16 family members given vaccine

hynesie08

steddyeddy wrote: »

I wouldn't have to because when I worked in a hospital we had a list.

How many once in a generation pandemics did you work with?

is_that_so

Rotunda too has owned up to a couple of relatives having been vaccinated.

Russman

steddyeddy wrote: »

I'm blaming the HSE as a whole. Why did the HSE provide no support, why was there no back up list. It's complete incompetence.

It may well be that. I agree a system should have been in place months ago never mind at the start of the year.
Maybe they never thought they'd get extra doses from the vials and that any backup list need only be 20 names long in case of no-shows. I don't know, but i think the rush to outrage over this it more than a little OTT.
It could be argued the HSE did give support by getting them 104 extra names. How long should such a list reasonably be ? Who knows.

Wombatman

Amirani wrote: »

"Hang on, I know you are in the middle of an emergency and your health or the health of your baby maybe in imminent danger, but let me just jump in here and vaccinate you with a vaccine that hasn't been trialed on pregnant women yet."

Sorted.

Have a look at the HSE advice on the COVID-19 vaccine and pregnancy and then get back to us.

Hell, I'd vaccinate the fathers to be, in the ER, before the Masters children.

GreeBo

GreeBo wrote: »

Can you give us the list of people who, within an hour and with no consent issues you could have materialized?

Standby list of all healthcare workers within 30 minutes reach. Actually this would have taken effort in part of HSE to set up such a register but a couple of folk with tech knowledge and some hospital admin knowledge could have set this up very nicely. Those for vaccine 1, those for vaccine 2.

steddyeddy

jill_valentine wrote: »

9 of them were over 70, so they were already due to get their first dose in the near future. 2 were HSE staff, so similar. So... Five doses will shuffle around and we'll get 120 people fully dosed way faster than they otherwise would have been.

We're arguing over 5 doses from 1100+ mass vaccination, that didn’t even exist on paper before the planned dosings were done.

This is exactly the thinking we've been warned about by experiences elsewhere, getting so bogged down in the idea of everybody getting dosed in their precise formal order that the overall speed of the rollout gets lost, Israel's attitude to vaccination vs California's.

I have no problem with 9 people over 70. I have a problem with the 5 unknowns and 2 college age students.

We're not arguing over 7 does we're arguing over 14 doses. They get it twice and they have to get it in a time period. They knock other people off the list the second time.

Unfortunately J we have to get "bogged down" in fact with regards to medicine.

JP Liz V1

TheChizler wrote: »

Family members who worked in the hospital though. I agree the optics aren't great.

Those 16 were hospital employees? I thought family of employees

steddyeddy

hynesie08 wrote: »

How many once in a generation pandemics did you work with?

Like flu pandemics or just corona virus types?

Christy42

Russman wrote: »

It may well be that. I agree a system should have been in place months ago never mind at the start of the year.
Maybe they never thought they'd get extra doses from the vials and that any backup list need only be 20 names long in case of no-shows. I don't know, but i think the rush to outrage over this it more than a little OTT.
It could be argued the HSE did give support by getting them 104 extra names. How long should such a list reasonably be ? Who knows.

Plus add to that everyone on that list needed to be contacted and ensured that they were free to take the vaccine. Plenty were probably working or isolating or even taking a nap and so couldn't come in. So presumably they tried more than 104 which would have taken some of that 6 hour window down further.

McFly85

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Regardless of the issue and however one sees it the fact it was given to the Masters kids was never going to go down well

Agreed it looks bad, but then had they not done it there'd probably be headlines about them wasting vaccines.

I think it was a fair call considering it was early on in the distribution before all of the supports were in place.

Donald Trump

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Those 16 were hospital employees? I thought family of employees

It also said a few were over 70.


I imagine that they don't have regular employees over 70. If they do have any, they are probably frontline (e.g. doctors or specialists still working). Probably not too many 70 year old security men

titan18

is_that_so wrote: »

Rotunda too has owned up to a couple of relatives having been vaccinated.

I'll imagine it's more than just those 2 aswell

Russman

Russman wrote: »

It may well be that. I agree a system should have been in place months ago never mind at the start of the year.
Maybe they never thought they'd get extra doses from the vials and that any backup list need only be 20 names long in case of no-shows. I don't know, but i think the rush to outrage over this it more than a little OTT.
It could be argued the HSE did give support by getting them 104 extra names. How long should such a list reasonably be ? Who knows.

Ideally should have been a national database of all healthcare workers to be vaccinated, from which standby lists could also have been made.

steddyeddy

is_that_so wrote: »

Rotunda too has owned up to a couple of relatives having been vaccinated.

I seen that. This time 37 members.

hynesie08

Deleted User wrote: »

Standby list of all healthcare workers within 30 minutes reach. Actually this would have taken effort in part of HSE to set up such a register but a couple of folk with tech knowledge and some hospital admin knowledge could have set this up very nicely. Those for vaccine 1, those for vaccine 2.

30 minutes walk? 30 minutes drive? Live or work 30 minutes away? Do you do it alphabetically/by age/pps no?

What do you do when there's no shows and the dose has already been drawn?

Russman

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Regardless of the issue and however one sees it the fact it was given to the Masters kids was never going to go down well

Totally agree with this. Its a massive own goal from a PR perspective.

But then again, if you were in a command position and had to make a legitimate decision and, in your eyes, had done everything above board, can anyone say they wouldn't help a relative/friend/colleague if you could show you had taken reasonable measures to avoid it ?

Kimbot

titan18 wrote: »

I'll imagine it's more than just those 2 aswell

Did i see a story over the weekend that the beacon clinic vaccinated non-front line staff aswell?

is_that_so

titan18 wrote: »

I'll imagine it's more than just those 2 aswell

Yeah, the media are going to start hunting down others so better to fess up now.

BrianD3

steddyeddy wrote: »

That's the definition of the Irish civil service. Unfortunately the more people who think like that the less we can expect back.

Thing is though, while some posters in this thread (who hopefully are never employed in the public service or in any position of responsibility) seem to have no issues with nepotism, many actual public servants would recoil in horror at this. Those are the good ones with a public service ethos. Still some bad ones and given the relatively recent news stories about nepotism in recruitment in the HSE, that organisation would appear to still have issues.

I'd say that many defending this don't even believe what they're saying just looking for an argument. The usual boards phenomenon of pick a side of an argument in order to criticise and wind others up even if it means defending the indefensible. No point criticising third parties like the HSE or Coombe as they are not "here". Throw in a few sneers about the perpetually outraged etc.

Similar to if I went on a thread about Charlie Haughey's antics and tried to spin it as him doing things for the "right reasons". No point taking the opposite side and trying to get a reaction out of Haughey himself.

hynesie08

hynesie08 wrote: »

30 minutes walk? 30 minutes drive? Live or work 30 minutes away? Do you do it alphabetically/by age/pps no?

What do you do when there's no shows and the dose has already been drawn?

People who could be within the premises within 30 minutes whatever method that would take. Eg it's looking like 6 spares have 12 on standby via text, they reply "on standby" and shortly after the positive responders texted to arrive. It's done all the time with other things in life.

Christy42

[Deleted User] wrote: »

People who could be within the premises within 30 minutes whatever method that would take. Eg it's looking like 6 spares have 12 on standby via text, they reply "on standby" and shortly after the positive responders texted to arrive. It's done all the time with other things in life.

You have 120 spares. So you want 240 people on stand by in this situation...

is_that_so

Russman wrote: »

Totally agree with this. Its a massive own goal from a PR perspective.

But then again, if you were in a command position and had to make a legitimate decision and, in your eyes, had done everything above board, can anyone say they wouldn't help a relative/friend/colleague if you could show you had taken reasonable measures to avoid it ?

It's always going to be viewed poorly. The better way to do it is to leave out the 2 relatives/friends and take the hit on the loss of two doses. There's a bit of a higher moral ground in that.

kravmaga

DraftDodger wrote: »

There is going to be lots and lots of this kind of stuff going on in the coming weeks and months and it won't be confined to this country either. As the son of a 82 year old father and a 79 year old mother who are basically confined to the house until they get their second jab to hear of people jumping queues is maddening.

My parents are the same age group approx , 81 and 77, have not even received the 1st vaccine yet, they have been onto their respective GP's about this.

So your parents at least are doing alright considering they already received the 1st vaccine.

McFly85

So it seems it's happened elsewhere, with the Rotunda looking to get ahead of the story.

While it's less likely this will happen again, the HSE now must look to set up a dedicated process where they can look to contact any potential frontline worker with an availability for a vaccine. I think maybe a call tree system would work well if they already have a centralised list. Hospital contacts HSE>HSE sends text to all frontline workers who are in nearby hospitals>any replies with yes compiled and sent back to the HSE to relay the information to the hospital with the surplus.

hynesie08

Deleted User wrote: »

People who could be within the premises within 30 minutes whatever method that would take. Eg it's looking like 6 spares have 12 on standby via text, they reply "on standby" and shortly after the positive responders texted to arrive. It's done all the time with other things in life.

So since the 2 kids work in healthcare, they'd be on this list right? What if 10 people reply?

is_that_so

steddyeddy wrote: »

I seen that. This time 37 members.

That many? Got the impression it was only a handful. This says two.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/family-members-of-staff-at-rotunda-hospital-received-leftover-covid-19-vaccine-1.4461367

jill_valentine

is_that_so wrote: »

It's always going to be viewed poorly. The better way to do it is to leave out the 2 relatives/friends and take the hit on the loss of two doses. There's a bit of a higher moral ground in that.

So we're officially and explicitly at the point of throwing out vaccines purely to keep unaffected people happy.

Christy42

is_that_so wrote: »

It's always going to be viewed poorly. The better way to do it is to leave out the 2 relatives/friends and take the hit on the loss of two doses. There's a bit of a higher moral ground in that.

There is idiocy in that. We want more people vaccinated. If this nonsense gets enacted it will delay the entire thing. Next you will have people worrying about distant relatives or whatever.

Make every attempt to get it to the right people but if that fails then absolutely use it on whoever you can get there.

Russman

jill_valentine wrote: »

So we're officially and explicitly at the point of throwing out vaccines purely to keep unaffected people happy.

That's the modern world we're living in right now.

is_that_so

is_that_so wrote: »

It's always going to be viewed poorly. The better way to do it is to leave out the 2 relatives/friends and take the hit on the loss of two doses. There's a bit of a higher moral ground in that.

I thing there are a whole lot more than that in the "less deserving" cohort. Not that anybody is is undeserving, but I mean folk who should not have got it ahead to likes of the medical & healthcare staff directly dealing with known Covid cases in other hospitals. Bringing relatives etc in is do demoralising for such staff.