starting. All the UK has experience up to now is the application of the Canada-stule rules to its exports. So the robustness of your supply chain won't really be tested until July, when UK import controls kick in.

It's good news that exports have been unaffected. Most of the major chemical multinationals have a policy of operating to EU standards in their worldwide operations, even in the US; if your employer is one of these, or is in the supply chain for one of these, then that will certainly have helped them in maintaining their exports to the EU.

dogbert27

RobMc59 wrote: »

I agree with your opinion regarding the UK vaccine performance . Trade issues are becoming a real eye opener for many here,even those pro EU are increasingly incensed by the perception of 'dirty tricks'by the EU and subsequent apparent gloating about it.
Regardless of the EU coming to its senses at the last minute over the phantom article 16,its left a bad taste with many here,how von der leyden is still in office is also puzzling to many here.
On a different subject,the company I work for uses chemicals from Holland and Germany amongst others.They investigated sourcing them from the US but there are issues with transportation.At the beginning of January there was a short period of disruption to supply which did affect production at the facility.This has returned to normal now,with chemicals from all EU countries arriving on time.Exports to EU countries have been unaffected.

Perception of dirty tricks and the EU gloating about it? WTF?

It's a perception because it's portrayed that way in the UK media as usual that the EU are being unfair to the UK for rightfully imposing it's rules.

How many times does it have to be said that this is what the UK wanted! When asked repeatedly what they wanted from Brexit the UK government could not give a rational answer except "Brexit means Brexit". Total nonsense.

Enzokk

I am interested in the good vibes the vaccine rollout and how it has spread. Even commentators that are not fans of the current government have been caught up in the success they are having. I think this was apparent in 2012 as well with the Olympics, when austerity and cuts were forgotten for a few months while the country basked in the glory of their athletes and the staging of the event.

The fact that this has spread over into the discussion on how Brexit is going should be a worry for someone that didn't vote for Brexit or the Tories. This means they will be chasing short term success before an election to maintain their power and then have 4 years to royally screw up what they want.

schmoo2k

dogbert27 wrote: »

Perception of dirty tricks and the EU gloating about it? WTF?

It's a perception because it's portrayed that way in the UK media as usual that the EU are being unfair to the UK for rightfully imposing it's rules.

How many times does it have to be said that this is what the UK wanted! When asked repeatedly what they wanted from Brexit the UK government could not give a rational answer except "Brexit means Brexit". Total nonsense.

To be fair, if any pro Brexiter was to visit this thread, they could easily spot "elitist and gloating" posts.

One of the more worrying trends in the more right leaning pro Brexit, anti EU, anti Woke, anti Vacs brigade has become more about being simply opposed to anything the "evil" lefty establishment believes in (as it simply must be wrong).

As I dropped Facebook a couple of years ago and only use twitter for customer support I couldn't quite believe how blinkered it can be - take a look at this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N65Dvf4nH4o and there is plenty more like it.

Peregrinus

Enzokk wrote: »

I am interested in the good vibes the vaccine rollout and how it has spread. Even commentators that are not fans of the current government have been caught up in the success they are having. I think this was apparent in 2012 as well with the Olympics, when austerity and cuts were forgotten for a few months while the country basked in the glory of their athletes and the staging of the event.

The fact that this has spread over into the discussion on how Brexit is going should be a worry for someone that didn't vote for Brexit or the Tories. This means they will be chasing short term success before an election to maintain their power and then have 4 years to royally screw up what they want.

Brexit's a done deal. Not only is there no short to medium-term prospect of the UK rejoining the EU or joining the EEA or the CU; there is no short to medium-term prospect of any significant renegotiation of either the Withdrawal Agreement (inc. NI Protocol) or the Trade and Co-operation Agreement. The EU just doesn't have the appetite at this point; they've given this the guts of 5 years; they have made a deal with the UK; they have other things to be doing. All there is is some scope for fine tuning of the operation/implementation of the agreements that are in place.

The result is that, Brexit-wise, an early general election is not that important. Even if there were to be a change of government in the next 12 months, the options open to the new government would be pretty much the same as the options open to this one; make the best fist you can of the deals the UK had done. There might be other reasons for wanting the Tories to lose office, but not this.

Leroy42

Brexit was built on peoples perceptions of the EU. That they were nearly all wrong should have taught people something about actually learning the facts rather than just 'I think'.

As for anyone in the UK being surprised VdL still has a job, have they looked at their own parliament? Corruption is rife, Johnson attempted to break international law, he lied to the Queen, Patel, Cummings.

This is why Brexit is the car crash it is. The people in the UK, particularly the MPs, are doing all this based on a feeling, based on what they think the EU is and what they feel the EU does to them.

No facts, no plans. Rob, even you say that everything seems fine now, but you surely know the massive costs coming down the line because of the end of membership of REACH. Have you not looked into what effect that might have or is everything just short term?

RobMc59

Leroy42 wrote: »

Brexit was built on peoples perceptions of the EU. That they were nearly all wrong should have taught people something about actually learning the facts rather than just 'I think'.

As for anyone in the UK being surprised VdL still has a job, have they looked at their own parliament? Corruption is rife, Johnson attempted to break international law, he lied to the Queen, Patel, Cummings.

This is why Brexit is the car crash it is. The people in the UK, particularly the MPs, are doing all this based on a feeling, based on what they think the EU is and what they feel the EU does to them.

No facts, no plans. Rob, even you say that everything seems fine now, but you surely know the massive costs coming down the line because of the end of membership of REACH. Have you not looked into what effect that might have or is everything just short term?

If a British take on brexit proceedings so far doesn't fit with your view of it thats hardly surprising given a high proportion of European media outlets tend not to report any negative news regarding eu actions.It pains me to say it but Ireland is by far the worst for this.
The EU is clearly rattled by how brexit has panned out so far which has manifested itself in the extraordinary phantom article 16 fiasco.

Peregrinus

RobMc59 wrote: »

The EU is clearly rattled by how brexit has panned out so far which has manifested itself in the extraordinary phantom article 16 fiasco.

That's a bizarre claim. Can you explain it? To the rest of the world that particular incident is fairly obviously explained by the EU being rattled by the deficiencies in its vaccination strategy, which have nothign whatseover to do with Brexit or with how Brexit has played out.

If anybody is rattled by how Brexit has played out, it's the UK. It's in the UK that we see lively public discussion about the urgent need to renegotiate, or even uniltarally withdraw from, the Brexit deal that the UK negotiated, signed, ratified, claimed as a triumph and hailed as "oven-ready". And just a few weeks after it entered into operation, too. They'd hardly be doing that if they weren't a bit rattled, now, would they?

I've put up with him fine for what feels like years but since the start of January, Rob's posts are just a relentless assault on logic and facts. I'd prefer an echo chamber to this in my life every single day.

You win, Rob. Ignored.

PeadarCo

RobMc59 wrote: »

If a British take on brexit proceedings so far doesn't fit with your view of it thats hardly surprising given a high proportion of European media outlets tend not to report any negative news regarding eu actions.It pains me to say it but Ireland is by far the worst for this.
The EU is clearly rattled by how brexit has panned out so far which has manifested itself in the extraordinary phantom article 16 fiasco.

You mean certain elements of the British populations take. If you look at the fishing industry for example Brexit has been catastrophic from day 1 pretty much and pretty much any business that relies on the EU as an expert market. You have numerous businesses that are creating jobs in the EU instead of the UK as a direct result of Brexit and that's before you talk about the impact before 2021.

What views are you referring to can you show any examples or is this another version of project fear? Project fear has now become reality as predicted.

tubercolossus

RobMc59 wrote: »

If a British take on brexit proceedings so far doesn't fit with your view of it thats hardly surprising given a high proportion of European media outlets tend not to report any negative news regarding eu actions.It pains me to say it but Ireland is by far the worst for this.
The EU is clearly rattled by how Brexit has panned out so far which has manifested itself in the extraordinary phantom article 16 fiasco.

The simplest way of seeing this Comical Ali-style nonsense is as pure projection. Everything Rob and his ilk says, and in fact this goes all the way up to Gove, Johnson et al, are de facto confessions. No-one who has even a passing familiarity with the toxic bile the British Tory/redtop press has been pumping out for decades could type the bolded part without cringing.

Professor Moriarty

Main headline on RTE website today:
EU 'late with approval' over vaccine - von der Leyen


Second headline on Irish Times website today:
Ursula von der Leyen admits Europe ‘not where it wants to be’ in fight on Covid-19